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On October 19 2010 17:25 loladin wrote:
I'd rather pick on the all the toss players whom he played in a row. They had litterally dosens of games to figure out his playstyle and counter it, but weren't able to do so.
You can say that the guy who runs the same crisp build seven rounds in a row has a problem to adapt, but what about the players he does it against? None of those games were even really that close, SeleCT was ripping it up before he met IdrA in the finals.
Isn't it Day[9] who says the game isn't about having a tricky or hidden strategy. It is about having faith in your own style and executing it perfectly that leads to you being a great player. I'd rather play perfectly, but predictable rather than vary my strategy and play weaker.
In the end though I think exhaustion and lack of TvZ play in practice and throughout the tournament that let IdrA dominate him. Also IdrA is a beast, so there is no shame in losing to him.
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On October 19 2010 17:25 loladin wrote:
I'd rather pick on the all the toss players whom he played in a row. They had litterally dosens of games to figure out his playstyle and counter it, but weren't able to do so.
How much of a chance have the players at the event to do such analysis at the spot though? Tyler played Huk and then went pretty much straight into the ring against select, for example.
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On October 19 2010 17:25 loladin wrote:
I'd rather pick on the all the toss players whom he played in a row. They had litterally dosens of games to figure out his playstyle and counter it, but weren't able to do so.
You can say that the guy who runs the same crisp build seven rounds in a row has a problem to adapt, but what about the players he does it against? None of those games were even really that close, SeleCT was ripping it up before he met IdrA in the finals.
Saying none of his games were even close is kind of bullshit considering how many 2-1 series he had. Its not like he 2-0d his way through the losers bracket and he went 7 games with tyler i believe. I like how the drama of him working his way through the loser's bracket is immediately remembered as him dominating everyone instead of the actual having hard fought series pretty much every step of the way.
Edit: He did amazing and his stamina is going to be stuff of nerd legend that day but someone who loses 2 series to different people and has 3 2-1 series hardly steamrolled everyone. But oh how things get distorted.
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He 2-0'ed LZgamer, TTone, qxc, and HuK (regardless of HuK kinda throwing it away in the second game). He played 2-1 vs Slush and and KiwiKaki, arguably his weakest matchup and one of the premier toss players around. He beat Tyler 3-1 (to make the final score 3-4) in the losers brackets, when coming into that game with a 1-2 from their previous match.
All this doing, the same schtick over and over again, or so it was said. To be fair though, iNcontrol also said he thought SeleCT played brilliantly.
As long as his crisp build kept on working and winning, I don't see the need to change it up.
EDIT: bigjenk, you have a point, I might have been a little too heavy handed with my compliments on SeleCTs pre-"Grand Finale" games -- regardless though, I still think my main point from the first post stands.
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On October 19 2010 18:20 loladin wrote:
He 2-0'ed LZgamer, TTone, qxc, and HuK (regardless of HuK kinda throwing it away in the second game). He played 2-1 vs Slush and and KiwiKaki, arguably his weakest matchup and one of the premier toss players around. He beat Tyler 3-1 (to make the final score 3-4) in the losers brackets, when coming into that game with a 1-2 from their previous match.
All this doing, the same schtick over and over again, or so it was said. To be fair though, iNcontrol also said he thought SeleCT played brilliantly.
As long as his crisp build kept on working and winning, I don't see the need to change it up.
EDIT: bigjenk, you have a point, I might have been a little too heavy handed with my compliments on SeleCTs pre-"Grand Finale" games -- regardless though, I still think my main point from the first post stands.
I'm taking nothing away from what he did, i think it is more impressive that he faced elimination games in many series including having to 3-1 tyler. I think it is pretty apparent in the state of high end terran right now hyper aggression from mid game on is necessary and that pretty much neccesitates heavy mmm. Picking on him using the same type of build most games is pretty much like picking on fruitdealer for pretty much going hatch first every game he could get away with it. Im not sure what people want to see out of terran as meching pretty much cedes map control for a majority of the game. I actually think bio is much more exciting to watch then terran meching and going for a 200 push.
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All of you 1200 level armchair SC2 philosophers can talk once you're even good enough to get invited to MLG. SeleCT played practically 8 hours straight and beat every good toss in NA, plus dominated QXC and Slush.
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that's what makes this forum fun, to be able to be an armchair pro and discuss. If not this community would be non-existant only populated by pros who are to busy playing the game to actually post and interact with other people.
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On October 19 2010 21:59 PJA wrote:
All of you 1200 level armchair SC2 philosophers can talk once you're even good enough to get invited to MLG. SeleCT played practically 8 hours straight and beat every good toss in NA, plus dominated QXC and Slush.
I'm guessing when you're fed shit at a 5 star restaurant, you just sit there and smile while eating it up eh?
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On October 19 2010 21:59 PJA wrote:
All of you 1200 level armchair SC2 philosophers can talk once you're even good enough to get invited to MLG. SeleCT played practically 8 hours straight and beat every good toss in NA, plus dominated QXC and Slush.
I didn't realize one had to be one of the best to be knowledgeable about a subject. I guess none of us say say the Beatles were better than Justin Bieber considering we haven't sold albums
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On October 19 2010 12:53 GenoZStriker wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2010 12:34 TehRaZer wrote:On October 19 2010 07:32 learning wrote:
BTW: You should try and get a TERRAN player on the cast who ISN'T afraid to speak up and join in on some debate with the King Protoss that are Tyler and inControl.
I'd like to see Morrow in there. iNcontroL will eat MorroW alive. I mean that in every possible way you could think off. The thing is that MLG did not allow the players to look at the replays after their games, so the players from the looks of it did not really realize that SelecT was playing the same build. iNcontroL and Idra both realized it during SelecT's games against KiWiKaKi followed by HuK on the big screen, that he was doing the exact same build over and over again, which is why Idra also crushed him because he knew exactly what he was going to do. Unlike QXC who mixed things up, SelecT didn't which is why QXC was a much tougher fight for Idra than SelecT was. Maybe if he iNcontroL had said that it might not have sound as bad as you guys make it seem. And that's why iNcontroL says that SelecT will have to mix things up in the future because you come across someone like Idra who knows you'll be playing the same build every game, he's going to get crushed. But a job well done nonetheless for second place.
If I recall, Select didn't even use the same army composition against Idra as he did against his Protoss opponents. At the very least, at the moment of his crushing defeat he was trying to push with mainly marines and tanks, not mmm. I don't think it makes sense that a Zerg studying a Terran's TvP and TvT can predict how the Terran will play TvZ, though a minor case can be made for Idra perhaps watching the single TvZ Select played at the tourney.
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will there be a SotG for this week, or will are the Minicasts going to take the place of this week's cast?
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On October 19 2010 22:41 KevinIX wrote:
will there be a SotG for this week, or will are the Minicasts going to take the place of this week's cast?
On October 19 2010 12:43 itmeJP wrote:
We won't be doing a podcast tonight (Monday) but we will do one on Tuesday night. Sorry, too exhausted from the event and traveled cross country today.
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8751 Posts
On October 19 2010 17:58 Ghad wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2010 17:25 loladin wrote:
I'd rather pick on the all the toss players whom he played in a row. They had litterally dosens of games to figure out his playstyle and counter it, but weren't able to do so.
How much of a chance have the players at the event to do such analysis at the spot though? Tyler played Huk and then went pretty much straight into the ring against select, for example.
lol yeah this kid has it backwards. i owned select on friday... pretty much would have been 3-0 if i hadnt slipped up w/ silly errors a bit in game 1. then select had a day to think about how he'd adjust if he played me again. i went into the tournament knowing how to beat what he was doing. what was stupid is that i tried different builds things the 2nd time i played him because i assumed i'd need to. i think i would have done much better if i had played 1 build over and over against him because i think i can outplay him when he does his one build order and i do my one build order. at least the evidence points toward that being true
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On October 19 2010 23:02 Liquid`Tyler wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2010 17:58 Ghad wrote:On October 19 2010 17:25 loladin wrote:
I'd rather pick on the all the toss players whom he played in a row. They had litterally dosens of games to figure out his playstyle and counter it, but weren't able to do so.
How much of a chance have the players at the event to do such analysis at the spot though? Tyler played Huk and then went pretty much straight into the ring against select, for example. lol yeah this kid has it backwards. i owned select on friday... pretty much would have been 3-0 if i hadnt slipped up w/ silly errors a bit in game 1. then select had a day to think about how he'd adjust if he played me again. i went into the tournament knowing how to beat what he was doing. what was stupid is that i tried different builds things the 2nd time i played him because i assumed i'd need to. i think i would have done much better if i had played 1 build over and over against him because i think i can outplay him when he does his one build order and i do my one build order. at least the evidence points toward that being true
Yeah, I think it would've worked :/ But you played very very well anyway.
btw, nice to see that you like elliott smith
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On October 19 2010 23:02 Liquid`Tyler wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2010 17:58 Ghad wrote:On October 19 2010 17:25 loladin wrote:
I'd rather pick on the all the toss players whom he played in a row. They had litterally dosens of games to figure out his playstyle and counter it, but weren't able to do so.
How much of a chance have the players at the event to do such analysis at the spot though? Tyler played Huk and then went pretty much straight into the ring against select, for example. lol yeah this kid has it backwards. i owned select on friday... pretty much would have been 3-0 if i hadnt slipped up w/ silly errors a bit in game 1. then select had a day to think about how he'd adjust if he played me again. i went into the tournament knowing how to beat what he was doing. what was stupid is that i tried different builds things the 2nd time i played him because i assumed i'd need to. i think i would have done much better if i had played 1 build over and over against him because i think i can outplay him when he does his one build order and i do my one build order. at least the evidence points toward that being true
So u got psyched out by a robot, I mean sticking with the same build did great by him.
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United States7481 Posts
I don't know why people give select shit for doing the same build vP when Idra did the same essential build vT every game. If what you have works, go for it!
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Doing a build everyone knows you will do and still winning is pretty impresive for me.
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No podcast this week? 
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Not really impressive when all these Ps fell to same strat over and over, its really on the protoss players shoulders to be able to adapt.
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On October 19 2010 23:46 Congism wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2010 23:02 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On October 19 2010 17:58 Ghad wrote:On October 19 2010 17:25 loladin wrote:
I'd rather pick on the all the toss players whom he played in a row. They had litterally dosens of games to figure out his playstyle and counter it, but weren't able to do so.
How much of a chance have the players at the event to do such analysis at the spot though? Tyler played Huk and then went pretty much straight into the ring against select, for example. lol yeah this kid has it backwards. i owned select on friday... pretty much would have been 3-0 if i hadnt slipped up w/ silly errors a bit in game 1. then select had a day to think about how he'd adjust if he played me again. i went into the tournament knowing how to beat what he was doing. what was stupid is that i tried different builds things the 2nd time i played him because i assumed i'd need to. i think i would have done much better if i had played 1 build over and over against him because i think i can outplay him when he does his one build order and i do my one build order. at least the evidence points toward that being true So u got physced out by a robot, I mean sticking with the same build did great by him.
The winner of the ESL does not get psyched* out by a robot.
On that note, Idra GSL fighting!
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EPT
