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Part 1) recent (lack of) Zerg results
It's only been 3 months since Kato '24 so too early to draw any conclusions. We've gotten used to Zerg dominance over the past 5+ years so people immediately make noises when we see a blip in the trend.
There are circumstances apart from Serral's absence:
1. In Korea, for the 2 championship-level contenders, Dark is a new father on top of approaching retirement, frankly I don't know how he finds the energy to still compete. Solar has apparently gotten a bit demoralized after losing to Clem in Kato and not been practicing much - this is hearsay but somewhat validated by Solar's recent post calling himself lazy.
2. In Europe, the only other contender is Reynor. What I've noticed about him is he's become complacent (bragging about his own speed, saying he will win GSL...) and submissive (saying "Serral is the GOAT" - remember he was once on par with Serral) at the same time. I still think he has potential but in the near term he seems to be having a psyche issue.
Part 2) reflecting on Serral
Why does Serral win so much? I'd love to watch an interview of pros on this - IMO in TvZ Serral makes better use of Zerg's arsenal than others:
1. combine fungals with other units in a 1-2 punch - while other zergs can also easily land fungals, their troop movements are often not coordinated well enough to land the killing blow. Terran late game defense is so dependent on ghosts that once they are eliminated the game is over
2. always encircle - this is a no brainer for me and I'm surprised so many zergs get caught up in frontal battles without tactics. This is especially effective against Tanks/Libs.
3. always backstab during a frontal engagement - again a no brainer but few zergs do this consistently - and I'm not sure it's just an APM issue. Rather there needs to be a conscious effort to set them up in advance (e.g. park lings at an empty space and attack only when Terran has moved into Zerg territory). Lurkers, ling/bane, mutas are perfect for this - Zergs can "fire-and-forget" and tax Terran multi-tasking. Explain to me how Terran is supposed to scan/dodge fungals when a burrowed lurker is killing a full base of SCVs?
3. optimized builds, large maps, queens + solid defense so no risk of dying in the early game, then fast expand into superior economy, use creep to gain mobility so as to protect peripheral bases together with static defenses, relentless attacks to drain Terran of resources, and eventually overwhelm
Serral is fast but it's not like he's the fastest. To me it's the discipline of sticking to this playbook (obviously enabled by good APM/multi-tasking) that sets him apart. Kinda makes me wonder if Maru had chosen to play Zerg what would he have looked like.
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On May 22 2024 17:33 Poopi wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2024 17:06 Harris1st wrote:On May 22 2024 02:59 Poopi wrote:On May 22 2024 01:18 goldensail wrote:On May 22 2024 00:14 Poopi wrote:On May 21 2024 23:12 Durnuu wrote:
Poopi's unadultered hatred of Protoss is as old as the game, and even becoming a "writer" hasn't stopped it Is it hatred though? I watched more PvP this tournament with Firefly vs herO and SKillous vs herO than TvT, since I was sleeping when Maru fought GuMiho (only watched Spirit vs Maru as TvT series). Overall I enjoy the three protoss match-ups, albeit I find PvP a bit too volatile for my taste, and PvZ seems a bit too protoss favored as of late Personally I wouldn't say PvZ is protoss favored. Rather Zergs have become too complacent because for too long they can just grow the economy quicker, trade however inefficiently, and still overwhelm - to the extent that they forgot how to deal with Protoss aggression esp. on smaller maps. With the raw power of the Zerg arsenal, they will bounce back - mark my words. That’s also a possibility. Watching EU zergs without Serral to guide them might make them look bad, so I should wait until the perfect Zerg comes back to see how Zerg truly fares in ZvT and ZvP. The other zergs ain’t at Serral’s level yet to judge the MUs @darklycid: not always. Pretty often when I felt that Protoss struggled in PvT and terrans has it too easy, I cheered for the protoss to win. It happened a lot especially when Clem was playing. I am more Maru biased than Terran biased, so ideally the balance is as that only Maru can win the big tournaments while the other terrans can’t  Balancing around Serral / Maru / Zest would be my ideal There really aren't any "EU zergs" anymore. There is only Reynor and he seems pretty washed these last few months. He wouldn't even be qualified if it weren't for MaxPax fear of LAN. I doubt he can string something together for Dallas. Serral coming directly from the military we'll see how he does but I don't expect too much. Dallas is gonna be a P and T fest but not necessarily because of the patch I don't think Serral "military" training prevents him for training enough to win the whole thing. As for Reynor, I don't think he is washed up either, the expectations put on him were from successes in very favorable patches / conditions, his results are not particularly surprising. Lambo / Elazer are still EU zergs
By definition yes Lambo and Elazer are EU Zergs. Though they both haven't had any impact in the last ~12 months so why you think they would is beyond me. It's like expecting Armani to make a run. He is a Korean Zerg after all and we all know Korean Zergs are good.
As for Reynor: His last notable result is 4 month ago in an online cup (3rd at Master Coliseum) and 7 months ago in an offline cup (3rd at EU Masters Winter). So yes I do expect him to do better than he is doing right now. Washed may be too extreme but he is definitely slumping.
As for Serral: I don't know anything about the Finnish military but I do know military service in general. What makes you think he can be "training enough to win the whole thing"?
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France12738 Posts
On May 22 2024 20:09 Harris1st wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2024 17:33 Poopi wrote:On May 22 2024 17:06 Harris1st wrote:On May 22 2024 02:59 Poopi wrote:On May 22 2024 01:18 goldensail wrote:On May 22 2024 00:14 Poopi wrote:On May 21 2024 23:12 Durnuu wrote:
Poopi's unadultered hatred of Protoss is as old as the game, and even becoming a "writer" hasn't stopped it Is it hatred though? I watched more PvP this tournament with Firefly vs herO and SKillous vs herO than TvT, since I was sleeping when Maru fought GuMiho (only watched Spirit vs Maru as TvT series). Overall I enjoy the three protoss match-ups, albeit I find PvP a bit too volatile for my taste, and PvZ seems a bit too protoss favored as of late Personally I wouldn't say PvZ is protoss favored. Rather Zergs have become too complacent because for too long they can just grow the economy quicker, trade however inefficiently, and still overwhelm - to the extent that they forgot how to deal with Protoss aggression esp. on smaller maps. With the raw power of the Zerg arsenal, they will bounce back - mark my words. That’s also a possibility. Watching EU zergs without Serral to guide them might make them look bad, so I should wait until the perfect Zerg comes back to see how Zerg truly fares in ZvT and ZvP. The other zergs ain’t at Serral’s level yet to judge the MUs @darklycid: not always. Pretty often when I felt that Protoss struggled in PvT and terrans has it too easy, I cheered for the protoss to win. It happened a lot especially when Clem was playing. I am more Maru biased than Terran biased, so ideally the balance is as that only Maru can win the big tournaments while the other terrans can’t Balancing around Serral / Maru / Zest would be my ideal There really aren't any "EU zergs" anymore. There is only Reynor and he seems pretty washed these last few months. He wouldn't even be qualified if it weren't for MaxPax fear of LAN. I doubt he can string something together for Dallas. Serral coming directly from the military we'll see how he does but I don't expect too much. Dallas is gonna be a P and T fest but not necessarily because of the patch I don't think Serral "military" training prevents him for training enough to win the whole thing. As for Reynor, I don't think he is washed up either, the expectations put on him were from successes in very favorable patches / conditions, his results are not particularly surprising. Lambo / Elazer are still EU zergs By definition yes Lambo and Elazer are EU Zergs. Though they both haven't had any impact in the last ~12 months so why you think they would is beyond me. It's like expecting Armani to make a run. He is a Korean Zerg after all and we all know Korean Zergs are good. As for Reynor: His last notable result is 4 month ago in an online cup (3rd at Master Coliseum) and 7 months ago in an offline cup (3rd at EU Masters Winter). So yes I do expect him to do better than he is doing right now. Washed may be too extreme but he is definitely slumping. As for Serral: I don't know anything about the Finnish military but I do know military service in general. What makes you think he can be "training enough to win the whole thing"?
I think you are being too harsh on Lambo and Elazer, or underestimating them.
As for Reynor, I agree with goldensail above. Reynor has been complacent for multiple reasons: he got good during the omega OP Zerg era (2019), so he probably saw himself better than he really was. Now that you got to work harder as Zerg to win, it gets difficult and you can get demotivated quickly.
As for the bragging, it’s his persona, but disrespecting Maru has been a bane for foreign Zergs in the past.
Nerchio for example trash talked Maru hard in like 2016-2017, before fading into obscurity. Reynor trash talking the GOAT before participating in the GSL is reminiscent of the young guns who trash talked Michael Jordan when entering the big league. It usually doesn’t end well
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EPT
