• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 16:01
CEST 22:01
KST 05:01
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent9Maestros of the Game: Week 1/Play-in Preview12[ASL20] Ro24 Preview Pt2: Take-Off7[ASL20] Ro24 Preview Pt1: Runway132v2 & SC: Evo Complete: Weekend Double Feature4
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues20LiuLi Cup - September 2025 Tournaments2Weekly Cups (August 25-31): Clem's Last Straw?39Weekly Cups (Aug 18-24): herO dethrones MaxPax6Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris75
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues SpeCial on The Tasteless Podcast What happened to Singapore/Brazil servers?
Tourneys
WardiTV Mondays Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense Mutation # 488 What Goes Around Mutation # 487 Think Fast
Brood War
General
The Korean Terminology Thread [ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent FlaSh on ACS Winners being in ASL ASL20 General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
Is there English video for group selection for ASL [ASL20] Ro16 Group B [ASL20] Ro16 Group A BWCL Season 63 Announcement
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread High temperatures on bridge(s)
TL Community
Nomor CS NeoBank 0822'606969 The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Collective Intelligence: Tea…
TrAiDoS
A very expensive lesson on ma…
Garnet
hello world
radishsoup
Lemme tell you a thing o…
JoinTheRain
RTS Design in Hypercoven
a11
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
INDEPENDIENTE LA CTM
XenOsky
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 997 users

[Trick] Early Game +7% Mineral Boost - Page 6

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 4 5 6 7 8 53 Next
-Frog-
Profile Joined February 2009
United States514 Posts
September 12 2010 21:11 GMT
#101
I could spend the whole game using every single larvae the second it spawns but I don't because I need to manage my army and scout at the same time.
powered by coffee, driven by hate.
aru
Profile Joined April 2010
183 Posts
September 12 2010 21:13 GMT
#102
On September 13 2010 06:10 ltortoise wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2010 06:09 frog HERO wrote:
On September 13 2010 06:06 ltortoise wrote:
On September 13 2010 06:05 frog HERO wrote:
On September 13 2010 06:02 ltortoise wrote:
On September 13 2010 05:57 Half wrote:
On September 13 2010 05:48 ltortoise wrote:
On September 13 2010 05:41 frog HERO wrote:
On September 13 2010 05:35 Logo wrote:
On September 13 2010 05:33 frog HERO wrote:
[quote]

Why in the world is a bad thing that there is some skill that differentiates good players from bad ones? That's the basis of a competitive game. If you are only interested in casual play I doubt you will even be in the same league as players who can execute this perfectly 100% of the time.


You could make SC2 require the player to juggle tennis balls while playing and it'd add skill to the game.

It wouldn't make the game any better though.

Same with this trick, it pretty much adds nothing to the game that anyone should care about and instead is a useless headache that you're going to end up doing several thousands times over the course of your SC2 career.


Your juggling example is extreme and beyond the scope of reason. This trick isn't particularly difficult for anyone who has spent a decent amount of time playing RTS games and occurs during a period of the game where you basically do nothing anyways. It gives a small edge to those willing to learn and execute it but won't be the difference between a win and a loss for the vast majority of players.

If you were expected to do this during the mid game while larvae injecting, macroing off of 4 hatches, controlling your army, etc then you would have a valid point that it is ridiculous and too much of an APM sink. But that simply isn't the case, it's a cool trick that gives players with mouse/keyboard precision an advantage. And being accurate and fast with your mouse and keyboard is an essential part of being a starcraft player.


I don't even think you are correct in what you say. If the OP is correct, there is a delay after the worker finishes the "Mine" command, so this means that all it takes to continuously get a mining advantage at any point in the game is to:

A. select a worker currently mining the mineral patch
B. Queue return cargo
C. Queue mine. Fin.

That evades the problem of a faulty "return" command, and eliminates the AI delay from that mining worker.

Of course a more efficient method would be to shift-select a bunch of mining workers quickly, then queue return and mine.

Either way, this is stupid, and comparing it to making units is stupid, since that involves a decision, namely to make units at all, and if so which units to make. Likewise MULE is a decision (should I scan instead?), so is chrono boost (what do I chrono boost?)

This "trick" (bug) does not involve any decisions. If you have any workers, you want them mining as fast as possible. Completely mandatory. There is absolutely no decision to be made here, none.

Every other ACTUAL macro mechanic involves some sort of decision to be made. I have complete faith that Blizzard will fix this. They would never put something so inelegant in their game on purpose.


This is an extremely superficial and shallow view on how SC2 and SC1 is played.

It is a decision, and the scope of the decision exceeds the depth of mechanics like Muling and chronoboosting. Its a decision that exists on a meta-game level, consisting of a balance between microing workers for econ optimization, microing scouting for more information, making optimal simcities, etc etc. These things cannot be done all at once, and it is a strategic decision for the player on a meta-game level which one he wants to choose. Another factor this factors in is player skill, and how aware a player is of his own capabilities.

Its literally 10x better then crap like muling.


That is the biggest crock of bullshit I have ever read.

Let me rephrase what you just said without using all your bullshit terms:

"It's a decision because you have to decide whether or not you have the time to do it, or if there is something else more important to do."

Sure, but name any other mechanic in SC2 that works like that. Every single mechanic I can think of involves choice. There is no choice here except to do it as often as possible without sacrificing bigger parts of your game.

Imagine the optimal SC2 player: he would be perfectly doing this all the time, endlessly, throughout the entire game. Impossible and stupid. It makes SC2 absolutely ugly. Yuck.


What is an SC2 mechanic that isn't something you decide to do based on whether you have the time to do it or whether there is something more important to do? I could spend the entire game perfectly microing my overseer so that I have the optimal scouting information but I don't because I am sacrificing bigger parts of my game. How is this different?


Scouting with your overlord isn't a macro mechanic. I specifically said macro.

Edit: well I MEANT macro anyway....Macro mechanic, here.


What is an SC2 macro mechanic that isn't something you decide to do based on whether you have the time to do it or whether there is something more important to do? I could spend the entire game perfectly injecting larvae so that I have the optimal amount of larvae but I don't because I could lose my entire army that I wasn't microing or I could have no scouting information. How is this different?


Nope. Won't fly with me. Spawn larvae is a CHOICE. You could also use that energy for spreading creep or healing units.


ie. Making a queen is mandatory to being a good zerg? I guess you could choose not to make a queen.
iEchoic
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1776 Posts
September 12 2010 21:14 GMT
#103
It blows my mind that people think that repeating a series of commands somehow adds skill to the game. The juggling example is perfect.

Literally anybody could do this if they put enough time into doing it. You could actually train an ape to do it. Getting good at doing this says nothing about your RTS skills. It says nothing about your thought process. Literally the only thing it does is signal that you've practiced it a lot.
vileEchoic -- clanvile.com
Klive5ive
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United Kingdom6056 Posts
September 12 2010 21:14 GMT
#104
Sweet.
This does wonders for my 10pools great find.
Remember when SC2 was first played and someone asked a Blizzard guy "what am I supposed to do at the start?" (because of the low apm requirements)... this is the answer!

I think "sockmining" could catch on.
Don't hate the player - Hate the game
ltortoise
Profile Joined August 2010
633 Posts
September 12 2010 21:14 GMT
#105
On September 13 2010 06:11 frog HERO wrote:
I could spend the whole game using every single larvae the second it spawns but I don't because I need to manage my army and scout at the same time.


Or you could decide that you don't want to make units right then, for whatever reason. All these things you are talking about involve decisions. And you still have to decide which units to make.

You could be saving your money for a more expensive unit. Decisions, decisions, decisions.
Lennon
Profile Joined February 2010
United Kingdom2275 Posts
September 12 2010 21:16 GMT
#106
On one side you've got "Free +7% minerals? Yes, please. How do I do this?". On the other side you've got "Now I have to do extra work to keep up? Zzzz. I can't be bothered because it doesn't make any significant difference anyway". I feel sorry for the latter.
tofucake
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Hyrule19084 Posts
September 12 2010 21:17 GMT
#107
Kawaii just did this vs Suppy in OWC 8. He had insane income.
Liquipediaasante sana squash banana
caPnjazz
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany23 Posts
September 12 2010 21:17 GMT
#108
Awesome find, Sockfolder. Didn't notice the difference at first but tested it again on slower and saw the difference. I will now spend the rest of my sunday trying to use this in my games.
leetchaos
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States395 Posts
September 12 2010 21:19 GMT
#109
This works, its impossible for me to do on all my workers throughout the first few minutes (100apm). But I could easily see pro players pulling this off, I think its interesting.
Pandain
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States12989 Posts
September 12 2010 21:19 GMT
#110
I was wondering how this affects 6 pools in particular. I'm trying to test more, (first game he went forge first, figures), but if anyone can comment more succinctly on this it'd be nice.

Also, to those who are saying that "oh, this isn't real skill and it actually might take away from the game," I would have to disagree with you. It's like SCBW where drones couldn't just auto-rally to the mineral patch. You actually had to take care of it. This adds more depth to it, you have to make sure your workers are mining to their greatest efficiency.

To those saying, "oh its just a tactless thing, not real strategy", just imagine your a general making sure your grunts mine the most efficient way and don't slack off after mining each time.

Great find, and great 1st post.

cr4ckshot
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States291 Posts
September 12 2010 21:20 GMT
#111
We'll dub this method as "Sockfolding".
SONE
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada839 Posts
September 12 2010 21:21 GMT
#112
On September 13 2010 05:35 lolaloc wrote:
Just to add, let's call this trick "Sockfolding".


sorry to the ^, someone beat you to it
TitleRug
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States651 Posts
September 12 2010 21:21 GMT
#113
I think it should be called "mineral boosting" like the article seems to suggests.
coLCruncher fighting!
Kyruel
Profile Joined April 2010
United States91 Posts
September 12 2010 21:22 GMT
#114
can anyone make a video of this?
Zurles
Profile Joined February 2009
United Kingdom1659 Posts
September 12 2010 21:22 GMT
#115
On September 13 2010 05:20 Snowfield wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2010 05:19 Zurles wrote:
legendary find, everyone in the world will be doing this soon if it remains this way.


Or not really because it's a minimal gain which you can EASILY screw up and make it not worth anything, we will see.


Every pro player will, that's what I was talking about, not the general casuals, of course they won't
Channel56k
Profile Joined June 2010
United States413 Posts
September 12 2010 21:24 GMT
#116
On September 13 2010 06:14 iEchoic wrote:
It blows my mind that people think that repeating a series of commands somehow adds skill to the game. The juggling example is perfect.

Literally anybody could do this if they put enough time into doing it. You could actually train an ape to do it. Getting good at doing this says nothing about your RTS skills. It says nothing about your thought process. Literally the only thing it does is signal that you've practiced it a lot.


I dont see it as that "mind blowing"....

Is says nothing about your thought process?

Well it says your thinking about what to do with the extra 7% income, that implies some macro skill no? It also implies your eager to try new tactics, that speaks to creativity.

Your right, it also signals that you've practiced a lot and those who generally practice are increasing their skills and any given RTS.

I dont see what your issue is buddy? Can i call you buddy?
"Do yourself a favor, and don't listen to me."
Dionyseus
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
United States2068 Posts
September 12 2010 21:24 GMT
#117
7% is huge, i'm kinda hoping it gets patched i'm very lazy at the beginning (my apm in the beginning is like 0 but i get around 100 during the rest of the game.
9/5/10 P acct: NA D 10,683 651pts 69w56L http://sc2ranks.com/char/us/290365/LetoAtreides T acct: NA D 16,137 553pts 70w67L http://sc2ranks.com/char/us/1560008/Khrone Z: NA G 16,058 465pts 28w26L http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/1997354/Omnius
ltortoise
Profile Joined August 2010
633 Posts
September 12 2010 21:24 GMT
#118
On September 13 2010 06:19 Pandain wrote:
Also, to those who are saying that "oh, this isn't real skill and it actually might take away from the game," I would have to disagree with you. It's like SCBW where drones couldn't just auto-rally to the mineral patch. You actually had to take care of it. This adds more depth to it, you have to make sure your workers are mining to their greatest efficiency.


Dumb comparison. Telling a fresh worker to mine is nothing. It was an unfortunate distraction, but it takes almost no effort compared to exploiting this bug continuously. There is no "depth" here.
Phant
Profile Joined August 2010
United States737 Posts
September 12 2010 21:25 GMT
#119
I hope this gets patched simply because it is an extremely boring mechanic.
wxwx
Profile Joined May 2010
527 Posts
September 12 2010 21:25 GMT
#120
boring repetitive crap. I spend my mining time chatting with friends/opponent, grabbing a drink, or whatever.. And now you're saying I can't anymore?

Probably not gonna GL HF anymore too. That would put me back 20 minerals.

IMO this is bad for the game.. This isn't really micro, since you have nothing to micro against. It's basically just routine spamming that anyone can do with practice. There's no split-second decision making or reaction micro... It's just a predetermined clicking routine... Might as well award minerals to the player who types the alphabet backwards while droning... That's "keyboard skill" too am i right?
Prev 1 4 5 6 7 8 53 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 3h 59m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 592
IndyStarCraft 172
UpATreeSC 94
JuggernautJason51
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 2858
Rain 1097
Dewaltoss 198
firebathero 159
Soulkey 81
sSak 54
Mind 44
Killer 22
Dota 2
qojqva4329
League of Legends
Reynor93
Counter-Strike
fl0m1327
pashabiceps1270
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu520
Other Games
Grubby3705
FrodaN1477
B2W.Neo584
Beastyqt397
ToD167
C9.Mang0165
Sick58
MindelVK20
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1760
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 21 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH233
• davetesta35
• StrangeGG 13
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 33
• FirePhoenix13
• Michael_bg 3
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21558
• WagamamaTV581
League of Legends
• TFBlade798
Other Games
• imaqtpie1349
• Shiphtur280
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Monday
3h 59m
Kung Fu Cup
15h 59m
ByuN vs HeRoMaRinE
OSC
19h 59m
Moja vs Babymarine
Solar vs TBD
sOs vs goblin
Nice vs INexorable
sebesdes vs Iba
Nicoract vs TBD
NightMare vs TBD
OSC
1d 3h
ReBellioN vs PAPI
Spirit vs TBD
Percival vs TBD
TriGGeR vs TBD
Shameless vs UedSoldier
Cham vs TBD
Harstem vs TBD
RSL Revival
1d 13h
Cure vs SHIN
Reynor vs Zoun
Kung Fu Cup
1d 15h
The PondCast
1d 16h
RSL Revival
2 days
Classic vs TriGGeR
ByuN vs Maru
Online Event
2 days
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
BSL Team Wars
2 days
Team Bonyth vs Team Dewalt
BSL Team Wars
2 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Maestros of the Game
3 days
ShoWTimE vs Classic
Clem vs herO
Serral vs Bunny
Reynor vs Zoun
Cosmonarchy
3 days
Bonyth vs Dewalt
[BSL 2025] Weekly
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Maestros of the Game
4 days
BSL Team Wars
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Snow vs Sharp
Jaedong vs Mini
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
Light vs Speed
Larva vs Soma
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Copa Latinoamericana 4
SEL Season 2 Championship
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21: BSL Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

2025 Chongqing Offline CUP
BSL Polish World Championship 2025
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
EC S1
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.