On October 07 2010 13:44 Bloodba7h wrote:
It's always left to right positions, never vertical. You can check for yourself in the editor.

Check it out:

Map -> Team Placement (advanced)

1v1a - bottom left spawn, enemy in top right or bottom right
1v1b - top left spawn, enemy in top right or bottom right
1v1c - top right spawn, enemy in bottom left or top left
1v1d - bottom right spawn, enemy in bottom left or top left

They all show placement of non-vertical positions. Basically, you'll always be using the middle of the map (or the area behind the destructible rocks in your main).

Good job Blizz. Except I can't 6 pool to victory every time now. Bad job.

I hope it's alright if I add this to the OP. This is a pretty important find and would aid the maturation of this thread. Thanks a bunch (lemme know if it isn't ok)!

Bloodba7h

Canada20 Posts

October 07 2010 05:35 GMT

#83

That's cool

On_Slaught

United States12190 Posts

October 07 2010 05:38 GMT

#84

On October 07 2010 14:33 Genome852 wrote:

Show nested quote +

I don't think you can. Maybe you're thinking of the 3rd bases?

It's the "nat" of that base. Even if you can't spawn there, if any game on this map makes it to the endgame (which is pretty unlikely with all the all-ins and rushes you will see), the fact tanks can cover most the expos on the map with ease will be a game-deciding factor.

Obsolescence

United States270 Posts

October 07 2010 05:44 GMT

#85

On October 07 2010 14:33 Genome852 wrote:

Show nested quote +

I don't think you can. Maybe you're thinking of the 3rd bases?

He is talking about this:

On October 07 2010 12:06 Obsolescence wrote:
Attacking opponents natural gas from your nat's plateau [SEE EDIT]
+ Show Spoiler +

If vertical positions were possible (see OP edit) then this would be natural to natural tank fire.

wonderwall

New Zealand695 Posts

October 07 2010 05:48 GMT

#86

What is wrong with having an open middle of the map? We don't really need chokes and destructible rocks everywhere, maybe just a nice open plain with a watch tower in the center.

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

October 07 2010 05:53 GMT

#87

On October 07 2010 14:48 wonderwall wrote:
What is wrong with having an open middle of the map? We don't really need chokes and destructible rocks everywhere, maybe just a nice open plain with a watch tower in the center.

Blasphemy!

NeoLearner

Belgium1847 Posts

October 07 2010 06:12 GMT

#88

Hmmm, if this map would be posted in the custom game section, I would have some questions:

1) The small patches of high ground in the middle, are they droppable?
2) The watch towers in the middle, do they cover this ground? That would suck... I really like that spot to park on overlord. Don't immediately see another "parking space".
3) Double height main seems nice to fend of reapers. However, please tell me they can't jump past the back door destructible rocks!
4) One attack path... There is quite a few destructible paths, but even they are close. If you siege up in the middle, will you cover these additional paths also?

leeznon

United States255 Posts

October 07 2010 06:54 GMT

#89

wtf Blizzard, not again...

iamJason

Australia25 Posts

October 07 2010 07:03 GMT

#90

Apparently no one told the SC2 level designers about the pro BW maps, because every ladder map they've made has broken several key rules that made those maps, and in turn BW, balanced.

Smigi

United States328 Posts

October 07 2010 10:02 GMT

#91

Blizzard replacing bad maps with bad maps.

We need to start an ICcup map movement, blizzard isnt cutting it.

Dommk

Australia4865 Posts

October 07 2010 10:05 GMT

#92

Lol, now combine that with MMM drops that bounce between Nats faster than you can ever move between them

Grebliv

Iceland800 Posts

October 07 2010 10:09 GMT

#93

And here I've been worrying about making nats tankable... at all.

kasumimi

Greece460 Posts

October 07 2010 10:16 GMT

#94

This map has already been convicted in this thread when it's the only large map in an already shitty map pool. The only map that forces a different early-mid game.

All the other maps are equally pathetic or even worse than this. And the people complaining about this being a T map are probably trolls or silver players.

The focus should be on the fact that the entire map pool is made by amateurs and designers who don't understand the game at all. The community should try pressure Blizzard include Iccup maps or at least mymic their style, not meaninglessly whine on an issue everyone is more or less aware of.

Liquid`Drone

Norway28665 Posts

October 07 2010 10:21 GMT

#95

I don't see why people are negative towards always making it cross position. I think that is AWESOME personally.. most two player maps struggle with not having enough expansions. now we have enough expansions, but you also eliminate the randomness and imbalance that comes with different spawning positions. (take metalopolis for example - it's one of the best maps around for "total balance", but as a zerg player, I feel like I am advantaged every game I get cross positions, and disadvantaged every time I get close positions.) forcing cross position in every game is awesome I think.

mOnion

United States5657 Posts

October 07 2010 10:23 GMT

#96

its just weird cuz they could've just as easily removed the other 2 cross position spawns and just called it a 2 player map....

but i guess this is cute. its like a 2 player map with different scenery each spawn. yay.

ParasitJonte

Sweden1768 Posts

October 07 2010 10:25 GMT

#97

On October 07 2010 19:21 Liquid`Drone wrote:
I don't see why people are negative towards always making it cross position. I think that is AWESOME personally.. most two player maps struggle with not having enough expansions. now we have enough expansions, but you also eliminate the randomness and imbalance that comes with different spawning positions. (take metalopolis for example - it's one of the best maps around for "total balance", but as a zerg player, I feel like I am advantaged every game I get cross positions, and disadvantaged every time I get close positions.) forcing cross position in every game is awesome I think.

But they don't force cross positions. Either cross position or horizontal position. So there will be a similar scenario. You'll scout your opponent and either sigh or double expand.

Sixes

Canada1123 Posts

October 07 2010 10:28 GMT

#98

Given the spawn information this map seems fine.

I have some questions regarding reapers. Is the main's cliff a double height one ? (but single down to natural) and is there space for reapers around the back door rocks?

I think that reapers have to jump up to the nat on this map ... and I don't think reapers can go through the back door on horizontal positions.

On both the new maps I will probably go roaches (except ZvZ) because 5 roaches kill rocks fast and it looks like the maps will be very good for Z if you can open them up early.

ParasitJonte

Sweden1768 Posts

October 07 2010 10:30 GMT

#99

On October 07 2010 14:29 kojinshugi wrote:
I swear it's like some people won't be happy until the only two ladder maps are Metalopolis and Novice Blistering Sands.

Uhm no. All maps are pretty bad...

kojinshugi

Estonia2559 Posts

October 07 2010 10:32 GMT

#100

On October 07 2010 19:16 kasumimi wrote:
The focus should be on the fact that the entire map pool is made by amateurs and designers who don't understand the game at all. The community should try pressure Blizzard include Iccup maps or at least mymic their style, not meaninglessly whine on an issue everyone is more or less aware of.

This isn't Brood War.

The designers understand the game just fine, it seems more like a lot of BW players don't understand that SC2 is a different game that will go where the designers want it to go instead of regressing into BW once you're done screaming about the changes enough.

For a spectator sport, smaller, more volatile maps are better. If there's nothing "abusable" about a map the map is boring and fosters long macro games.

The only person I've seen comment on this whose opinion I actually give two craps about is Artosis, and he said he quite likes the map. But the threads are full of people spouting one-liners about ICCup.

Blizzard won't make this into BW. Screaming even louder won't make that any less true.