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[IEM] Cologne Day 1 - Open Bracket - Page 20

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 18 19 20 21 22 64 Next
vjcamarena
Profile Joined October 2013
Spain493 Posts
February 13 2014 14:55 GMT
#381
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

I personally kind of agree. Phoenixes seem "too necessary" for Protoss against mutas. It's either get mutas and crush them, or have no good solution at all. Stalker/Archon/Storm are all much weaker since HOTS introduced fast regen.
Still, that didn't lose TLO this game. He just forgot his mutas for a little while.
Mvp and ForGG! - Vortix FTW - Never forget Lucifron
KalWarkov
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Germany4126 Posts
February 13 2014 14:55 GMT
#382
On February 13 2014 23:54 20cts wrote:
TLO didn't protect his mutas with his corruptors.


i think he simply didnt expect phoenix range to have finished so early
DiaBoLuS ** Sc2 - Protoss: 16x GM | Dota2 - Offlane Immortal | Wc3 - Undead decent level | Diablo nerd | Chess / Magnus fanboy | BVB | Agnostic***
m0ck
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
4194 Posts
February 13 2014 14:55 GMT
#383
On February 13 2014 23:54 20cts wrote:
TLO didn't protect his mutas with his corruptors.

They came out a bit late, and hasu hid his building phoenix count in order to do the assault that killed almost all of TLO's army.
DJHelium
Profile Joined December 2010
Sweden13480 Posts
February 13 2014 14:55 GMT
#384
On February 13 2014 23:54 20cts wrote:
TLO didn't protect his mutas with his corruptors.


I think the plan was to protect them with his pack of hydras that had harassed the third earlier.
#1 player in the world atm: J-god | Follow me on twitter! @DJHelium
FeyFey
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany10114 Posts
February 13 2014 14:56 GMT
#385
On February 13 2014 23:53 sparklyresidue wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

Kinda felt that way watching this game too


Phoenix got a range increase from the get go in HotS, so the Range upgrade is super strong now. I think they will have to overwork this a bit, since Phoenix can pretty much fight Corrupters as well.
deacon.frost
Profile Joined February 2013
Czech Republic12133 Posts
February 13 2014 14:59 GMT
#386
On February 13 2014 23:56 FeyFey wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2014 23:53 sparklyresidue wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

Kinda felt that way watching this game too


Phoenix got a range increase from the get go in HotS, so the Range upgrade is super strong now. I think they will have to overwork this a bit, since Phoenix can pretty much fight Corrupters as well.

Don't forget muta + corruptor TLO played this badly, he did not lost to phoenix range.
I imagine France should be able to take this unless Lilbow is busy practicing for Starcraft III. | KadaverBB is my fairy ban mother.
vjcamarena
Profile Joined October 2013
Spain493 Posts
February 13 2014 14:59 GMT
#387
On February 13 2014 23:55 DJHelium wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2014 23:54 20cts wrote:
TLO didn't protect his mutas with his corruptors.


I think the plan was to protect them with his pack of hydras that had harassed the third earlier.

I agree, I think this was the plan too.
On another note, good on ESL to give us a short rundown about the maches we don't watch. Much better than nothing.
Mvp and ForGG! - Vortix FTW - Never forget Lucifron
Doublemint
Profile Joined July 2011
Austria8760 Posts
February 13 2014 14:59 GMT
#388
On February 13 2014 23:56 FeyFey wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2014 23:53 sparklyresidue wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

Kinda felt that way watching this game too


Phoenix got a range increase from the get go in HotS, so the Range upgrade is super strong now. I think they will have to overwork this a bit, since Phoenix can pretty much fight Corrupters as well.


heavily upgraded phoenix do kinda "ok" vs. corrupters. bear in mind that they cost the same as corrupters on their own. not including the fleet beacon + range upgrade.
Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before the fall.
KalWarkov
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Germany4126 Posts
February 13 2014 15:00 GMT
#389
On February 13 2014 23:56 FeyFey wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2014 23:53 sparklyresidue wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

Kinda felt that way watching this game too


Phoenix got a range increase from the get go in HotS, so the Range upgrade is super strong now. I think they will have to overwork this a bit, since Phoenix can pretty much fight Corrupters as well.


no, they cant oO
i mean they can if you have twice as many and you have the upgrade done, but its not like they are cheaper in any way.

Hasu started to produce additional phoenix, a 2nd stargate and the fleet beacon well before he scouted it. that was the main reason for tha game to be like that
DiaBoLuS ** Sc2 - Protoss: 16x GM | Dota2 - Offlane Immortal | Wc3 - Undead decent level | Diablo nerd | Chess / Magnus fanboy | BVB | Agnostic***
Heartland
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Sweden24604 Posts
February 13 2014 15:01 GMT
#390
On February 13 2014 23:59 Doublemint wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2014 23:56 FeyFey wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:53 sparklyresidue wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

Kinda felt that way watching this game too


Phoenix got a range increase from the get go in HotS, so the Range upgrade is super strong now. I think they will have to overwork this a bit, since Phoenix can pretty much fight Corrupters as well.


heavily upgraded phoenix do kinda "ok" vs. corrupters. bear in mind that they cost the same as corrupters on their own. not including the fleet beacon + range upgrade.


With range it's very much an intense micro battle to fight corruptors with phoenix. It'd be entirely impossible without the range upgrade unless the phoenix outnumbered the Corruptors a lot.
Dinotramp
Profile Joined August 2012
Nauru2871 Posts
February 13 2014 15:02 GMT
#391
Never could've predicted that bracket.
RIP Starcraft scene in the UK. Defeated by EG money and Swedish Zergs.
Doublemint
Profile Joined July 2011
Austria8760 Posts
February 13 2014 15:02 GMT
#392
On February 14 2014 00:01 Heartland wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2014 23:59 Doublemint wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:56 FeyFey wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:53 sparklyresidue wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

Kinda felt that way watching this game too


Phoenix got a range increase from the get go in HotS, so the Range upgrade is super strong now. I think they will have to overwork this a bit, since Phoenix can pretty much fight Corrupters as well.


heavily upgraded phoenix do kinda "ok" vs. corrupters. bear in mind that they cost the same as corrupters on their own. not including the fleet beacon + range upgrade.


With range it's very much an intense micro battle to fight corruptors with phoenix. It'd be entirely impossible without the range upgrade unless the phoenix outnumbered the Corruptors a lot.


yeah, pretty much exactly my point.
Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before the fall.
m0ck
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
4194 Posts
February 13 2014 15:03 GMT
#393
On February 14 2014 00:00 KalWarkov wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2014 23:56 FeyFey wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:53 sparklyresidue wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

Kinda felt that way watching this game too


Phoenix got a range increase from the get go in HotS, so the Range upgrade is super strong now. I think they will have to overwork this a bit, since Phoenix can pretty much fight Corrupters as well.


no, they cant oO
i mean they can if you have twice as many and you have the upgrade done, but its not like they are cheaper in any way.

Hasu started to produce additional phoenix, a 2nd stargate and the fleet beacon well before he scouted it. that was the main reason for tha game to be like that

Corrupter is a dedicated anti-air unit, they should be able to do well against phoenixes.. With the range-upgrade and in large numbers, phoenixes can hold off a lot more than their own supply in muta+corrupter.
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
February 13 2014 15:03 GMT
#394
On February 14 2014 00:02 Dinotramp wrote:
Never could've predicted that bracket.


Your whining is annoying

Also San, MC, Stardust are by far the best players in the bracket.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
Caladan
Profile Joined May 2008
Germany1238 Posts
February 13 2014 15:04 GMT
#395
Just went up and watched the grid on liquipedia.
Protoss fest again. -.-

No one will complain about balance on tl.net for obvious reasons, but as a viewer some more non-PvP rounds would be pretty nice to watch. Sad that Taeja couldn't make it. At least we have some pretty decent terrans and one good zerg in stage 2 groups. Looking forward to these!
Heartland
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Sweden24604 Posts
February 13 2014 15:04 GMT
#396
On February 14 2014 00:03 m0ck wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 14 2014 00:00 KalWarkov wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:56 FeyFey wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:53 sparklyresidue wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

Kinda felt that way watching this game too


Phoenix got a range increase from the get go in HotS, so the Range upgrade is super strong now. I think they will have to overwork this a bit, since Phoenix can pretty much fight Corrupters as well.


no, they cant oO
i mean they can if you have twice as many and you have the upgrade done, but its not like they are cheaper in any way.

Hasu started to produce additional phoenix, a 2nd stargate and the fleet beacon well before he scouted it. that was the main reason for tha game to be like that

Corrupter is a dedicated anti-air unit, they should be able to do well against phoenixes.. With the range-upgrade and in large numbers, phoenixes can hold off a lot more than their own supply in muta+corrupter.


They really are able to do very well vs Phoenixes. Who are, I might add, also a dedicated anti-air unit. It is only when Protoss has managed to survive long enough to get 15+ Phoenixes with range and upgrades that they can occasionally kite vs Corruptors. But if you look away for a moment you're going to get eaten alive. Phoenixes never trade efficiently vs Corruptors.
m0ck
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
4194 Posts
February 13 2014 15:04 GMT
#397
On February 14 2014 00:03 DarkLordOlli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 14 2014 00:02 Dinotramp wrote:
Never could've predicted that bracket.


Your whining is annoying

Also San, MC, Stardust are by far the best players in the bracket.

What insight
Dinotramp
Profile Joined August 2012
Nauru2871 Posts
February 13 2014 15:05 GMT
#398
On February 14 2014 00:03 DarkLordOlli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 14 2014 00:02 Dinotramp wrote:
Never could've predicted that bracket.


Your whining is annoying

Also San, MC, Stardust are by far the best players in the bracket.


I'm just surprised TLO and Revenge didn't do that well, been quite good recently.
RIP Starcraft scene in the UK. Defeated by EG money and Swedish Zergs.
Doublemint
Profile Joined July 2011
Austria8760 Posts
February 13 2014 15:06 GMT
#399
On February 14 2014 00:03 m0ck wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 14 2014 00:00 KalWarkov wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:56 FeyFey wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:53 sparklyresidue wrote:
On February 13 2014 23:52 Topin wrote:
is the phoenix upgrade really necessary for the game? i feel that phoenix do the job ok w/o and the +range is an overkill T_T

Kinda felt that way watching this game too


Phoenix got a range increase from the get go in HotS, so the Range upgrade is super strong now. I think they will have to overwork this a bit, since Phoenix can pretty much fight Corrupters as well.


no, they cant oO
i mean they can if you have twice as many and you have the upgrade done, but its not like they are cheaper in any way.

Hasu started to produce additional phoenix, a 2nd stargate and the fleet beacon well before he scouted it. that was the main reason for tha game to be like that

Corrupter is a dedicated anti-air unit, they should be able to do well against phoenixes.. With the range-upgrade and in large numbers, phoenixes can hold off a lot more than their own supply in muta+corrupter.


They do well against phoenix... phoenix without upgrades and without the higher numbers do absolute abysmal damage and get wrecked. This game is hardly exemplary of any balance discussion attempt. TLO let his mutas die.
Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before the fall.
Caladan
Profile Joined May 2008
Germany1238 Posts
February 13 2014 15:06 GMT
#400
On February 14 2014 00:05 Dinotramp wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 14 2014 00:03 DarkLordOlli wrote:
On February 14 2014 00:02 Dinotramp wrote:
Never could've predicted that bracket.


Your whining is annoying

Also San, MC, Stardust are by far the best players in the bracket.


I'm just surprised TLO and Revenge didn't do that well, been quite good recently.


Yeah, Revenge is quite a beast, but against MC and San...
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