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On February 18 2010 13:52 Try wrote:
It's very simple: whoever practices more will be the better player. Additionally, I dont see why WC3 skills would be better transferable to SC2 than SC1 skills. Either way, I expect an equal distribution of gamers from both games to be at the top of the ladder. That is, if the progamers don't immediately switch =P.
from my experience interviewing top players for game design critic positions, starcraft players are far more inclined to grasp the core fundamentals of tactics and strategy than war3 players are.
As to why that is, i'll let the guessing/explanations come from whomever would like ponder.
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I would just like to remind everyone that this is infact not the final release.. if there is too low a skill ceiling to differentiate good players from non.,. there gonna change stuff.. stop worrying and enjoy the streams!
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Korea (South)11568 Posts
does reducing the graphics quality to the bare minimum of the game, make it easier to determine ZvZ and PvP?
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On February 18 2010 16:20 Tfact_rats wrote:
I would just like to remind everyone that this is infact not the final release.. if there is too low a skill ceiling to differentiate good players from non.,. there gonna change stuff.. stop worrying and enjoy the streams!
Affirmative!
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On February 18 2010 16:06 superbabosheki wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2010 15:11 TheYango wrote:On February 18 2010 15:08 superbabosheki wrote:
Is it me or is the game too easy? All the things us SC players use our APM for have gone down the gutter :[ Is this based on having played the game, or from watching streams of people stomping obvious newbies? I'm basing this on the fact that it is a fact. Huge armies in one control group(less micro, less 1click2cick3click4click just to move around which is less multitask), multiple building selection(less macro, obvious reasons). It is MY opinion that the multitask for sc2 is significantly lower than sc1, hopefully a few betakey holders can confirm this.
You need to watch KHB's stream. He is currently number one ranked in the platinum league and he sure as hell does allot more than just rallying all units to one control group and right clicks.
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Even if it is mechanically easier, you still won't be good enough to go pro. 
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Everything moves so slow, and because of all the graphic detail, it doesn't seem fluid compared to broodwar's simplicity. Also, these maps are GAY. Every single map you must break the destructable rocks blocking the choke to get out. It's like playing NR15 man, not fun. Almost all of the games I've played people rush air.
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On February 18 2010 16:06 superbabosheki wrote:
I'm basing this on the fact that it is a fact. Huge armies in one control group(less micro, less 1click2cick3click4click just to move around which is less multitask), multiple building selection(less macro, obvious reasons). It is MY opinion that the multitask for sc2 is significantly lower than sc1, hopefully a few betakey holders can confirm this.
If this is true, the multi-tasking will probably move towards more multiple battles, and better control of those battles. Right now, even at the Pro level, they have trouble microing multiple battles across the map. I would think that Pros would be able to concentrate more on the multiple battles and use better micro for battles, IMHO.
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It will definitely take some getting used to. Anyone switching from SC1 to SC2 will certainly have difficulty distinguishing units in the battles but everyone will adapt in time. Just like when people switched from DotA to HoN. Everybody complained that they couldn't tell what was going on in HoN but now nobody wants to go back to DotA.
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Poll: So, does it????
(Vote): totally! youll pick it up in minutes!
(Vote): its like a whole new game 
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Germany / USA16648 Posts
Sick of the wc3 vs sc again, stop it, before I make you stop
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On February 18 2010 16:43 Tomed wrote:
It will definitely take some getting used to. Anyone switching from SC1 to SC2 will certainly have difficulty distinguishing units in the battles but everyone will adapt in time. Just like when people switched from DotA to HoN. Everybody complained that they couldn't tell what was going on in HoN but now nobody wants to go back to DotA.
Wait, there are still people playing Hon? Most I know stopped after a weak or so and went back to Dota.
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On February 18 2010 16:34 Seele wrote:
Every single map you must break the destructable rocks blocking the choke to get out. It's like playing NR15 man, not fun. Almost all of the games I've played people rush air.
Vote down the novice maps?
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kinda inbetween scbw and wc3
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i Played about 5-6 matches, and it plays very closely. It felt slower but im pretty sure the first games were not on the "fastest" speed, because they were like the noob games. There is cheese and everything and it is quite similar to SC1 as far as mechanics, and yes while easier, APM still matters and feels like it matters which i thought was good.
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Friends that I've talked to says it plays like StarCraft. Can't say for myself since I don't have a key yet.
I personally am grateful for the new features(unlimited unit selection, multiple production buildings on one hotkey, and onscreen text notifications on buildings being finished) because it makes certain parts of the game quicker and easier. It just leaves more time for other things like having some awesome micro in intense fights and so on.
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From my experience, no, it doesn't play like SC.
In SC, with a few exceptions, getting to a certain unit before an opponent had a counter never seemed to just win the game. In SC2, I've won many games thanks to just 1 or 2 units that my opponent didn't have the counter for.
It plays more like Warhammer 40k: Dawn of War to me where later tiers can just dominate when used well (assuming the player can live to it).
Could also just require more experience with the game - just what I've found so far.
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The problem at the moment is that next to no one has adapted to the much faster pace of the game. Basically every game is a bit more like ZvZ was in SC:BW. It is really common for people to fall behind on army count and get crushed or to forgo teching completely and find themselves without an answer to what you throw at them next.
While macro is a lot less click intensive the mental focus for macro is still needed. Yes you will have most buildings in a few control groups but you still can't afford to skip making units from them, also if you queue you still fail. On top of that you need to pay attention to additional timings like hatch larvae etc.
All in all it plays fairly differently from SC at least atm, but many key elements are still there and most people should transition smoothly. However SC players likely won't hold a large advantage over WC3 players beyond the very first few initial games.
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I play T in SC1 with around 120 apm
I played P in SC2 with around 50 apm (lol) but I don't know if the Blizzard in-game APM count uses the same method as bwchart for SC1
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People saying its hard to distinguish on a stream need to realize that this really doesn't matter because they're going to use an HLTV like system so you watch the match like you're there observing it, in the game engine. We're not going to be watching the game exclusively on youtube and low quality streams like we have been for Brood War.
That is, if they actually stick to what they've announced
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EPT
