EPTplease explain
Ultralisk bug/issue with patch 1.1.1 - Page 16
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ComaDose
Canada10357 Posts
please explain | ||
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Justifer
107 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:29 JJdawes wrote: since in 10x the player you are or will ever be thanks bro The mule is perfectly balanced. On blistering Sands the Ultralisk bug would literally allow you to attack the rocks and kill turrets and supply depos that were watching them. Thats fucking stupid and it needed to be patched. | ||
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ThirdStorm
21 Posts
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
On September 29 2010 04:56 Tsagacity wrote: You're missing the part where terran has 5 pre-igniter hellions behind his thors. You're missing reading this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=155495 | ||
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DooMDash
United States1015 Posts
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baconbits
United States419 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:27 ComaDose wrote: not a nerf. splash range is same just from different location. will affect more units to the side. its a meele unit. why should it reach over/through thors? its a meele unit why should the splash be from the center of the target? AFAIK side splash doesn't really help a MELEE unit. maybe if they had 7 range like other massive ground units... *cough* | ||
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ch4ppi
Germany802 Posts
Are Utralisks suppose to counter Thors? Or are Thors suppose to counter Utralisks? Making up some "supposed to do X" is not good. They WERE pretty balanced in their dynamic between each other. Now the Ultras arent that good anymore. And btw I like it how some Terran player just say its reasonable... | ||
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Justifer
107 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:34 ch4ppi wrote: Making up some "supposed to do X" is not good. They WERE pretty balanced in their dynamic between each other. Now the Ultras arent that good anymore. And btw I like it how some Terran player just say its reasonable... I'm a 1600 point diamond Zerg player and i say its reasonable. | ||
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ComaDose
Canada10357 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:34 baconbits wrote: AFAIK side splash doesn't really help a MELEE unit. your right. unless its wading through a field of zealots or something, but should a melee unit have depth splash? does that even make sense. they did not decrease the radius right? how can you argue that attacking the front of a pf or destructable rocks should damage things behind it. yah obviously it was better but it purely didnt make any sense. | ||
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Karkadinn
United States132 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:32 ThirdStorm wrote: Are Utralisks suppose to counter Thors? Or are Thors suppose to counter Utralisks? Ultralisks had their damage type changed specifically to give them the role of countering armored units. Thors are also lower tech, ranged, and can hit air units. If ultralisks don't counter thors heavily, something is dreadfully wrong. | ||
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VorcePA
United States1102 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:32 ThirdStorm wrote: Are Utralisks suppose to counter Thors? Or are Thors suppose to counter Utralisks? In theory, ultralisks should be a soft counter to thors, in the same way vultures were a soft counter to dragoons in SC1 (they got demolished in a head-to-head fight, but spider mines put the battle in their favour). Food for food, resources for resources, ultralisks and thors are even. However, thors have a long range ground attack and an even longer range air attack, and have a long-range, long-duration stun upgrade. So, in theory, because ultralisks are only ground attack, they should be the victor. | ||
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:34 ch4ppi wrote: Making up some "supposed to do X" is not good. They WERE pretty balanced in their dynamic between each other. Now the Ultras arent that good anymore. And btw I like it how some Terran player just say its reasonable... if by pretty balanced you mean 6 ultra pwn 11 thors like in cool's game, yes they were balanced. (just nitpicking here, I agree with what you said) | ||
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tetracycloide
295 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:27 ComaDose wrote: not a nerf. splash range is same just from different location. will affect more units to the side. its a meele unit. why should it reach over/through thors? its a meele unit why should the splash be from the center of the target? Two problems here. First, it's possible you just don't understand what splash means but when the splash range is the same but it starts at a location further away from where you want it to be then it's absolutely a nerf in damage dealt. Second, you seem to be under the impression that units in starcraft work logically in some way. Is there a logical reason every siege tank operator is psychically linked to every other so they never shoot at the same target unless they need to? Is there a logical reason brood lords can fling an endless supply of broodings at things and never get smaller? It just doesn't make sense to analyze balance that way. | ||
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Fa1nT
United States3423 Posts
Ultra are supposed to tank and survive to deal damage Thors are not supposed to out-DPS them even without a damage type bonus.. And they can hit air, and fly on medivacs >_> | ||
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Goliathsorrow
Italy317 Posts
Edited. | ||
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JinDesu
United States3990 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:40 MrCon wrote: if by pretty balanced you mean 6 ultra pwn 11 thors like in cool's game, yes they were balanced. (just nitpicking here, I agree with what you said) For the love of god, it wasn't 6 ultras wtfpwning 11 thors. 15 thors 2-2 vs 10 1-4 ultras, a bunch of zerglings, banelings, and roaches that softened up the top 4 thors and absorbed their attacks until the ultras got the thors down to half life. THEN 14 thors wtfpwned 3 ultras in one instant. If it was a good spread of thors vs the ultras only, even before this patch, Cool would have lost that battle. | ||
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Fitz
Canada77 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:33 MrCon wrote: You're missing reading this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=155495 It's perfectly reasonable to assume a couple hellions along with such a gas heavy factory oriented thor build. | ||
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Justifer
107 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:43 Fa1nT wrote: Ultra are supposed to counter all armored ground units Ultra are supposed to tank and survive to deal damage Thors are not supposed to out-DPS them even without a damage type bonus.. And they can hit air, and fly on medivacs >_> Ultralisks can fly in overlords? They still tank and deal damage like there suppose to and now and they still counter armored heavily. Just because they don't have massive splash doesn't mean they dont do any of the things you mentioned | ||
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:24 Justifer wrote: (I'm a 1600 point diamond zerg and this is what I thought about the following post) I also disagree. Infestors are not a necessity to win games and to claim terran requires no micro is simply stupid. Your examples are also stupid. To say you end up with a spire instead of an infestation pit early game does not matter. You shouldn't be opening early game with Infestors. Ultras were not designed to hard counter heavy mech and just because there splash damage was reduced does not mean they are still not a hard counter to mech. Ultralisk were designed just like in Starcraft BW to soak up damage. Thats why they have 500 hp and 5 armor. A unit like the ultralisk that has 500 hp splash damage and can hit 15 every second or so is never useless. The point of ultralisk countering thors is you can mass produce them so much quicker. To claim that an Ultralisk which is made out of one production building and can be made out more than one at a time can't be a single unit spawning one at a time is stupid. So don't go around spouting out bs when your clueless about what your talking about. I'm tired of people who are in bronze trying to claim imbalances when they don't even know how to play the game well. I also disagree with this. and with my being warned for talking to a person who should know exactly why i disagree based on my stream. but yeah opening infestors is very strong vs T and ultras role used to be tanks for damage and then they lowered their survivability in order to deal a bunch of damage to fortified fronts (tanks thors collosus ect). so its probably the idea of ultralisks to be a armored buster. | ||
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ComaDose
Canada10357 Posts
On September 29 2010 05:42 tetracycloide wrote: Two problems here. First, it's possible you just don't understand what splash means but when the splash range is the same but it starts at a location further away from where you want it to be then it's absolutely a nerf in damage dealt. Second, you seem to be under the impression that units in starcraft work logically in some way. Is there a logical reason every siege tank operator is psychically linked to every other so they never shoot at the same target unless they need to? Is there a logical reason brood lords can fling broodings and things and never get smaller? It just doesn't make sense to analyze balance that way. yes it makes zerg worse when zerg should be getting better. yes it does less effective desirable damage. yes if your zerg you can qq if you want. yes it makes more sense this way. no im not an idiot. i just find nerf a hard word to throw around. and i will always believe the blizzard world is perfectly logical  the siege tanks have auto targeting systems that are networked together and calculate the available targets and tanks in range several times a second. the operator just watches the lights flash. the metabolic rate of a broodlord astoundingly creates fetuses and matures them to broodlords in seconds using nothing but the nutrients in the air. | ||
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