EPT[GSTL] Round 1 AxA vs SouL Season 2 2013 - Page 41
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4107 Posts
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dreamseller
Australia914 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:43 Aunvilgod wrote: Vipers. Kiting the Ultras? Nope. I would love to see more Vipers being used. off topic but i find vipers to be really expensive and they take too long to get into action (build time + consume) in fast paced trade games like this, which is every 4m game | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:44 Destructicon wrote: Wow, that was a crazy good game, but you could really see the difference in quality of play between Hyvaa and DRG when it came to the ling, bling muta phase of the game, DRG was so much more cost efficient there and took way better fights. Hyvaa kept losing small groups of banes and lings to having them bated into marines and not doing any damage. But that was still a great game overall, and it was a nice change of pace to see a zerg reach Hive for once, I think it could have even been a closer game, Hyvaa either needed to re-expand to his old 4th, or not lose all his drones to that mine shot, or harass Innovation more. I have new respect for Hyvaa now. And more importantly, he lost all his mutas so he had nothing by lategame to deal with the 10+ Medivacs constantly healing. | ||
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Elite_
United States4259 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:44 Destructicon wrote: Wow, that was a crazy good game, but you could really see the difference in quality of play between Hyvaa and DRG when it came to the ling, bling muta phase of the game, DRG was so much more cost efficient there and took way better fights. Hyvaa kept losing small groups of banes and lings to having them bated into marines and not doing any damage. But that was still a great game overall, and it was a nice change of pace to see a zerg reach Hive for once, I think it could have even been a closer game, Hyvaa either needed to re-expand to his old 4th, or not lose all his drones to that mine shot, or harass Innovation more. I have new respect for Hyvaa now. I have lost respect for hyvaa... He can macro like that but chooses to cheese 95% of his ZvTs. D: | ||
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Gamegene
United States8308 Posts
he spent the entire early game trying to piss off innovation and squeek an advantage and only managed to lose literally every single unit before innovation had 6 hellions. it might not seem like much, but that scouting worker he kept at innovation's natural, the 8 extra zerglings he made to try and sneak past, those could have been more creep in the midgame, a faster fourth base, an extra ultralisk by the end of the game. that game was so close towards the end that the small disadvantages hyvva put on himself early game could have tipped the victory to his favor. | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
Of course... just watch DRG. Just don't build Lostralisk/Investor and stay on moneylisk/painling. Then you can kill those SCVs+PF with a mutalisk counter, instead of only killing the SCVs with fungals and you can kill those medivacs when you crush the army instead of watching them fly away or wasting 10fungals on them. And then you can stop that drop in the end and don't lose your spawning pool. | ||
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Aunvilgod
2653 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:44 Destructicon wrote: Wow, that was a crazy good game, but you could really see the difference in quality of play between Hyvaa and DRG when it came to the ling, bling muta phase of the game, DRG was so much more cost efficient there and took way better fights. Hyvaa kept losing small groups of banes and lings to having them bated into marines and not doing any damage. But that was still a great game overall, and it was a nice change of pace to see a zerg reach Hive for once, I think it could have even been a closer game, Hyvaa either needed to re-expand to his old 4th, or not lose all his drones to that mine shot, or harass Innovation more. I have new respect for Hyvaa now. I think the main difference was that DRG was much more active with his mutas. Also he morphed more blings I think. On September 10 2013 20:45 dreamseller wrote: off topic but i find vipers to be really expensive and they take too long to get into action (build time + consume) in fast paced trade games like this, which is every 4m game But after the Zerg manages to get infestors and a few Ultras he usually gets some more breathing room. Like in this game. I think when hyvaa tried to kill the 5th of INnoVation he could have been less aggressive and instead built Vipers. | ||
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Baatun
Germany1 Post
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NovemberstOrm
Canada16217 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:45 Fjodorov wrote: one thing I noticed both DRG and Hyvaa did, besides great injects, was that they spent minerals on a spine wall at the base targeted by the parade push. Ive been screaming at zergs sitting on 1.5k minerals with out enough larva to do this and I really think it buys alot of time. If Zergs could micro their ultras better at set up better flanks I think ZvT wil only get better. spine wall plus earlier hive have helped zergs a lot. | ||
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Zaxon
Belgium209 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:43 Aunvilgod wrote: Vipers. Kiting the Ultras? Nope. I would love to see more Vipers being used. That is wrong. DRG said that he thinks the outcome of TvZ is mostly determined by control during the engagements. And who are you to say anything else? Mhh i have seen viper's do really well in PvZ and i was suprised how much it did but you gotta remember it costs extra APM i dont know if microing the vipers is the best efficient thing | ||
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Gamegene
United States8308 Posts
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Destructicon
4713 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:43 Aunvilgod wrote: Vipers. Kiting the Ultras? Nope. I would love to see more Vipers being used. That is wrong. DRG said that he thinks the outcome of TvZ is mostly determined by control during the engagements. And who are you to say anything else? I hope you are joking, Vipers are terrible vs Bio, you cast cloud, but the bio moves out of the cloud and continue kiting, if you move the vipers far forward enough to do clouds behind the bio then they get focus fired down and destroyed, and then the bio just moves out of the cloud and continues to kite anyway. Infestor is still the much better choice. Yes please, make more vipers vs my bio, I want more free wins. | ||
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ZergX
France436 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:45 Fjodorov wrote: one thing I noticed both DRG and Hyvaa did, besides great injects, was that they spent minerals on a spine wall at the base targeted by the parade push. Ive been screaming at zergs sitting on 1.5k minerals with out enough larva to do this and I really think it buys alot of time. If Zergs could micro their ultras better at set up better flanks I think ZvT wil only get better. I strongly agree with u : ) the spines are really crucial , some better flanks, a little bit more time for zergs , and the TvZ match up can become pure insanety !^ | ||
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Zerg.Zilla
Hungary5029 Posts
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75
Germany4057 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:46 Big J wrote: Of course... just watch DRG. Just don't build Lostralisk/Investor and stay on moneylisk/painling. Then you can kill those SCVs+PF with a mutalisk counter, instead of only killing the SCVs with fungals and you can kill those medivacs when you crush the army instead of watching them fly away or wasting 10fungals on them. And then you can stop that drop in the end and don't lose your spawning pool. i meant like: in the end the zerg cant do anything except ling bling muta. i really loved that game but im a bit unsatisfied that it always has to be that kinda of game in TvZ | ||
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double1185
Vietnam211 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:40 liberate71 wrote: He stopped to breathe too much, needed more harass like that fungal on the 4th  W/ continous rallying marine, actually i dont get where he could have room to breath, harass on the 4th can only come once cause u need energy to fungal marine, and im sure that from the time he harass to the time he lost that base his infestor never got to more than 100 energy. I do believe Hyvaa really play better there, that mine hit on the drone is either a play of genius or a lucky one, u nvr know. Everything just go exactly like MC statement, poor Hyvaa, he really the best player today | ||
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NicksonReyes
Philippines4431 Posts
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pylonsalad
Canada649 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:40 tdt wrote: -MC I really want to see the day that Zergs build about 3 Swarm Hosts, right after they got Hive. Just 3 should do the trick. It's sacking 3 Mutas & 12 zerglings for space control & Widow Mine timer screw ups. They eat 2 widow mine shots and they've paid for themselves. The real issue with the parade push is that Zergs haven't found a good way to push it back from their bases without beating it all the way back. Space Control via Swarm Hosts would do the trick. But you don't need mass numbers. Much like Broodlords in in TvZ. Just a few (so 3-5) does almost all of the work. Gone are the days of mass tech switches generally working. Well, unless it's PvZ into a mass Muta switch with no Templar or Stalkers on the field, haha. | ||
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SigmaoctanusIV
United States3313 Posts
On September 10 2013 20:41 juvenal wrote: new maps starting to kick in no? Maps are a huge deal. Maps and Innovation didn't scout that 4th for a long time. Letting that go pretty much allowed hyvaa to stay in the game as long as he did. | ||
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