• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 03:29
CEST 09:29
KST 16:29
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists14[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy21
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers11Maestros of the Game 2 announced32026 GSL Tour plans announced11Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail1MaNa leaves Team Liquid21
StarCraft 2
General
MaNa leaves Team Liquid 2026 GSL Tour plans announced Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued
Tourneys
GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding 2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) SEL Doubles (SC Evo Bimonthly)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 520 Moving Fees Mutation # 519 Inner Power
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Data needed ASL21 General Discussion Pros React To: Tulbo in Ro.16 Group A RepMastered™: replay sharing and analyzer site
Tourneys
Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro16 Group A [ASL21] Ro16 Group B
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Reappraising The Situation T…
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1876 users

Beta Balance Update #9 - Page 20

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 HotS
824 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 18 19 20 21 22 42 Next All
arcane1129
Profile Joined January 2011
United States271 Posts
December 13 2012 05:50 GMT
#381
On December 13 2012 14:33 SuperYo1000 wrote:
muta buff?....

Can we have tempest shoot archons then?


No but you can have +1 range phoenix with a +2 range upgrade
Arco
Profile Joined September 2009
United States2090 Posts
December 13 2012 05:53 GMT
#382
On December 13 2012 12:47 Geos13 wrote:
Oh yay the Tempest is being pushed even more into a hard counter role

My prediction -> The possibility of Tempests causes no BLs or colossus to be built against them and so the Tempest itself is never built.

Tempest are actually quite versatile of an air unit. Despite their huge bonuses to massive, once you have a ton of them with plenty of Templar to protect them it's very hard to stop it with non-massive unit compositions.
blade55555
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States17423 Posts
December 13 2012 05:53 GMT
#383
On December 13 2012 14:16 CTSChao wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 13 2012 13:38 xAdra wrote:
On December 13 2012 13:19 Ldawg wrote:
I am loving these constant tweaks to the beta. Reminds me of BW, where everything was essentially OP so in the end it was a balanced game.

Does anyone else wish the game could be in a constant state of beta? I just love all the tweaks and new units. Particularly fun is trying all the crazy strategies, since there are few (if any) "standard" builds.

While it would be cool from a certain point of view, you have to keep in mind that Sc2 has an extremely prominent E-sports scene, and for this to flourish the game should be kept balanced at all times. Or else you have things like Ryung vs Sniper, where Ryung blamed his losses on the current imbalance.



yep, that was actually embarrassing to watch. I think it was game 4, but Ryung had a massive supply advantage, and every engagement he split like a god, but sniper was still somehow able to stay in the game with fungals, ultras, and infested terrans. And then to watch the last game, where ryung once again played as good as any terran could in this current time period, but still lost to infestors


Yeah and forgetting siege tech in that last game. He played so perfect lol.

So tosses how are you liking the new mutalisks so far?
When I think of something else, something will go here
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
December 13 2012 06:12 GMT
#384
On December 13 2012 14:53 blade55555 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 13 2012 14:16 CTSChao wrote:
On December 13 2012 13:38 xAdra wrote:
On December 13 2012 13:19 Ldawg wrote:
I am loving these constant tweaks to the beta. Reminds me of BW, where everything was essentially OP so in the end it was a balanced game.

Does anyone else wish the game could be in a constant state of beta? I just love all the tweaks and new units. Particularly fun is trying all the crazy strategies, since there are few (if any) "standard" builds.

While it would be cool from a certain point of view, you have to keep in mind that Sc2 has an extremely prominent E-sports scene, and for this to flourish the game should be kept balanced at all times. Or else you have things like Ryung vs Sniper, where Ryung blamed his losses on the current imbalance.



yep, that was actually embarrassing to watch. I think it was game 4, but Ryung had a massive supply advantage, and every engagement he split like a god, but sniper was still somehow able to stay in the game with fungals, ultras, and infested terrans. And then to watch the last game, where ryung once again played as good as any terran could in this current time period, but still lost to infestors


Yeah and forgetting siege tech in that last game. He played so perfect lol.

So tosses how are you liking the new mutalisks so far?


I don't agree that it has to be balanced at all times to flourish. For example, if we are to consider WoL decently balanced right now, then the early WoL was imbalanced. Yet, the scene was still flourishing.

It would be interesting and fun if the strategies/units kept changing every few years, but that's pretty much like making a new game haha (you'd have to change the things in such a way as to keep the design still interesting and "making sense" and not just changing random things)

but it would still be fun to watch/play, since it would be less about playing perfectly with a balanced game and more like discovering what strategies are the best and how to play in an unstable metagame

but then again, a similar idea can be applied, in the forms of new and interesting maps :D just to a lesser extent
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
Velinath
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States694 Posts
December 13 2012 06:21 GMT
#385
That is a pretty huge muta buff. I'm excited to try it out, as I've always preferred muta play to anything else in the midgame and have felt limited in midgame options at times due to the strength of Infestors (they can feel indispensable in some games).
Crawdad
Profile Joined September 2012
614 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-13 06:28:52
December 13 2012 06:28 GMT
#386
How do the upgrades for Tempests work?

Are there three different values (air attack vs. massive, air attack vs. non-massive, ground attack)?
thezanursic
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
5498 Posts
December 13 2012 06:28 GMT
#387
Caduceus Reactor what's that?
http://i45.tinypic.com/9j2cdc.jpg Let it be so!
Crawdad
Profile Joined September 2012
614 Posts
December 13 2012 06:30 GMT
#388
On December 13 2012 15:28 thezanursic wrote:
Caduceus Reactor what's that?


The upgrade that gives Medivacs an increased healing rate.
Arco
Profile Joined September 2009
United States2090 Posts
December 13 2012 06:30 GMT
#389
On December 13 2012 15:28 thezanursic wrote:
Caduceus Reactor what's that?

Old Medivac energy upgrade, they changed it to increase healing done
SarcasmMonster
Profile Joined October 2011
3136 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-13 06:36:58
December 13 2012 06:36 GMT
#390
On December 13 2012 15:30 Crawdad wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 13 2012 15:28 thezanursic wrote:
Caduceus Reactor what's that?


The upgrade that gives Medivacs an increased healing rate.


I think it's extremely important for you posters to know that I was the one who suggested that change. Therefore I'm officially a SC2 game designer, and my opinion matters more than everyone elses.
MMA: The true King of Wings
Asturas
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Finland587 Posts
December 13 2012 06:36 GMT
#391
oh my...
SC2 is becoming Brood War, in this meaning that it is now collection of OP units. Same as in BW - you know: BW's Tanks, HTs and so on. In HOTS: Medivacs, Reapers, Mutas, Tempests(?)
I don't know if I like it, but man... pro games, tournaments, this is going to be interesting.

One more thing. Long time ago Blizzard nerfed Hellions because they were OP in... TvT. Even before that they nerfed Reapers, coz of OP in TvZ. In HOTS new Reapers are definitely too powerful in TvT. They don't seem to be a problem in other matchups, but they cause same problem in TvT as Hellions caused long time ago. I wonder when they are going to be changed.
There are no boundaries, that's the final conclusion.
Woizit
Profile Joined June 2011
801 Posts
December 13 2012 06:47 GMT
#392
On the topic of colour changes, how's the colour contrast of Zerg units in HOTS?

Broodlings and Infestor eggs are indistinguishable in WOL, which make it very hard to understand which is whose in Zerg mirrors. Will Blizzard be fixing this?
s3rp
Profile Joined May 2011
Germany3192 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-13 06:48:58
December 13 2012 06:48 GMT
#393
On December 13 2012 15:36 Asturas wrote:
oh my...
SC2 is becoming Brood War, in this meaning that it is now collection of OP units. Same as in BW - you know: BW's Tanks, HTs and so on. In HOTS: Medivacs, Reapers, Mutas, Tempests(?)
I don't know if I like it, but man... pro games, tournaments, this is going to be interesting.

One more thing. Long time ago Blizzard nerfed Hellions because they were OP in... TvT. Even before that they nerfed Reapers, coz of OP in TvZ. In HOTS new Reapers are definitely too powerful in TvT. They don't seem to be a problem in other matchups, but they cause same problem in TvT as Hellions caused long time ago. I wonder when they are going to be changed.


Reapers makes TvT a bit wierd but it doesn't neccesarly break the matchup. Yeah Gasless openings are extremely hard to pull off ( but not impossible if you're careful ) but other than that i think it's fine . You can allways build a few Reaper yourself and put them in a bunker ( watching other reapers get torn apart by a reaper bunker is hillarious , almost as fun as watching a horde of zerglings get destroyed by 4 reapers in a bunker and your opponent scream imba ^^ ) or get a marauder or fasttech to widow mines.
nomyx
Profile Joined June 2012
United States2205 Posts
December 13 2012 06:59 GMT
#394
The more and more time that passes the better HOTS is getting. I've been playing Protoss ever since the Wings beta (having switched from Zerg in brood war) and while I do enjoy playing Protoss, I want to go back to my Zerg roots. The buffs to the hydralisk and mutalisk (both of which were my first and second favorite units) are making me really excited. It was first the roach and the infestor that pushed me away from switching back to Zerg, but with all these HOTS changes (not just to zerg but to all the races) SC2 is becoming a much better game to watch and play. And I love it.

Quick question for those in the beta, how are swarm hosts looking?
mannerless
Profile Joined May 2010
Brazil86 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-13 07:00:53
December 13 2012 07:00 GMT
#395
/\ Swarm Hosts are badass.

It's weird, I know BL/Infestor was ridiculous in WOL but making BLs tottaly worthless (at laest in ZvP)isn't exactly a good solution.
lurking the forums since 2003
Zahir
Profile Joined March 2012
United States947 Posts
December 13 2012 07:06 GMT
#396
The muta change I am not crazy about. It feels like a contrived excuse to keep widow Mines in as a (badly designed) anti air unit for Terran. I am disappointed blizz did not yet make boost speed for medivac cost energy (rather than Cooldown). I also think tempests were strong enough... The other changes were good I guess.

Overall I'm still excited that blizzard is continuing to implement patches.
What is best? To crush the Zerg, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of the Protoss.
BigRedDog
Profile Joined May 2012
461 Posts
December 13 2012 07:11 GMT
#397
To be honest, i am not that excited about the health regeneration buff given to mutalisks.

It doesn't make them stronger in a fight. They might last one more hit because of faster regeneration. The regeneration might help them get back in the fight faster....(but queen's quick heal role is already doing that).

The faster acceleration buff is actually a lot better. You can dance around the army and harass like a ninja.
Big Red Dog!
Daswollvieh
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
5553 Posts
December 13 2012 07:12 GMT
#398
On December 13 2012 15:36 SarcasmMonster wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 13 2012 15:30 Crawdad wrote:
On December 13 2012 15:28 thezanursic wrote:
Caduceus Reactor what's that?


The upgrade that gives Medivacs an increased healing rate.


I think it's extremely important for you posters to know that I was the one who suggested that change. Therefore I'm officially a SC2 game designer, and my opinion matters more than everyone elses.


It only matters if you say you´re high masters and you should know that by now.

Mutalisk change looks good. So they were onto something with the reaper regeneration. ^^

Wish they adressed the Seeker Missile, but that will probably come soon.
gronnelg
Profile Joined December 2010
Norway354 Posts
December 13 2012 07:13 GMT
#399
Sick change to the mutas! Nice! :D
Lulzez || My stream: http://www.twitch.tv/gronnelg
Graphix
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
United States208 Posts
December 13 2012 07:17 GMT
#400
i dont understand the reason for buffing mutalisks and buffing widow mines the patch previous. widow mines destroy mutas in zvt
~Jaedong Forever~
Prev 1 18 19 20 21 22 42 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 31m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
scan(afreeca) 951
Pusan 291
Zeus 155
actioN 138
Sacsri 125
Backho 96
ggaemo 58
Aegong 19
Noble 17
Bale 17
[ Show more ]
Hm[arnc] 15
IntoTheRainbow 12
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm125
League of Legends
JimRising 674
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K1211
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox307
Mew2King60
Westballz23
Other Games
summit1g10806
m0e_tv405
C9.Mang0334
Trikslyr30
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream5089
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream2487
Other Games
gamesdonequick772
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Stunt486
Upcoming Events
CranKy Ducklings
2h 31m
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
3h 31m
SC Evo League
6h 1m
IPSL
8h 31m
WolFix vs nOmaD
dxtr13 vs Razz
BSL
11h 31m
UltrA vs KwarK
Gosudark vs cavapoo
dxtr13 vs HBO
Doodle vs Razz
Patches Events
14h 31m
CranKy Ducklings
16h 31m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 2h
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
1d 3h
Ladder Legends
1d 7h
[ Show More ]
BSL
1d 11h
StRyKeR vs rasowy
Artosis vs Aether
JDConan vs OyAji
Hawk vs izu
IPSL
1d 11h
JDConan vs TBD
Aegong vs rasowy
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Bisu vs Ample
Jaedong vs Flash
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Barracks vs Leta
Royal vs Light
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
KCM Race Survival
5 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Escore
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W3
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W4
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.