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Taking something completely out of context isn't clever or smart. Don't misquote people.
TvZ Balance Suggestions - Page 63
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FC.Strike
United States621 Posts
Taking something completely out of context isn't clever or smart. Don't misquote people. | ||
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TRAP[yoo]
Hungary6026 Posts
On August 13 2010 06:24 oldahe wrote: Dear Friends, I understand how it is easier to complain about alleged imba, rather the trying to just play better. Sure, the game is in an early stage, sure some stuff needs to be sorted out. Here i give you TLO´s most recent Zerg vs Terran ownage. Its a great example on how Zerg has a ton of options to deal with terran. http://tv.esl.eu/de/vod/22313 gg can i ask you a question? why bother posting if you have no clue?! read the thread carefully and realize that a terran who goes nearly all bio is not a problem in the slightest. this match says NOTHING about balance...its the arguably best german player against a guy from blizzard...wtf. in the game he loses the thor in a stupid fashion and does zero damage against the zerg because hes afraid of zerglings who are running into a wallin... and the only things tlo does are infestor harass(which he is kinda known for in zvt) and a drop on a terran who is already dead because hes one base against three. | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:10 FC.Strike wrote: Taking something completely out of context isn't clever or smart. Don't misquote people. I was just saying that this isn't anything new. It's always been a complaint, and if they didn't feel the need to fix it in Brood War, I don't see the need to fix it now with nerfed SCVs. EDIT: And how was I misquoting? I was making a bit of a satire, if anything, but that is a literal post Day9 made in 2005. | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:15 TRAP[yoo] wrote: can i ask you a question? why bother posting if you have no clue?! read the thread carefully and realize that a terran who goes nearly all bio is not a problem in the slightest. this match says NOTHING about balance...its the arguably best german player against a guy from blizzard...wtf. in the game he loses the thor in a stupid fashion and does zero damage against the zerg because hes afraid of zerglings who are running into a wallin... and the only things tlo does are infestor harass(which he is kinda known for in zvt) and a drop on a terran who is already dead because hes one base against three. That actually brings up a good point. Bio is horribly underpowered. If mech was nerfed, as everyone seems to want, then Bio would need a buff or twenty. Seems really game breaking, IMO. | ||
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Iggyhopper
United States259 Posts
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:31 Iggyhopper wrote: If mech is so bad after the patch that bio needs a buff, then maybe it's time for Terran to be completely redone. I mean Zerg retain 90% of what was in SC, Protoss retain 60%. It's Terran that went balls to the wall and has way too many changes. It could be argued, and should be argued, that Zerg needs complete redoing. It's hard to say though, as PvZ seems pretty balanced, and TvP seems pretty balanced. Of course, according to Blizzard, every matchup is at around 50% win/loss at all levels of play, which is all anyone can hope for. | ||
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TRAP[yoo]
Hungary6026 Posts
and i have to agree...bio is very weak. another argument would be that you cant fight the zerg army directly but instead you have to use drops and such...sounds familiar  | ||
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epik640x
United States1134 Posts
Banelings may kill marines but that's all they kill and they are melee and expensive and take away lings. | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:34 TRAP[yoo] wrote: bio is not underpowered but banelings just rape marines^^ and i have to agree...bio is very weak. another argument would be that you cant fight the zerg army directly but instead you have to use drops and such...sounds familiar Banelings rape marines, and mutas rape marauders. . .hum, sounds beat to me. XD. Pretty much Muta Baneling Zergling destroys anything without tanks, effectively. | ||
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Iggyhopper
United States259 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:33 MythicalMage wrote: It could be argued, and should be argued, that Zerg needs complete redoing. It's hard to say though, as PvZ seems pretty balanced, and TvP seems pretty balanced. Of course, according to Blizzard, every matchup is at around 50% win/loss at all levels of play, which is all anyone can hope for. If they get a buff -- Protoss already have a hard enough time bio. Zerg and Terran need tweaking. | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:38 epik640x wrote: I don't think bio is weak at all. With medivacs and being able to stim and kite the entire zerg T1 force is pretty broken and medivacs need a nerf. Roaches don't even heal that fast burrowed with the healing upgrade. Banelings may kill marines but that's all they kill and they are melee and expensive and take away lings. Perhaps at a low level, but at the pro level, Zergs, like IdrA, do a little dance when the Terran doesn't go mech. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:38 epik640x wrote: I don't think bio is weak at all. With medivacs and being able to stim and kite the entire zerg T1 force is pretty broken and medivacs need a nerf. Roaches don't even heal that fast burrowed with the healing upgrade. Banelings may kill marines but that's all they kill and they are melee and expensive and take away lings. According to Idra, the only reason bio is playable at all is because tanks are absurdly strong regardless of whether you're playing bio and mech, and that Terran is riding a large enough economic advantage in the midgame that it doesn't matter if bio is weak. If zerg weren't playing catch-up all game, infestors/banelings would be prohibitively strong against bio. | ||
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EleanorRIgby
Canada3923 Posts
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Iggyhopper
United States259 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:48 EleanorRIgby wrote: It's very easy to tell a good Zerg from a bad Zerg. It's kind of hard to tell a good 'toss from a bad one.this is like reading one of those flavour of the month op class threads in the wow forums, zergs are well represented at the top of the ladders and arguments like "only newbs play terran" are just stupid Good Terran and bad Terran are only separated by micro. This also explains why the Korean Terran are owning Zerg. This is also why TLO is a very good Terran player. I'm pulling this out of my ass but from the things I see and hear, it's a good claim. | ||
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SpicyCrab
402 Posts
You're right. To the zerg players complaining that ZvT is "unbalanced" You're right. To the terran and protoss players saying "it's not unbalanced." Please try it from the other side. See what it is like to lose to players you are obviously MUCH better than, see what it's like to barely squeeze out wins from complete noobs because they know how to build a couple tanks. Seriously, try it out and tell me it's fair. Better yet, show us zerg (well actually I play random) players what we're supposed to be doing to overcome it, nobody else has been able to figure it out. | ||
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Antpile
United States213 Posts
I never see toss players claiming that they want their robo units to be an army in itself and require no gateway support. Zerg players never... well, i'm not even sure how you'd divide the zerg army into two seperate types. Why is it so terrible if bio needs some tank support or if mech needs marines to keep air off of them? That's the whole reason the Thor was buffed as far as I can tell, so that the terran didn't have to make marines to fight mutas and could build an entirely mech army. I personally think that was the patch that broke ZvT. In the same patch, they buffed the crap out of missile turrets and gave Thor's a very powerful AE air attack. The matchup went from zerg using mutas to counter mech (tanks mostly) to not being able to counter mech at all. | ||
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st3roids
Greece538 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:20 MythicalMage wrote: That actually brings up a good point. Bio is horribly underpowered. If mech was nerfed, as everyone seems to want, then Bio would need a buff or twenty. Seems really game breaking, IMO. pls before posting nonsense watch qxc vs machine bio ghost build , then come and tell us how bad it is nvm i posted it so every1 can see http://starcraft2reps.com/index.php?a=details&id=1127 | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
About the replay: If you happened to watch Root Gaming's stream last night, you would have noticed that qxc tried the ghost mass snipe build against a drunken Sheth, and almost got utterly crushed. He only won, and barely at that, with a heavy marauder transition. EDIT: The link to the root gaming thing can be found here. | ||
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fantastix
Germany5 Posts
On August 13 2010 07:40 MythicalMage wrote: Banelings rape marines, and mutas rape marauders. . .hum, sounds beat to me. XD. Pretty much Muta Baneling Zergling destroys anything without tanks, effectively. dude that is just wrong, i can also say, marauder rape banelings and marines rape mutas, you gotmy point? .... | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 13 2010 08:25 fantastix wrote: dude that is just wrong, i can also say, marauder rape banelings and marines rape mutas, you gotmy point? .... Marines don't rape mutas. They're cost effective, sure, but they're not ideal. And banelings, and zerglings to a greater extent, do kill marauders. It may take five banelings to kill one marauder, but it'll kill the five other units around that marauder too. EDIT: None of this matters. Muta baneling zergling is the most standard way to beat bio. Bio is anything but strong, in a professional scene. | ||
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