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On August 14 2010 22:20 Eiviyn wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2010 21:35 keioh wrote:
I might be a Captain Obvious for this one, but... "Narud" is "Duran" backwards. I have to say this, but I don't know if it makes any sense. I'm not saying he isn't Duran because in all likelyhood, Narud probably is Duran, but I just can't see his motivation. Duran would want to kill Kerrigan for his hybrids to prosper, referencing the "In Utter Darkness" dialog. Narud, however, is basically working to save Kerrigan. That's rather conflicting. Although that opens the plot twist of Duran not being able to kill Kerrigan in her zerg form, but as Narud he can use Raynor to weaken her with the artifact and then kill her.
So if Narud was the one to inform the dominion/ control Raynor to collect these artifacts, then what sprung Kerrigan to want these? Maybe if Narud went back into his old Duran form, and inform her (unlikely but why else would kerrigan want these), This puts Kerrigan in danger, (she comes out into the open world and becomes human again) which is what Duran wants? It isn't just coincidence that Moebius and Kerrigan wants these things at the same time.
Sorry if I'm not making any sense here. But I'm just trying to speculate what sprung Kerrigan to want these.
EDIT: this backs up the theory that Narud is Duran
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The key word might be natural, but just like your use of the word real previously in this thread, it has no meaning outside speculation.
Granted, splicing DNA is unlikely to be qualified as being natural, however, given the assumption that the hybrids are Xel'naga, then it must be natural enough.
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On August 15 2010 06:03 Elegance wrote:
So if Narud was the one to inform the dominion/ control Raynor to collect these artifacts, then what sprung Kerrigan to want these? Maybe if Narud went back into his old Duran form, and inform her (unlikely but why else would kerrigan want these), This puts Kerrigan in danger, (she comes out into the open world and becomes human again) which is what Duran wants? It isn't just coincidence that Moebius and Kerrigan wants these things at the same time.
Sorry if I'm not making any sense here. But I'm just trying to speculate what sprung Kerrigan to want these.
EDIT: this backs up the theory that Narud is Duran
Impossible to tell right now, hopefully it is explained why Kerrigan wanted those artifacts in HotS otherwise it'd be a rather annoying plot hole.
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Good read, fills in some of the gaps with comforting speculation (backed by sources, of course), I guess we'll just have to wait and see where th story goes from here.
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I just replayed SCII and noticed some more probs with your idea.
First if you look at the dark voice's portrait you will notice that he looks like a weird Protoss, meaning he is probably wearing a Hybrid skin (or maybe even a previous Xel'Naga incarnation), however the Voice in the Dark looks like a giant tentacled blob, most closely resembling C'thun from warcraft (in personality as well I might add >_< ). Any way this is further proof to me that they AREN'T the same.
Secondly, during In Utter Darkness he (the Dark Voice) says "As I was your beginning so shall I be your end." Meaning that he had a hand in the creation of the Protoss, this means he had to be a Xel'Naga because nothing went wrong with the Protoss experiment and the entity was imprisoned at the time. We also know that the Voice in the Dark was destroying civilizations when he was stopped by the Xel'Naga who just arrived meaning he couldn't be a Xel'Naga himself, so clearly the two entities are not one the same.
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On August 15 2010 06:08 Eiviyn wrote:The key word might be natural, but just like your use of the word real previously in this thread, it has no meaning outside speculation. Granted, splicing DNA is unlikely to be qualified as being natural, however, given the assumption that the hybrids are Xel'naga, then it must be natural enough.
"The xel'naga will not be reborn. Instead, a monstrous and powerful perversion of both protoss and zerg will be set loose upon the universe, and all that we know and cherish will fall in their wake."
http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Hybrid
Is this finally good enough for you?
I mean, if you have a problem with the content of the wiki, take it to them, I am merely quoting them.
On August 15 2010 07:41 nemanja1503 wrote:
I just replayed SCII and noticed some more probs with your idea.
First if you look at the dark voice's portrait you will notice that he looks like a weird Protoss, meaning he is probably wearing a Hybrid skin (or maybe even a previous Xel'Naga incarnation), however the Voice in the Dark looks like a giant tentacled blob, most closely resembling C'thun from warcraft (in personality as well I might add >_< ). Any way this is further proof to me that they AREN'T the same.
Secondly, during In Utter Darkness he (the Dark Voice) says "As I was your beginning so shall I be your end." Meaning that he had a hand in the creation of the Protoss, this means he had to be a Xel'Naga because nothing went wrong with the Protoss experiment and the entity was imprisoned at the time. We also know that the Voice in the Dark was destroying civilizations when he was stopped by the Xel'Naga who just arrived meaning he couldn't be a Xel'Naga himself, so clearly the two entities are not one the same.
We had this discussion about the Voice in the Dark and the Dark Voice a couple of pages ago, and reached a conclusion that it is unlikely that two super-powerful, hostile to the Xel'naga creatures, which boast to be the 'one true God', exist in the same galaxy, are unaware of each other, and have similar names.
Furthermore, the real face of the Dark Voice, or it's physical manifestation may be different than the possessed Hybrid shown in the campaign. It is entirely possible that Blizzard haven't thought of the future of the story themselves.
Also, a couple of pages back, I said that the Xel'naga, who accelerated the evolution of the Protoss and Zerg, are not their true creators. Although I am repeating myself, I'll say it once again. In it's centre, purity of essence and form are naturally developed traits, that's why the Xel'naga scour the universe for species having developed them.
That means the Xel'naga are not the creators of the Protoss and the Zerg and a Xel'naga would most probably never boast they did so (take their benevolent nature and way of thinking).
Furthermore if indeed, and chance is very high, Voice in the Dark and the Dark Voice are the same entity, it was already imprisoned when the Xel'naga traveled to Aiur.
The boast of the Dark Voice that he was the creator of the Protoss and Zerg does not make him a Xel'naga. On the contrary, it solidifies the idea he is not.
Here we go into speculation, I already said that it is completely possible that the Dark Voice is so powerful that he lured the Xel'naga into choosing races which he has created himself. That explains why would he boast that he was the beginning of the Protoss and the Zerg.
It is possible that the Protoss and the Zerg were created with flaws the Dark Voice could exploit (Protoss being religiously fanatic and opposing change and the Zerg being easy to manipulate - even Terrans used Zerg for their own aim, remember?; also explains how the Overmind, who is a Xel'naga creation based on Zerg DNA fell under the influence of the Dark Voice, while the Dark Voice was imprisoned).
Here Terrans step in as a balancing factor the Dark Voice could not envision. And, for all you Human-lovers, they become much more important. Tassadar broke with the Conclave due to humans, Zerg leadership was changed due to humans, the Khalai and Nerazim came together and overcame their differences with the help of humans.
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I have a complaint about the Xel'naga. Why did they give up sex and sexual reproduction in the first place? Merging of two species in separate corners of the galaxy is a ridiculous method of reproduction.
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On August 23 2010 13:47 DetriusXii wrote:
I have a complaint about the Xel'naga. Why did they give up sex and sexual reproduction in the first place? Merging of two species in separate corners of the galaxy is a ridiculous method of reproduction.
Since when did you get to pick the way you were able to reproduce?
Anyways, great piece together of the random tidbits of lore I have read over the years. I am a little confused on how the 2 races make Xel Naga, did I miss something?
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On August 14 2010 22:20 Eiviyn wrote:
I'm not saying he isn't Duran because in all likelyhood, Narud probably is Duran, but I just can't see his motivation.
Duran would want to kill Kerrigan for his hybrids to prosper, referencing the "In Utter Darkness" dialog. Narud, however, is basically working to save Kerrigan. That's rather conflicting.
Although that opens the plot twist of Duran not being able to kill Kerrigan in her zerg form, but as Narud he can use Raynor to weaken her with the artifact and then kill her.
Don't forget, as Narud (as a Moebius leader), he blackmailed Tychus to try to kill her. I'm going to go with the "she can't be killed easily in Zerg form" theory. Note that WoL ends with battlecruisers flying overhead. Something tells me that HotS starts off escaping from the Terrans on Char.
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I have this really dirty feeling that Valerian is going to somehow end up himself being/becoming an alien(either dark voice race, or become new zerg king). Blizzard is known to recycle characters/plot twists, and he has that Arthas vibe haha. His obsession with artifacts+ moebius ties to dark ones and the mengsk factories making hybrids seems like it could come together somehow.
Maybe by the end of zerg campaign he gets some control of zerg to keep them "evil" in protoss campaign.
edit: Maybe the dark voice are like exiled or radical militant xelnaga that had other goals?
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Interesting (if inconclusive) data point:
In the game data files, the "Dark Voice" portrait is filed under Protoss, and if you open the portrait in the editor and zoom out it's quite obviously a protoss.
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sorry if this has been answered, but where is everyone coming up with this dr. narud? was he in the secret mission that i have yet to unlock? i don't recall seeing him anywhere in sc2 =[[[
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On August 24 2010 09:13 KillerPlague wrote:
sorry if this has been answered, but where is everyone coming up with this dr. narud? was he in the secret mission that i have yet to unlock? i don't recall seeing him anywhere in sc2 =[[[
He's the leader of the Moebius foundation in the Moebius factor mission. He also has the same facial hair as Samir Duran. Kerrigan claims to see through his "Dr. Narud" charade.
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Really good points made by the OP in every post he made in this thread - a commendable effort. Hell, I consider myself a lore freak but a few points you made put some things into a better perspective, I never thought I'd say that 
The only problem is the flood of stupid replies this has gotten, questions asked which are answered in the topic / in the wiki links. Some people just can't grasp things which are more complicated than a Hollywood movie plot it seems =\
Personally I think Blizzard is doing a great job with the plot so far (despite WoL being pretty predictable and Hollywood love story-like all along. Oh and I mentioned this elsewhere once, the only thing which irks me is the lack of UED activity. I'm sure they kinda noticed that nothing made it back from their expeditionary fleet 5 years ago.)
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Actually, it is quite simple:
Dark Voice = Space Diablo
Tassadar = Space Archangel Gabriel
Valerian = Space Arthas
Ulrezaj = Space Illidan
Tychus = Space Grom Hellscream
Zeratul = Ninja Space Deckard Cain
Raynor = Space Guybrush Threepwood
Recycling character designs for better sustainability in the future.
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On August 24 2010 11:57 brocoli wrote:
Actually, it is quite simple:
Dark Voice = Space Diablo
Tassadar = Space Archangel Gabriel
Valerian = Space Arthas
Ulrezaj = Space Illidan
Tychus = Space Grom Hellscream
Zeratul = Ninja Space Deckard Cain
Raynor = Space Guybrush Threepwood
Recycling character designs for better sustainability in the future.
Awesome. I don't know who half those guys are but the idea of Ninja Space Deckard Cain is pretty much the best thing ever.
Ever.
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=D
But on a more serious note:
On August 15 2010 18:40 Rethq wrote:
The boast of the Dark Voice that he was the creator of the Protoss and Zerg does not make him a Xel'naga. On the contrary, it solidifies the idea he is not.
Here we go into speculation, I already said that it is completely possible that the Dark Voice is so powerful that he lured the Xel'naga into choosing races which he has created himself. That explains why would he boast that he was the beginning of the Protoss and the Zerg.
It is possible that the Protoss and the Zerg were created with flaws the Dark Voice could exploit (Protoss being religiously fanatic and opposing change and the Zerg being easy to manipulate - even Terrans used Zerg for their own aim, remember?; also explains how the Overmind, who is a Xel'naga creation based on Zerg DNA fell under the influence of the Dark Voice, while the Dark Voice was imprisoned).
Here Terrans step in as a balancing factor the Dark Voice could not envision. And, for all you Human-lovers, they become much more important. Tassadar broke with the Conclave due to humans, Zerg leadership was changed due to humans, the Khalai and Nerazim came together and overcame their differences with the help of humans.
This makes So much sense, and is also quite awesome...
...but I don't have enough faith that this new Blizzard would be able to come up with such an amazing story =/
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quite unreliable info if you ask me, well at least parts of it.
Don't think what you wrote is really correct and it may go any way.
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EPT
