On September 23 2010 07:53 Aylear wrote:
That's a pretty ridiculous map flaw right there.

Remind me again why Blizzard won't let skilled map makers create SC2 maps for ladder?

They're just a bit too proud

MusiK

United States302 Posts

September 27 2010 00:17 GMT

#202

Lol... I was staring at the top of the image and asking, WHERE IS THE CREEP?!?! IMBA

But i looked at the bottom. Verry glaring disadvantage the right side has.

You are E-famous because Artosis and Tasteless mentioned this problem in their cast (no doubt that they read your post.) Congrats

Craton

United States17247 Posts

September 27 2010 00:21 GMT

#203

On September 23 2010 07:48 Ketara wrote:
This is something that we should really be ramming down Blizzards throats on their own forums.

We've been complaining about it since beta, but thus far they've been content to ignore the asymmetry of maps; try searching about it, you should find plenty.

ZomgTossRush

United States1041 Posts

September 27 2010 00:22 GMT

#204

On September 26 2010 09:17 Geiko wrote:
Didn't want to make a new thread about this so i'll just post it here, but i think Delta Quadrant is ridiculously imbalanced... If you spawn close position, the farthest away clockwise has such an advantage because he his able to expand AWAY from his opponent. He can abuse those high ground cliffs which are close to his base and it seems impossible to defend the natural...
[image loading]

TBH, i don't think i have ever taken that back natural, unless for a specific build. But as for the natural flow for getting a third, i always just opt for a gold. Since if you spawn close pos, you have the option to then expand away. Plus you dont have to worry about harrasment via cliff. The only thing you have to worry about is ground harrasment, which is countered just by having good map vision.

ChThoniC

United States536 Posts

October 01 2010 18:41 GMT

#205

Honestly, I think Blizzard is relatively good at map design, but their technical flaws are ridiculous. IMO they should bring back Twisted Meadows (and maybe Terenas Stand) from Warcraft 3 and dump some of the imbalanced maps.

mathemagician1986

Germany549 Posts

October 01 2010 20:09 GMT

#206

I once read that on Lost Temple reapers can hit the natural expansion while on top of the cliff on some positions, but can't on others.

Can anyone confirm this? Would be another thing to fix.

greendestiny

Bosnia-Herzegovina114 Posts

October 07 2010 08:38 GMT

#207

I kind of understand why the maps have such glaring flaws.
When they were being made, the focus was on showcasing game engine/map editor/special abilities and thus haven't been thoroughly tested for abuses.
That wouldn't be a problem, though, if only Blizzard paid more attention to us, the players...

Caphe

Vietnam10817 Posts

October 07 2010 09:21 GMT

#208

Nice find.
For people that pushing for Blizzard to use ICCup maps, its not happening, since most ICCUP maps are just make over of Kespa SC:BW map.
With the situation between Blizzard and Kespa rightnow, there is no way Blizzard will obtain the rights to use these maps for SC2.

Speaking of which, I dont think why Blizzard has to make SC2 maps themselves. The Korean are the BEST at making maps. Why dont just oursourcing map making to some Korean firms.
Is Mapdori(the one who map many famous SC:BW map) a individual company in Korea?

kojinshugi

Estonia2559 Posts

October 07 2010 09:29 GMT

#209

Why do maps need to be absolutely symmetrical? They're already asymmetrical for Terran since starting positions dictate building placement due to addons. Being at 12 o clock on LT means you can have addons and a bling proof wall. Being at 6 o clock means goodbye addons if blings come.

And you're looking at Scrap Station in a vacuum. Yes, the creep spread is not identical. Doesn't the other base have any other benefits? One immediately apparent bonus is that the close air side is much smaller on the 12 o clock base, making it easier to defend against air harassment and drops.

It's very easy to make assumptions (symmetry is always better) and then cherry pick things that support that assumption (creep spread is slightly harder on this map due to asymmetry).

kojinshugi

Estonia2559 Posts

October 07 2010 09:33 GMT

#210

Caphe, I'm pretty sure Blizzard will eventually use outside maps.

But I can assure you they won't be ICCup maps, not least of all because Diamond is so utterly unprofessional as their spokesperson.

"Blizzard, your maps and all your design decisions are absolute garbage, our maps are clearly superior and counter to your shitty design decisions, use those".

Why does anyone think this kind of approach is a good idea?

kariido

Saudi Arabia179 Posts

October 07 2010 10:16 GMT

#211

Please start using iCCup maps people, Blizzard won't integrate them on their own. They need to see that players prefer and want the iCCup maps.

Ichabod

United States1659 Posts

December 04 2010 19:36 GMT

#212

The top position is still a little bit closer, but now it just takes two tumors on each side.
For patch 1.2 on scrap station:
South Spawn normal creep:+ Show Spoiler +

North spawn normal creep:+ Show Spoiler +

South spawn 1 tumor:+ Show Spoiler +

North spawn 1 tumor:+ Show Spoiler +

I'm pretty sure I put the tumors in the right places, or close enough anyway to demonstrate.
(since creep spreading got changed in 1.2, I assumed it would be fine to bring up this topic..and since another related one was closed)

Ketara

United States15065 Posts

December 05 2010 01:04 GMT

#213

The problem still exists in the new patch. The change made creep spread 1 square farther to the north, not to the south.

For further Scrap Station related issues, please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=171033

TemplarCo.

Mexico2870 Posts

December 22 2010 00:57 GMT

#214

On October 07 2010 18:33 kojinshugi wrote:
Caphe, I'm pretty sure Blizzard will eventually use outside maps.

But I can assure you they won't be ICCup maps, not least of all because Diamond is so utterly unprofessional as their spokesperson.

"Blizzard, your maps and all your design decisions are absolute garbage, our maps are clearly superior and counter to your shitty design decisions, use those".

Why does anyone think this kind of approach is a good idea?

well yeah Diamonds approach isn't the best but if Blizzard starts to look deep into iCCup Maps, at some point they'll BEG for the rights to use them, even tough there will be some maps that will attract less attention but with some good maps at a point Blizzard will fall