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Off-Topic General Discussion - Page 1515

Forum Index > The Shopkeeper′s Inn
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jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
March 26 2014 18:41 GMT
#30281
On March 27 2014 02:49 onlywonderboy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 02:42 SagaZ wrote:
Link is high tier in project M? brb switching games

I would take that list with a huge grain of salt ha.


Yes, but Link is very good in P:M. He just has a lot of options for most situations, and he's fairly easy to use imo. I think he'll lose some favor once people get used to playing against him.
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-26 18:43:40
March 26 2014 18:42 GMT
#30282
On March 27 2014 03:41 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 02:49 onlywonderboy wrote:
On March 27 2014 02:42 SagaZ wrote:
Link is high tier in project M? brb switching games

I would take that list with a huge grain of salt ha.


Yes, but Link is very good in P:M. He just has a lot of options for most situations, and he's fairly easy to use imo. I think he'll lose some favor once people get used to playing against him.

Maybe Smashboard browsing has just ruined me, read some stuff about him not being that good. Although I guess this was a couple months ago so maybe perceptions have changed. But then again opinions are opinions.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
phyvo
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States5635 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-26 18:46:55
March 26 2014 18:44 GMT
#30283
On March 27 2014 02:23 onlywonderboy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 01:48 jcarlsoniv wrote:
http://clashtournaments.com/project-m-3-02-preliminary-tier-list/

this tier hurts my brain in so many ways

fucking reign of gaming level shit

On March 27 2014 01:46 wei2coolman wrote:
On March 27 2014 01:42 Requizen wrote:
The difference is, people can relate to stupid work bullshit, but if I talk about my relationship it sounds like bragging.

Well it is a little bit. But that's not the point.

No one cares about your superior officer.


alwp

Yeah, I love Zelda, but most people on Smashboards agrees she's not that high of a tier. I played in a small tournament a couple weekends ago at Ohio State and took second, but the guy that won was on a whole other level than everyone else. He was the only one that Wavedashed consistently and what not. He didn't drop a single game, it was rough haha.


liquid KDJ usually wins the weekly PM tournament in my area and he plays zelda among other characters.

IMO you shouldn't really worry about tiers in PM. Even the worst of PM's low tier is far better off than Melee's atm. The more important thing is to try out characters and just pick the one you like. Heck I see people putting Dedede at the bottom of their lists all the time and a Dedede player placed 5th at Apex out of 500-600 entrants.

It's not like anybody gathered a ton of data that shows how bad Dedede is, they just formed an opinion based on their, what, 3 months worth of experience since version 3.0? If after a year he's turns out awful there's actual people that can patch things this time so I doubt that any character will be left unplayable.
"BE A MANGO TO SLEEP LIKE A SNORING TIGER" - Monte
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
March 26 2014 18:47 GMT
#30284
I don't think tiers are the end all be all, but I think they are a good spring board for discussion about a characters' strengths and weaknesses. Overall P:M is way more balanced so specific tiers don't mean nearly as much.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-26 18:49:48
March 26 2014 18:49 GMT
#30285
On March 27 2014 03:42 onlywonderboy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 03:41 jcarlsoniv wrote:
On March 27 2014 02:49 onlywonderboy wrote:
On March 27 2014 02:42 SagaZ wrote:
Link is high tier in project M? brb switching games

I would take that list with a huge grain of salt ha.


Yes, but Link is very good in P:M. He just has a lot of options for most situations, and he's fairly easy to use imo. I think he'll lose some favor once people get used to playing against him.

Maybe Smashboard browsing has just ruined me, read some stuff about him not being that good. Although I guess this was a couple months ago so maybe perceptions have changed. But then again opinions are opinions.


Idk, I've played against a few recently and had some real trouble just because of how much he was able to do/deal with.

edit: also, his Up B ledge guard is gay as fuck

On March 27 2014 03:44 phyvo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 02:23 onlywonderboy wrote:
On March 27 2014 01:48 jcarlsoniv wrote:
http://clashtournaments.com/project-m-3-02-preliminary-tier-list/

this tier hurts my brain in so many ways

fucking reign of gaming level shit

On March 27 2014 01:46 wei2coolman wrote:
On March 27 2014 01:42 Requizen wrote:
The difference is, people can relate to stupid work bullshit, but if I talk about my relationship it sounds like bragging.

Well it is a little bit. But that's not the point.

No one cares about your superior officer.


alwp

Yeah, I love Zelda, but most people on Smashboards agrees she's not that high of a tier. I played in a small tournament a couple weekends ago at Ohio State and took second, but the guy that won was on a whole other level than everyone else. He was the only one that Wavedashed consistently and what not. He didn't drop a single game, it was rough haha.


liquid KDJ usually wins the weekly PM tournament in my area and he plays zelda among other characters.

IMO you shouldn't really worry about tiers in PM. Even the worst of PM's low tier is far better off than Melee's atm. The more important thing is to try out characters and just pick the one you like. Heck I see people putting Dedede at the bottom of their lists all the time and a Dedede player placed 5th at Apex out of 500-600 entrants.

It's not like anybody gathered a ton of data that shows how bad Dedede is, they just formed an opinion based on their, what, 3 months worth of experience since version 3.0? If after a year he's turns out awful there's actual people that can patch things this time so I doubt that any character will be left unplayable.


I do hope, though, that the PMBR will come closer and closer to a hands off approach with the game. The beauty of Melee is that it has been left completely alone, which caused people to grow and develop to overcome different things within the game.

Unfortunately, that means that select few Melee characters are actually viable at a high level. P:M has done an amazing job at opening to doors to a huge cast of characters, I just hope that at some point they say "ok, we're done making changes".
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
phyvo
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States5635 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-26 18:55:36
March 26 2014 18:49 GMT
#30286
They're a springboard for discussion indeed but they're not a good reason to avoid playing the character you like in PM.

Melee competitive tier actually broadened a lot (8 characters I hear), it's all the characters below that which absolutely suck. Given the history PMBR has being smash vets (and what I've read from them on the forums) I doubt they have an over-patching kind of culture (not to mention that they watched Brawl+, an older mod, fall into this pattern and die a long time ago).
"BE A MANGO TO SLEEP LIKE A SNORING TIGER" - Monte
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
March 26 2014 18:52 GMT
#30287
On March 27 2014 03:49 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 03:42 onlywonderboy wrote:
On March 27 2014 03:41 jcarlsoniv wrote:
On March 27 2014 02:49 onlywonderboy wrote:
On March 27 2014 02:42 SagaZ wrote:
Link is high tier in project M? brb switching games

I would take that list with a huge grain of salt ha.


Yes, but Link is very good in P:M. He just has a lot of options for most situations, and he's fairly easy to use imo. I think he'll lose some favor once people get used to playing against him.

Maybe Smashboard browsing has just ruined me, read some stuff about him not being that good. Although I guess this was a couple months ago so maybe perceptions have changed. But then again opinions are opinions.


Idk, I've played against a few recently and had some real trouble just because of how much he was able to do/deal with.

edit: also, his Up B ledge guard is gay as fuck

Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 03:44 phyvo wrote:
On March 27 2014 02:23 onlywonderboy wrote:
On March 27 2014 01:48 jcarlsoniv wrote:
http://clashtournaments.com/project-m-3-02-preliminary-tier-list/

this tier hurts my brain in so many ways

fucking reign of gaming level shit

On March 27 2014 01:46 wei2coolman wrote:
On March 27 2014 01:42 Requizen wrote:
The difference is, people can relate to stupid work bullshit, but if I talk about my relationship it sounds like bragging.

Well it is a little bit. But that's not the point.

No one cares about your superior officer.


alwp

Yeah, I love Zelda, but most people on Smashboards agrees she's not that high of a tier. I played in a small tournament a couple weekends ago at Ohio State and took second, but the guy that won was on a whole other level than everyone else. He was the only one that Wavedashed consistently and what not. He didn't drop a single game, it was rough haha.


liquid KDJ usually wins the weekly PM tournament in my area and he plays zelda among other characters.

IMO you shouldn't really worry about tiers in PM. Even the worst of PM's low tier is far better off than Melee's atm. The more important thing is to try out characters and just pick the one you like. Heck I see people putting Dedede at the bottom of their lists all the time and a Dedede player placed 5th at Apex out of 500-600 entrants.

It's not like anybody gathered a ton of data that shows how bad Dedede is, they just formed an opinion based on their, what, 3 months worth of experience since version 3.0? If after a year he's turns out awful there's actual people that can patch things this time so I doubt that any character will be left unplayable.


I do hope, though, that the PMBR will come closer and closer to a hands off approach with the game. The beauty of Melee is that it has been left completely alone, which caused people to grow and develop to overcome different things within the game.

Unfortunately, that means that select few Melee characters are actually viable at a high level. P:M has done an amazing job at opening to doors to a huge cast of characters, I just hope that at some point they say "ok, we're done making changes".

Nope, they're gonna go full Riot.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
sung_moon
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States10110 Posts
March 26 2014 19:12 GMT
#30288
On March 27 2014 03:49 phyvo wrote:
They're a springboard for discussion indeed but they're not a good reason to avoid playing the character you like in PM.

Melee competitive tier actually broadened a lot (8 characters I hear), it's all the characters below that which absolutely suck. Given the history PMBR has being smash vets (and what I've read from them on the forums) I doubt they have an over-patching kind of culture (not to mention that they watched Brawl+, an older mod, fall into this pattern and die a long time ago).


Damn Melee sounds a lot like Mvc2.

What's more popular though, Project M or Brawl?
Assuming Project M but Brawl is probably played more because its more recent. Just curious, and purely basing off what I know from only watching an hour to two of Apex Brawl/Melee footage.
Forever Young
WaveofShadow
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada31495 Posts
March 26 2014 19:15 GMT
#30289
I'm so tired.....
twitch.tv/waveofshadow ||| Winner of AHGL's So You Think You Can Cast! ||| Juicy Dad for lyfe ||| 'idk i get a kick out of stupid things' - Jarms Yarng
jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
March 26 2014 19:25 GMT
#30290
On March 27 2014 04:12 sung_moon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 03:49 phyvo wrote:
They're a springboard for discussion indeed but they're not a good reason to avoid playing the character you like in PM.

Melee competitive tier actually broadened a lot (8 characters I hear), it's all the characters below that which absolutely suck. Given the history PMBR has being smash vets (and what I've read from them on the forums) I doubt they have an over-patching kind of culture (not to mention that they watched Brawl+, an older mod, fall into this pattern and die a long time ago).


Damn Melee sounds a lot like Mvc2.

What's more popular though, Project M or Brawl?
Assuming Project M but Brawl is probably played more because its more recent. Just curious, and purely basing off what I know from only watching an hour to two of Apex Brawl/Melee footage.


Project M is more recent. I'm not actually sure which is more popular right now, but P:M is picking up a lot of steam. Cuz, ya know, it doesn't suck.
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21245 Posts
March 26 2014 19:43 GMT
#30291
In terms of how much it matters from an ESPORTS perspective, Melee >>> Project M > Brawl.
TranslatorBaa!
sung_moon
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States10110 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-26 20:02:20
March 26 2014 20:01 GMT
#30292
Figured the Smash community was experiencing the "Well this games better (Melee/ Project M) but there's more money (?) and people (also ?) playing this newer inferior game". Can attest this is the dilemma a ton of the players around here that play SF4/MVC3 feel (specifically the OGs) and imagine its the same for the Smash ppl (especially Melee players)
Forever Young
kainzero
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States5211 Posts
March 26 2014 20:15 GMT
#30293
My favorite part of Oculus Rift being bought by Facebook is people complaining about it.

On Facebook.
Nos-
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Canada12016 Posts
March 26 2014 20:23 GMT
#30294
On March 27 2014 05:15 kainzero wrote:
My favorite part of Oculus Rift being bought by Facebook is people complaining about it.

On Facebook.

Don't worry they're going to fund VR with corporate rebellious spirit energy
Bronze player stuck in platinum
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
March 26 2014 20:29 GMT
#30295
On March 27 2014 04:43 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
In terms of how much it matters from an ESPORTS perspective, Melee >>> Project M > Brawl.

so why is melee >>> project m?
Are their mechanics that exist that P:M doesn't have, that Melee does?
liftlift > tsm
GhandiEAGLE
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States20754 Posts
March 26 2014 20:30 GMT
#30296
On March 27 2014 05:29 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 04:43 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
In terms of how much it matters from an ESPORTS perspective, Melee >>> Project M > Brawl.

so why is melee >>> project m?
Are their mechanics that exist that P:M doesn't have, that Melee does?

P:M feels a little weird. Personally I don't think it's to the extent that Cheep suggests, but Melee is still a little better (mechanically).
Oh, my achin' hands, from rakin' in grands, and breakin' in mic stands
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21245 Posts
March 26 2014 20:38 GMT
#30297
In terms of prestige and value placed on winning a tournament, when all three games are at the same tournament, you bet your ass people are gonna care more about melee, both from a competitor and a spectator perspective.

Facebook down 12% over the past week, 7% today. RIP 10B market cap.
TranslatorBaa!
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
March 26 2014 20:46 GMT
#30298
On March 27 2014 05:38 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
In terms of prestige and value placed on winning a tournament, when all three games are at the same tournament, you bet your ass people are gonna care more about melee, both from a competitor and a spectator perspective.

Facebook down 12% over the past week, 7% today. RIP 10B market cap.

Oh I thought you were talking about like competitiveness in regards to how balanced the game is and game design stuff, not nostalgia fags (YEAH U HERD ME)
liftlift > tsm
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-26 20:48:46
March 26 2014 20:47 GMT
#30299
On March 27 2014 05:29 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 04:43 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
In terms of how much it matters from an ESPORTS perspective, Melee >>> Project M > Brawl.

so why is melee >>> project m?
Are their mechanics that exist that P:M doesn't have, that Melee does?

It's a more mechanically complex game and has a higher skill cap. Takes way more time to get good at Melee. Kinda seems like BW compared to SC2. Plus there is a ton of history to the game and rivalries and storylines already exists so there is stuff for spectators to latch onto.

Edit: Most of the mechanics that exists in Melee also exist in P:M but they are generally easier to pull off.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-26 20:50:17
March 26 2014 20:49 GMT
#30300
On March 27 2014 05:47 onlywonderboy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2014 05:29 wei2coolman wrote:
On March 27 2014 04:43 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
In terms of how much it matters from an ESPORTS perspective, Melee >>> Project M > Brawl.

so why is melee >>> project m?
Are their mechanics that exist that P:M doesn't have, that Melee does?

It's a more mechanically complex game and has a higher skill cap. Takes way more time to get good at Melee. Kinda seems like BW compared to SC2. Plus there is a ton of history to the game and rivalries and storylines already exists so there is stuff for spectators to latch onto.

Edit: Most of the mechanics that exists in Melee also exist in P:M but they are generally easier to pull off.


What mechanics are in Melee that aren't in P:M? I know there were issue[s] with having to work with the Brawl engine, but I don't actually know the specifics.

edit: also, easier to pull off in what way?
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
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