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The state of Battle.net 2.0 - Page 25

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Renaissance
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Canada273 Posts
May 24 2010 16:30 GMT
#481
On May 25 2010 01:25 EliteAzn wrote:
Please hold off the complaining until the game comes out.

For the billionth time by the billionth person
THIS IS BETA

This post would be acceptable if the release date wasn't TWO MONTHS AWAY.
Live forever or die trying.
Necrosjef
Profile Joined March 2010
United Kingdom530 Posts
May 24 2010 16:31 GMT
#482
On May 25 2010 01:25 EliteAzn wrote:
Please hold off the complaining until the game comes out.

For the billionth time by the billionth person
THIS IS BETA


Umad?
Europe Server Diamond Player: ID=Necrosjef Code=957
Sinensis
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States2513 Posts
May 24 2010 16:31 GMT
#483
Just as an example of the effect lack of LAN is having on the game, take a look at the Florida TL meet up. Only 16 people could play at the same time because there is a maximum users per IP limit. There were around 100 of us there. I think that's the moment I completely lost faith in bnet 2.0.

You can wave your "it's just a beta" psalms from your fanboy bible around all you want, potential esports titles in their beta stage (2 months before release, mind you) should be able to be played at LAN events.
irishash
Profile Joined November 2008
United States285 Posts
May 24 2010 16:32 GMT
#484
On May 25 2010 01:30 Renaissance wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 25 2010 01:25 EliteAzn wrote:
Please hold off the complaining until the game comes out.

For the billionth time by the billionth person
THIS IS BETA

This post would be acceptable if the release date wasn't TWO MONTHS AWAY.


um think about it. it took overnight for blizzard to patch some huge changes to zerg, and you think two months isn't enough time to make some other major changes if they want?
Bibdy
Profile Joined March 2010
United States3481 Posts
May 24 2010 16:35 GMT
#485
Things can be fixed just as quickly as they're broken. Have any of you ever worked in software?
Perfect Balance
Profile Joined April 2010
Norway131 Posts
May 24 2010 16:36 GMT
#486
Telling people that they shouldn't complain about a game before they buy it, is asinine.

A company is deliberately trying to minimize communication between its customers, and implementing features that aim at getting a peek at your private life and habits - THEN making you sign an agreement saying they can use that information for any purpose - is clearly open for criticism.
"Do you REALLY want chat rooms?" - You're good Blizzard! I was just fakin' it!
PokePill
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States1048 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-24 16:36:57
May 24 2010 16:36 GMT
#487
On May 25 2010 01:32 irishash wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 25 2010 01:30 Renaissance wrote:
On May 25 2010 01:25 EliteAzn wrote:
Please hold off the complaining until the game comes out.

For the billionth time by the billionth person
THIS IS BETA

This post would be acceptable if the release date wasn't TWO MONTHS AWAY.


um think about it. it took overnight for blizzard to patch some huge changes to zerg, and you think two months isn't enough time to make some other major changes if they want?


How about some real perspective? They've been working on this game since mid 2003. Why would they be able to do something in 2 months that they couldn't do properly in 7 years?
Bibdy
Profile Joined March 2010
United States3481 Posts
May 24 2010 16:38 GMT
#488
On May 25 2010 01:36 Perfect Balance wrote:
Telling people that they shouldn't complain about a game before they buy it, is asinine.

A company is deliberately trying to minimize communication between its customers, and implementing features that aim at getting a peek at your private life and habits - THEN making you sign an agreement saying they can use that information for any purpose - is clearly open for criticism.


Then don't use it. You're not forced to sign up for Facebook integration in order to play the game. I would think that people using Facebook already either aren't aware, or don't care, about their privacy, anyway. This whole security madness about Facebook recently is hilarious. Like all of a sudden people realized they're putting personal information on the internet on a daily basis.
EliteAzn
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States661 Posts
May 24 2010 16:41 GMT
#489
remember, there is a huge hardware/software update that is triggering the end of phase 1.

Start making complaint posts after phase 2 begins.
(╯`Д´)╯︵ ┻━┻ High Five! _o /\ o_
Renaissance
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Canada273 Posts
May 24 2010 16:45 GMT
#490
Let's complain when things are fully finalized. Great idea.
Live forever or die trying.
Perfect Balance
Profile Joined April 2010
Norway131 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-24 16:46:29
May 24 2010 16:46 GMT
#491
Then don't use it. You're not forced to sign up for Facebook integration in order to play the game. I would think that people using Facebook already either aren't aware, or don't care, about their privacy, anyway. This whole security madness about Facebook recently is hilarious. Like all of a sudden people realized they're putting personal information on the internet on a daily basis.


You're signing an agreement with Blizzard as you enter Battle.net. They can use any of your chat, text, any map you produce and any custom content, and sell it for their own gain. That's ONE issue. Then there is the missing: LAN, basic chat, customized games, hosting, clan support.

The users are getting a bad deal, and being led behind the light, it's sickening that so many of you accept this.
"Do you REALLY want chat rooms?" - You're good Blizzard! I was just fakin' it!
Seltsam
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States343 Posts
May 24 2010 16:48 GMT
#492
I can't wait to see one of two things:
Ether
A - All the stuff everyone is complaining isn't in the beta is in the retail version and everyone who bitched and moaned about how there it was missing in beta feels like a moron.

B - None of that stuff is in the beta and everyone who is bitching and moaning without making any constructive comments will bitch and moan about how their counter-productive bitching and moaning didn't make Blizzard see the incredible wisdom behind their angsty bitching and moaning.

I don't know which is more likely, and I hope it's A because I want to see that stuff implemented, too. But do people seriously expect to say shit like "Blizzard just wants money so they are making battlenet 2 suck so that idiots buy it" really is going to solve anything?

Really, if everyone just stopped and asked, "what am I hoping to accomplish with this post?" before they posted, there would either be a lot more constructive posts here, or a lot fewer overall posts.
Team Limited ftw! www.teamltd.net
Liquid`Jinro
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Sweden33719 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-24 16:50:58
May 24 2010 16:48 GMT
#493
On May 25 2010 00:37 rackdude wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 24 2010 23:52 HalfAmazing wrote:
There is no such thing as a casual gamer. He is an excuse to shove shit down your throat. You don't appreciate the taste of shit? MAYBE YOU'RE TOO HARDCORE. MAYBE YOU NEED TO BE MORE CASUAL.

You think a casual gamer doesn't want chat channels, LAN, or any of that good stuff? WHY NOT? YOU THINK "THE CASUAL GAMER" IS SOME KIND OF RETARD? If something matters to you, then you're HARDCORE. If you don't give a shit, you're CASUAL.

"THE CASUAL GAMER" is an invention by Blizzard's marketing department. Some fictionalized ignoramus who loves the buckets and buckets of shit shoveled into his mouth. "OHHH NOM NOM NOM YUM YUM BLIZZARD SHIT IS THE GOOD SHIT." "THE CASUAL GAMER" is some apathetic tool with no discerning appetite who'll eat whatever shit he's offered.

"THE CASUAL GAMER" is easy to cater to, as he has no desires, demands or concerns! If you're only disappointing EVERY. SINGLE. HARDCORE. player in the world, fear not, because "THE CASUAL GAMER" will still buy it!

Blizzard is just using "THE CASUAL GAMER" to deprive you of basic functionality in an effort to achieve greater control over your gaming experience. Because you care, you're HARDCORE and you're just not the target demographic. SORRY. "THE CASUAL GAMER" is a fucking myth.


No, they DO exist. THEY come from things like C&C and WOW. Why would you BUY those games if you're NOT casual?

But seriously, there are casual gamers. Most of them are age 20ish-40 women who do "microgaming". They pay the most for in game content and they constantly flip games for the newest Zombies vs Plants. I thought my mom (yeah, my mom) was odd that she did that, but it's now becoming the norm. And it's a big cash cow. Blizzard is trying to get that demographic because they have the money, but they normally only buy smaller games. So you can see Blizzard's active attempt to get the demographic.

http://www.1pstart.com/women-dominate-casual-gaming/ (Read the title)

http://www.forbes.com/2008/03/13/casual-gaming-women-tech-personal-cx_bc_0314casual.html

http://news.vgchartz.com/news.php?id=5995

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04/17/technology/17drill.html

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704882404574463652777885432.html (Activision is mentioned in this one)

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2006/10/7922.ars



Now does the marketing make sense? Does the UI make sense? Does the censorship make sense? It just follows this research (and much more). They took the man who implemented casual gaming into Xbox (Xbox arcade) and made him head of Bnet 2.0


There is also a lot of research into achievements and casual gaming. I cannot find it right now because I think it was a few psychology papers from journals, but they are finding this demographic and they are finding they have the money. You know what else you find? They want the "fluff"/achievements.

PS. RANDOM CAPS is very annoying at least to me. You MAY want to not use them. It will get your point across better.

What kind of retard would you have to be (and I don't mean you btw) to think you are going to get the "soccermom" demographic to play an RTS game because of achievments?

I mean, what makes anyone think they are going to go for THIS:
[image loading]

Just because the game has achievments? Really?

Also, I would have thought this is exactly the demographic that would appreciate chat features, but I guess not.

On May 25 2010 01:41 EliteAzn wrote:
remember, there is a huge hardware/software update that is triggering the end of phase 1.

Start making complaint posts after phase 2 begins.

I think the majority of complaints comes from things that Blizzard has officially said WONT be in the game by release but will MAYBE be added later.
Moderatortell the guy that interplanatar interaction is pivotal to terrans variety of optionitudals in the pre-midgame preperatories as well as the protosstinal deterriggation of elite zergling strikes - Stimey n | Formerly FrozenArbiter
Bibdy
Profile Joined March 2010
United States3481 Posts
May 24 2010 16:49 GMT
#494
On May 25 2010 01:46 Perfect Balance wrote:
Show nested quote +
Then don't use it. You're not forced to sign up for Facebook integration in order to play the game. I would think that people using Facebook already either aren't aware, or don't care, about their privacy, anyway. This whole security madness about Facebook recently is hilarious. Like all of a sudden people realized they're putting personal information on the internet on a daily basis.


You're signing an agreement with Blizzard as you enter Battle.net. They can use any of your chat, text, any map you produce and any custom content, and sell it for their own gain. That's ONE issue. Then there is the missing: LAN, basic chat, customized games, hosting, clan support.

The users are getting a bad deal, and being led behind the light, it's sickening that so many of you accept this.


Me, I'm paying for a game that I get to play and kill imaginary things in during my spare time after work. I don't plan to release any personal information or recite my potentially award-winning novels to people in the middle of these games.

I don't need Facebook to do any of that, either. I log in, kill stuff, log out.

Now, if you're the kind of person who opens up every conversation with "Hey, want to hear about this amazing screenplay I wrote?", then yeah, you might run into problems.
LaughingTulkas
Profile Joined March 2008
United States1107 Posts
May 24 2010 16:52 GMT
#495
On May 25 2010 01:27 junemermaid wrote:
All this rage is expected from people who don't understand what is being done. B.net 2.0 is the new system that Blizzard is using for ALL THEIR GAMES, not just sc2. This is on the level of a Steam client release.

Does anyone remember Steam's release? Buggy friends list, laggy as hell connections, crashes on start up, inability to launch games, chat windows that wouldn't deliver messages, updates that never installed properly, memory leaks, the list goes on and on.

This doesn't get ironed out in the beta phase (steam didn't, so why do we expect this from bnet 2.0?). A lot of steam's functionality wasn't implemented until quite some time later. I expect no more or less from bnet 2.0. When all is said and done, however, I expect b.net 2.0 to live up to all the hype its garnered. This should include all the points being discussed currently (chat rooms, global ladder, tournament systems, clan channels, online replays etc...). To demand it at release or during beta unwarranted; demanding it during launch is a little more reasonable, but understandable if it isn't delivered.

Anyone expecting a smooth and easy ride when buying on day 0 for SC2 is naive. All I need to do is point to Half-Life 2 & CS:S implementation of steam for precedence.


Nobody below you responded to this and I think it's quite insightful. QFT.
"I love noobies, they're so happy." -Chill
Perfect Balance
Profile Joined April 2010
Norway131 Posts
May 24 2010 16:57 GMT
#496
On May 25 2010 01:49 Bibdy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 25 2010 01:46 Perfect Balance wrote:
Then don't use it. You're not forced to sign up for Facebook integration in order to play the game. I would think that people using Facebook already either aren't aware, or don't care, about their privacy, anyway. This whole security madness about Facebook recently is hilarious. Like all of a sudden people realized they're putting personal information on the internet on a daily basis.


You're signing an agreement with Blizzard as you enter Battle.net. They can use any of your chat, text, any map you produce and any custom content, and sell it for their own gain. That's ONE issue. Then there is the missing: LAN, basic chat, customized games, hosting, clan support.

The users are getting a bad deal, and being led behind the light, it's sickening that so many of you accept this.


Me, I'm paying for a game that I get to play and kill imaginary things in during my spare time after work. I don't plan to release any personal information or recite my potentially award-winning novels to people in the middle of these games.

I don't need Facebook to do any of that, either. I log in, kill stuff, log out.

Now, if you're the kind of person who opens up every conversation with "Hey, want to hear about this amazing screenplay I wrote?", then yeah, you might run into problems.


Comedy is a good way of disarming serious topics that need to be discussed, good job.

There are some major issues here: Our privacy is being violated without any prior notice, the work that we put into a custom map is stolen by Blizzard to make money. The user will receive a small "cut" of the income Blizzard makes from selling content that you've made. This would be illegal if you didn't sign an agreement giving away all your rights to Blizzard. They can basically do anything they want with ANY of your facebook information without your permission.

After deliberately removing LAN, chat, clan support and some basic features to prevent users from communicating, Blizzard will steal your map and charge people money for it, hi-jack your LAN event and demand a cut from the income, then sell your private information to an ad company.
"Do you REALLY want chat rooms?" - You're good Blizzard! I was just fakin' it!
xenocide.psv
Profile Joined May 2010
United States25 Posts
May 24 2010 17:02 GMT
#497
On May 25 2010 01:27 junemermaid wrote:
All this rage is expected from people who don't understand what is being done. B.net 2.0 is the new system that Blizzard is using for ALL THEIR GAMES, not just sc2. This is on the level of a Steam client release.

Does anyone remember Steam's release? Buggy friends list, laggy as hell connections, crashes on start up, inability to launch games, chat windows that wouldn't deliver messages, updates that never installed properly, memory leaks, the list goes on and on.

This doesn't get ironed out in the beta phase (steam didn't, so why do we expect this from bnet 2.0?). A lot of steam's functionality wasn't implemented until quite some time later. I expect no more or less from bnet 2.0. When all is said and done, however, I expect b.net 2.0 to live up to all the hype its garnered. This should include all the points being discussed currently (chat rooms, global ladder, tournament systems, clan channels, online replays etc...). To demand it at release or during beta unwarranted; demanding it during launch is a little more reasonable, but understandable if it isn't delivered.

Anyone expecting a smooth and easy ride when buying on day 0 for SC2 is naive. All I need to do is point to Half-Life 2 & CS:S implementation of steam for precedence.


Yea, I was there on release day, and have used Steam since then, and it took them something like 3-4 years to make it good. Do you really want a game you already waited over a decade for to take 3-4 ADDITIONAL years to be playable? I sure as hell don't, especially not when they had a perfect system in place before, and decided to replace it with a dumbed down, less functional one. Battle.net in SC1 was closer to what Steam is now, and the new Battle.net is terrible in comparison.
Spawkuring
Profile Joined July 2008
United States755 Posts
May 24 2010 17:05 GMT
#498
On May 25 2010 01:27 junemermaid wrote:
All this rage is expected from people who don't understand what is being done. B.net 2.0 is the new system that Blizzard is using for ALL THEIR GAMES, not just sc2. This is on the level of a Steam client release.

Does anyone remember Steam's release? Buggy friends list, laggy as hell connections, crashes on start up, inability to launch games, chat windows that wouldn't deliver messages, updates that never installed properly, memory leaks, the list goes on and on.

This doesn't get ironed out in the beta phase (steam didn't, so why do we expect this from bnet 2.0?). A lot of steam's functionality wasn't implemented until quite some time later. I expect no more or less from bnet 2.0. When all is said and done, however, I expect b.net 2.0 to live up to all the hype its garnered. This should include all the points being discussed currently (chat rooms, global ladder, tournament systems, clan channels, online replays etc...). To demand it at release or during beta unwarranted; demanding it during launch is a little more reasonable, but understandable if it isn't delivered.

Anyone expecting a smooth and easy ride when buying on day 0 for SC2 is naive. All I need to do is point to Half-Life 2 & CS:S implementation of steam for precedence.


The difference between this and Steam is that Steam at the very least had a solid core of features, and most of the problems it had were purely technical. I don't mind the fact that Bnet is laggy right now because it's a beta, and beta is when such issues are ironed out.

The main issue people have with Bnet isn't some technical problems, it's the INTENTIONAL, CALCULATED decisions to remove many of the features the community once enjoyed or desired in the name of control. There are no technical limitations with chat channels or cross-region play (even people in Europe say that lag between regions is minimal). Blizzard purposely removed these things and many of them show no signs of coming back. I honestly don't know what custom mapmakers are gonna do now that they have to live with the fact that they can only publish so many maps worth of content, or the fact that they can take everything we make and sell it at any time. It goes far beyond simple lag issues, and that's why we're upset.
mav451
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1596 Posts
May 24 2010 17:07 GMT
#499
Maybe I have a rosy memory, but I don't recall Steam having nearly the same amount of problems we are seeing with BNet2.0. With Steam, that platform was constantly and _quickly_ getting updated. Valve had no problems patching the platform quickly, sometimes even multiple times on the same day to fix problems. Blizzard isn't even close to as responsive as that yet.

Does it worry me? Yes.
With no power comes no responsibility?
Bibdy
Profile Joined March 2010
United States3481 Posts
May 24 2010 17:08 GMT
#500
On May 25 2010 01:57 Perfect Balance wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 25 2010 01:49 Bibdy wrote:
On May 25 2010 01:46 Perfect Balance wrote:
Then don't use it. You're not forced to sign up for Facebook integration in order to play the game. I would think that people using Facebook already either aren't aware, or don't care, about their privacy, anyway. This whole security madness about Facebook recently is hilarious. Like all of a sudden people realized they're putting personal information on the internet on a daily basis.


You're signing an agreement with Blizzard as you enter Battle.net. They can use any of your chat, text, any map you produce and any custom content, and sell it for their own gain. That's ONE issue. Then there is the missing: LAN, basic chat, customized games, hosting, clan support.

The users are getting a bad deal, and being led behind the light, it's sickening that so many of you accept this.


Me, I'm paying for a game that I get to play and kill imaginary things in during my spare time after work. I don't plan to release any personal information or recite my potentially award-winning novels to people in the middle of these games.

I don't need Facebook to do any of that, either. I log in, kill stuff, log out.

Now, if you're the kind of person who opens up every conversation with "Hey, want to hear about this amazing screenplay I wrote?", then yeah, you might run into problems.


Comedy is a good way of disarming serious topics that need to be discussed, good job.

There are some major issues here: Our privacy is being violated without any prior notice, the work that we put into a custom map is stolen by Blizzard to make money. The user will receive a small "cut" of the income Blizzard makes from selling content that you've made. This would be illegal if you didn't sign an agreement giving away all your rights to Blizzard. They can basically do anything they want with ANY of your facebook information without your permission.

After deliberately removing LAN, chat, clan support and some basic features to prevent users from communicating, Blizzard will steal your map and charge people money for it, hi-jack your LAN event and demand a cut from the income, then sell your private information to an ad company.


Considering they're playing the role of the distributer, retailer and marketer, and they developed the tool you used to produce said content, do you really see them doing it any other way? Are they just meant to give you all this stuff for free?
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