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WCG 2011 Grand Finals - Page 377

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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BigLighthouse
Profile Joined October 2010
United Kingdom424 Posts
December 10 2011 11:11 GMT
#7521
Well I guess Kas should have finally proved his worth to people who've been doubting him. And Titan has notched up another solid tournament appearence, seriously where did this guy come from? I dont normally think of myself as ignorant but a month ago I didnt even know this player existed.
Benjef
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United Kingdom6921 Posts
December 10 2011 11:12 GMT
#7522
On December 10 2011 20:09 aTnClouD wrote:
Happy for Kas and Titan, 3rd-4th place match is going to be way more interesting than the finals.

Yeh agreed. I feel like its alot bigger for one of them to come third than the first and 2nd place game.
<3 | Dota 2 | DayZ | <3
Suohhen
Profile Joined November 2011
United States59 Posts
December 10 2011 11:15 GMT
#7523
On December 10 2011 20:04 KinQuh wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 20:00 Suohhen wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:43 SeaSwift wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:30 Suohhen wrote:
So typical of Eastern Europeans to play defensively, it is kind of funny when that style matches up with the hyper aggression of those used to playing on the Korean ladders.

Even in PvP, this kind of shows a bit more, like with Hasu vs HuK in the NASL: HuK's aggression just couldn't get through HasuObs' defence and passivity. If Huk had instead gone for HerO style of play, harassing while expanding, I think the outcome could have been very different.


I think it seems so obvious in PvP because there has been a big shift in the meta game in the past month. It used to seem like everyone 4 gated but now that is really only ok on certain maps or with other tech added like blink or warp prism. With all the traveling he has been doing I don't think he has been able to practice the new style and this was apparent in his games against Titan and Seiplo at Dreamhack especially, but you could see that he was adapting somewhat at NASL against Hasuobs. Then again he cuts a lot of corners in his play, almost surely a technique he developed to deal with all the cheese he faces in Korea, can he learn to play more standard in the PvP matchup. We shall see.

Or theres a factor you could consider. Seiplo HasuObs and Titan have better pvp than Huk?


Of course in those games they did, but those players have done far less to prove themselves than Huk so anyone who thinks any of those players are in the same league as him is a moron. Of course they could continue to have success and establish themselves as players of the caliber of Huk or even better, but my point is that I expect him to fix the holes in his game and stop losing those games. Will I be right, time will tell. Besides Hasuobs said he watched a ton of Huk's stream to prepare for the match, who is preparing for any of these players. That is something you have to endure if you want to maintain a spot at the top. You can bet that people will be prepared for roach all-ins at the next MLG he participates in for example.
KinQuh
Profile Joined February 2011
Finland810 Posts
December 10 2011 11:17 GMT
#7524
On December 10 2011 20:15 Suohhen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 20:04 KinQuh wrote:
On December 10 2011 20:00 Suohhen wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:43 SeaSwift wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:30 Suohhen wrote:
So typical of Eastern Europeans to play defensively, it is kind of funny when that style matches up with the hyper aggression of those used to playing on the Korean ladders.

Even in PvP, this kind of shows a bit more, like with Hasu vs HuK in the NASL: HuK's aggression just couldn't get through HasuObs' defence and passivity. If Huk had instead gone for HerO style of play, harassing while expanding, I think the outcome could have been very different.


I think it seems so obvious in PvP because there has been a big shift in the meta game in the past month. It used to seem like everyone 4 gated but now that is really only ok on certain maps or with other tech added like blink or warp prism. With all the traveling he has been doing I don't think he has been able to practice the new style and this was apparent in his games against Titan and Seiplo at Dreamhack especially, but you could see that he was adapting somewhat at NASL against Hasuobs. Then again he cuts a lot of corners in his play, almost surely a technique he developed to deal with all the cheese he faces in Korea, can he learn to play more standard in the PvP matchup. We shall see.

Or theres a factor you could consider. Seiplo HasuObs and Titan have better pvp than Huk?


Of course in those games they did, but those players have done far less to prove themselves than Huk so anyone who thinks any of those players are in the same league as him is a moron. Of course they could continue to have success and establish themselves as players of the caliber of Huk or even better, but my point is that I expect him to fix the holes in his game and stop losing those games. Will I be right, time will tell. Besides Hasuobs said he watched a ton of Huk's stream to prepare for the match, who is preparing for any of these players. That is something you have to endure if you want to maintain a spot at the top. You can bet that people will be prepared for roach all-ins at the next MLG he participates in for example.

I wasnt saying that they are better than Huk,i was just saying that the are better in PvP
Holy check.
PlayX
Profile Joined July 2011
Germany79 Posts
December 10 2011 11:18 GMT
#7525
What's the outcome of Kas - MVP in the semifinals?
Your birth certificate is actually a apology letter from the abortion clinic - Destiny
Qaatar
Profile Joined January 2011
1409 Posts
December 10 2011 11:19 GMT
#7526
On December 10 2011 20:18 PlayX wrote:
What's the outcome of Kas - MVP in the semifinals?


MVP doesn't lose TvT's nowadays. 2-0.
friendlyass
Profile Joined January 2011
United States23 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-10 11:20:25
December 10 2011 11:19 GMT
#7527
On December 10 2011 20:18 PlayX wrote:
What's the outcome of Kas - MVP in the semifinals?


MVP won 2:0
"sirl" (smile in reallife) is the new "lol"
AxionSteel
Profile Joined January 2011
United States7754 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-10 11:25:37
December 10 2011 11:21 GMT
#7528
On December 10 2011 20:15 Suohhen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 20:04 KinQuh wrote:
On December 10 2011 20:00 Suohhen wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:43 SeaSwift wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:30 Suohhen wrote:
So typical of Eastern Europeans to play defensively, it is kind of funny when that style matches up with the hyper aggression of those used to playing on the Korean ladders.

Even in PvP, this kind of shows a bit more, like with Hasu vs HuK in the NASL: HuK's aggression just couldn't get through HasuObs' defence and passivity. If Huk had instead gone for HerO style of play, harassing while expanding, I think the outcome could have been very different.


I think it seems so obvious in PvP because there has been a big shift in the meta game in the past month. It used to seem like everyone 4 gated but now that is really only ok on certain maps or with other tech added like blink or warp prism. With all the traveling he has been doing I don't think he has been able to practice the new style and this was apparent in his games against Titan and Seiplo at Dreamhack especially, but you could see that he was adapting somewhat at NASL against Hasuobs. Then again he cuts a lot of corners in his play, almost surely a technique he developed to deal with all the cheese he faces in Korea, can he learn to play more standard in the PvP matchup. We shall see.

Or theres a factor you could consider. Seiplo HasuObs and Titan have better pvp than Huk?


Of course in those games they did, but those players have done far less to prove themselves than Huk so anyone who thinks any of those players are in the same league as him is a moron. Of course they could continue to have success and establish themselves as players of the caliber of Huk or even better, but my point is that I expect him to fix the holes in his game and stop losing those games. Will I be right, time will tell. Besides Hasuobs said he watched a ton of Huk's stream to prepare for the match, who is preparing for any of these players. That is something you have to endure if you want to maintain a spot at the top. You can bet that people will be prepared for roach all-ins at the next MLG he participates in for example.


He'll only do that if he stops travelling around the world every single week for every single minor/major tourney that invites him. Otherwise he'll continue to be extremely inconsistent. Doesn't matter if it's PvP, PvT or PvZ, he crashes out early in many, many foreign tourneys. I just don't know how he can get good practice with the amount of travelling he does. With the results and actual play HuK has been displaying lately, I find it hard to rate him higher than the top Eurotosses and expect him to drop from Code S in the Up/Downs.

Suohhen
Profile Joined November 2011
United States59 Posts
December 10 2011 11:24 GMT
#7529
On December 10 2011 20:17 KinQuh wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 20:15 Suohhen wrote:
On December 10 2011 20:04 KinQuh wrote:
On December 10 2011 20:00 Suohhen wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:43 SeaSwift wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:30 Suohhen wrote:
So typical of Eastern Europeans to play defensively, it is kind of funny when that style matches up with the hyper aggression of those used to playing on the Korean ladders.

Even in PvP, this kind of shows a bit more, like with Hasu vs HuK in the NASL: HuK's aggression just couldn't get through HasuObs' defence and passivity. If Huk had instead gone for HerO style of play, harassing while expanding, I think the outcome could have been very different.


I think it seems so obvious in PvP because there has been a big shift in the meta game in the past month. It used to seem like everyone 4 gated but now that is really only ok on certain maps or with other tech added like blink or warp prism. With all the traveling he has been doing I don't think he has been able to practice the new style and this was apparent in his games against Titan and Seiplo at Dreamhack especially, but you could see that he was adapting somewhat at NASL against Hasuobs. Then again he cuts a lot of corners in his play, almost surely a technique he developed to deal with all the cheese he faces in Korea, can he learn to play more standard in the PvP matchup. We shall see.

Or theres a factor you could consider. Seiplo HasuObs and Titan have better pvp than Huk?


Of course in those games they did, but those players have done far less to prove themselves than Huk so anyone who thinks any of those players are in the same league as him is a moron. Of course they could continue to have success and establish themselves as players of the caliber of Huk or even better, but my point is that I expect him to fix the holes in his game and stop losing those games. Will I be right, time will tell. Besides Hasuobs said he watched a ton of Huk's stream to prepare for the match, who is preparing for any of these players. That is something you have to endure if you want to maintain a spot at the top. You can bet that people will be prepared for roach all-ins at the next MLG he participates in for example.

I wasnt saying that they are better than Huk,i was just saying that the are better in PvP


Still I agree they may be, but my suspicion is that he will improve his understanding of the new meta game and become very proficient in that match-up, but again only time will tell because there was a time that most would say it was his best match-up.
Grettin
Profile Joined April 2010
42381 Posts
December 10 2011 11:29 GMT
#7530
Damn Xigua, I'm impressed. Even though he had fairly easy way to the finals, he seem to be in a good shape. I hope finals won't be completely domination by MVP:

Good luck Xigua! I believe!
"If I had force-fields in Brood War, I'd never lose." -Bisu
zyzq
Profile Joined February 2011
United States3123 Posts
December 10 2011 11:31 GMT
#7531
MVP now the holder of the #1 ELO spot in both the International scene and Korean scene
Suohhen
Profile Joined November 2011
United States59 Posts
December 10 2011 11:32 GMT
#7532
On December 10 2011 20:21 AxionSteel wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 20:15 Suohhen wrote:
On December 10 2011 20:04 KinQuh wrote:
On December 10 2011 20:00 Suohhen wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:43 SeaSwift wrote:
On December 10 2011 19:30 Suohhen wrote:
So typical of Eastern Europeans to play defensively, it is kind of funny when that style matches up with the hyper aggression of those used to playing on the Korean ladders.

Even in PvP, this kind of shows a bit more, like with Hasu vs HuK in the NASL: HuK's aggression just couldn't get through HasuObs' defence and passivity. If Huk had instead gone for HerO style of play, harassing while expanding, I think the outcome could have been very different.


I think it seems so obvious in PvP because there has been a big shift in the meta game in the past month. It used to seem like everyone 4 gated but now that is really only ok on certain maps or with other tech added like blink or warp prism. With all the traveling he has been doing I don't think he has been able to practice the new style and this was apparent in his games against Titan and Seiplo at Dreamhack especially, but you could see that he was adapting somewhat at NASL against Hasuobs. Then again he cuts a lot of corners in his play, almost surely a technique he developed to deal with all the cheese he faces in Korea, can he learn to play more standard in the PvP matchup. We shall see.

Or theres a factor you could consider. Seiplo HasuObs and Titan have better pvp than Huk?


Of course in those games they did, but those players have done far less to prove themselves than Huk so anyone who thinks any of those players are in the same league as him is a moron. Of course they could continue to have success and establish themselves as players of the caliber of Huk or even better, but my point is that I expect him to fix the holes in his game and stop losing those games. Will I be right, time will tell. Besides Hasuobs said he watched a ton of Huk's stream to prepare for the match, who is preparing for any of these players. That is something you have to endure if you want to maintain a spot at the top. You can bet that people will be prepared for roach all-ins at the next MLG he participates in for example.


He'll only do that if he stops travelling around the world every single week for every single minor/major tourney that invites him. Otherwise he'll continue to be extremely inconsistent. Doesn't matter if it's PvP, PvT or PvZ, he crashes out early in many, many foreign tourneys. I just don't know how he can get good practice with the amount of travelling he does.


There was such a massive explosion in eSports this year and that had tournaments and players scrambling to adjust, I suspect that things will settle down a lot in 2012 because we have already seen some evidence, I mean look at the players who were interested in IEM at the beginning of the year and the first event of next year they have dKiller and dde qualified from America. I love BitterDam and will continue to watch, but it is clear to the top tier players who are interested in competing in Korea that MLG is the event to focus on and of course the big money events like IPL, and Dreamhack.
AsnSensation
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany24009 Posts
December 10 2011 11:33 GMT
#7533
Just watched the wc3 vods awesome games! Lyn <3<3<3 Loved how the korean casters went nuts haha some good memories for wc3

As for sc2 it seems like MVP will scoop another 20k christmas money for his girlfriend and Polt's christmas present is the participation in the blizzard cup. Still damn impressed by xigua, Kas and Titan!
Dattish
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Sweden6297 Posts
December 10 2011 11:39 GMT
#7534
--- Nuked ---
Suohhen
Profile Joined November 2011
United States59 Posts
December 10 2011 11:40 GMT
#7535
On December 10 2011 20:29 Grettin wrote:
Damn Xigua, I'm impressed. Even though he had fairly easy way to the finals, he seem to be in a good shape. I hope finals won't be completely domination by MVP:

Good luck Xigua! I believe!


Not sure how to look at this, the utopian view would be that the glory of a victory here would have the biggest effect spread over a country of almost 1.5 billion people. But the paranoid view of my fellow Americans is that the swarm will engulf us.

But of course players like this can only help bridge the gap between China and the rest of the world and make the world closer. I'm happy to see him have success because this year has clearly been tough for him with the failure at IEM China that he didn't even qualify for and the fact that he couldn't go to Blizzcon even though he did qualify for it because of visa issues. I have all the respect in the world for top tier zerg players and they are so fun to watch.
Mouzone
Profile Joined April 2011
3937 Posts
December 10 2011 11:46 GMT
#7536
When is the grand final?
MVTaylor
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United Kingdom2893 Posts
December 10 2011 11:54 GMT
#7537
Xigua hasn't dropped a map all tournament, wow

Bit of a shame Polt gets in to Blizzard Cup if MVP wins as he's been so off his game recently I can't see him getting more than one win in his group, who knows though, could surprise us...
@followMVT
BarbieHsu
Profile Joined September 2011
574 Posts
December 10 2011 12:03 GMT
#7538
On December 10 2011 20:54 mvtaylor wrote:
Xigua hasn't dropped a map all tournament, wow

Bit of a shame Polt gets in to Blizzard Cup if MVP wins as he's been so off his game recently I can't see him getting more than one win in his group, who knows though, could surprise us...


If Xigua wins, he gets in? Wow, that would be interesting.
Tarotis
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
Germany1931 Posts
December 10 2011 12:04 GMT
#7539
On December 10 2011 21:03 BarbieHsu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 20:54 mvtaylor wrote:
Xigua hasn't dropped a map all tournament, wow

Bit of a shame Polt gets in to Blizzard Cup if MVP wins as he's been so off his game recently I can't see him getting more than one win in his group, who knows though, could surprise us...


If Xigua wins, he gets in? Wow, that would be interesting.

yup
Logros
Profile Joined September 2010
Netherlands9913 Posts
December 10 2011 12:14 GMT
#7540
I didn't really watch any of this tournament before but it was 99% clear that MVP was gonna take it anyway.
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