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On October 15 2010 21:54 Patriot.dlk wrote:
I sometimes played with the idea to get the cannon just to shoot at my own buildings or on a mule that was about to die or something to get rid of the energy when facing templars... So really glad they changed this.
I will now upgrade this every time I will have thors because they snipe buildings very well and ultras/thor/immortal/collossus can pop out
ok sounds reasonable.
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WTF???? Energy bar of Corruptor removed???
How to beat them now in PvZ???
I loved to feedback them, but now there's nothing to do against them...
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If protoss is so powerfull and needs a nerf with every patch find me one major tournament lately that toss have won or been in the finals and i dont mean 100$ worth of tournaments.
all things equal players care about pros playing - not about me or you - in major tournaments.
so in that sense balancing should have been occured with top notch in mind not silver leagues.
Point me a serious tournament whereas a pro won by massing vrays i could point a tournament that terran won by massing marauders or thors.
Yet thors and marauders getting buffed or staying the same.
This is just another bs rushed patch to satisfy the masses and not addressing major issues at all that all top players have to face.
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On October 15 2010 22:02 st3roids wrote:
If protoss is so powerfull and needs a nerf with every patch find me one major tournament lately that toss have won or been in the finals and i dont mean 100$ worth of tournaments.
all things equal players care about pros playing - not about me or you - in major tournaments.
so in that sense balancing should have been occured with top notch in mind not silver leagues.
Point me a serious tournament whereas a pro won by massing vrays i could point a tournament that terran won by massing marauders or thors.
Yet thors and marauders getting buffed or staying the same.
This is just another bs rushed patch to satisfy the masses and not addressing major issues at all that all top players have to face.
what difference does it make if marauders are not nerfed? drop plays took a massive hit, should be much easier to defend against medivac dropping with the slower medivac and 33% higher hp on nexus.
voidray was probably nerfed because it can be difficult to scout a proxy stargate and even at the highest level a proxy voidray is instant loss for anyone. the nerf also makes carrier more viable. simply buffing the carrier would be rediculous, they're already insanely hard to stop without massing the direct counter unit.
On October 15 2010 03:09 Achilles wrote:
Thor
-Energy bar removed.
Huge buff.
maybe we'll see less marauder medivac spam and more mech?
good change. not to mention that having to EMP your own thors to make them viable was dumb.
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On October 15 2010 22:02 st3roids wrote:
If protoss is so powerfull and needs a nerf with every patch find me one major tournament lately that toss have won or been in the finals and i dont mean 100$ worth of tournaments.
all things equal players care about pros playing - not about me or you - in major tournaments.
so in that sense balancing should have been occured with top notch in mind not silver leagues.
Point me a serious tournament whereas a pro won by massing vrays i could point a tournament that terran won by massing marauders or thors.
Yet thors and marauders getting buffed or staying the same.
This is just another bs rushed patch to satisfy the masses and not addressing major issues at all that all top players have to face.
Man i think terran got enough nerfs, don't you think?
Nerfed baracks, medivac, reapers. Btw toss got +500hp for nexus.
It may look like thors got buffed, but that cooldown change is very logical and nice, and if thors will be OP vs. toss then Blizz will adjust something I think. Now people will start using thors in TvP and I think it's good.
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Yea great now instead of having to face marauders only u have to face thors as well without viable counters,
splendit
in gsl 1 we had 28 toss 21 terran and 16 zerg or somethign similar.
Patch 1.1 comes - terran nerf patch supposevly -
Gsl 2 comes 28 terran 20 toss 15 zerg.
Patch 1.1.2 and gsl2 finals will be tvt
ps nerfing medivacs should mean nerfing the healing capasity not 1 sec slower to reach end of the map fyi.
Nerfing baraccs would have been a potential reactor removal not 5 sec build time.
I love how easy you label irrelative things as nerfs but the 35% vray dmg decrease and moving speed was a buff according to terrans .
You guys really something.
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Guys, we should obviously play more before we jump into conclusions. I think it's too early to make such strong statements as "BCs will have no counter from P" and "Roaches are too strong and broken now". To those players that are wondering how are they going to stop corruptors as P now, i think you ll find a way other than the sarcastic "dont let him make them" solution that pre-patch 1.1 many Zerg players were getting when they were roflstomped by countless of T and P opennings...
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Every other toss unit "counters" thor, maybe you should play the game more and whine less. I'll rather see more thors than boring MMM every game.
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On October 15 2010 21:14 Alpina wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 21:02 Nyx wrote:On October 15 2010 10:03 Lavitage wrote:
I never had trouble with reapers. Now since this patch makes them objectively suck.... every Terran is going to choose Hellions to harass early instead, yeah?
Roach with 4 range > hellions? You make hellions to kill workers - not to kill roaches. Why the hell everyone says that hellion harass won't be efective? Now it will be just a little bit easier to defend vs. hellion harass and nothing more.
yes but it's not cat and mouse anymore.
the cat must now defeat a guard dog before it can reach the mice.
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On October 15 2010 22:17 hoovehand wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 21:14 Alpina wrote:On October 15 2010 21:02 Nyx wrote:On October 15 2010 10:03 Lavitage wrote:
I never had trouble with reapers. Now since this patch makes them objectively suck.... every Terran is going to choose Hellions to harass early instead, yeah?
Roach with 4 range > hellions? You make hellions to kill workers - not to kill roaches. Why the hell everyone says that hellion harass won't be efective? Now it will be just a little bit easier to defend vs. hellion harass and nothing more. yes but it's not cat and mouse anymore. the cat must now defeat a guard dog before it can reach the mice.
That is how it was always supposed to be.
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On October 15 2010 20:52 Cloak wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 20:49 DTown wrote:On October 15 2010 20:46 Cloak wrote:On October 15 2010 20:32 revy wrote:
My thoughts:
Void Ray change is perfect, makes them more viable uncharged and now they don't totally rape face when charged. And by perfect, you mean never used competitively again, then you'd be correct. One less unit to worry about in TvP so I guess it is perfect for Terrans. omg. what you should do: 1. see patch notes 2. play SC2 and use VRs 3. discuss their attributes on forums. what everyone does: 1. see patch notes. 2. complain. This is especially true when a unit is completely changed and not just nerfed. You may all well be right about VRs being useless now. But I will not accept that you can somehow know this just from reading the considerable changes to the unit in patch notes. Already have. In games and in a unit tester. Extremely cost ineffective piece of garbage. It'd take an idiot to think that a 35% dps nerf on a glass cannon is a buff in any capacity. It's bad enough it got nerfed so heavily, we don't need assholes telling us it's a buff. Have you played with Void Rays yet? No. Probably laughing your ass off that a 150 mineral Queen can solo a VR now.
A queen obviously will not solo a VR.
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+ Show Spoiler +On October 15 2010 22:14 st3roids wrote:
Yea great now instead of having to face marauders only u have to face thors as well without viable counters,
splendit
in gsl 1 we had 28 toss 21 terran and 16 zerg or somethign similar.
Patch 1.1 comes - terran nerf patch supposevly -
Gsl 2 comes 28 terran 20 toss 15 zerg.
Patch 1.1.2 and gsl2 finals will be tvt
ps nerfing medivacs should mean nerfing the healing capasity not 1 sec slower to reach end of the map fyi.
Nerfing baraccs would have been a potential reactor removal not 5 sec build time.
I love how easy you label irrelative things as nerfs but the 35% vray dmg decrease and moving speed was a buff according to terrans .
You guys really something.
2 QQ posts on one page, don't you have a diner to run?
Only in SC2 can Terran get nerfed 5 times in one patch and people still whine about it making them more OP.
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United Kingdom12042 Posts
ps nerfing medivacs should mean nerfing the healing capasity not 1 sec slower to reach end of the map fyi.
It's nerfing drops, since it's easier to chase them down, there's nothing wrong with Medivacs heal.
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On October 15 2010 22:22 lololol wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 20:52 Cloak wrote:On October 15 2010 20:49 DTown wrote:On October 15 2010 20:46 Cloak wrote:On October 15 2010 20:32 revy wrote:
My thoughts:
Void Ray change is perfect, makes them more viable uncharged and now they don't totally rape face when charged. And by perfect, you mean never used competitively again, then you'd be correct. One less unit to worry about in TvP so I guess it is perfect for Terrans. omg. what you should do: 1. see patch notes 2. play SC2 and use VRs 3. discuss their attributes on forums. what everyone does: 1. see patch notes. 2. complain. This is especially true when a unit is completely changed and not just nerfed. You may all well be right about VRs being useless now. But I will not accept that you can somehow know this just from reading the considerable changes to the unit in patch notes. Already have. In games and in a unit tester. Extremely cost ineffective piece of garbage. It'd take an idiot to think that a 35% dps nerf on a glass cannon is a buff in any capacity. It's bad enough it got nerfed so heavily, we don't need assholes telling us it's a buff. Have you played with Void Rays yet? No. Probably laughing your ass off that a 150 mineral Queen can solo a VR now. A queen obviously will not solo a VR.
Uh, actually can anyone confirm/deny this?
Eh who cares, I get like 20 queens in my ZvPs anyway lol.
Is anyone seeing this as a potential buff to the Void Ray? Maybe now it can actually be used as support in an army like the banshee because of the buff to the 1st charge. It may have gotten weaker as cheese but isn't it better as a general unit?
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Don't see why the game isn't pretty much balanced now. Changes to Terran are sensible.
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WTF???? Energy bar of Corruptor removed???
How to beat them now in PvZ???
I loved to feedback them, but now there's nothing to do against them...
What do you do against vikings? Note that Vikings have greater range and are much more versatile than corruptors.
Am I the only Zerg player confused about toss players QQ'in this? I've always had difficulty against Colos, especially in team games, and this change will finally make Corruptors a somewhat viable counter.
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On October 15 2010 22:17 hoovehand wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 21:14 Alpina wrote:On October 15 2010 21:02 Nyx wrote:On October 15 2010 10:03 Lavitage wrote:
I never had trouble with reapers. Now since this patch makes them objectively suck.... every Terran is going to choose Hellions to harass early instead, yeah?
Roach with 4 range > hellions? You make hellions to kill workers - not to kill roaches. Why the hell everyone says that hellion harass won't be efective? Now it will be just a little bit easier to defend vs. hellion harass and nothing more. yes but it's not cat and mouse anymore. the cat must now defeat a guard dog before it can reach the mice.
Tell that to mutas?
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On October 15 2010 22:22 lololol wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 20:52 Cloak wrote:On October 15 2010 20:49 DTown wrote:On October 15 2010 20:46 Cloak wrote:On October 15 2010 20:32 revy wrote:
My thoughts:
Void Ray change is perfect, makes them more viable uncharged and now they don't totally rape face when charged. And by perfect, you mean never used competitively again, then you'd be correct. One less unit to worry about in TvP so I guess it is perfect for Terrans. omg. what you should do: 1. see patch notes 2. play SC2 and use VRs 3. discuss their attributes on forums. what everyone does: 1. see patch notes. 2. complain. This is especially true when a unit is completely changed and not just nerfed. You may all well be right about VRs being useless now. But I will not accept that you can somehow know this just from reading the considerable changes to the unit in patch notes. Already have. In games and in a unit tester. Extremely cost ineffective piece of garbage. It'd take an idiot to think that a 35% dps nerf on a glass cannon is a buff in any capacity. It's bad enough it got nerfed so heavily, we don't need assholes telling us it's a buff. Have you played with Void Rays yet? No. Probably laughing your ass off that a 150 mineral Queen can solo a VR now. A queen obviously will not solo a VR.
Reports from the unittester says that it isn't very obvious...
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On October 15 2010 22:17 hoovehand wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 21:14 Alpina wrote:On October 15 2010 21:02 Nyx wrote:On October 15 2010 10:03 Lavitage wrote:
I never had trouble with reapers. Now since this patch makes them objectively suck.... every Terran is going to choose Hellions to harass early instead, yeah?
Roach with 4 range > hellions? You make hellions to kill workers - not to kill roaches. Why the hell everyone says that hellion harass won't be efective? Now it will be just a little bit easier to defend vs. hellion harass and nothing more. yes but it's not cat and mouse anymore. the cat must now defeat a guard dog before it can reach the mice.
Are terrans supposed to have unrestricted harass or something? How does that make sense at all
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To change the direction of this discussion slightly, what do you people think about the thor and it's special ability?
Its been known for quite a while that the cannon ability hugely overlaps with the thor's own natural attack. DPS is so similar that the ability is usually skipped. The removal of energy is a step in the right direction I think, but I feel that the thor in general is in need of a unit overhaul.
The Thor is cost effective against basically every ground unit thanks to the raw DPS it puts out at a whopping 7 range. Its essentially a big boring marine, with an ability that overlaps with its own DPS.
Personally, I'd like to see Thor ground DPS or range toned down so it can fit its originally intended "tank unit" role, rather than something you can mass and a-move. At the same time, the cannon ability should be redesigned to somethink more interesting than "do X damage". I liked the original AoE bombardment ability, but it feels like it overlaps a bit too much with what siege tanks are supposed to do. Any ideas?
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EPT
