EPTEDIT: Aw, confirmed bug. Well, it does look rather stupid, to be honest.
Ultras vs Repaired PF - Page 28
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MinoMino
Norway1103 Posts
EDIT: Aw, confirmed bug. Well, it does look rather stupid, to be honest. | ||
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cArn-
Korea (South)824 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:18 Darkn3ss wrote: /fixed! xD It's like protoss who loves spamming FF's. You need ultras to deal with them (sometimes even unupgraded ultras). Now you'll need Ultras to also kill PF's. Terran can still take third and 4th relatively safely until then tho... *sighs I think Ultras can have the "Ram" back... just scrap PF's altogether... I mean would Terrans be happy if hatcheries had an upgrade to allow them to have subterranean spines (lurkers)? And then another upgrade to give them +2 Armor and +1 range or someother shit like that?? I actually kinda like hatcheries having Plague ability along with the above mentioned spines! Oh, and maybe queen can get dark swarm at hive? XD Now that's balance!!! If terrans had that kind of static defense they wouldn't need PFs in the first place, so mb ppl can stop talking crap already. It's a bit ridiculous splash hope they fix it fast, even if that's quite funny to see SCVs going to work on their PFs get slaughtered instantely lol | ||
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Cranberries
Wales567 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:33 iEchoic wrote: Fuuuu this thread is so frustrating. Do you really not see the issue with a melee unit hitting units like 5 tiles away, which looks completely stupid and is completely unnecessary? I can't believe this even needs to be justified. Do you think 20 SCVs and a Thor being unkillable is necessary? Do you think 20 SCVs and a Battlecruiser being unkillable is necessary? Do you think 20 SCVs and a PF being unkillable is necessary? If one thing is overpowered, and Blizzard accidently introduces something that is also overpowered - and the two overpowered things meet and it works as it should that is balance. If 5 Ultralisks attack a Nexus with 10-15 Photon Cannons, that expansion is still going down - why should Terran be the exception? | ||
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iEchoic
United States1776 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:37 Cranberries wrote: Do you think 20 SCVs and a PF being unkillable is necessary? What the hell are you talking about, I'm not saying a PF should be unkillable, I'm just saying the splash shouldn't extend 5 tiles from the ultra because it looks retarded and makes no sense. | ||
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Phayze
Canada2029 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:38 iEchoic wrote: What the hell are you talking about, I'm not saying a PF should be unkillable, I'm just saying the splash shouldn't extend 5 tiles from the ultra because it looks retarded and makes no sense. Yep, good positioning would have the exact same consequence as the 5 tile swipe, but muich harder to do, and therefore not as easy for a player who just 1a's to kill 20 scvs repairing with a bunch of ultras which are just bugging out attacking 1 at a time. A good player you still surround the PF and SCV's and kill just as many, I do not think ultras should even swipe 1 tile past the planetary fortress. but swipe whats between the PF and the ultra. | ||
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Cranberries
Wales567 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:38 iEchoic wrote: What the hell are you talking about, I'm not saying a PF should be unkillable, I'm just saying the splash shouldn't extend 5 tiles. Then perhaps we should balance this by only allowing a certain number of SCVs, say 5, to repair a building and allowing a certain number of SCVs, say 3, to repair a unit? Sounds fair right? Remember, sir Terran, Repair heals at around 21 hps. If you have 5 SCVs repairing a PF, that's 100 hps meaning that 5 Ultralisks would only do 118.75 dps excluding armour. The Planetary Fortress has 3 armour so against a PF 5 Ultralisks, factoring in 100 hps of repair, do 100 dps. That means it takes exactly 15 seconds for 5 Ultralisks (1500/1000 cost) to take down the building. A Nexus, or Hatchery on the other hand die a lot faster. Repair is so ridiculously stupid it's mind boggling how Terran players think it is fine, and that is frustrating for Zerg/Protoss players who don't have anything similar. | ||
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iEchoic
United States1776 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:44 Cranberries wrote: Repair is so ridiculously stupid it's mind boggling how Terran players think it is fine, and that is frustrating for Zerg/Protoss players who don't have anything similar. Stop turning this into your personal balance whine thread, if you have a problem with repair, make a new thread about it. Ultras hitting units they're not even close to is stupid, period. | ||
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okrane
France265 Posts
we're not talking freaking zerglings here... It is a very late-game solution to the PF and general wall-ins maze building defense. Something tells me that if you have ultralisks hitting your buildings and your army isnt immediately nearby to deal with them, you're doing something wrong. The problem is Terrans love the sense of security given by their wall-ins and PF-expansions, all this leading to them actually having fun in-game, because you know, being the harasser is fun while being harassed is quite the opposite. This thing should be let live for a couple of weeks so that people can test it out. It is also interesting to note how Protoss is going to be affected by this change. | ||
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XXXSmOke
United States1333 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:01 Johoseph wrote: This is what all good players do when a change comes down the pipe. They just give up. seriously man, it's a bug that will be fixed at some point, how about you man up and deal with it until it is. Uhmm dealing w balance is totally fine. But dealing w a bug that has an absurd exploit that is what is killing my desire to play. | ||
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okrane
France265 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:46 iEchoic wrote: Stop turning this into your personal balance whine thread, if you have a problem with repair, make a new thread about it. Ultras hitting units they're not even close to is stupid, period. And siege tanks intelligently-splashing 13 range away is also stupid right? And Hold-position Lurkers decimating 20 marines in 1 shot isnt? And spells like Plague (300 dps or so) or Dark Swarm (making units invulnerable mind you) werent stupid? Look, I agree, that ultra splash is retarded. But maybe its best for the game for it to remain that way. | ||
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Cranberries
Wales567 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:46 iEchoic wrote: Stop turning this into your personal balance whine thread, if you have a problem with repair, make a new thread about it. Ultras hitting units they're not even close to is stupid, period. But this concerns repair because if SCVs couldn't repair, like Protoss' and Zerg's, the SCVs would be moved to a new mining location because the expansion was under attack? Do you seriously think this is imbalanced, but 3 Hellions wiping out an entire mineral line in <5 seconds is balanced, or 4 Marauders in a Medivac sniping a Nexus/Hatchery in <20 seconds is balanced? Or making 4 Vikings and shutting down any competent air force from Protoss is balanced? Terran have many broken things. Protoss have a few broken things and Zerg has 1 broken thing. If Zerg's "only broken" thing gets fixed, they must all get fixed. It's about double standards, of which there should be none. | ||
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Half
United States2554 Posts
And siege tanks intelligently-splashing 13 range away is also stupid right? And Hold-position Lurkers decimating 20 marines in 1 shot isnt? And spells like Plague (300 dps or so) or Dark Swarm (making units invulnerable mind you) werent stupid? Look, I agree, that ultra splash is retarded. But maybe its best for the game for it to remain that way. Perhaps your confusing powerful with stupid. A long range artillery tank killing marines from a very long distance is not vury retarded sir. Seriously what is wrong with you people and extremes. Its either got to be unkillable PFs or 6x3 range splash ultralisks. Isn't there somewhere in between? | ||
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Trampsi
Norway39 Posts
The first terran QQ gets a blue reply within the first hour ^^ | ||
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Leopoldshark
United States176 Posts
I'll try not to get into the imbalance of PFs, but I'll only say that if you require a huge army to take out just 1 building, there is an issue. Not to consider your opponent likely has a huge army already and will be able to wipe you out. If he had 5 ultras, it is likely the Terran already had 20 marines, 10 marauders, 3 medivacs, and 5 siege tanks (that's probably generous, but likely, assuming that then the zerg will probably have a sizeable force of zerglings/banelings). I think the main issue is not the Planetary Defense but the ability to repair with 20 SCVs. I think the solution would be to either 1. nerf the repair rate after a certain number of SCVs are repairing a single unit/structure or 2. place a maximum limit of how many SCVs can be repairing a structure at once (let's say 5). It would be equivalent to how Medivacs heal biological units (one at a time). Placing 20 Medivacs on a Marine and have him take out armies of zerg would be a similar example (albeit a bad one). Ultralisk cleave is the biggest weapon they have. It makes marines tremble in fear. This could be an issue if, lets say, people were abusing the large cleave by targeting buildings to take out entire armies located near them. But in any of these instances, like with most other imbalances in the game, a smart player will find ways to counter it. In my opinion it is sort of ridiculous for Zerg to have to rely on T3, costly units in order to take out buildings (Ultras/Brood Lords). I think unit vs unit balance is more important than unit vs. 1 building. Then again, I am not a diamond player so feel free to take what I say with a grain of salt. | ||
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Grond
599 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:46 iEchoic wrote: Stop turning this into your personal balance whine thread, if you have a problem with repair, make a new thread about it. Ultras hitting units they're not even close to is stupid, period. Well in all fairness your posts have been whine posts too. I'm sure it will be changed eventually. It's perfectly fair to point out there are plenty of things about Terran that many consider OP. Unlike some of the Terran complaints this one is easily preventable, just keep some Marauders in front of your PF. | ||
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XXXSmOke
United States1333 Posts
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ChrisXIV
Austria3553 Posts
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
If it's really a bug, then there should be a way to deal with PF.  | ||
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DooMDash
United States1015 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:56 slimshady wrote: This is all hilarious btw. If it's really a bug, then there should be a way to deal with PF. Lots of ways to deal with them.. | ||
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Trampsi
Norway39 Posts
On September 22 2010 15:55 XXXSmOke wrote: You guys are forgetting that this splash bug is working vs armored units as well. Me and my friend were testing it out. When you have a thor being hit the ultras get close to the same radius of splash damage which turns your army into papaer mache in a few seconds. How is this suddenly a bug now and not before? The only change was ram being removed and damage reduced... Ram was never used against thors..? | ||
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