Oh Micro, Where Art Thou?

LaLuSh

Sweden2358 Posts

April 26 2010 23:32 GMT

Thanks to Opp4 for helping me record the videos. And thanks to Pholon for helping me with the pictures.

Starcraft 2 – The devolution of micro: units somehow lost their ability to dance. Are we sure this isn’t a prequel to Starcraft?

Preface

This is a thread that I have been wanting to write ever since the beginning of the beta. It is about a feeling, or rather a hunch, I had early on regarding some of SC2’s inherent flaws, and the way in which they might negatively impact the game. The reason for the thread being delayed, is in part because it seemed so very overwhelming having to crystallize all these ideas into words, but also because I needed some time before I could be reasonably certain the issues I’m about to bring up and attack indeed pose a real problem.

I will not be targeting balance specifically, but rather what I think are the underlying reasons to why SC2 is and will continue to be hard (I don’t want to say impossible) to balance. Come to think of it balance is a poor choice of word here. While I’m sure the game can be balanced in the sense that every race has an equal chance in terms of win percentage, I feel that without some drastic changes it will be hard to ever give the game a dynamic feel. At the moment, Blizzard is desperately trying to force some dynamic feel into the game by nerfing the crap out of everything. It isn’t working. The game has deeper flaws that won’t allow their minor balance changes to create the ripple effects they’re intended to create. Rather than seeing a multitude of different strategies and openings being made viable by these balance changes, most of the time they turn out to be only affecting early game survivability. The root of every problem seems unbendable, and consistently persists throughout the mid- and lategame stages. Unless Blizzard truly wants 4-5 production buildings on 1 base to be one of the predominant strategies in SC2, they better think long and hard about some necessary changes.

The best strategy against everything currently looks something like this. Any idiot can pull it off. Variations include removing the robo and possibly adding another gate.

Much of what I’m about to present are ideas that came into fruition in a series of games against the former German SC-player Fisheye in the very early stages of the beta. During our first ladder game against each other we at one point just stopped playing completely and instead tried stuff out for 1½ hour, resulting in a discussion about what it was that made the game feel “not quite right”. Something about SC2 just made the game feel wrong, when put in comparison to its predecessor. While looking to pinpoint the cause, we both said we would probably never find ourselves playing this game merely for the sake of our enjoyment, the way we did with Broodwar. It felt like a crucial ingredient had gone missing somewhere along the way; a crucial albeit highly illusive ingredient that we couldn’t quite put our finger on.

Without further ado, what I believe to be the ingredient(s):

Moving Shot
A series of techniques employed to avoid deceleration when firing. Applied in Starcraft using the following techniques:

Attack command: Right click or a-click on a unit followed by a quick move command to avoid deceleration. If you don’t a-click on a unit or building your units will act like SC2 air units.
Hold position: Move units towards enemy and press H followed by a move command to avoid deceleration. Allows spreading shots and dealing damage more efficiently as opposed to target firing one single unit and wasting damage.
Patrol command: Allows you to fire from a 90° angle without losing speed. Is frequently employed against scourge.

I think people have failed to realize just how big of a deal moving shot is. It’s easy to overlook, being as it is a subtle mechanic that did all its work in the shadows. But the moving shot mechanic was an absolutely incremental part of Starcraft: Brood War. I would even go as far as to argue that moving shot in fact was one of the main contributing factors to Brood War being as balanced as it was.

Starcraft had a one size fits all damage system. Now how the hell did Blizzard balance it despite not being able to give units arbitrary bonus damage values towards specific armor types?

Let’s just think about it for a second. Were Blizzard’s balance designers really that good in 1999? Or did the game in fact owe a lot of its success to an exceptionally well coded engine, and the resulting smooth gameplay and perfect control that followed with it? Many people throughout these years we’ve enjoyed with Starcraft have argued the stance that Blizzard managing to balance Starcraft as well as they did must have been a fluke of cosmic proportions. Well what if it wasn’t? What if the game - through being coded in a way that gave the player perfect control of one’s units, and thus made the ceiling of the possible infinitely high - in reality balanced itself?

The last time this manly game ever needed to be balanced, was in April 2001.

The last patch to ever include balance changes to Starcraft was version 1.08, released in the first half of 2001. Did Blizzard’s balance designers manage to anticipate 9 years worth of strategic evolution, or did they simply code a game that was so good, so very mechanically sound, and lent such control to its users that it acted as a buffering agent for kinks and imbalances?

The consequences of Moving Shot – an illustrative comparison.

Imagine the two following different but yet similar scenarios.

Scenario 1: You’ve got 3 corsairs and one canon guarding your mineral line in Brood War. Your opponent flies in with 8 mutalisks, and notices your templar archives (applicable to any important building) is out of place and starts picking away at it.

Scenario 2: You’ve got 3 phoenixes and one canon guarding your mineral line in Starcraft 2. Your opponent flies in with 8 mutalisks and notices your stargate is slightly out of place and starts picking away at it.

Which of these situations would you feel the most comfortable being in? And why?

Because Brood War allows perfect control of air units, with short firing animations and a built in delay before any deceleration occurs, you hardly ever see anyone idiotic enough to try and pick off a building, despite them in theory having the clearly superior air force. The reason being that corsairs are completely free to fire off cheap shots while the mutalisks are under an attack cooldown after firing a volley. Basically any sort of aggression in Brood War is tied to an amount of risk. A proper moving shot mechanic in conjunction with perfect maneuverability allows the corsair to turn 180° in the opposite direction as soon as it feels threatened (despite the corsair being a unit with one of the slower turning animations in sc). The radius which can be successfully defended grows, as a properly controlled corsair can move about freely at the perimeter of a canon’s range without taking too big of a risk.

Put this in contrast to Starcraft 2, where people don’t really know what to make out of phoenixes. In Starcraft 2 air units begin to decelerate as soon as they initiate their firing animation. They glide in the direction they were heading before the attack command was issued and turn around their axis to be able to face the enemy. They then proceed to lose all functionality and all maneuverability during this firing sequence. Blizzard’s hastily scrambled excuse of a hotfix for moving shot tricks you into believing it can actually be done. Don’t be fooled though. Try and change direction while the firing animation is in effect and you’ll soon realize the vessel is immobilized! There is [i]no turning back once you’ve committed to firing that shot. What you thought to be a moving shot was in fact a “gliding shot”.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNj0zwthmXY
Thanks to my friend Opp4 for helping me record these scenarios. He’s a D-player in Starcraft but has no trouble outmicroing me in SC2. He admittedly screwed up a bit in the Brood War scenario. He could definitely do better. But who’s to say it wasn’t because Starcraft is so micro intense? Another thing to note is that no attention was spent on macroing while recording these videos.

Moving Shot: When the firing animation is shorter than the built in delay for deceleration.

Gliding Shot: When the firing animation is longer than the built in delay for deceleration.

Perfect control vs. no control. In Starcraft, because firing animations are so short, you can change direction while the aircraft is gliding. You have to be facing the enemy in order to fire. In SC2 you glide in the direction you were heading, while the aircraft turns around its axis to aim and shoot. It then proceeds to lose all maneuverability during its gliding sequence.

The problem that arises is: you can never engage with an inferior force against a superior one. The outcome of taking the risk of firing a shot on a superior air force in SC2 is a vastly different one from that of Brood War. It doesn’t matter how well you control your air units. Every time you fire a shot you are essentially committing to taking at least a volley worth of damage. With the gliding shot mechanic there is no way in which you can avoid taking this damage. And since your opponent’s air force is superior, you will in most cases sustain more damage than you will ever cause unto him. To add further insult to injury, the “gliding shot” mechanic actually makes your units move towards your opponent’s in an immobilized state, while his “gliding shot” moves in the right direction to intercept and anticipate your delayed and tardy change of direction. Blizzard just fucked you over twice.

Why do phoenixes suck against mutas? Because Blizzard made it so.

The Valkyrie Analogy

The unit from Brood War that is the most similar to SC2-units in terms of control is undoubtedly the valkyrie. The way the unit was used in BW may give us some valuable hints on what to expect with regards to the strategic evolution of air units in SC2.

In which context was the valkyrie primarily used in Starcraft?
In a defensive context. Either backed up by turrets or in conjunction with a main army.

In which context was the valkyrie never used?
Harassing. Engaging an enemy air force without backup. Valkyries never wandered alone.

There is little else that differentiates a valkyrie from a corsair aside from the moving shot (don’t mention the unit cost, lol). Yet this small difference somehow makes a world of difference in how the unit is used in the game. While the valkyrie can never be used in an offensive context by its own right, the corsair is a unit that, if controlled properly, can be all over the place: harassing, scouting, supporting shuttles, defending.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEvu1iiYm5o&#t=11m20s
Difficult micro trick where Fantasy abuses the gliding shot mechanic through issuing a patrol command in the opposite direction the instant before he fires, thus gliding backwards and away from his opponent. On the second try he partially fails and one valkyrie easily gets picked off. This is the danger of units that have immobilizing firing animations. The “gliding shot” mechanic causes them to glide right into the enemy’s superior air force without being able to turn or abort.

Liquipedia on Valkyrie Micro:
Because Valkyrie can not usually move while firing its lengthy eight missiles, they are often vulnerable to Scourge. Because of this it is important to keep Valkyries close to a Marine and Medic army in order to protect against such sniping. A trick that can be used to help accomplish this is as follows:
• Move the a Valkyrie (or stacked group of Valkyries) towards the intended target.
• Immediately patrol in the opposite direction

Further ramifications and more examples

The other week I read Saracen’s great post about the evolution, or devolution, of the Zerg race. He managed to give us a great example of why zerglings aren’t as viable and versatile as they were in Starcraft. His argument revolved around something I like to call the “terrible terrible damage syndrome”. Shortly put: the inflation of dps, hp and armor in the early tiers has made our most basic melee fighters suck in the mid- and lategame. The lack of support units to soak up damage also adds to them not being as viable in said stages.

I think Saracen hit the nail right on the head with this explanation. But when it came to why scourge, lurkers and other units could never fit in, he didn’t really provide an extensive explanation aside from “terrible terrible damage”. I’m going to return to the terrible terrible damage syndrome a bit later, but first I’d like to examine why certain units would have a hard time fitting in if they were to be included in Starcraft 2.

Scourge

Imagine if scourge existed in SC2. Imagine if they were spire tech units just as in Starcraft. Imagine the scenario in the above picture. Imagine any scenario where any race makes any air units.

Would you dare to fire off a single shot against a muta/scourge army with vikings? Even if there were 2 turrets around? Ugh… I’m having this nightmarish déjà vu feeling like I’ve seen this happen somewhere before.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bq6FGH0xZXY&#t=7m59s

You think phoenixes are bad against mutalisks as it is? They deal 20 damage and they still somehow mysteriously suck. Imagine if scourge were in the game. Ok. Now imagine you’re a balance designer working for Blizzard. How much more bonus damage would you now reward phoenixes against light armor to balance out the game?

The lack of a proper moving shot mechanic in SC2 already makes fighting off or defending against a superior air force impossible. Imagine what effects adding scourges to the game would have on balance. It would literally be impossible for any air force to ever engage an opponent zerg army with scourges mixed in. Harassing with banshees? Forget about it.

Imagine there’s no micro
It’s easy if you try
Starcraft 2 below us
Above us only Brood War
Imagine all the units
Living life with no control

No Corsair, No Cry

[image loading]

This section isn’t about corsairs specifically, but rather air units that deal splash damage in general. Units with splash damage usually deal small amounts of damage. Either that or they’re given some other handicap like an insanely long attack cooldown (valkyrie). From a balance perspective it’s only natural. They grow increasingly stronger as their numbers build up. That’s why the corsair only does 5 damage, and the valkyrie only 6 damage per rocket.

This creates a counter system where units with base armor are strong against splash damage. If a unit has 1 base armor, that’s a whole 20% reduction in the damage it takes from a corsair. It also makes air carapace upgrade a crucial and integral part of the game.

The corsair was balanced in Starcraft because it had moving shot. Without it the game would be broken.

The only reason the corsair was even viable in the first place in Starcraft was because of the moving shot mechanic. What good would an air unit that dealt 5 damage otherwise do if it became immobilized and impossible to micro after it fired?

Let me answer that for us: Absolutely none.

And that is the very reason why no air unit with splash damage exists in Starcraft 2. First off: to even make them viable they’d have to be given more damage than their Brood War counterparts. That brings us to our second point: they would both suck and absolutely destroy at the same time. What they wouldn’t do though, is be balanced and decide the outcome of a game through micro, dexterity, speed and skill.

Let me explain why they’d either suck or absolutely destroy - all depending on the situation.

Imagine the zerg you’re playing is tech switching to mutas. You scout it but your reaction will be slightly delayed as stargates only produce one unit at a time. Now, to not make this long-winded, just imagine you had 3phoenixes doing 8damage each (with splash), but you couldn’t ever engage your opponent because if you did you’d have to run away since the three phoenixes deal about as much damage in one volley as a single phoenix without splash. You’re under the critical mass needed to engage head on. And with the gliding shot mechanic firing a shot is actually worse than opting to not fire a shot.

The second scenario: You survive or anticipate the tech switch. To not make this long-winded either, just imagine that your opponent now’s in the situation of the phoenixes (even though he’s zerg) in the example above. He’s now the one who under no circumstances can engage you. He can’t even try and pick off a probe because the gliding shot mechanic will fuck him over everytime he decides to fire a shot. Gliding shot effectively kills harassing and micro.

While we were busy whining about MBS and macro, Blizzard took the opportunity to remove micro from the game from right under our noses. Hardly anyone noticed. The ones who did were bashed down upon for not being able to explain and give arguments as to why there was “no micro in the game” anymore.

The terrible terrible damage hypothesis

The terrible terrible damage hypothesis conjectures that with the loss of control in an RTS game, there has to be compensation in terms added damage, hp, armor and range to units.

Do we have conclusive evidence to support this? No, not really. But somewhere in our hearts we know it to be true. We feel in our hearts, without being able to explain it, that Starcraft 2 is a game where one’s strategic choices make up for more than one’s individual skill. Somewhere all of us get the feeling that the build orders we choose are of greater importance than the way we micro. That the number of units we produce is of greater significance than the way we control them. Frankly put: that Starcraft 2 requires less skill.

Here are some examples of how a proper moving shot would change SC2:

Banshee

Would require less range (6 range is ridiculous).
As a result spore colonies and canons wouldn’t be as useless as they are now.
Damage could be nerfed. Banshees would be able to kite perfectly. No need for it to 2shot workers anymore.
Movement speed could be increased (why would you want units with the speed of a sc1 Scout in Starcraft 2? Didn’t you learn anything?).

Vikings

Less damage, shorter attack cooldown.
Increased movement speed.
Wouldn’t need a Transformers-gimmick.

Hellion

One of these had moving shot. It remained a viable harassing alternative throughout every stage of the game.

Less (bonus) damage. Wouldn’t need a stupid damage upgrade.
There is no reason whatsoever - aside from the game engine sucking - that this unit shouldn’t have the ability to move and shoot. Of course its damage might need a nerf due to its increased mobility, but that can easily be taken care of.
Every single one of these changes hinges on the fact that Blizzard brings down damage inflation and hp/armor throughout the tech trees. Hellions will continue to suck in a supportive role, past the early midgame, as long as colossuses, roaches, immortals, etc. remain in their current state. It will probably also require a revamp of macro mechanics, but that’s a topic for my next article

Corruptor

This unit is stupid. The only reason it’s in the game is because it used to have a cool mechanic that corrupted enemy air units.

Blizzard, please remove the corruptor and replace it with a unit that actually makes sense! Preferably a unit with an attack animation that doesn’t look stupid, but at the same time allows it to move while firing! Corrupting buildings is a stupid spell and you know it. I’d rather that corruptors had no energy (when the hell have you seen someone use up the corruptors’ energy?) so templars couldn’t feedback them because they have a spell that no one ever uses.

Phoenix

Would actually be a useful counter against mutas.
Might need a damage nerf if people can micro properly with it (terrible terrible damage inflation is a recurring theme).
Its speed is good, all SC2 air units should be fast!

Void Ray

Fuck yes Blizzard. You actually made a unit with moving shot. Now all you have to do is make people be able to target fire units while moving. I mean, an AUTOMATIC RANDOM LASER BEAM emanating from it is nice and all, but I think players would like to be able to choose what to shoot at while performing the moving shot. As it is now, you can’t move and shoot if you actually want the void ray to target a specific building or unit (lol nice one Blizzard, genious).

Archon

[image loading]

Would make it suck less.
Slow moving melee units don’t really have a place in a game of terrible terrible damage. A lot more would have to change than simply granting the archon moving shot if they’d want it not to suck. In Brood War it admittedly had more of a gliding shot, as its attack animation was slightly longer than the time it took for the archon to decelerate. Nonetheless, it was better than nothing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tH212wgDy6g
Admittedly more of a gliding shot, but a gliding shot is better than having legs

Archons used to look like they floated above ground in SC1. In SC2 Blizzard gave them legs. They eventually listened to the negative feedback and removed the legs though. But it was merely a cosmetic change, as archons still act like they have got legs (coming to a full stop every time they attack). Floating ground units all used to have the ability to move and shoot in SC1 (Vultures, drones, archons, probes (?)).

Workers: Drones, SCVs (not in sc1, but why not in sc2?) and probes

I know Blizzard have changed the attack animation for the drone being the moving shot hating company that they are nowadays. But if it’s actually possible to implement a moving shot in SC2 (which I doubt), they should really change it back to the old one – just so it can move and shoot.

Have you guys noticed how retarded workers behave in SC2? Have you ever tried chasing after a scouting enemy worker? Noticed how they like to fuck up their attack animation and jump backwards in the opposite direction? Noticed how they take so long to carry out their attack animation that they eventually miss? Noticed how they have to come to a full stop before attacking? Noticed how impossible it is to put down an expansion if your opponent really doesn’t want you to put down an expansion?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7oAaMIQv2Y&#t=7m35s
JulyZerg in one of the first displays where moving shot with a drone was used in an aired game

How the hell do you expect Jaedong to switch over to this game if he, even with the most perfect control and anticipation, can’t prevent a 100 apm noob from delaying his expansion? Do you really expect the Koreans to switch over from a perfect game to one that lacks even the most basic control? Are you all deluded?

Blizzard design philosophy pre Dustin Browder-era
“Let’s design a great engine and worry about units, graphics and art later. Hell, let’s even throw a game in the trash bin and recode it from scratch if people think it sucks.”

Blizzard design philosophy post Dustin Browder
“Hey guys let’s design awesome, cool and unique units and worry about the game and balance afterwards. We can always fix that. Sure people will think the game has flaws, but balance and time will sort that out”

.

One of the main problems with the Dustin Browder school of design philosophy, is that they won’t realize they’ve screwed up until it’s too late. And they’ve had ample warning:

Chill 2008 BWWI:
So all in all, units do what you want, except for a few. Mutalisks stack, yes, but it really isn’t comparable to the original. They overlap if you spam but usually spread out pretty easily. Mutalisk micro is very hard to do. Mutalisks are still good, and I spent quite a lot of time with them, but I really couldn’t get the hang of harassing too well with them. I tried patrol, hold, and attack, and nothing made them emulate their Brood War counterparts. That’s not to say Mutalisk micro can’t be done and won’t be solved eventually. I’m just saying in this build, I personally couldn’t get it to happen.

Starcraft II Q&A – Batch 31
In StarCraft, some units had instant attack animations (Corsiar, Mutalisk, Vulture). This allowed people with good micro to make these units move and shoot. In contrast there were units that had an attack animation which required the unit to stop and shoot. This allowed people with good micro to dance (move, shoot, move shoot, maximizing the distance travelled without the unit losing any shooting time). In Warcraft III, units tended to have attack animations which took as long as the cooldown for the attack, making micro actions such as these non-existent.
Will units in StarCraft II have attack animations that last as long as the cooldown for their attack, similar to Warcraft III? or will players be able to dance (moving in between shooting) like in StarCraft? Also, will there be any units with instant attack animations that can be micromanaged to move and shoot like in StarCraft?

Balance will be the first priority when determining the animation duration for units. With that said, there will be certain units that players will be able to dance with (EN: lies), and there will be other units which will force the unit to stop and fire. Some units in StarCraft II will not only need to stop and fire, but will do additional damage to a target while it focuses. All of these characteristics which determine how a unit will be used in competitive play will be chosen based on balance.

In Conclusion

The solution is pretty obvious. Shorten the attack animations and make units dance again. If Starcraft II’s game engine really is as awesome as Dustin Browder has said it is – on multiple occasions. If it really “can do anything”. Then why is it that not a single unit in the game ended up with a shorter firing animation than the time it takes them to decelerate? Was it really all because of balance, Blizzard?

What good is a “terribly awesome engine that can do [almost] anything”, if it can’t achieve a moving shot?

I personally suspect that Starcraft 2 was coded in a way that has prevented Blizzard from implementing moving shot. Perhaps the engine is too awesome to allow it. Perhaps it emulates Newtonian Physics too well for moving shot to exist. While I was trying it out, the main difference I noticed was that in SC1 you had to direct your units towards the enemy you were attacking. After the attack animation was done you could control your units in any direction you wanted. In SC2, your air unit will simply glide in whatever direction it was gliding before you issued the attack command and turn around its axis to aim towards the enemy. It’s not realistic at all if you think about real life air to air combat. But in Blizzard’s awesome engine, a body in motion will stay in motion unless… it exceeds its deceleration timer?

I don’t want to be too harsh on Dustin Browder and Blizzard. Because I think Starcraft II is a decent game after all. But somewhere along the way it feels like they missed the entire point of what makes up for a great RTS game. They forgot that the most crucial ingredients to a game is not how cool and awesome its units are, but how it feels when you play it. That inexplicable feeling that the game grants you [i]total control of your actions. Playing Brood War it felt like – given enough time and practice – you could achieve anything!

Putting someone like Dustin Browder in charge of development for SC2 though, is almost like letting one of the many overly-enthuasiastic-and-overly-optimistic TL forum resident D- noobs have the last say about what is good and bad for a multi million dollar game. Sure those crazy (slightly delusional) threads about the viability of some obscure unit or strategy can be fun to read from time to time. But in the end it's always reassuring to have that old veteran come in, one of those fountains of cynicism, to tell you what will work and what won't. What's realistic and what's not. Where your focus should rather lie instead of wasting your time with things might be awesome but don't work in reality. I feel that Blizzard desperately needed but lacked one of those voices in the development of SC2. The passion is there no doubt, but there needs to be a voice of reason behind it all.

I am a bit worried that everyone suddenly stopped questioning Dustin Browder and Blizzard after the Starcraft II Beta was released. How come we all settled for less, when what we should have been doing – if anything – was asking for at least as much as we had before? No chat rooms, no ability to switch in between servers, no LAN support, no whisper functionality, no DND, unlimited unit selection, rally point to minerals, MBS, no moving shot; the list goes on and on. One compromise after the other.

I’m not saying every change was unwarranted, or that every change was for the worse. Most of us can by now agree on the fact that MBS and unlimited unit selection turned out to be pretty good changes. But the fact of the matter is: we’re constantly settling for less and less without even putting up a real fight.

It disgusts me that every time I see someone on these forums bash down on a flaw in the game, all he’s ever met with is the same generic response: “Yes but Starcraft II is a different game, ’other’ types of micro/whatever might show up in the future as it develops and evolves”.

Who knows, those arguments might hold true, although I personally doubt they will. We’re entirely missing the point arguing in such a way though. Why in the first place should we be accepting that Starcraft II is regressing in to a more primitive form than its predecessor? Isn’t this, after all, the sequel, as opposed to the prequel?

How does Dustin Browder explain the fact that air units in SC2, the sequel, suddenly regressed and lost their ability to maneuver while firing? Is there perhaps a disturbance in the Khala?

Start demanding more out of Blizzard! I implore you all not to settle for less than you deserve. Let’s at least demand that Blizzard put the micro back in a game that was already robbed of its macro!

Blizzard HQ. Irvine, CA., 2008

[Dustin Browder is sitting at his computer answering fansite questions from http://scsuperbestfriends.com/, declaiming every word out loud as he’s hammering away at his keyboard]

Dustin Browder: We have this awesome awesome engine, it can do anything…

[In walks David Kim, with a printout of the latest Q&A Batch in his hands]

David Kim: Hey Dustin they’re asking about moving shot again, what should I tell them?
Dustin Browder: Tell them we’re working on it.
David Kim: But that’s what we said last time.
Dustin Browder: Well tell them it’s a balance issue.
David Kim: We did that one too.
Dustin Browder: …

Dustin Browder looks annoyed and scratches his beard

Dustin Browder: Have the lore guys come up with something.

*Edit: I was planning on including an examination of the turning animations in this article as well, but I think this is about as much as anyone will read in one go. Another topic that was left out was the macro mechanics. I plan on writing about these as well, explaining why I think lurkers can never be tier 2, and why strategies such as 4gate are the norm rather than the exception in SC2. Don’t expect that one to be finished within the week though! This one drained my powers

noojOh

United States755 Posts

April 26 2010 23:40 GMT

nice read
i don't agree with what a lot of people say to change sc2 because it is a whole different game and they seem to want to make it exactly like sc1
but i agree with this
we need more micro

-Valor-

United States283 Posts

April 26 2010 23:43 GMT

False use of where art thou.

Ranix

United States666 Posts

April 26 2010 23:45 GMT

I lol'd so hard at the Dustin Browder anecdote at the bottom.

mOnion

United States5651 Posts

April 26 2010 23:45 GMT

oh this is relatively new lol.

well it's so difficult to compare the phoenix to corsair. but your analysis of the glide mechanic is really interesting.

i miss your stream

beetlelisk

Poland2276 Posts

April 26 2010 23:45 GMT

On April 27 2010 08:40 noojOh wrote:
nice read
i don't agree with what a lot of people say to change sc2 because it is a whole different game and they seem to want to make it exactly like sc1
but i agree with this
we need more micro

Totally. This is incredibly long article, Good Job.

Entertaining

Canada793 Posts

April 26 2010 23:46 GMT

i completely agree with this. whenever i say this game lost all its micro people scream kite. how hard is it to kite seriously even WOW players do it. with no defenders advantage and almost no micro (other then spells) i dont see myself playing this game for 10 years.

v3chr0

United States856 Posts

April 26 2010 23:47 GMT

Quite a write up, I definitely agree.

orgolove

Vatican City State1650 Posts

April 26 2010 23:47 GMT

Great article. Dustin really is the bane of SC2's existence. Ugh, just thinking about how much he screwed up the storied franchise that was CnC makes me puke.

SC2Phoenix

Canada2814 Posts

April 26 2010 23:47 GMT

#10

wow amazing read. GJ capturing the issue imo

ziz

203 Posts

April 26 2010 23:47 GMT

#11

yes... please moving shots... come backkk

dronebabo

10866 Posts

April 26 2010 23:49 GMT

#12

--- Nuked ---

Nal_rAwr

United States2611 Posts

April 26 2010 23:50 GMT

#13

i might possibly just pass on starcraft 2 even though i played lots of bw
like i did with ssbb

Half

United States2554 Posts

April 26 2010 23:50 GMT

#14

I really like this article, its basically articulates all my thoughts on SC2 micro that I was too lazy to write out

The "Terrible Terrible Damage" syndrome is what I was trying to articulate on my thread about Roaches.

Watching Jaedong play zerg was like watching someone play an entirely different game. If art is an expression of beauty using ones personal ability, then a sport is the expression of skill or perfection using ones personal ability. The current design of SC2 ultimately restricts the amount one can express his skill.

A "esport" would be a game that is conducive to that practice, and as far as Blizzard games go, SC2 has so far been the the least conducive. (Excluding WoW lol). The amount of control one is able to apply to the game is crucial to the games development as an Esport.

Suggestion to the OP:

The article was fantastic, but I'd suggest doing some small editting here and there. This is going to reach the ears of blizzards developers, and its important to remember that impression is just as important as how right you are. You want to not only create a message that is logically right and popular and amazing, but also conducive with the goals Dustin is going to intend.

Blizzard isn't interested in the means, only the ends. How conducive the game is to skill, and how good of an esport it is, are only factors on how good of a game it is, their end goal (and by proxy, how profitable it is, though I doubt Dustin is consciously thinking of that as he balances. I'm not that cynical

). You need to tie in how a game less conducive to skill creates a less exciting, fun, game, and I'm sure thats the case, you just need to emphasize that and covey it into the ears of the developers if we want change.

I'd would personally remove the "Would allow you to remove the transformation gimmick" in your suggestion to the viking. Most of your changes are not only conducive to the evolution of SC2 as a Esport, but also to the evolution of SC2 as a normal game. Blizzard is interested in that as well, and I think that "gimmicks" like that are not only intended, but desirable, so suggesting the removal of things that make it look more interesting to a new player communicated the wrong sort of message.

As an example, certain statements like the "Terrible Terrible Damage syndrome" can, and probably will, be misinterpreted by Blizzard developers as "Boring", and Dustins probably going to think something like "But Terrible Terrible Damage is really cool". It is, so in that sense, the name is a bit of a misnonmer.

The real effect of the terrible terrible damage syndrome is it actually renders a game environment less conducive to terrible terrible damage. If a unit that does terrible terrible damage is located in a low tech position, it isn't terrible terrible damage is it? It is just the norm. Its important to note that not only are you creating a environment less conducive to skill, but also less condusive to spectators and creating less exciting, dynamic play.

bendez

Canada283 Posts

April 26 2010 23:52 GMT

#15

I completely disagree. I welcome the new mechanics, and after playing 500+ games and watching tournaments, I can say that sc2 has plenty of micro.

Funnytoss

Taiwan1471 Posts

April 26 2010 23:52 GMT

#16

Excellent article, you really helped put into words something that had been bothering me when playing the game. The optimist in me says that it's a relatively easy fix in the game engine, but who knows. Your point about the theoretically unlimited skill ceiling in BW making it the classic it is now definitely hit home.

Lollersauce

United States357 Posts

April 26 2010 23:53 GMT

#17

On April 27 2010 08:32 LaLuSh wrote:
How come we all settled for less, when what we should have been doing – if anything – was asking for at least as much as we had before?

Because it doesn't do (use british accent) to be overly negative around these parts.
The over-optimistic noobs are unfortunately what is encouraged by default, because it promotes happy happy joy joy discussion. Like about how awesome ultras are, or Bnet 2.0 is going to be awesome except it's not lol joke's on you.

W/e. Too late. And I doubt Browder and co are going to fix anything that serious given what we've seen from Blizzard as of late.

SensFaiL

United States98 Posts

April 26 2010 23:53 GMT

#18

wow your article blew me away dude, very detailed and precise. great job, my hopes go out that blizzard reads this article.

Ninja4ever.

France231 Posts

April 26 2010 23:53 GMT

#19

I totally fucking agree with this, and I think EVERYONE will too.
You need a poll, to show blizzard how much we want dancing units back in the game.

dudeman001

United States2412 Posts

April 26 2010 23:54 GMT

#20

Bloody freaking amazing. Major props Lalush, damn. I like your points and your argument makes a huge amount of sense. I feel almost silly posting in response to this, it just covers the topic so well.

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