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On April 08 2010 03:54 StoLiVe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2010 03:41 G4MR wrote:
Next steps are to:
Nerf Immortal Energy Shields a tad bit
Switch Hallucination (Default) and Forcefield (as an upgrade) the only way they should fix the force field is to put in 75 energy instead of 50 to put them a little bit later in the early game without put off the possibility to defend an early push and not let 1 sentry make 4 force field
Sounds good.
I personally think they should just release the world editor.
+ Show Spoiler +Blistering Sands - Wider choke at natural, Remove fail rock behind main. 
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On April 08 2010 03:51 zomgzergrush wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2010 03:51 Alou wrote:
Why exactly are void rays nerfed in this? It seems more of just a change, rather than a simple nerf or buff. I think we need to try it some before we all jump on the raging bandwagon. If a queen can kill a voidray or if hydras can pop out in time before 1 voidray rush kills the hatch, then all is good.
Perhaps you don't understand the full nature of this Void Ray "nerf."
Before, a Queen could kill a single VR one on one. This is no longer the case. The VR does much more damage to Queens in the lower stages. Once the Queen dies, the VR will be fully charged, and can immediately target the Hatch at maximum power.
So Zerg players are going to have to get Spore Crawlers if they even smell VRs coming from the Protoss.
And actually it's ridiculously easy for Z to deal with Voidrays - just build additional queens.
While a Hatchery is producing a Queen, it cannot also be making a Lair/Hive. So building a Queen delays your tech massively.
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Imo, the marauder change doesnt add anything. Sure they dont have slow... but you can still get slow and tons of marauders.. nothing prevents you from doing that.
Im totally not happy with the changes to hydra and roaches. The roach is just due to too much whine and the hydra is insane as theyre already fragile, the already have a slower attackspeed and it isnt like T or P doesnt have a single answer for them. Why nerf Z's midgame? Trying to force us to get early hive for BL? Or want us to try muta spam or infestors that are mediocre?
Void Ray, I dont really care, dont see why the nerf...
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On April 08 2010 03:56 NicolBolas wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2010 03:51 zomgzergrush wrote:On April 08 2010 03:51 Alou wrote:
Why exactly are void rays nerfed in this? It seems more of just a change, rather than a simple nerf or buff. I think we need to try it some before we all jump on the raging bandwagon. If a queen can kill a voidray or if hydras can pop out in time before 1 voidray rush kills the hatch, then all is good. Perhaps you don't understand the full nature of this Void Ray "nerf." Before, a Queen could kill a single VR one on one. This is no longer the case. The VR does much more damage to Queens in the lower stages. Once the Queen dies, the VR will be fully charged, and can immediately target the Hatch at maximum power. So Zerg players are going to have to get Spore Crawlers if they even smell VRs coming from the Protoss.
Yeah I always for some odd reason try getting up 1 spore early on for DT/VR harass.
Imo, the marauder change doesnt add anything. Sure they dont have slow... but you can still get slow and tons of marauders.. nothing prevents you from doing that.
Yeah your right; at the same time you have to make a risk as well. Get the upgrade for marauders or get stim. Because facing a group of speedlings while getting a moved by hydra's aren't so great for marauders. Just an example.
It just stops terran from doing those early rauder builds early game.
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On April 08 2010 03:55 3FFA wrote:
why not just go sentry/zealot? They destroy both mutas, hydras, roaches, zealots, banelings, just about every single zerg unit.
LOL I think Zerg can just counter-attack somewhere else to avoid the artificial chokes ruining everything. 
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Fuck why do they keep on nerfing the Zerg 
How am I gonna be able to win if not because of the imba of the race and the Roach
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On April 08 2010 03:54 Mannerheim wrote:
I really lost on TvP early game now. Fast thors? How would you stop a zealot push..
you can still use marauder but now you have to wall instead only use slow attack to stay alive
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On April 08 2010 03:56 NicolBolas wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2010 03:51 zomgzergrush wrote:On April 08 2010 03:51 Alou wrote:
Why exactly are void rays nerfed in this? It seems more of just a change, rather than a simple nerf or buff. I think we need to try it some before we all jump on the raging bandwagon. If a queen can kill a voidray or if hydras can pop out in time before 1 voidray rush kills the hatch, then all is good. Perhaps you don't understand the full nature of this Void Ray "nerf." Before, a Queen could kill a single VR one on one. This is no longer the case. The VR does much more damage to Queens in the lower stages. Once the Queen dies, the VR will be fully charged, and can immediately target the Hatch at maximum power. So protoss players are going to have to get immortals if they even smell roaches coming from the Zerg. Show nested quote +And actually it's ridiculously easy for Z to deal with Voidrays - just build additional queens. While a Hatchery is producing a Queen, it cannot also be making a Lair/Hive. So building a Queen delays your tech massively.
Made a few changes there.. seems like you now know my pain?
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They can decrease the build time of mech all they want but honestly unless they can lower the gas cost, and maybe the food cost, it's still underpowered.
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On April 08 2010 03:58 3nickma wrote:Fuck why do they keep on nerfing the Zerg How am I gonna be able to win if not because of the imba of the race and the Roach
lololol so funny
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say it with me, people: THE VOID RAY WAS NOT NERFED
It gained significantly more initial (stage 1+2) dmg, especially against non-armoured units, and does more average damage over time to all units.
It was also made slightly more expensive, mineral-wise, and takes a bit more dmg.
Just because there are some relatively small negative changes to a unit does not mean it was nerfed.
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On April 08 2010 03:56 NicolBolas wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2010 03:51 zomgzergrush wrote:On April 08 2010 03:51 Alou wrote:
Why exactly are void rays nerfed in this? It seems more of just a change, rather than a simple nerf or buff. I think we need to try it some before we all jump on the raging bandwagon. If a queen can kill a voidray or if hydras can pop out in time before 1 voidray rush kills the hatch, then all is good. Perhaps you don't understand the full nature of this Void Ray "nerf." Before, a Queen could kill a single VR one on one. This is no longer the case. The VR does much more damage to Queens in the lower stages. Once the Queen dies, the VR will be fully charged, and can immediately target the Hatch at maximum power. So Zerg players are going to have to get Spore Crawlers if they even smell VRs coming from the Protoss. Show nested quote +And actually it's ridiculously easy for Z to deal with Voidrays - just build additional queens. While a Hatchery is producing a Queen, it cannot also be making a Lair/Hive. So building a Queen delays your tech massively.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=118684
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On April 08 2010 03:59 {88}iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2010 03:56 NicolBolas wrote:On April 08 2010 03:51 zomgzergrush wrote:On April 08 2010 03:51 Alou wrote:
Why exactly are void rays nerfed in this? It seems more of just a change, rather than a simple nerf or buff. I think we need to try it some before we all jump on the raging bandwagon. If a queen can kill a voidray or if hydras can pop out in time before 1 voidray rush kills the hatch, then all is good. Perhaps you don't understand the full nature of this Void Ray "nerf." Before, a Queen could kill a single VR one on one. This is no longer the case. The VR does much more damage to Queens in the lower stages. Once the Queen dies, the VR will be fully charged, and can immediately target the Hatch at maximum power. So protoss players are going to have to get immortals if they even smell roaches coming from the Zerg. And actually it's ridiculously easy for Z to deal with Voidrays - just build additional queens. While a Hatchery is producing a Queen, it cannot also be making a Lair/Hive. So building a Queen delays your tech massively. Made a few changes there.. seems like you now know my pain?
GO GO incontrol! I love it when the inferior zerg become traitors and turn to the great and powerful protoss for great power and then fight against their own brethren! You gotta love the NEW Incontrol!
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Blizzard is teasing my penis; where the hell is the patch??? ANyone patch yet?
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Zerg aren't dead now. People need to stop overreacting. Zerg air is still badass and this will just give lings (which are amazing in sc2 if you haven't noticed) more face time.
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On April 08 2010 04:01 LUE.Leoj wrote:
They can decrease the build time of mech all they want but honestly unless they can lower the gas cost, and maybe the food cost, it's still underpowered.
I agree but still it's more viable now. pretty sure in the next patch we will see some gas decrease on the tank
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On April 08 2010 03:51 Zelniq wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2010 03:21 diehilde wrote:
in all honesty, jinro had the best tvz on the entire EU server with a strategy centered around thors. The only somewhat viable counter was a shitton of roaches. Now with Thor build time decreased and roaches substantially nerfed, plus the prior patch which made thor annihilate air I cant see anyone beating that strat. how does -1 armor for roach matter vs thor? it helps the hellions a tiny bit vs roaches but theyre still not that good vs just tons of roaches. marauders previously did 18 damage to roaches and now do 19, not the biggest deal. mass roach into broodlords still seems very very strong vs metal / bio/metal play
its not the -1 to armor which is the big thing against thors, but the 15 second decrease on thor build time.
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On April 08 2010 03:43 TheAntZ wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2010 03:41 G4MR wrote:
Next steps are to:
Nerf Immortal Energy Shields a tad bit
Switch Hallucination (Default) and Forcefield (as an upgrade) Both bad Its not the immortals shields that people are hating on, its the ridiculous damage it does And the sentry thing...come on...really? Protoss is supposed to hold off early aggression how exactly, without force field?
With a Hallucinated Colossus, duh.
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On April 08 2010 03:59 {88}iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2010 03:56 NicolBolas wrote:On April 08 2010 03:51 zomgzergrush wrote:On April 08 2010 03:51 Alou wrote:
Why exactly are void rays nerfed in this? It seems more of just a change, rather than a simple nerf or buff. I think we need to try it some before we all jump on the raging bandwagon. If a queen can kill a voidray or if hydras can pop out in time before 1 voidray rush kills the hatch, then all is good. Perhaps you don't understand the full nature of this Void Ray "nerf." Before, a Queen could kill a single VR one on one. This is no longer the case. The VR does much more damage to Queens in the lower stages. Once the Queen dies, the VR will be fully charged, and can immediately target the Hatch at maximum power. So protoss players are going to have to get immortals if they even smell roaches coming from the Zerg. And actually it's ridiculously easy for Z to deal with Voidrays - just build additional queens. While a Hatchery is producing a Queen, it cannot also be making a Lair/Hive. So building a Queen delays your tech massively. Made a few changes there.. seems like you now know my pain?
care to elaborate? I can't really tell whether you're being sarcastic or not. :S
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On April 08 2010 04:02 3FFA wrote:
GO GO incontrol! I love it when the inferior zerg become traitors and turn to the great and powerful protoss and then fight against their own brethren! You gotta love the NEW Incontrol! He's a pussy. He wasn't able to handle the awesomeness of Spawn Larva.
kidding.... I betrayed Terran for Zerg in my case. I kept calling down MULEs instead of scanning periodically
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EPT
