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On April 24 2012 19:48 Ghoststrikes wrote:
People forget that Bomber had really shitty econ after that huge drop. Alicia killed so many SCVs.
It's one rare case that chronoboost > MULEs (Chronoing all the gateways to resupply with all his bank)
That's what people need to understand. The games are balanced asymmetrically, so you do have to play races differently. If depowering production is really as ineffective as the whiners in this thread say, then don't target the production specifically when you drop.
And its not like that was a common game that we see all the time. It was a great comeback from Alicia.
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On April 24 2012 19:51 Fragile51 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2012 19:49 poorcloud wrote:On April 24 2012 19:47 Mentalizor wrote:On April 24 2012 19:43 poorcloud wrote:
Not balance whining but protoss is actually the only race that is able to take an expo and thus do an even more powerful attack.
Boggles your mind really. Then what is it -.- ? Just stating a fact. Dosen't mean i actually think the game is imbalanced since it is based on so many other factors as well. Pretty sure zerg in ZvP can do the same, 3 hatch baneling bust.
Which doesn't work because delaying your attack is stupid.
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On April 24 2012 19:50 SwizzY wrote:
My god so this is the infamous LR whine that people talk about....
Sure bomber completely leveled the main, but not before the resource advantage off the 3-base was capitalized on - there were 5 gates at the third. Alicia knew he was going to lose everything so he made 6 at his third, one of which died.
Bomber lost cost-INEFFICIENTLY in all 3 fights (main, nat, third). AND he didn't think he didn't need any additional bunker support even when army supply was even.
I just don't understand how retarded people get in this thread. That was a crazy back and forth moment where Bomber overestimated his advantage, which if he hadn't, he wouldve been ahead economically.
Jesus Christ. GG.
How dare you to try to make sense?
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losers choice always leads to terrans chosing dual sight vs p, antiga vs z etc etc
would prefer randomized maps with 1 veto per player
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Norway25712 Posts
On April 24 2012 19:50 KristofferAG wrote: SlayerS_Alicia v  StarTale_Bomber
1-1Maps:Daybreak StarTale_BomberAtlantis Spaceship SlayerS_AliciaDual Sight5.00SlayerS_Alicia is spawning as the red Protoss in the 2 o'clock position. StarTale_Bomber is spawning as the blue Terran in the 8 o'clock position. Alicia opens with a Gateway. Bomber starts off with a barracks. Bomber finishes off his wall with a supply depot. Alicia gets an Assimilator. Cybernetics Core going down for Alicia, getting his first Zealot. Bomber goes for a 1rax expand, with his CC being built on the high ground in the main. Warp Gate tech started for Alicia as he takes his second Assimilator, though he's not mining for it. Two more Barracks started for Bomber, followe by double Refinery. Alicia takes his Nexus. CC finishes up for Bomber, immediately upgraded to an Orbital. Two more Gateways started for Alicia. Bomber adds on a bunker at the top of his ramp.
10.00
Robotics Facility going down for Alicia.
Bomber starts the Stimpak research.
Factory placed down for Bomber.
Starport built after factory finishes up, reactor added on to Factory.
Observer coming out for Alicia, still only 3 Gateways for Alicia.
Medivac production started as Bomber takes his natural. Stimpak finishes.
Immortal on the way for Alicia, adding on a Robotics Bay.
Combat Shield started for Bomber as he moves out across the map.
Bomber drops two full medivacs in the main of Alicia, are able to take out all the Stalkers in the main and a bunch of Probes before it's cleaned up.
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On April 24 2012 19:51 sAsImre wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2012 19:51 Fragile51 wrote:On April 24 2012 19:49 poorcloud wrote:On April 24 2012 19:47 Mentalizor wrote:On April 24 2012 19:43 poorcloud wrote:
Not balance whining but protoss is actually the only race that is able to take an expo and thus do an even more powerful attack.
Boggles your mind really. Then what is it -.- ? Just stating a fact. Dosen't mean i actually think the game is imbalanced since it is based on so many other factors as well. Pretty sure zerg in ZvP can do the same, 3 hatch baneling bust. Which doesn't work because delaying your attack is stupid.
Of course it works.
Naniwa lost to that build against Zenio.
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On April 24 2012 19:49 vthree wrote:
I think one of the problems with that map is that early 3rd by Protoss isn't really punishable
From my understanding, early 3rd by P is not punishable by bio play. At best you can break even. Consider the timing at which bio moves out. Bio is better when the P doesn't take a 3rd and gets tech at a significant cost to unit production. Vs a 3rd, you will have 3rax, 5rax finishing when you move out. You will simply be repelled by unit count.
What early 3rd seems to be punished by is the fast 2 gas after CC -> cloakshee/tank play. This essentially is the hard counter, not only does it block the massive gate push with 2nd shee+siege, it collects an autowin by killing tons of probes with your first shee.
Of course the thing is that you blindly determine your build. You don't get to put down +2gas AFTER you confirm 3rd nexus, you do it 1m before! So this the "coinflip" nature of SC.
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On April 24 2012 19:53 Tsubbi wrote:
losers choice always leads to terrans chosing dual sight vs p, antiga vs z etc etc
would prefer randomized maps with 1 veto per player
it was decided before hand, so the maps were favorable for Alicia here (Daybreak/Atlantis vs Dual Sight)
But I agree that loser's pick leads to stupid maps (Entombed PvZ/Antiga TvZ/Atlantis ZvT...)
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On April 24 2012 19:45 Mentalizor wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2012 19:42 teamamerica wrote:On April 24 2012 19:37 Ertu wrote:
Why did the casters think that Alicia was ahead??? Bomber had 3 OCs better upgrades and 5 rax with medivacs, Of course this would happen. LOL Alica lost his entire main for nothing. And wins. Tell me again Bomber was ahead. Bomber started to have really ineffecient attacks. Losing at the 3rd, being repelled at the nat and even losing 2 drops in the main. And since he didn't kill the forges 2/2 finished up. Chargelot/Archon with 2/2 is really not bad against MMM. And on top of this, Alicia may have been down on supply. But having 2,5k/1,4k in the bank will give a huge boost in army size, when the production kicks in again. I saw this coming. ...But my liquibet is on Bomber :'/
I guess the frustrating thing is: Fast 3 nexus into mass gate attack. Tons of bunkers so he holds. Then you have a 100 second window before chargelot archon is out. So even after you hold the mass gate, the toss isn't behind in tech at all as all his zlots (vs just getting 2 medivacs out) have charge and so you need to turtle back to a good ghost count on a large map like this, because you just can't engage cost effectively without a good ghost count. Maybe the solution is to go ghost before medivacs but on such a large map again, you need medivacs, or any stim you make to catch harassing units while you walk across the map hurts you a ton. I mean sure Bomber lost the 2 medivacs but his ENTIRE MAIN. ~12 gates, tons of pylons, a nexus, templar archive. Worth nothing?
Bomber really fucked up that attempted drop/attack nat on Daybreak though TT.
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nice army movement by alicia!
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On April 24 2012 19:53 Bashion wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2012 19:51 sAsImre wrote:On April 24 2012 19:51 Fragile51 wrote:On April 24 2012 19:49 poorcloud wrote:On April 24 2012 19:47 Mentalizor wrote:On April 24 2012 19:43 poorcloud wrote:
Not balance whining but protoss is actually the only race that is able to take an expo and thus do an even more powerful attack.
Boggles your mind really. Then what is it -.- ? Just stating a fact. Dosen't mean i actually think the game is imbalanced since it is based on so many other factors as well. Pretty sure zerg in ZvP can do the same, 3 hatch baneling bust. Which doesn't work because delaying your attack is stupid. Of course it works. Naniwa lost to that build against Zenio.
Yes it can work, but it's pretty much all in.
It's not light pressure that doesn't even have to do damage, but already pays off if you keep your opponent in his base, so I don't see how you can compare it to the Parting build except that both builds involve a fast third.
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That was smart for alicia xD
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why would u set yourself up for a flank..on yourself lol
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On April 24 2012 19:53 Bashion wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2012 19:51 sAsImre wrote:On April 24 2012 19:51 Fragile51 wrote:On April 24 2012 19:49 poorcloud wrote:On April 24 2012 19:47 Mentalizor wrote:On April 24 2012 19:43 poorcloud wrote:
Not balance whining but protoss is actually the only race that is able to take an expo and thus do an even more powerful attack.
Boggles your mind really. Then what is it -.- ? Just stating a fact. Dosen't mean i actually think the game is imbalanced since it is based on so many other factors as well. Pretty sure zerg in ZvP can do the same, 3 hatch baneling bust. Which doesn't work because delaying your attack is stupid. Of course it works. Naniwa lost to that build against Zenio.
Taking Nani as an exemple who cuts every corners possible is pretty stupid most builds would have 4/6 FF available + some units, gl with your banes.
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Norway25712 Posts
On April 24 2012 19:53 KristofferAG wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2012 19:50 KristofferAG wrote:SlayerS_Alicia v StarTale_Bomber
1-1Maps:Daybreak StarTale_BomberAtlantis Spaceship SlayerS_AliciaDual Sight5.00SlayerS_Alicia is spawning as the red Protoss in the 2 o'clock position. StarTale_Bomber is spawning as the blue Terran in the 8 o'clock position. Alicia opens with a Gateway. Bomber starts off with a barracks. Bomber finishes off his wall with a supply depot. Alicia gets an Assimilator. Cybernetics Core going down for Alicia, getting his first Zealot. Bomber goes for a 1rax expand, with his CC being built on the high ground in the main. Warp Gate tech started for Alicia as he takes his second Assimilator, though he's not mining for it. Two more Barracks started for Bomber, followe by double Refinery. Alicia takes his Nexus. CC finishes up for Bomber, immediately upgraded to an Orbital. Two more Gateways started for Alicia. Bomber adds on a bunker at the top of his ramp.
10.00
Robotics Facility going down for Alicia.
Bomber starts the Stimpak research.
Factory placed down for Bomber.
Starport built after factory finishes up, reactor added on to Factory.
Observer coming out for Alicia, still only 3 Gateways for Alicia.
Medivac production started as Bomber takes his natural. Stimpak finishes.
Immortal on the way for Alicia, adding on a Robotics Bay.
Combat Shield started for Bomber as he moves out across the map.
Bomber drops two full medivacs in the main of Alicia, are able to take out all the Stalkers in the main and a bunch of Probes before it's cleaned up.
15.00
First Colossus is on the way as, range upgrade chrono boosted.
Two gateways added on as Viking production starts for Bomber.
+1 Infantry attack on the way.
Alicia looks to be moving out with his first Colossus.
Another Gateway added on for Alicia.
Bomber is moving out as Alicia gets in position to move in.
Nice forcefields keep all of the army of Bomber out, and Alicia moves in, but Bomber pulls back, stims in and takes out the entire army of Alicia in a nice sandwich attack.
A bunch of SCVs are taken out, but Bomber is going on the offensive.
Bomber is taking out the natural of Alicia, Alicia isn't able to move down the ramp.
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Terrans are too eager to sack their bunkers in many situations. Leads to many a heartache.
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United Kingdom38257 Posts
Phew, thank god the actually good player wins! =)
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Poll: Recommend Alicia vs Bomber Game 3?No (11) 92% If you have time (1) 8% Yes (0) 0% 12 total votes Your vote: Recommend Alicia vs Bomber Game 3? (Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time
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Thank god the WAAAY better player won!
edit: LOL @Asha`
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EPT
