EPT[Code S] Ro16 Group D WCS KR GSL Season 3 2013 - Page 120
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GunPaladin
United States1205 Posts
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tozi
United States506 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:44 PoP wrote: Well it's not like ESF are dominating either. No one is dominating anything and no one is actually consistent, and that's a terribly bad sign for a competitive game. Hopefully by next year this esf kespa thing will be irrelevant. But I agree, there needs to be more consistency. This can only be achieved by a small group of players (3-4) REALLY stepping up their game (utterly impeccable micro macro) or an increase in the skill ceiling through blizzard | ||
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Musicus
Germany23576 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:44 jonich0n wrote: a grand total of 2 people voted for Maru & Parting advancing in the heart poll, out of 50. guess the vast majority are more or less slightly disappointed / mad in some respect. this group was just too crazy. Top 2 1st 2nd 3rd 4th Estimated by Aligulac. Modify. always trust aligulcac, I think they even predicted all the 2-1 scores | ||
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fluidin
Singapore1084 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:44 PoP wrote: Well it's not like ESF are dominating either. No one is dominating anything and no one is actually consistent, and that's a terribly bad sign for a competitive game. yep, this is infinitely more worrying than flash losing (lel) for the scene. started watching with the advent of sc2, and at least back then mvp and nestea were dominating. now? champions change on a regular basis. some even drop out, like bomber -.- | ||
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Dodgin
Canada39254 Posts
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tozi
United States506 Posts
Maybe I should sleep now... almost 7 in the morning EST | ||
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Boonbag
France3318 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:27 Ammanas wrote: Apparently Bisu said on his Afreeca stream (source is some random poster on TL though) that SC2 progamer salaries dropped so much that it is more profitable to stream BW on Afreeca then being SC2 progamer. (Although, imo more likely is that HIS salary dropped so much and it is only more profitable for HIM (and few others, like JangBi and Sea) because they are what they are...) im not random yo | ||
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fluidin
Singapore1084 Posts
this makes it so that only those few players who can perform at the given level are able to keep winning and dominate. in bw it seemed that raw mechanics was the 'wall'. not sure if sc2 should replicate that or look for something else. right now even if your decision making is really good, it's still such a volatile game. | ||
opterown
Australia54784 Posts
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:32 Grumbels wrote: Why not? For instance, why not one year from now with a more stable meta? Too volatile. The game doesn't reward skill linearly. | ||
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dustinth
China205 Posts
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Ammanas
Slovakia2166 Posts
Was not meant as an insult, I just couldn't remember and frankly couldn't bother to check who was the poster.. | ||
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Boonbag
France3318 Posts
On September 29 2013 20:01 Ammanas wrote: Was not meant as an insult, I just couldn't remember and frankly couldn't bother to check who was the poster.. i laughed when i found your post, was prolly 1 chance out of million i stumble upon it ^^ | ||
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Godwrath
Spain10135 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:44 PoP wrote: Well it's not like ESF are dominating either. No one is dominating anything and no one is actually consistent, and that's a terribly bad sign for a competitive game. How long did it take for somebody to really dominate on BW ? | ||
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jonich0n
United States1982 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:59 dustinth wrote: My heart broken... Yeah... there should be a disclaimer for people that are rooting for Flash that this would be extremely difficult to watch. Really don't think there's a worse way to go out and fail to advance in this format than the way this went down against Parting and Maru  He defended Maru's cheese in game 3 so well... but everything from then on, was like a horror show. qq | ||
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TeeTS
Germany2762 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:44 PoP wrote: Well it's not like ESF are dominating either. No one is dominating anything and no one is actually consistent, and that's a terribly bad sign for a competitive game. Maru and Soulkey are pretty consistent. Soulkey won WCS Kor 1, and made Ro8 in season 2 & 3. Maru went out in season 1 to Soulkey alone, won season 2 and made Ro8 in season 3. Rain is allways near the top too. To me this looks pretty consistent. Overall we have a lot of similar faces in the Ro16 every season. Losira made it that far in every season, Flash too. Of course every season, some players flash in, while others have a little downtime, but you have that in every sport. You can´t define consistency only about tournament wins, perhaps even back to back, in the hardest league on the planet. In football (for americans: soccer) there has never been a back to back UEFA Champions League winner. never ever! Would you say this is a bad sign for a competitive sport like football? This is not a bad sign, because you have a big pool of players who consistently perform well (in SC2 this means qualifying for WCS Korea Premier League, because this is so fuckin hard, that these 32 players are definately all in the top 50 players in the world!) while having different winners from time to time. This shows we have a healthy competition at the top, this shows the game is overall pretty fair to anyone. I must say, I´m getting sick of these "SC2 in a bad shape, game is dying" comments. SC2 for itself is in a pretty good shape. Yeah there are problems like the very long list of unused units for terran. But these problems are not bigger than those any game has. For LoL f.e. Riot overbuffed one item right before the world championships and now this item dominates the competition there. And NOONE fuckin cares, they have fun. To me that would be an even bigger problem than everything we have in SC2 right now, but for the LoL community it is totally fine. We should look way more positive onto our game! | ||
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ElBlanco
Australia140 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:55 opterown wrote: I think a part of the perceived volatility is that there are simply many more tournaments and games than in bw. also, travel to foreign tournaments can really mess with player schedules/practice. It's a number of factors. First of all yeah there are a lot more tournaments which can make it seem like players aren't quite as dominant. Second of all and this is probably the most important point, HOTS was released this year and has underwent patch changes since then. How consistent were players the 1-2 years after BW was released? People expect SC2 to be at the position BW was in when it reached its peak but that took what 8 years or something? It's not true anyway, we have seen plenty of players who have been very consistent in SC2. Of course a new expansion and balance changes can make it difficult to stay on top but we still see players consistently up there (soulkey and innovation are obvious examples). In WoL we saw plenty of players consistently at the top despite the metagame changing many times and despite the fluctuations in balance and patchs. This argument only crops up when a player people really like or expect to win drop out. It's a way of blaming the game and not the player. The biggest flaw and this complaint isn't that it's not true, it's that it isn't necessarily a bad thing. Not all competitive games and sports are consistently dominated by a few players. Perhaps there really is just a very even playing field at the top and that isn't a bad thing for the game. Would it be great to see some consistent champions like MVP? Sure but seeing a more competitive field isn't bad either. | ||
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PoP
France15446 Posts
On September 29 2013 20:14 TeeTS wrote: Maru and Soulkey are pretty consistent. Soulkey won WCS Kor 1, and made Ro8 in season 2 & 3. Maru went out in season 1 to Soulkey alone, won season 2 and made Ro8 in season 3. Rain is allways near the top too. To me this looks pretty consistent. Overall we have a lot of similar faces in the Ro16 every season. Losira made it that far in every season, Flash too. Of course every season, some players flash in, while others have a little downtime, but you have that in every sport. You can´t define consistency only about tournament wins, perhaps even back to back, in the hardest league on the planet. By consistency I mean Mvp-like consistency. Or even MKP/DRG. Which is, finish top-4 of almost every tournament, creating rivalries between them, stuff like that. Players that are really scary to face, that people talk about. Who's talking about Soulkey these days? Who's afraid of Rain after showing so many times that he can't keep his composure in important moments? Who's afraid of Flash? Only Innovation has been that guy these last few months. But it was a bit too short-lived it appears. Also, is there even one decent rivalry these days? Flash vs Innovation could have been one, but that's it, as far as I know. In football (for americans: soccer) there has never been a back to back UEFA Champions League winner. never ever! Would you say this is a bad sign for a competitive sport like football? This is not a bad sign, because you have a big pool of players who consistently perform well (in SC2 this means qualifying for WCS Korea Premier League, because this is so fuckin hard, that these 32 players are definately all in the top 50 players in the world!) while having different winners from time to time. It's not just about winning trophies, teams like Barcelona and (more recently) Bayern are the current "bonjwa" teams and any team in the world would be scared to play against them. Everyone excepts them to destroy basically almost any other team (barring a few). You don't have that in a game like SC2 at the moment. Not even close. Also sports like that are different by nature because those teams have a huge history and long-term fans. So I feel like it's not the most fair comparison. | ||
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NicksonReyes
Philippines4431 Posts
On September 29 2013 20:06 Godwrath wrote: How long did it take for somebody to really dominate on BW ? By that I'm guessing you're referring to a dominance like Nada's and not Boxer's. His started 2002, so about 4 years. You can't really compare it to SC2 though. Pro SC1 started with people playing with like 20 apm + Show Spoiler + | ||
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papaz
Sweden4149 Posts
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