EPTOn November 14 2021 01:56 nojok wrote:
Imagine if Serral was born in Korea, he'd be the goatest.
Imagine if Serral was born in Korea, he'd be the goatest.
If Serral was Korean with the same results no one would call him the GOAT.
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JJH777
United States4418 Posts
If Serral was Korean with the same results no one would call him the GOAT. | ||
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FuRong
New Zealand3089 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24238 Posts
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
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Argonauta
Spain4967 Posts
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Fanatic-Templar
Canada5819 Posts
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:08 Argonauta wrote: I am always amazed by Maru, so on point shutting down those nydus in the main Yeah, he was very on point in their series in the NeXT qualifier, but he accidentally let one through, and he lost the deciding game. It was on the same map as well. It is clear that Maru was determined not to make the same mistake. | ||
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Xain0n
Italy3963 Posts
Also, for the usual naysayers above, not winning Code S because you never play it is a litte different than playing it and never winning it. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24238 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:08 FuRong wrote: I don't want to curse it, but if Serral can get past Rogue then there's really good potential for a Maru/Serral final with both players in top form. well, assuming that the winner of Zest / Scarlett will lose against the winner of Serral / Rogue (which is reasonable) and that Maru beats Clem (again more than reasonable), we should get a great finals no matter what. But I get it, the fabled Maru / Serral finals with both players cruising a great form is something we've all been waiting for  | ||
Poopi
France12912 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:08 FuRong wrote: I don't want to curse it, but if Serral can get past Rogue then there's really good potential for a Maru/Serral final with both players in top form. I would rather have Maru vs Rogue or Clem vs Serral so no cross server bs | ||
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Seacow
Sweden99 Posts
Excellent play from Maru - Heromarine analyzed g2 vs Serral and pointed out how structured Maru's gameplan is. Super smooth transitions with a very robust development of CC:s and infrastructure. Hope we get Maru vs Rogue/Serral finals. | ||
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Captain Peabody
United States3128 Posts
On November 14 2021 01:37 Charoisaur wrote: their performance at World championships surely don't qualify them as GOAT. Serral has 1, Rogue 3 I mean the big difficulty of foreigner vs Korean comparison is that the first 2/3rds to 3/4s of SC2's existence were dominated by Koreans to the point that there really was no question that they were the best (and to the extent that we had world championships that were entirely Korean). There's no question that the top Korean players have been at the top longer than the top foreigners. There's also not really any question that the general foreigner vs Korean skill balance has drastically changed in the last few years. | ||
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:12 Seacow wrote: Excellent play from Maru - Heromarine analyzed g2 vs Serral and pointed out how structured Maru's gameplan is. Super smooth transitions with a very robust development of CC:s and infrastructure. Hope we get Maru vs Rogue/Serral finals. Oh, it'll be great to watch this analysis. Do you have a link/timestamp to that? Edit: Scratch that, I found it. Thanks! | ||
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DarkGamer
Germany330 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:07 JJH777 wrote: If Serral was Korean with the same results no one would call him the GOAT. I would: Vs maru 6-2 Vs ty 5-2 Vs cure 7-2 Vs Innovation 16-8 Vs rogue 5-4 Vs dark 4-4 Vs Solar 7-3 Vs Trap 12-3 Vs Zest 10-3 No one i looked up has a winning record against him. I think thats a strong argument. | ||
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Seacow
Sweden99 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:14 buzz_bender wrote: Oh, it'll be great to watch this analysis. Do you have a link/timestamp to that? It was from the late stream yesterday, maybe 1h30 min or so into the VOD I believe, should be on his channel | ||
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Durnuu
13322 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:14 DarkGamer wrote: I would: Vs maru 6-2 Vs ty 5-2 Vs cure 7-2 Vs Innovation 16-8 Vs rogue 5-4 Vs dark 4-4 Vs Solar 7-3 Vs Trap 12-3 Vs Zest 10-3 No one i looked up has a winning record against him. I think thats a strong argument. No, because you don't determine the GOAT from 3 years of playing competitively in a game that has a (so far) 11-year lifespan | ||
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Captain Peabody
United States3128 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:16 Durnuu wrote: No, because you don't determine the GOAT from 3 years of playing competitively in a game that has a (so far) 11-year lifespan I mean, generally in real-world sports you do determine GOATs more by periods of dominance much more than long-term consistency near the top relative to the lifespan of the game (?). If we take that into account, though, three years is actually quite a long time relative to a mere 11-year lifespan. There's a reason why players like MVP still get brought up in GOAT discussions in SC2. Sports and ESPORTs both involve too many factors over too much time to be able to easily compare absolute skill. GOAT status is more about being a legend than about having the highest skill imo. | ||
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JJH777
United States4418 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:14 DarkGamer wrote: I would: Vs maru 6-2 Vs ty 5-2 Vs cure 7-2 Vs Innovation 16-8 Vs rogue 5-4 Vs dark 4-4 Vs Solar 7-3 Vs Trap 12-3 Vs Zest 10-3 No one i looked up has a winning record against him. I think thats a strong argument. And yet he's only managed to win 1 world championship in 9 attempts. Almost like a lot of those wins have huge asterisks and the losses are in important big money events. He's also something like 0-15 in open qualifier events. He's only won stuff that artificially limits the amount of Korean participation. Tell me when he wins a tournament by beating only top 10 KR players back to back to back like every top KR player has done. In every important bracket he's played besides Blizzcon 2018 he's had at least one or two extremely easy opponents. | ||
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Poopi
France12912 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:22 JJH777 wrote: And yet he's only managed to win 1 world championship in 9 attempts. Almost like a lot of those wins have huge asterisks and the losses are in important big money events. He's also something like 0-15 in open qualifier events. He's only won stuff that artificially limits the amount of Korean participation. Tell me when he wins a tournament by beating only top 10 KR players back to back to back like every top KR player has done. In every important bracket he's played besides Blizzcon 2018 he's had at least one or two extremely easy opponents. And that's without taking into account the balance of his dominance periods. Once another good zerg (Reynor) was good enough to challenge him in a very zerg favored meta, he did not dominate as hard even domestically. When Clem kept growing and TvZ became fairer, he got dominated hard domestically (although he has done well in the online DH Season Finals). Katowice will be a big test, he is among the 6-7 players that could win it | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany16062 Posts
On November 14 2021 02:13 Captain Peabody wrote: I mean the big difficulty of foreigner vs Korean comparison is that the first 2/3rds to 3/4s of SC2's existence were dominated by Koreans to the point that there really was no question that they were the best (and to the extent that we had world championships that were entirely Korean). There's no question that the top Korean players have been at the top longer than the top foreigners. There's also not really any question that the general foreigner vs Korean skill balance has drastically changed in the last few years. Sure but I don't think we should disregard everything that happened before 2018 because of this. From 2018 on Serral may be the most succesful player but looking at their whole careers I don't think he has a claim. it's not the korean's fault foreigners weren't competitive before. Well technically it is but you know what I mean | ||
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