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On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage.
How about we let the viewers decide who should be featured based on whose stream they choose to watch? If you believe that avilo is "bad for the community" then you should find fault with all the people who watch his stream since they are contributing to the problem by giving him attention.
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On July 07 2014 06:20 HomeWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage. You are toxic, really toxic for SC2 community, and you should stop doing this kind of stuff. Stick to what you know and not venture into realms about you don't even have a clue.
Hahahahahaha
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On July 07 2014 06:20 HomeWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage. You are toxic, really toxic for SC2 community, and you should stop doing this kind of stuff. Stick to what you know and not venture into realms about you don't even have a clue.
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/SHOUTcraft
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/SHOUTcraft/Clan_Wars
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Axiom
Yep, seems pretty toxic to me....
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On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage.
They turn in because he provides entertainment. Some are there because he is one of the few players, who play mech. Some are there because he whines about protoss. And some are there because they hate him.
That's the same reason you would get views with that static image. People expect you to entertain them.
Avilo is not the reason people stop playing the game or stop watching!
Do you really think a player finishes laddering, watches avilos rant and suddenly thinks the game is broken?
I think it's the other way around. He plays, thinks 'toss imba' and watches avilo.
It like the end of Wol where everybody pretended the game was balanced.
Then HotS can out and everybody complained about BL Infestor.
EDIT: Btw, i find it pretty low to make fun of somebodys lisp!
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On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage.
That's your opinion, and you, like Avilo, are entitled to your opinion. However, thousands of viewers evidently disagree with your opinion, seeing as Avilo was able to maintain the average viewer count that is required to become a featured streamer. As for his cast, am I missing something? Why is everyone so upset about it? As others have said, he basically did what he always does. Those who enjoy what he always does are free to tune in, while those like you are free to not tune in. I really don't see why his cast warrants all the hate.
Many people tune into him not only because they like him, but because they like his play-style. His viewerbase is filled with people who are sick of seeing bio and are ready for some mech. People who like games that last over 60 minutes, and involve HUGE armies getting in HUGE battles. So while you may have superior numbers (that you feel the need to rub in everyone's face all the time), Avilo has a niche that he is very good at.
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So what if avilo exaggerate,it only compensate for rest of terrans saying nothing.
TB attacking avilo for this or that is not too professional.Sure he has right to his own opinion but as SC2 public figure its pretty shitty to badmouth any player,even semi-pro as avilo is.
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On July 07 2014 06:27 mabla wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage. They turn in because he provides entertainment. Some are there because he is one of the few players, who play mech. Some are there because he whines about protoss. And some are there because they hate him. That's the same reason you would get views with that static image. People expect you to entertain them. Avilo is not the reason people stop playing the game or stop watching! Do you really think a player finishes laddering, watches avilos rant and suddenly thinks the game is broken? I think it's the other way around. He plays, thinks 'toss imba' and watches avilo. It like the end of Wol where everybody pretended the game was balanced. Then HotS can out and everybody complained about BL Infestor.
Excellent point. Avilo's stream is a safe haven for anybody who has had it up to here with Terran bio, and wants to see some long drawn out mech games that last for over 60 minutes.
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It like the end of Wol where everybody pretended the game was balanced.
Pretty sure nobody believed the game was balanced at the end of WoL. Hell I quit casting for several months after IPL5 because the game CLEARLY wasn't balanced, as in, BL/Infestor was literally unstoppable for Terran and had no answer. The current state of the game is not at all like that. Protoss are obviously in a phase of dominance but they are not winning absolutely everything and they do not have one all powerful build that counters anything a Terran can ever do.
Avilo is a cancerous element, his only contribution to the scene is his negativity, we would certainly have a better scene if Avilo was not part of it. I'm sure that yes, people come off ladder (assuming they play) and come to Avilos stream for validation of their views, just like racist people go to Stormfront for validation. That does not mean we should approve of Stormfront or Avilo, both only reinforce existing negativity.
So what if avilo exaggerate,it only compensate for rest of terrans saying nothing.
TB attacking avilo for this or that is not too professional.Sure he has right to his own opinion but as SC2 public figure its pretty shitty to badmouth any player,even semi-pro as avilo is.
Avilo viewer spotted. Yes suuuure, Avilo is the one brave voice of the Terran race, everyone else is too afraid to say anything, got it.
Avilo does so much damage to the balance discussion because he seeds it with misinformation, nonsense and rhetoric. Just extreme SJW make discussing important topics online difficult, Avilos existence and audience makes discussing balance difficult.
As for professionalism, I am not concerned about your opinion on professionalism. You watch Avilo, you obviously do not care about professionalism, you simply want to use it as a shield against my criticism. What do you want me to do, apologise for having a larger audience than Avilo? I'm not allowed to criticise anyone who isn't as successful as me? Yeah I don't see your logic here. Community figures should be condemning cancerous elements of our scene. If we won't, who will?
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On July 07 2014 06:22 Crot4le wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:20 HomeWorld wrote:On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage. You are toxic, really toxic for SC2 community, and you should stop doing this kind of stuff. Stick to what you know and not venture into realms about you don't even have a clue. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/SHOUTcrafthttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/SHOUTcraft/Clan_Warshttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/AxiomYep, seems pretty toxic to me....
While I admire his managerial skills, TotalBiscuit as a sc2 player = 0, so yeah, his opinions related in this thread are toxic and out of place for his position.
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On July 07 2014 06:30 TotalBiscuit wrote:Pretty sure nobody believed the game was balanced at the end of WoL. Hell I quit casting for several months after IPL5 because the game CLEARLY wasn't balanced, as in, BL/Infestor was literally unstoppable for Terran and had no answer. The current state of the game is not at all like that. Protoss are obviously in a phase of dominance but they are not winning absolutely everything and they do not have one all powerful build that counters anything a Terran can ever do. Avilo is a cancerous element, his only contribution to the scene is his negativity, we would certainly have a better scene if Avilo was not part of it. I'm sure that yes, people come off ladder (assuming they play) and come to Avilos stream for validation of their views, just like racist people go to Stormfront for validation. That does not mean we should approve of Stormfront or Avilo, both only reinforce existing negativity.
If you are negative about Protoss it is ok though?
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On July 07 2014 06:20 HomeWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage. You are toxic, really toxic for SC2 community, and you should stop doing this kind of stuff. Stick to what you know and not venture into realms about you don't even have a clue.
Yeah i would trade 100 Avilos for one TB.
As a sidenote, i really dont like it when tb responds agressive to comments or critiziscm, justifyable or not. It is because of the work he does, i hold him to a higher standard i would hold a normal poster to. Thats my problem though, because those thoughts belong to me. They have nothing to do with the actual person inteself, because i dont know him. As soon as i remind myself of that, it goes back to a neutral state of mind, where i concentrate on things that acutally matter to me. :-D
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On July 07 2014 06:31 HomeWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:22 Crot4le wrote:On July 07 2014 06:20 HomeWorld wrote:On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage. You are toxic, really toxic for SC2 community, and you should stop doing this kind of stuff. Stick to what you know and not venture into realms about you don't even have a clue. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/SHOUTcrafthttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/SHOUTcraft/Clan_Warshttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/AxiomYep, seems pretty toxic to me.... While I admire his managerial skills, TotalBiscuit as a sc2 player = 0
So that puts me on the level of Avilo then, who has not accomplished anything as a SC2 player.
As an fyi I have actually won more televised showmatches than Avilo has 
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On July 07 2014 06:30 TotalBiscuit wrote:Pretty sure nobody believed the game was balanced at the end of WoL. Hell I quit casting for several months after IPL5 because the game CLEARLY wasn't balanced, as in, BL/Infestor was literally unstoppable for Terran and had no answer. The current state of the game is not at all like that. Protoss are obviously in a phase of dominance but they are not winning absolutely everything and they do not have one all powerful build that counters anything a Terran can ever do.
According to http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Premier_Tournaments P dominance is more marked than Z's dominance during the horrible BL/Infestor era.
But yeah balance whine in the away avilo does it is just cancer.
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Avilo is playing currently playing against Terran, so is obviously now claiming that his opponent is map hacking because he obviously can't blame it on balance in this situation!
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You know the game has gone to shit when one person speaking his mind (even if he is wrong/biased/idiot/whatever) is a problem. Jesus.
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On July 07 2014 06:34 Karpfen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:30 TotalBiscuit wrote:It like the end of Wol where everybody pretended the game was balanced. Pretty sure nobody believed the game was balanced at the end of WoL. Hell I quit casting for several months after IPL5 because the game CLEARLY wasn't balanced, as in, BL/Infestor was literally unstoppable for Terran and had no answer. The current state of the game is not at all like that. Protoss are obviously in a phase of dominance but they are not winning absolutely everything and they do not have one all powerful build that counters anything a Terran can ever do. According to http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Premier_Tournaments P dominance is more marked than Z's dominance during the horrible BL/Infestor era. But yeah balance whine in the away avilo does it is just cancer.
Recent five tourneys: 2 Protoss, 2 Terran, 1 Zerg. Seems pretty balanced to me.
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TotalBiscuit is right that Avilo is toxic. That's not really even debatable. The question is whether TL should make the decision to remove featured streams that are toxic. That's a policy question for the TL leadership.
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I dont want to shit on avilo but his approach is so wrong. He has recently encouraged his viewers to leave every TvP on ladder as a form a protest. He also thinks that turtling to 70 minutes with 60 ravens is saving esports. He also shits on korean protosses saying "i learned how to click my nexus from korea so i win tournaments" if anything, his balance whine is purely psychological and his influence is quickly spreading to other terran players which causes the game to decline even further
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On July 07 2014 06:30 codonbyte wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 06:27 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 06:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:07 codonbyte wrote:On July 07 2014 06:03 TotalBiscuit wrote:On July 07 2014 06:01 mabla wrote:On July 07 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Removing Avilo from the featured list seems like a perfectly reasonable measure to me. It would not be the first time someone has been removed from the featured list because Teamliquid believed their content was detrimental to the site and scene. Avilo qualifies. It's not like his stream is even good enough quality to be featured anyway, I guess the ad money wasn't enough to buy a proper microphone. Good idea! And while we're at it, we can also ban all the Korean players without mic and/or camera, since their quality is surely worse than a stream with a cam and a bad mic. Their streams are objectively better from a production standpoint since Avilo is not speaking in any of them. 1.3k people disagree with you, seeing as at this very moment, his stream is ONLY his voice and 1.3k viewers think that's good enough to tune into. It's cute that you think they're tuning in because they like him. You need only read his chat, the majority of people hate him, they're there to make fun of him. If I turn on my stream right now with a static image I will get more views than Avilo. 1.3k people is not impressive. He is a circus act, the village idiot, the kind of person you put in the stocks and throw rotten fruit at. If anything he is a symptom of a diseased scene that needs a good clean-up, someone who should be left to languish in obscurity, not given pride of place on the Teamliquid frontpage. They turn in because he provides entertainment. Some are there because he is one of the few players, who play mech. Some are there because he whines about protoss. And some are there because they hate him. That's the same reason you would get views with that static image. People expect you to entertain them. Avilo is not the reason people stop playing the game or stop watching! Do you really think a player finishes laddering, watches avilos rant and suddenly thinks the game is broken? I think it's the other way around. He plays, thinks 'toss imba' and watches avilo. It like the end of Wol where everybody pretended the game was balanced. Then HotS can out and everybody complained about BL Infestor. Excellent point. Avilo's stream is a safe haven for anybody who has had it up to here with Terran bio, and wants to see some long drawn out mech games that last for over 60 minutes.
A safe heaven.. as long as you don't remember him there is other mech players, that some of them are known, and that some of them are as good / better than him. Also, as long you agree with him, don't say anything to contradict him, and to try to argue with him, regardless of how polite or constructive you are.
In short, it is a safe heaven, as long as you don't try to do anything besides actively supporting him.
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EPT
