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On April 26 2013 06:34 KrazyTrumpet wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 06:30 mataxp wrote:
I really dont want to hear "we can do better" I mean cloaken seems like a cool guy, but it just seems like a lame explanation. What other responses do people expect? This was a clusterfuck that everyone should have seen coming a mile away for the first season. I don't really understand why we have to keep beating this dead horse.
I mean, after the debacle that WCS was, one could expect that all the issues were at least discussed, and given a possible solution, I was somewhat waiting for a tease of those solutions, more advertising, date for the website, etc.
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Official Blizzard WCS shows confirmed.
Thanks Cloaken.
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On April 26 2013 06:33 Exarl25 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 06:27 shaldengeki wrote:On April 26 2013 06:22 Exarl25 wrote:
Why is everyone acting like it's only America getting screwed here? Blizzard made all regions equal in prize money as if they are equal in skill and that's where these problems are coming from in the first place. If you just region lock things then that is incredibly unfair to the Koreans, it's just punishing them for being better. WCS Korea prize money needs to be higher than the other regions, and not just 25% higher or some shit, they should be getting at least 5x as much. Do that and region lock it all and everything is nice and fair. Blizzard pretending that the monumental skill gap between regions simply doesn't exist is the root cause of these problems. I think the issue is that there's more motivating this system than just "everything should be a pure meritocracy". We all recognize that there's nothing inherent in Europeans / Americans that makes them less-good at SC2 than Koreans. So if you ever want non-Koreans to be as good as Koreans in general, you need to give them special attention and in particular spend more money incentivizing and training them. It's the same reason why we have progressive tax brackets. People at the bottom don't really deserve to be at the bottom a lot of the time; there are a lot of people who have the potential to be top-tier players, but for external reasons would never get there without some assistance. Are you completely missing the point I'm making? Sure give the foreigners a helping hand, but do it WITHOUT sucking money out of the Korean scene and screwing over everyone who isn't a Life or Innovation caliber player.
I'm not sure what you mean by "help foreigners but don't spend more money/<your_favourite_skill_metric_here> on them". Doesn't it all come down to money in the end? I assume their SC2 eSports group has some sort of budget that they try to adhere to, so spending decisions in a single season are necessarily zero-sum in nature.
It seems like you're saying that WCS ought to be a pure meritocracy with regards to tournament winnings, but I don't think that's the whole picture for Blizzard here. I'm not sure why you're saying this is "unfair" when clearly Blizzard is trying to be fair - just fair in a different way, accounting for scenes that are smaller and less well-developed.
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He has seen prototypes of some of the IPL guys' shows. State of Play hosted by Kevin Knocke incoming.
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TB looks prepared to totally wreck Cloaken!
Probably Cloaken expected the usual gang and some funny snarky comments, but not with TB and DjWheat (also sharp questions).
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TB asking the questions that need to be asked, and as much as i respect cloakens position, it feels like he has to say everything to skirt around the reply of "we know we arent ready"
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On April 26 2013 06:36 Exarl25 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 06:34 Mauldo wrote:
I'm sad that TB didn't hold him to explaining why Blizzard says it's committed to region growth but at the same time allows Koreans to come in and completely rape and pillage the WCS NA scene. Korean pillaging =/= NA scene growth
At least the Blizzard rep is holding strong and coming up with legit-enough answers. If it was just a repeat of the MLG-non-apology I'd have finally committed and switched to DOTA 2. Holy fucking shit, the Koreans are getting screwed over just as bad. Why the hell is no one speaking up for them? Acting like they are rolling in stolen cash when the vast majority of them are simply slaving away in team houses all day for nothing.
So NA doesn't deserve a scene? We can't grow a scene with teamhouses and economic foundation ourselves if we keep sacrificing our scene to our Koreans overlords.
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On April 26 2013 06:37 Prog455 wrote:
So does people actually think that the previous WCS model was better for grassroot growth?
no
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Imo WCS Na/Eu/KR should of been the exact same thing as last year except more content and more games in terms of Groups/Qualfiiers/etc to get the best of the best, region lock would be a must unless you are an actual resident (not a citizen)
This would A) allow foreigners to still play in GSL, B) allow Koreans not in GSL extra chances through both OSL and WCS KR, and C) promote local scenes
You could easily just seed players who win soemthing like an OSL or GSL, this whole unified Korean thing is just silly to me, OSL and GSL could of co existed with minimal effort between the two
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great work by JPMcD, TotalBiscuit and DJWheat today.
Blizzard deserves the haymaker face shots they are taking during SotG today.
Respect to Blizzard and CLoaken for being willing to take hte public beating they know they deserve.
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I'm still reeling from the unveiling that WCS is being ran by 4 people.
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No having a main portal website is just a fucking joke. That should be one of the very first things to get up.
It feels like Blizzard just go,
"hey let's do a (worse) regional WCS!"
"great idea!"
"okay call gsl, mlg and esl and they can sort that out. People can probably find information at TL and reddit."
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Wasnt TB a former lawyer or something? Dude is a huge asset for the show, asking the right questions.
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i wonder how pissed slasher is when he is no longer number 1 ESPORTS JOURNALIST. apparently you really can do more than email some questions and get a text response 
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TB is destroying cloaken. Not holding back. Last I saw this much destruction was when NesTea 4-0 Losira.
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On April 26 2013 06:37 shaldengeki wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 06:33 Exarl25 wrote:On April 26 2013 06:27 shaldengeki wrote:On April 26 2013 06:22 Exarl25 wrote:
Why is everyone acting like it's only America getting screwed here? Blizzard made all regions equal in prize money as if they are equal in skill and that's where these problems are coming from in the first place. If you just region lock things then that is incredibly unfair to the Koreans, it's just punishing them for being better. WCS Korea prize money needs to be higher than the other regions, and not just 25% higher or some shit, they should be getting at least 5x as much. Do that and region lock it all and everything is nice and fair. Blizzard pretending that the monumental skill gap between regions simply doesn't exist is the root cause of these problems. I think the issue is that there's more motivating this system than just "everything should be a pure meritocracy". We all recognize that there's nothing inherent in Europeans / Americans that makes them less-good at SC2 than Koreans. So if you ever want non-Koreans to be as good as Koreans in general, you need to give them special attention and in particular spend more money incentivizing and training them. It's the same reason why we have progressive tax brackets. People at the bottom don't really deserve to be at the bottom a lot of the time; there are a lot of people who have the potential to be top-tier players, but for external reasons would never get there without some assistance. Are you completely missing the point I'm making? Sure give the foreigners a helping hand, but do it WITHOUT sucking money out of the Korean scene and screwing over everyone who isn't a Life or Innovation caliber player. I'm not sure what you mean by "help foreigners but don't spend more money/<your_favourite_skill_metric_here> on them". Doesn't it all come down to money in the end? I assume their SC2 eSports group has some sort of budget that they try to adhere to, so spending decisions in a single season are necessarily zero-sum in nature. It seems like you're saying that WCS ought to be a pure meritocracy with regards to tournament winnings, but I don't think that's the whole picture for Blizzard here. I'm not sure why you're saying this is "unfair" when clearly Blizzard is trying to be fair - just fair in a different way, accounting for scenes that are smaller and less well-developed.
No that is not what I am saying. Give NA a region locked tournament with a respectable prize pool. That's great., But don't do that while killing half of Korea's tournament and giving them the same prize pool as a region with a tiny fraction of not only overall talent, but also number of competitive players. It's monumentally unfair. There is a vast skill gap between regions and the prize pools must reflect that.
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On April 26 2013 06:41 Dodgin wrote:
I'm still reeling from the unveiling that WCS is being ran by 4 people.
Not so much - delegation is at work. Mr. Chae is running WCS Korea, Sundance is running WCS Americas, and... I dunno, Carmac? is running WCS Europe.
Really, at the very top with working only with a few organizations, it's possible to run the whole thing with a relatively small group.
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Tonight: Official state of TB vs Blizzard.
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EPT
