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On June 06 2014 19:44 aZealot wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:39 Vindicare605 wrote:On June 06 2014 19:38 aZealot wrote:On June 06 2014 19:34 Ramiz1989 wrote:On June 06 2014 19:33 zimms wrote:On June 06 2014 19:18 aZealot wrote:On June 06 2014 19:17 Crot4le wrote:
Come on INnoVation please win the group. I want a TvT GSL final. Please, no. The boredom. Yeah, enough of this TvT! I mean we just recently had a Code S TvT about 250 days ago. He is talking about mirror matches in general. I agree with him, every non-mirror MU is better than mirror. True, but I don't particularly like TvT either. It might be my most disliked mirror MU. TvT is the only reason I play Terran over the other two races. I absolutely loathe playing ZvZ and PvP. I can watch them every now and then, but playing them is a fucking headache. Hahaha! TvT is the main reason I sometimes have second thoughts about switching to Terran this season.
I played Random for the entirety of WoL.
When HotS launched and ZvZ became an even bigger shit show (pre-Spore Crawler change) I decided to give it up for good. There is nothing more frustrating than getting 9 fucking ZvZs in a row while playing fucking Random.
I swear to god that happened to me before, I thought I was going to break my desk in half.
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On June 06 2014 19:44 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:43 sharkie wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 GumBa wrote:On June 06 2014 19:41 sharkie wrote:
Yeah like everyone said don't go lategame vs protoss
Even a ridicilous 5% win chance all in is better than to play vs storm and colossus x.x So we can agree no Terran is good lategame TvP I can agree with you there.  Ok then if you admit Inno is top 3-4 TvP
Maru and Bbyong are clear top2
MMA, Flash and Innovation share 3,4,5 in between
Maybe Polt as well
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Lorning
Belgica34432 Posts
On June 06 2014 19:47 GumBa wrote:Pls dont break my heart twice in one day INno  I think my passion will die
He just went on a 14 game win streak in ATC. He has to lose a bit, else terran gets nerfed
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On June 06 2014 19:47 Wintex wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:43 Heartland wrote:
I think we need to pay more attention to how late-game P army management is a lot about retreating and storm flanking. It's hard to fight the Terran army just in a straight up fight. It has to be zoned out, flanked and fought on favorable ground. Exactly. A lot of terrans just accept the terms of the protoss. In a battle you should seek the favorable grounds yourself. I wish players would build more turrets to counteract the possible drops, while also having like 2-3 marines patrolling for pylons. A lot of the problems in TvP stem from the difficulty in obtaining vision at times where it's necessary. Making it the focus point more at the battle instead of thinking of possible shit is a way to make the engagements easier too. Too bad that's reallllllyyy difficult.
Wish mech worked
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Tasteless just compared Mvp with Shine. :D
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On June 06 2014 19:48 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:47 Wintex wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 Heartland wrote:
I think we need to pay more attention to how late-game P army management is a lot about retreating and storm flanking. It's hard to fight the Terran army just in a straight up fight. It has to be zoned out, flanked and fought on favorable ground. Exactly. A lot of terrans just accept the terms of the protoss. In a battle you should seek the favorable grounds yourself. I wish players would build more turrets to counteract the possible drops, while also having like 2-3 marines patrolling for pylons. A lot of the problems in TvP stem from the difficulty in obtaining vision at times where it's necessary. Making it the focus point more at the battle instead of thinking of possible shit is a way to make the engagements easier too. Too bad that's reallllllyyy difficult. Wish mech worked
me too
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On June 06 2014 19:43 Heartland wrote:
I think we need to pay more attention to how late-game P army management is a lot about retreating and storm flanking. It's hard to fight the Terran army just in a straight up fight. It has to be zoned out, flanked and fought on favorable ground.
You can force the issue by shredding mineral lines to dust and waiting for the terran come to you while you set the terms of the engagement. Protoss can just sit on his bank because the there is no terran late game army composition that will crush the protoss.
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your Country52798 Posts
On June 06 2014 19:45 The_Templar wrote: Soulkey spawns in the top right  Zest spawns in the bottom left
2:00
Hatchery first vs Nexus first.
Third hatchery before spawning pool for Soulkey.
Zest getting a gateway followed by two assimilators.
3:00
Cybernetics core.
Faking a cannon rush for Zest.
Spawning pool finishes.
4:00
Soulkey getting some queens.
Soulkey getting zergling speed.
Stargate for Zest.
Roach warren for Zest.
5:00
Mothership core finishes.
Zest building two more gateways.
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uh oh Artosis is hating on Shine
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I wouldn't be too surprised if bogus doesn't make it still I'd love to have him on Ro8 board.
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On June 06 2014 19:48 Wintex wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:48 GumBa wrote:On June 06 2014 19:47 Wintex wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 Heartland wrote:
I think we need to pay more attention to how late-game P army management is a lot about retreating and storm flanking. It's hard to fight the Terran army just in a straight up fight. It has to be zoned out, flanked and fought on favorable ground. Exactly. A lot of terrans just accept the terms of the protoss. In a battle you should seek the favorable grounds yourself. I wish players would build more turrets to counteract the possible drops, while also having like 2-3 marines patrolling for pylons. A lot of the problems in TvP stem from the difficulty in obtaining vision at times where it's necessary. Making it the focus point more at the battle instead of thinking of possible shit is a way to make the engagements easier too. Too bad that's reallllllyyy difficult. Wish mech worked me too
ForGG plays mech.
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On June 06 2014 19:48 sharkie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:44 GumBa wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 sharkie wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 GumBa wrote:On June 06 2014 19:41 sharkie wrote:
Yeah like everyone said don't go lategame vs protoss
Even a ridicilous 5% win chance all in is better than to play vs storm and colossus x.x So we can agree no Terran is good lategame TvP I can agree with you there. Ok then if you admit Inno is top 3-4 TvP Maru and Bbyong are clear top2 MMA, Flash and Innovation share 3,4,5 in between Maybe Polt as well
polt has way better tvp than MMA and innovation
maru > flash = polt i'd say
bbyong might be the best tvp'er atm
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On June 06 2014 19:48 sharkie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:44 GumBa wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 sharkie wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 GumBa wrote:On June 06 2014 19:41 sharkie wrote:
Yeah like everyone said don't go lategame vs protoss
Even a ridicilous 5% win chance all in is better than to play vs storm and colossus x.x So we can agree no Terran is good lategame TvP I can agree with you there. Ok then if you admit Inno is top 3-4 TvP Maru and Bbyong are clear top2 MMA, Flash and Innovation share 3,4,5 in between Maybe Polt as well
lol INnos TvP is miles better than MMAs
top 5 is
Maru
Polt
INno
Bbyong
Flash (Maybe)
After Maru the positions fluctuate but in no way MMA and I say that as an MMA fan
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On June 06 2014 19:48 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:47 Wintex wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 Heartland wrote:
I think we need to pay more attention to how late-game P army management is a lot about retreating and storm flanking. It's hard to fight the Terran army just in a straight up fight. It has to be zoned out, flanked and fought on favorable ground. Exactly. A lot of terrans just accept the terms of the protoss. In a battle you should seek the favorable grounds yourself. I wish players would build more turrets to counteract the possible drops, while also having like 2-3 marines patrolling for pylons. A lot of the problems in TvP stem from the difficulty in obtaining vision at times where it's necessary. Making it the focus point more at the battle instead of thinking of possible shit is a way to make the engagements easier too. Too bad that's reallllllyyy difficult. Wish mech worked
It does at all levels on the ladder below high GM from what I've seen on streams.
It's fucking hard as hell to play though, which is why most Terrans don't bother with it. Why bother playing an overall inferior style when it isn't even easier to play?
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On June 06 2014 19:48 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:47 Wintex wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 Heartland wrote:
I think we need to pay more attention to how late-game P army management is a lot about retreating and storm flanking. It's hard to fight the Terran army just in a straight up fight. It has to be zoned out, flanked and fought on favorable ground. Exactly. A lot of terrans just accept the terms of the protoss. In a battle you should seek the favorable grounds yourself. I wish players would build more turrets to counteract the possible drops, while also having like 2-3 marines patrolling for pylons. A lot of the problems in TvP stem from the difficulty in obtaining vision at times where it's necessary. Making it the focus point more at the battle instead of thinking of possible shit is a way to make the engagements easier too. Too bad that's reallllllyyy difficult. Wish mech worked
DBro has tried his hardest to make sure that it will never happen.
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Suddenly we have a ton of "top protoss champions". Sen, Zest, Her0, Dear, Stardust, duckdeok - all champions and where they were a year ago? Nowhere.
"Coincidentally" all the powerful and famous terran players have fallen into a slump. Only Maru stands tall.
Was watching the game one where inno dropped 3 marauders that killed templar archives and robo, Zest did nothing to stop them when he had 10 zealots and 2 templars nearby. Sigh...
Nothing changed. You have to eithier win tvp early game by a gimmick or when toss fails with his cheese or in the mid game when terran has a small window of opportunity. Beyond that... you've got to be Maru to snatch up a win.
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On June 06 2014 19:49 Aeromi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:48 Wintex wrote:On June 06 2014 19:48 GumBa wrote:On June 06 2014 19:47 Wintex wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 Heartland wrote:
I think we need to pay more attention to how late-game P army management is a lot about retreating and storm flanking. It's hard to fight the Terran army just in a straight up fight. It has to be zoned out, flanked and fought on favorable ground. Exactly. A lot of terrans just accept the terms of the protoss. In a battle you should seek the favorable grounds yourself. I wish players would build more turrets to counteract the possible drops, while also having like 2-3 marines patrolling for pylons. A lot of the problems in TvP stem from the difficulty in obtaining vision at times where it's necessary. Making it the focus point more at the battle instead of thinking of possible shit is a way to make the engagements easier too. Too bad that's reallllllyyy difficult. Wish mech worked me too ForGG plays mech.
Against decent opponents though
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On June 06 2014 19:48 herMan wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:43 Heartland wrote:
I think we need to pay more attention to how late-game P army management is a lot about retreating and storm flanking. It's hard to fight the Terran army just in a straight up fight. It has to be zoned out, flanked and fought on favorable ground. You can force the issue by shredding mineral lines to dust and waiting for the terran come to you while you set the terms of the engagement. Protoss can just sit on his bank because the there is no terran late game army composition that will crush the protoss.
Remove the Energy on Battlecruisers and make it a skill like overcharge on void rays maybe?
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Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
On June 06 2014 19:49 Die4Ever wrote:
uh oh Artosis is hating on Shine
Yes let the evil flow!
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What about for example introducing a thor change, which makes the spells it has cooldown based, and giving them an upgrade at like Tier 4/5 which requires the fusion core, but makes them deal extra shield damage. It's a bigger unit, it doesn't fly and it has a harder time dying.
On June 06 2014 19:50 gTank wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2014 19:48 herMan wrote:On June 06 2014 19:43 Heartland wrote:
I think we need to pay more attention to how late-game P army management is a lot about retreating and storm flanking. It's hard to fight the Terran army just in a straight up fight. It has to be zoned out, flanked and fought on favorable ground. You can force the issue by shredding mineral lines to dust and waiting for the terran come to you while you set the terms of the engagement. Protoss can just sit on his bank because the there is no terran late game army composition that will crush the protoss. Remove the Energy on Battlecruisers and make it a skill like overcharge on void rays maybe?
Problem is tempests. rather thor be buffed.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/qnj1JcP.png)
