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Switzerland2892 Posts
On November 12 2011 04:05 fishjie wrote:
They just did a SOTG where they talked about tournaments not paying out money. This was spawned by Cloud making a thread where he complained about not getting paid. How do we know Cloud isn't lying? That hasn't been verified at all. Its just internets gossip.
Because some people on SOTG are progamers and didn't get their money?
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On November 12 2011 04:05 fishjie wrote:
They just did a SOTG where they talked about tournaments not paying out money. This was spawned by Cloud making a thread where he complained about not getting paid. How do we know Cloud isn't lying? That hasn't been verified at all. Its just internets gossip.
Because It's a common thing that has happened tons of times for like 15 years? The discussion about tournaments not paying money didn't even have much to do with cloud at all, he just brought it up.
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On November 12 2011 04:05 fishjie wrote:
They just did a SOTG where they talked about tournaments not paying out money. This was spawned by Cloud making a thread where he complained about not getting paid. How do we know Cloud isn't lying? That hasn't been verified at all. Its just internets gossip.
some of them have personal experience with tournaments being slow with payment or knowing people who had to go through a lot to get paid. the problem with tournaments being slow paying is a longstanding one at that, and they are more involved with the ESCW, ESL, etc. the PPSL is a recent event that was run by someone who i don't know was a name before now. the internet might move slowly for people who f5 all day, but actually this just all happened within a week and on the other side of the planet with little to no real journalistic coverage.
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On November 12 2011 04:08 Sneakyz wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2011 04:05 fishjie wrote:
They just did a SOTG where they talked about tournaments not paying out money. This was spawned by Cloud making a thread where he complained about not getting paid. How do we know Cloud isn't lying? That hasn't been verified at all. Its just internets gossip. Because It's a common thing that has happened tons of times for like 15 years? The discussion about tournaments not paying money didn't even have much to do with cloud at all, he just brought it up.
Exactly, and they did not comment on Cloud not getting paid, but their own experiences. Which is different than them commenting on a specific event and what took place there. Nuance is important.
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On November 12 2011 04:05 fishjie wrote:
They just did a SOTG where they talked about tournaments not paying out money. This was spawned by Cloud making a thread where he complained about not getting paid. How do we know Cloud isn't lying? That hasn't been verified at all. Its just internets gossip.
You realize cloud is one of the reliable? And you do realize by the time Stog covered it there were multiple players saying the same thing. Like big names not random people. You also realize they all had personal experiences with situations such as cloud? With the same events? Your statement is null because they did have facts, they had company's making threads about it, they had personal experiences, they know players personally that were involved.
That had non of that with this at the time. I dont see how you can possibly compare. Unless your being ignorant on purpose. Artosis told his side of the story, from his own experience, and he had a decent one. They didnt know all the facts. Who knows what the true facts are completely. And on top off it all, say they did read every post, every thread and believed every word... what would have happened? they would be spewing the same shit as everyone else, and there would be nothing new. Everyone who is complaining is just sad because they made up their judgment and wanted them to repeat what they were thinking. They didnt and now your mad? Just go read the threads on the issue and get over it. This is such pointless drama hah.
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Pretty much everyone who follows community events knows the PPSL drama and who is responsible for it. What does it really matter if SotG isn't as clued up as we are for once? It's not like you need your mom to tell you a man is doing a bad thing if you hear about him murdering someone on the local news.
Gus will never manage an event again, everyone knows he's a complete tool. This doesn't need to be "approved" by SotG hosts before everyone can feel happy the situation is done.
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We obviously need Foxnews to cover e sports.
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Well hopefully they address these serious issues next stog.
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On November 12 2011 04:05 fishjie wrote:
They just did a SOTG where they talked about tournaments not paying out money. This was spawned by Cloud making a thread where he complained about not getting paid. How do we know Cloud isn't lying? That hasn't been verified at all. Its just internets gossip.
So when people like idra, on state of the game(and he did) mention some tournaments not paying out, its all internet gossip obviously and we know more about these gamers lives then they themselves.
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Switzerland2892 Posts
Nice, they upload it really faster now
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point still stands. plenty of people have come forward with evidence of wrong doing, but its all dismissed as gossip that's been sensationalized. i mean, how much more of a legit source is IGN itself and pointing out all the things that went wrong? its just the tip of the iceberg.
if this is the standard response of community leaders to brush everything off, sponsors will respond by hmmm .... not sponsoring anymore. what gus did is completely unprofessional. a nontrivial amount of money is unaccounted for. this is fact and it is unacceptable.
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On November 12 2011 07:04 fishjie wrote:
point still stands. plenty of people have come forward with evidence of wrong doing, but its all dismissed as gossip that's been sensationalized. i mean, how much more of a legit source is IGN itself and pointing out all the things that went wrong? its just the tip of the iceberg.
if this is the standard response of community leaders to brush everything off, sponsors will respond by hmmm .... not sponsoring anymore. what gus did is completely unprofessional. a nontrivial amount of money is unaccounted for. this is fact and it is unacceptable.
I think that the issue is that this entire ordeal also kind of gives IPL a bad image. With there being so many rumors and whatnot, its hard to take it all seriously, especially when its all in relation to such a big, prominent, awesome organization as IGN. Nobody thinks that IGN is at fault here, but continuing to talk about it, especially when talking about things that are not confirmed, its just dragging out an issue that IGN probably wishes would go away.
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On November 12 2011 07:04 fishjie wrote:
point still stands. plenty of people have come forward with evidence of wrong doing, but its all dismissed as gossip that's been sensationalized. i mean, how much more of a legit source is IGN itself and pointing out all the things that went wrong? its just the tip of the iceberg.
if this is the standard response of community leaders to brush everything off, sponsors will respond by hmmm .... not sponsoring anymore. what gus did is completely unprofessional. a nontrivial amount of money is unaccounted for. this is fact and it is unacceptable.
I'm sorry, but are you seriously not willing to take the word of every progamer that has competed for any number of years? This isn't even BW/sc2, it's every esport that holds tournaments. Are 90% of progamers out to lie to us about this? I don't quite understand how you can function as a human being if you think this isn't enough proof that it exists.
There is a pretty fucking big difference between one person saying one thing with shaky sources, and hundreds of people telling you, from first hand experience, that something is up. The people that pay the money themselves have even acknowledged this in that thread. I honestly don't know if you're trolling.
progamers "there are issues with getting tournament prize money"
the tournaments themselves"yes there are problems with getting prize money"
example #1 and #2 of entire orgs going under due in part to them not paying prize money
fishje: "well gee I don't know about this, can we really take literally everyone's word on this?!"
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we need two podcasts
change the name of this one to "state of the recent tournaments"
and get a second one named "state of the game"
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On November 12 2011 08:31 lolnoty wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2011 07:04 fishjie wrote:
point still stands. plenty of people have come forward with evidence of wrong doing, but its all dismissed as gossip that's been sensationalized. i mean, how much more of a legit source is IGN itself and pointing out all the things that went wrong? its just the tip of the iceberg.
if this is the standard response of community leaders to brush everything off, sponsors will respond by hmmm .... not sponsoring anymore. what gus did is completely unprofessional. a nontrivial amount of money is unaccounted for. this is fact and it is unacceptable.
I'm sorry, but are you seriously not willing to take the word of every progamer that has competed for any number of years? This isn't even BW/sc2, it's every esport that holds tournaments. Are 90% of progamers out to lie to us about this? I don't quite understand how you can function as a human being if you think this isn't enough proof that it exists. There is a pretty fucking big difference between one person saying one thing with shaky sources, and hundreds of people telling you, from first hand experience, that something is up. The people that pay the money themselves have even acknowledged this in that thread. I honestly don't know if you're trolling. progamers "there are issues with getting tournament prize money" the tournaments themselves"yes there are problems with getting prize money" example #1 and #2 of entire orgs going under due in part to them not paying prize moneyfishje: "well gee I don't know about this, can we really take literally everyone's word on this?!"
Are you sure you quoted the right post?
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Too annoyed to keep listening after such a bad response to the whole PPSL issue. I would have preferred if they just didn't comment on it at all rather than throwing around ignorant opinions that its all just sensationalized. The sources are incredibly reliable community figures (IGN, Torch, TheGunRun, Dox etc.).
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On November 12 2011 09:20 Pondo wrote:
Too annoyed to keep listening after such a bad response to the whole PPSL issue. I would have preferred if they just didn't comment on it at all rather than throwing around ignorant opinions that its all just sensationalized. The sources are incredibly reliable community figures (IGN, Torch, TheGunRun, Dox etc.).
they dont know for sure and aren't sure what to think
WOW SO ANNOYING AND UNREASONABLE
i think jp wouldn't have asked the question had he known no one knew anything, but he did because it's reasonable to assume artosis might know something, considering he was there.
but he didn't and no one else knew anything, so the final verdict was just to wait a week and see what ACTUALLY happened.
there's nothing wrong with that.
y u mad 4?
edit: im still watching myself, and tyler just said something similar (topic was brought back up thanks to artosis)
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I think it's perfectly reasonable for someone like Tyler to not want to comment on the PPSL without knowing enough about the situation.
Although, it's pretty unfair for JP to criticize the reporting of the PPSL controversy as 'sensationalized' when very credible sources have been updating us with information, on TL and shows like 'FUCK Slasher.'
And then for the panel to make a blanket statement that the community that is acting like TMZ, or being melodramatic, is pretty condescending.
Personally, I'm not that bothered by how they handled the topic, as much as I'm disappointed -- particularly in Artosis' apolitical, neutral position. To be pretend to be non-partisan about a botched tournament that he casted for can be interpreted as a cop-out, or willful ignorance of all the people that work behind-the-scenes to make his job possible.
What people wanted to hear was Artosis say, "I'm not sure if all these rumors are true, but if they are, I'm never working with or for Gus again."
Let's put it this way: if InControl were in the exact same situation (he kind of was, in the early days of NASL), there would be row after row of pitchforks pointed at him. And I can't help but think InControl wouldn't just pretend not be involved or choose not to care.
That being said, I'd encourage people to listen to Live on 3 if you want to hear passionate discussion about the state of e-sports. State of the Game has always been more about five guys talking about SC2 tournaments and random shit.
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EPT
