Funny to hear that they think CatZ has a chance at taking this, sorry but CatZ's "innovative" play is just gimmicky and he does so to make up for the lack of his game mechanics.
On May 01 2011 10:01 XothermeK wrote: Funny to hear that they think CatZ has a chance at taking this, sorry but CatZ's "innovative" play is just gimmicky and he does so to make up for the lack of his game mechanics.
I always find it funny when people who don't even watch CatZ's games just go "LOL CatZ has no chance because proxy hatches/baneling busts/gimmicky play won't work on such an experienced player." Don't get me wrong I want and think Bratok will win but clearly you know nothing of catz if you auto assume that every game he goes for gimmicky play.
On May 01 2011 10:15 TemplarCo. wrote: I preferred Godzilla recking habit!!
I was wondering about that last time - it made me laugh because the two casters seemed so oblivious to it, and it was weirdly out of sync with what we'd seen so far.
As i said yesterday, I like the new background. And i still think if you use it to show highlights of the past game or previous games of the players like you used it for godzilla that would be awesome.
The tank contain/slow push with the high ground is so strong on that map...very hard to counter without mutas / some sort of rush or very aggressive strat. But also the roaches were completely useless and delayed the infestors too much.
On May 01 2011 10:26 Tachion wrote: only 275 energy to kill 1 medivac lol
Yeah, it's funny that one impact of the fungal change is that infestors are not as good against medivacs. Before it was easy to lock down with 1 fungal and kill with a few infested terrans.
I always find it funny when people who don't even watch CatZ's games just go "LOL CatZ has no chance because proxy hatches/baneling busts/gimmicky play won't work on such an experienced player." Don't get me wrong I want and think Bratok will win but clearly you know nothing of catz if you auto assume that every game he goes for gimmicky play.
Catz needs some macro hatcheries if he's going to play this ling/infestor style. He can't spend his resources and floats 1200 whenever he has to make units.
On May 01 2011 10:35 darthfoley wrote: god, people bitch about a black background, and now that they have a decent SC related background people don't like it either. sigh
On May 01 2011 10:34 Karthane wrote: Can't say i'm a fan of the background. Looks obviously fake and just makes the production value seem worse =/
it's supposed to look that way ...
so it's supposed to validate the production quality of the NASL?
The point is it's supposed to look a bit cheesy, because a plain gray professional background *also* showed off low production quality according to critics.
On May 01 2011 10:40 r33k wrote: The american way of pronouncing brat_ok makes me cringe every time, but they probably couldn't say it correctly without some chuckles...
On May 01 2011 10:34 Karthane wrote: Can't say i'm a fan of the background. Looks obviously fake and just makes the production value seem worse =/
it's supposed to look that way ...
so it's supposed to validate the production quality of the NASL?
The point is it's supposed to look a bit cheesy, because a plain gray professional background *also* showed off low production quality according to critics.
I think the plain gray background was used to focus on the commentators.
On May 01 2011 10:40 r33k wrote: The american way of pronouncing brat_ok makes me cringe every time, but they probably couldn't say it correctly without some chuckles...
how is it pronounced?
"ok" isn't pronounced as in the english "ok". Think hollywood russian or cuban pronounciation instead, either way make it sound communist.
On May 01 2011 10:40 r33k wrote: The american way of pronouncing brat_ok makes me cringe every time, but they probably couldn't say it correctly without some chuckles...
On May 01 2011 10:40 r33k wrote: The american way of pronouncing brat_ok makes me cringe every time, but they probably couldn't say it correctly without some chuckles...
how is it pronounced?
"ok" isn't pronounced as in the english "ok". Think hollywood russian or cuban pronounciation instead, either way make it sound communist.
i see. i've always joked to myself saying his name in a bond villain kinda way, i might have been pronouncing it right when i was joking around haha.
On May 01 2011 10:40 r33k wrote: The american way of pronouncing brat_ok makes me cringe every time, but they probably couldn't say it correctly without some chuckles...
how is it pronounced?
"ok" isn't pronounced as in the english "ok". Think hollywood russian or cuban pronounciation instead, either way make it sound communist.
i see. i've always joked to myself saying his name in a bond villain kinda way, i might have been pronouncing it right when i was joking around haha.
Strelok is supposed to be pronounced like that too.
On May 01 2011 10:52 StoLiVe wrote: HOLY CRAP !!!! epic timing by catz. this ma win the game for him
So does anyone else think that infestors are overly imbalanced?
Eh, I kind of like having casters that can change the game with their spells. Casters are slightly harder to use than their non-caster equivalent (banelings for infestors, Colossi for HT), so I think that there should be some benefit to doing that. It's a good spell, lets leave it at that until we see people winning some ridiculous amount off of infestor play alone.
On May 01 2011 10:52 StoLiVe wrote: HOLY CRAP !!!! epic timing by catz. this ma win the game for him
So does anyone else think that infestors are overly imbalanced?
Let's wait until some zerg players actually begin winning before we jump to this conclusion. And if it is, let's let it sit for over a year and when terran or protoss complain we can smugly recite Tyler, Incontrol and Day9's schtick about the game being too young to possibly be imbalanced back at them.
LOL @casters. they talk something about BIGGEST MISTAKE by bratok so far and guess what? 5min. later he won the series!?!?!?!?!? the cast is even worse then mlg so far.
That last game was so close, definitely one of the best back and forth matches in a while and proof that TvZ is the most exciting MU.
Although i was kind of disappointed at Gretorp's casting mistakes. He showed an obvious bias for CatZ, and he often missed key things happening in the game and misread situations.
Incontrol's natural charisma and good casting can't run the show alone! I hope Gretorp gets better at this casting thing.
Gretorp and incontrol have always been good, people just need a little bit of time getting used to new commentators and before they do, they'll bitch and whine like there's no tomorrow.
On May 01 2011 10:52 StoLiVe wrote: HOLY CRAP !!!! epic timing by catz. this ma win the game for him
So does anyone else think that infestors are overly imbalanced?
Let's wait until some zerg players actually begin winning before we jump to this conclusion. And if it is, let's let it sit for over a year and when terran or protoss complain we can smugly recite Tyler, Incontrol and Day9's schtick about the game being too young to possibly be imbalanced back at them.
idk about that. We didn't have to wait a year for them to fix beta Zerg, release Terran, and recent Protoss.
On May 01 2011 11:00 HarryKlein wrote: LOL @casters. they talk something about BIGGEST MISTAKE by bratok so far and guess what? min. later he won the series!?!?!?!?!? the cast is even worse then mlg so far.
haters gonna hate
Ofc you're a hater. I don't see why if he do some mistake he should not win. Come back can happen
On May 01 2011 10:52 StoLiVe wrote: HOLY CRAP !!!! epic timing by catz. this ma win the game for him
So does anyone else think that infestors are overly imbalanced?
I didn't say it was overpower o.o
Have you follow broodwar ? it's like a difiler who cast a dark swarm may change the result. Dark swarm was good but not over power
The difference is that for DS, you could cast 1 of em over a large ball of MM and send in 12 zerglings to force the MM to react. 12 zerglings going after MM with FG on them wont really make a difference. MM will just take the FG, clean up the lings, and heal up afterwards. FG is no where near as powerful as DS was
Edit: on top of that, defiler energy was damn near infinite with consume
On May 01 2011 11:00 HarryKlein wrote: LOL @casters. they talk something about BIGGEST MISTAKE by bratok so far and guess what? 5min. later he won the series!?!?!?!?!? the cast is even worse then mlg so far.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
Wouldn't be natural for them, but that's why they have khaldor (although he only comes when inc is playing)
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
Wouldn't be natural for them, but that's why they have khaldor (although he only comes when inc is playing)
When Idra vs Jinro played Tastosis somehow managed, even though they are much better friends with Idra. So I expect at least an attempt at neutrality when 2 non-Koreans play.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
Wouldn't be natural for them, but that's why they have khaldor (although he only comes when inc is playing)
It's North American Star League so I feel it should be centered on North American speak/culture! It will give something for the rest of the world (and North Americans) to laugh at.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
Wouldn't be natural for them, but that's why they have khaldor (although he only comes when inc is playing)
When Idra vs Jinro played Tastosis somehow managed, even though they are much better friends with Idra. So I expect at least an attempt at neutrality when 2 non-Koreans play.
Considering iNc was referring to an error he made in casting, not to any bias. I am slightly confused where that is coming from.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
Geoff. Geoff. Geoff. You are handsome, brilliant, funny, clever, cunning, wise, and you're on the same team as AXSLAV, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
Wouldn't be natural for them, but that's why they have khaldor (although he only comes when inc is playing)
When Idra vs Jinro played Tastosis somehow managed, even though they are much better friends with Idra. So I expect at least an attempt at neutrality when 2 non-Koreans play.
Considering iNc was referring to an error he made in casting, not to any bias. I am slightly confused where that is coming from.
On the other hand go go RET!
Go Ret indeed. I wasnt talking about the quote, but the general cast, in hindsight i should have used the quote option on Inc post.
On May 01 2011 11:12 brentsen wrote: Man, Goody is still a riddle to me. Sometime he looks like just so bad like not even diamond level and then again he pulls off briliant maneuvers.
This is a very unique match, the two progamers with the best and worst mechanics in Europe are playing against each other. Goody terrible macro is always too funny to watch :p
On May 01 2011 11:12 brentsen wrote: Man, Goody is still a riddle to me. Sometime he looks like just so bad like not even diamond level and then again he pulls off briliant maneuvers.
Honestly, Goody is so much better when he uses a factory. If you remember the TSL + Show Spoiler +
He had some of the worst 3 rax all in micro I'd ever seen, stuff that made the Gold League look good. However, his game previous in which he went mech he looked unstoppable.
I watched DarkForce play a ladder game against Goody two days ago. The build ret is doing looks almost identical to the build Ret is using currently. Darkforce used burrow movement and infestors and drop tech to abuse mech and then broodlords late game.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
Difference- I didnt pay 25$ for TSL so they can commentate how ever they like and I'll be grateful for free HD screen. On the other hand NASL took my money so I expect the casting to not be biased against my favorite players.
On May 01 2011 11:13 MYM.ClouD wrote: This is a very unique match, the two progamers with the best and worst mechanics in Europe are playing against each other. Goody terrible macro is always too funny to watch :p
On May 01 2011 11:13 MYM.ClouD wrote: This is a very unique match, the two progamers with the best and worst mechanics in Europe are playing against each other. Goody terrible macro is always too funny to watch :p
But ClouD, who needs macro when you're the Panzer General? Just a few siege tanks and he's golden.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
Difference- I didnt pay 25$ for TSL so they can commentate how ever they like and I'll be grateful for free HD screen. On the other hand NASL took my money so I expect the casting to not be biased against my favorite players.
LOL NASL took your money!? They pinned you down and beat you silly until you gave them your lunch money right? Caveat emptor - don't be so foolish.
If you don't like try going through the official channels to arrange a refund and stop derailing the LR thread
OT: Ret looked so good there, and he had a greater spire almost finished. Broodlords with that roach force would have been awesome to watch
On May 01 2011 11:13 MYM.ClouD wrote: This is a very unique match, the two progamers with the best and worst mechanics in Europe are playing against each other. Goody terrible macro is always too funny to watch :p
But ClouD, who needs macro when you're the Panzer General? Just a few siege tanks and he's golden.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
Difference- I didnt pay 25$ for TSL so they can commentate how ever they like and I'll be grateful for free HD screen. On the other hand NASL took my money so I expect the casting to not be biased against my favorite players.
LOL NASL took your money!? They pinned you down and beat you silly until you gave them your lunch money right? Caveat emptor - don't be so foolish.
If you don't like try going through the official channels to arrange a refund and stop derailing the LR thread
OT: Ret looked so good there, and he had a greater spire almost finished. Broodlords with that roach force would have been awesome to watch
Stoping now, 1 Question: whats LR? sorry i'm foreign so dont know some things
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
Difference- I didnt pay 25$ for TSL so they can commentate how ever they like and I'll be grateful for free HD screen. On the other hand NASL took my money so I expect the casting to not be biased against my favorite players.
LOL NASL took your money!? They pinned you down and beat you silly until you gave them your lunch money right? Caveat emptor - don't be so foolish.
If you don't like try going through the official channels to arrange a refund and stop derailing the LR thread
OT: Ret looked so good there, and he had a greater spire almost finished. Broodlords with that roach force would have been awesome to watch
Stoping now, 1 Question: whats LR? sorry i'm foreign so dont know some things
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
Difference- I didnt pay 25$ for TSL so they can commentate how ever they like and I'll be grateful for free HD screen. On the other hand NASL took my money so I expect the casting to not be biased against my favorite players.
LOL NASL took your money!? They pinned you down and beat you silly until you gave them your lunch money right? Caveat emptor - don't be so foolish.
If you don't like try going through the official channels to arrange a refund and stop derailing the LR thread
OT: Ret looked so good there, and he had a greater spire almost finished. Broodlords with that roach force would have been awesome to watch
Stoping now, 1 Question: whats LR? sorry i'm foreign so dont know some things
It stands for Live Report thread - which is what these tournament threads serve as.
It is for people who may not be able to watch the stream but want to follow the games so users are meant to post updates about the games
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
Difference- I didnt pay 25$ for TSL so they can commentate how ever they like and I'll be grateful for free HD screen. On the other hand NASL took my money so I expect the casting to not be biased against my favorite players.
Don't like the commentary then mute it. The bitching about the commentary is starting to get annoying. No where did they say if you pay $25 we won't ever say something bad about players you like.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
Difference- I didnt pay 25$ for TSL so they can commentate how ever they like and I'll be grateful for free HD screen. On the other hand NASL took my money so I expect the casting to not be biased against my favorite players.
LOL NASL took your money!? They pinned you down and beat you silly until you gave them your lunch money right? Caveat emptor - don't be so foolish.
If you don't like try going through the official channels to arrange a refund and stop derailing the LR thread
OT: Ret looked so good there, and he had a greater spire almost finished. Broodlords with that roach force would have been awesome to watch
Stoping now, 1 Question: whats LR? sorry i'm foreign so dont know some things
LR stands for live report. This is a live report thread.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
Difference- I didnt pay 25$ for TSL so they can commentate how ever they like and I'll be grateful for free HD screen. On the other hand NASL took my money so I expect the casting to not be biased against my favorite players.
LOL NASL took your money!? They pinned you down and beat you silly until you gave them your lunch money right? Caveat emptor - don't be so foolish.
If you don't like try going through the official channels to arrange a refund and stop derailing the LR thread
OT: Ret looked so good there, and he had a greater spire almost finished. Broodlords with that roach force would have been awesome to watch
Stoping now, 1 Question: whats LR? sorry i'm foreign so dont know some things
An LR thread (like this one) is a discussion so that the people who can't view the stream can hear what's happening.
Usually, it works with some person saying things like: 5:00 - Goody builds 2 Factories and adds Tech Labs. Ret expands to his third.
But because Stream access is pretty easy to find right now, it's really used for discussing the games as they happen.
On May 01 2011 10:57 iNcontroL wrote: LEFT LEFT SIDE OF MAP
DAMN IT
If you were commentating for just US/Americas audience i would understand you openly rooting for Catz, but NASL is trying to position itself as an INTERNATIONAL league. So please try to commentate to both sides of the ocean.
I said the final base was on the lower right side of the map when it was left.
So here I was commenting on that error.
You on the other hand are being odd.
It wasnt about the quote, i just wanted to make sure that you understood that i was talking to the casters . (more Gretorp than you admittedly, but he is not here). He, and sometimes you are just little bit too open about rooting for people for my taste.
Difference- I didnt pay 25$ for TSL so they can commentate how ever they like and I'll be grateful for free HD screen. On the other hand NASL took my money so I expect the casting to not be biased against my favorite players.
LOL NASL took your money!? They pinned you down and beat you silly until you gave them your lunch money right? Caveat emptor - don't be so foolish.
If you don't like try going through the official channels to arrange a refund and stop derailing the LR thread
OT: Ret looked so good there, and he had a greater spire almost finished. Broodlords with that roach force would have been awesome to watch
Huh? Taking someone's money doesn't necessarily mean taking by force. If you gave a cashier money to pay for your goods, he didn't 'take your money?'
The poster's point is pretty obvious: he paid for something and feels that it is not worth what he paid for. Way to play semantics though (and fail at it at the same time.)
On May 01 2011 11:24 bkrow wrote: One day Goody is going to mix up his style and a lot of zergs are going to die for going blind roach play :p
On another note - Ret's creep spread is insane! Him and IdrA love their creep haha! Banshee on the way for Goody
I think he needs to mix his play up less, his tank play is downright GORGEOUS, it's beyond powerful and it's so hard to break, and most of his losses come from mixing up his play. I don't think there's a single player in the world who is better at mech than GoOdy, in or out of korea.
On May 01 2011 11:26 Pirat6662001 wrote: Why did goody have 5 scvs building in each cc? i feel like queing is a newbie mistake, but may be there is a reason i dont get?
It could be something simple like he knows he can't afford a Factory until after all 5 SCVs, so might as well queue them. Or because he knows he needs to micro and can't afford to look back mid-battle to queue up more.
On May 01 2011 11:26 Pirat6662001 wrote: Why did goody have 5 scvs building in each cc? i feel like queing is a newbie mistake, but may be there is a reason i dont get?
Hehe Goody doesn't have the best mechanics in the world :/ i guess it's his way of not missing a cycle - probably not the most efficient approach
On May 01 2011 11:26 Pirat6662001 wrote: Why did goody have 5 scvs building in each cc? i feel like queing is a newbie mistake, but may be there is a reason i dont get?
It's a mistake, GoOdy has said regularly in interviews that he doesn't have the APM to keep up with his macro very well, so he queues to make sure they don't stop building. On the other hand, his tank control and tactics and general strategies are so good that he does great.
Considering that Ret is building lots of roaches guys, GoOdy isn't far behind at all. Look at the supply, remembering that zerg is supposed to be ahead at this point.
Whats to stop a zerg from just banking 2500/2500 against goody and poping out 25 mutas at once (so goody won't prepare) and just camping over the barracks? He has way too few marines
On May 01 2011 11:29 j4vz wrote: i cant wait for MC vs Ace even if its PvP.
MC stats vP: 15-2 (88.24%)
Ace stats All: 20-2 (90.91%) vP: 2-0 (100%)
Ace pwned IdrA,Moon,mOOnGLaDe.Ret,White-Ra... basically he hasnt lost yet vs anyone in a Best-Of series.
Huh? Wouldn't that mean he should have won GSL already? Or do you mean outside of GSL? I'm not challenging your assertion about his skill but I'm confused about your statement that he hasn't lost.
On May 01 2011 11:30 hifriend wrote: Pretty crazy that a player with mechanics like goody can keep up with the absolute elite. The man beat nestea in a bo3 for god's sake.
Imagine goody's strategic genius combined with ret's godly mechanics. O_O
On May 01 2011 11:20 Uhh Negative wrote: Like I've said and been banned for before: Goody is not a very good player, in my opinion.
your opinion is wrong
The games are proving me right
and what you are saying is proving that you don't know shit about sc2 or you didn't check goody accomplishments awell
No doubt he's a good strategic player, but he just doesn't have the macro/multitasking that is REQUIRED to be top level in starcraft. Now maybe if he works on improving his macro he will be a beast but that's not the case right now, in my opinion. Don't get angry, I'm just a no one expressing my thoughts of Goody.
On May 01 2011 11:20 Uhh Negative wrote: Like I've said and been banned for before: Goody is not a very good player, in my opinion.
your opinion is wrong
The games are proving me right
and what you are saying is proving that you don't know shit about sc2 or you didn't check goody accomplishments awell
No doubt he's a good strategic player, but he just doesn't have the macro/multitasking that is REQUIRED to be top level in starcraft. Now maybe if he works on improving his macro he will be a beast but that's not the case right now, in my opinion. Don't get angry, I'm just a no one expressing my thoughts of Goody.
Agreed, it makes me sick to my stomach every time I see him with like 400 minerals banked and 5 SCVs queued up at the 5min mark of the game.
I can't watch today unfortunately... but please Ace... take down MC! (I don't hate MC, but Ace is my favorite Korean protoss player and taking down MC would be huge for him... though it would be difficult).
Alright he ad timing is beyond annoying now. It literally makes the time in between ganmes miserable.
Cutting off the interview? Really? You are literally asking people to turn on adblock. Doesn't make any sense business wise either. Really makes me question the decision making ability of the producers here.....
I have my adblock off deliberate for NASL, because I didn't pay for the HQ stream but still want to support the league, but it would be nice if they didn't do commercials during the interviews.
Just curious about Goody, I know he has won.performed well in a lot of Euro tournaments. Are these tournaments where its multiple games in one day and you don't really know who you are playing?
The reason I bring this up is I feel like the players in the NASL have a full week to prepare for Goody's style (which I do love), but it seems like players being able to study him so much are finding ways to beat his mech army.
the sign of a well-done bluescreen/greenscreen background is if the viewer doesn't notice it. unfortunately it is not the case here.
one can clearly see that the casters are transposed onto it, as the outline of gretorp/incontrol against the background looks unnatural and digitized. it's highly distracting. ironically watching on 480p actually probably looks better than 720p because everything is pixelated on 480p anyway.
it's like those low budget tv shows where you see actors having a conversation in a moving car and you see the streets scrolling by in the background but the bluescreen is so badly done that it's obvious from the get-go that they're actually in a motionless car on a movie set.
nasl changed the drab grey background b/c they got a lot of complaints about the set looking low-budget, but i don't think they did themselves any favors with the new setup as the production quality actually looks worse.
On May 01 2011 12:05 Moonwrath wrote: Select and his massive 350 apm just forgets about his drop in the lower right and loses all his marines and medivacs there.
this is why sometimes its better to lower our apm in tournement instead of keep spamming like crazy like in pratice games.
Get the feeling that if Stalife got some marauders to break the tanks earlier (when he was miles ahead on upgrades) he might be in better shape. Stimmed marauders are so good at shattering tank lines with marine support. Now that Select's ground forces have caught up in upgrades, feels like its far too late.
What do you do when you lose a game like this? I mean, it must feel like the opponent outplayed you, but you can't really point out your loss to any big mistake you made.
On May 01 2011 12:15 Aequos wrote: What do you do when you lose a game like this? I mean, it must feel like the opponent outplayed you, but you can't really point out your loss to any big mistake you made.
Usually it's not you thinking about how you got outplayed (and this really isn't the case either), but how one battle, one poor position, or one tech switch killed you. You slap yourself for letting it happen, but it's nothing to get too upset about.
Edit: So many memories of Flash vs Fantasy, Flash vs Leta popping into my head right now.
beautiful switch by select, making all those vikings to enable him to use those 3 BCs. Love that he didn't overcommit like some in the past and make a ton of BCs.
On May 01 2011 12:19 Deathmanbob wrote: wow it went from 12k viewers to 9k in 5 second flat, that many people turn it off when a game ends before they start the next one?
Think it's because of the adverts. Don't think the viewer count counts people watching the ads. Not sure though :\
On May 01 2011 12:19 Deathmanbob wrote: wow it went from 12k viewers to 9k in 5 second flat, that many people turn it off when a game ends before they start the next one?
TvT is easily the best matchup. I love how positioning is so pivotal in TvT. You can have the smaller army overall, but if you have the better position, like SeleCT did, you can starve out your opponent or force them to get a bad army trade if they try to attack into it, all while you can expand.
On May 01 2011 12:19 TurkeyBacon wrote: Someone tell me how TvT is not winning the "Favorite Matchup to watch" poll?
Because no one wants to watch something that long and slow paced 3 games in a row. The final battle wasn't even epic, just a bunch of tanks die and he losses positional control so he is forced to gg
On May 01 2011 12:19 Deathmanbob wrote: wow it went from 12k viewers to 9k in 5 second flat, that many people turn it off when a game ends before they start the next one?
Think it's because of the adverts. Don't think the viewer count counts people watching the ads. Not sure though :\
On May 01 2011 12:19 TurkeyBacon wrote: Someone tell me how TvT is not winning the "Favorite Matchup to watch" poll?
Because no one wants to watch something that long and slow paced 3 games in a row. The final battle wasn't even epic, just a bunch of tanks die and he losses positional control so he is forced to gg
I don't need "epic" deathball vs deathball battles, I need smart, back and forth strategy that TvT provides. Just IMO.
On May 01 2011 12:19 TurkeyBacon wrote: Someone tell me how TvT is not winning the "Favorite Matchup to watch" poll?
Because no one wants to watch something that long and slow paced 3 games in a row. The final battle wasn't even epic, just a bunch of tanks die and he losses positional control so he is forced to gg
On May 01 2011 12:19 TurkeyBacon wrote: Someone tell me how TvT is not winning the "Favorite Matchup to watch" poll?
Because no one wants to watch something that long and slow paced 3 games in a row. The final battle wasn't even epic, just a bunch of tanks die and he losses positional control so he is forced to gg
You don't watch TvT for the last battle. It's the poking, positioning, repositioning, and dropping that you watch for. It almost takes on a turn-based style when the two players are playing so evenly. I guess you just have to appreciate it to like it.
And I just noticed that there was no poll for Ret vs Goody game 2. Didn't like it, motbob?
On May 01 2011 12:19 TurkeyBacon wrote: Someone tell me how TvT is not winning the "Favorite Matchup to watch" poll?
Because no one wants to watch something that long and slow paced 3 games in a row. The final battle wasn't even epic, just a bunch of tanks die and he losses positional control so he is forced to gg
Brood war says otherwise.
Average Broodwar game was like 12-15mins.
I don't need "epic" deathball vs deathball battles, I need smart, back and forth strategy that TvT provides. Just IMO.
And some people like the fast paced, intense micro battles in PvP. The 45min tank line stand-offs aren't everyones cup of tea. I enjoy them from time to time, but I can't stand it when it happens in virtually ever game on a Bo3/Bo5
On May 01 2011 12:19 TurkeyBacon wrote: Someone tell me how TvT is not winning the "Favorite Matchup to watch" poll?
Because no one wants to watch something that long and slow paced 3 games in a row. The final battle wasn't even epic, just a bunch of tanks die and he losses positional control so he is forced to gg
Brood war says otherwise.
Actually no, TvT is boring in BW as it is long and slow paced.
Looked kind of sloppy in my opinion. No offense, I love watching high level games, but to me a lot of top players really need to work on their decision making in the late-game.
i do not like TvT. Its one of my most boring matchups. i watch it but a lot of it comes down to who moves into the siege line and loses too much stuff. It is the easiest matchup for me to skip actually.
On May 01 2011 12:39 TheResidentEvil wrote: i do not like TvT. Its one of my most boring matchups. i watch it but a lot of it comes down to who moves into the siege line and loses too much stuff. It is the easiest matchup for me to skip actually.
It is true that the MU can lead to boring matches but you are insanely missing out on some awesome games.
Was Hasu-obs Meta-Meta gaming that voidray? Make it look some what suspicious that you are going for a push but expand anyway, forcing the paranoid Zerg to make some roaches?
not a fan of hasuobs opening tonight. zerg didnt react at all to it and hasuobs didnt capitalize on it. i dont really know what he was trying to accomplish
I like that machine is doing lots of baneling drops, but I feel like if he controlled them a bit better or even burrowed some if the probes ran away he would be doing a lot better in economy.
Is it me or is Zerg having a much easier time against Protoss recently? Don't really see many people complaining as much as they were a few weeks ago :o
It's because Zerg has learned to play against Protoss. Baneling drops are *so* cost effective and extremely taxing for the Protoss to handle in the midst of battle. Much more so than a medivac drop because if you don't pull your probes *instantly* most of them die.
The casters were right. HasuObs basically had to wait until Machine committed to a poorly positioned attack. Attacking up that ramp was really dangerous.
On May 01 2011 13:07 bluestuff wrote: man over 50 workers lost for hasuobs and still loses this game jesus
Yeah...that last attack was pretty sad tbh...You can't just do that, you need to have the broodlords shell away at the units at the choke with infestors support so they just can't be sniped by Blink Stalkers, force the Toss away then engage, not run everything and have 60 units all get stormed at once .__.
Super late Hive even though he was banking cash seemed kinda weird to me too
Machine needs to take a page out of the Spanishiwa end game vs Protoss book. Roaches got owned so hard by immortals, colossus, and storms, a perfect storm.
Hasu is one of the few protoss players I really enjoy watching, I also love that he still gets HTs because even though there not what they used to be with KA there still ridiculously strong.
Machine should have won... that whole map is just full of chokes so its super easy for toss to just sit back and wait for a poor engagement. Hasuobs completely outclassed.
On May 01 2011 13:10 motbob wrote: That map is pretty terrible for a zerg who wants to force a decisive engagement.
I really don't get why tournaments like it so much, it seems like a terribly imbalanced map for Protoss due to their cliffwalking mechanics (blink and Colossi) and their ability to make a choke much better.
On May 01 2011 13:09 adeezy wrote: Machine needs to take a page out of the Spanishiwa end game vs Protoss book. Roaches got owned so hard by immortals, colossus, and storms, a perfect storm.
perfectstorm would be an amazing id for a toss player
On May 01 2011 13:09 aurum510 wrote: Anyone who is saying "machine shouldn't have tried to bust through the choke!"
1) The whole map is a choke. 2) He was about to run out of bases on the map that he could mine from, while HasuObs was comfortably mining.
Haso has no air and a lack of funds, chokes are the only thing going for him. Broodlords outrange everything he has, with a few infestors he can just shell away from safe distance of the winding paths and force Hasu away to chokes further back or just engage him. Either way, there are always moments of opportunity to exploit when one side has to back away
On May 01 2011 13:09 will.pity wrote: really nice reaction timings to those baneling drops GG
lol he lost over 50 workers to banes.
He would've lost more if he didn't pull them away. Honestly, 50 probes killed delayed his economy so much he was not able to make any meaningful attack until the very end of the game when Machine sacced his army.
i cant remember the last time a zerg won playing too macro heavy engaging 200 vs 200 toss. gotta put more pressure early on while armies aren't that huge
On May 01 2011 13:09 will.pity wrote: really nice reaction timings to those baneling drops GG
lol he lost over 50 workers to banes.
How many drops did you count? atleast 8 or so? He lost more money in banelings than hasu lost in probes. And on 4 bases, it really didn't take that much effort for hasu to keep up probe production and keep his bases saturated. The bling drops were good at first, but they became horribly inefficient as the game went on. Hasu was just reacting too quickly to the majority of them.
On May 01 2011 13:09 will.pity wrote: really nice reaction timings to those baneling drops GG
lol he lost over 50 workers to banes.
He also sniped, overlords full of banes with his stalkers and lost 0 stalkers. He also pulled all his workers MULTIPLE times and saved ALL of them. When massive dropped ALL game long MANY MANY times. I think he did pretty well
I think trying to force an engagement as zerg on that map is the wrong way to try to play it. To that end, multi-pronged attacks at different locations is a better way, whittle them down. It's tough for zerg, but Machine was able to get his overlords back behind hasuobs's base multiple times, he could have built a few nydus worms or something.
On May 01 2011 13:09 adeezy wrote: Machine needs to take a page out of the Spanishiwa end game vs Protoss book. Roaches got owned so hard by immortals, colossus, and storms, a perfect storm.
perfectstorm would be an amazing id for a toss player
if i had a 2nd acct, i would rename it to perfectstorm now xD
I wonder if we will see blink stalkers on this map, i have a 100% win rate vs zerg on this map with blink stalker, i am only in diamond but its crazy on this map because of the low ground that is easy to blink 2
On May 01 2011 13:09 aurum510 wrote: Anyone who is saying "machine shouldn't have tried to bust through the choke!"
1) The whole map is a choke. 2) He was about to run out of bases on the map that he could mine from, while HasuObs was comfortably mining.
I agree, this map is very difficult for Zerg.
But looking back at this game, nothing happened for 15 minutes. Machine then took his 4th, that is good, but he let Hasuobs do whatever he wanted, and Hasu freely could take a 3rd while massing his army. What happens when you let a Protoss sit in his base and macro ? He'll run you over with a deathball
On May 01 2011 13:13 Funkatron wrote: some nydus would have been awesome in that game.
Yeah..it actually might have worked out really well, a Nydus in the base when Hasu only really has the forces to hold a single point at a time would have done wonders, hell you could even cover the Nydus with an overlord full of banes to stop workers sniping it.
Hasu had all his Templars at a single point, all Machine had to do was get his army around Hasu-obs then engage whilst his Templars are still trailing
Hasu-obs, iirc, is considered to have the best PvZ in Europe atm, can't rely on cookie cutter ram-roaches-into-toss-ball style that works against most
On May 01 2011 13:09 aurum510 wrote: Anyone who is saying "machine shouldn't have tried to bust through the choke!"
1) The whole map is a choke. 2) He was about to run out of bases on the map that he could mine from, while HasuObs was comfortably mining.
it was a bad engagement at THAT choke... his Broods were alone and undefended and Hasuobs was moving towards them to take them out. The toss army was sitting at the top of that ramp and machine runs his roaches over to "defend" his broods but just barrels into a fortified toss army and on that ramp he cant micro out of storms...
so yeah.. the fact that the entire map is full of chokes is moot... it was a dumb engagement, you cant argue that.
Out of curiosity, besides what iNcontrol said, what are the weaknesses to opening Spanishiwa style? It seems pretty good in theory (be immune to early pressure, have good income).
On May 01 2011 13:09 will.pity wrote: really nice reaction timings to those baneling drops GG
lol he lost over 50 workers to banes.
How many drops did you count? atleast 8 or so? He lost more money in banelings than hasu lost in probes. And on 4 bases, it really didn't take that much effort for hasu to keep up probe production and keep his bases saturated. The bling drops were good at first, but they became horribly inefficient as the game went on. Hasu was just reacting too quickly to the majority of them.
On May 01 2011 13:09 aurum510 wrote: Anyone who is saying "machine shouldn't have tried to bust through the choke!"
1) The whole map is a choke. 2) He was about to run out of bases on the map that he could mine from, while HasuObs was comfortably mining.
Haso has no air and a lack of funds, chokes are the only thing going for him. Broodlords outrange everything he has, with a few infestors he can just shell away from safe distance of the winding paths and force Hasu away to chokes further back or just engage him. Either way, there are always moments of opportunity to exploit when one side has to back away
Don't be blind. Machine had about as good of a unit position he could hope for. Broodlords shell army from a distance -> blink stalkers blinked to fight the broodlords -> which was where the roaches were, so pretty much all the roaches were fighting.
The positioning of the battle wasn't a mistake by machine. What was a fault was army comp. At the end, machine had a stockpile of gas, and he could have afforded to get good infestor numbers. High infestor numbers also happens to be very useful to stop large numbers of blink stalkers from blinking underneath your broodlords. He should have waited a bit, get like a dozen infestors, and then pushed, and it would have been much more powerful.
On May 01 2011 13:15 Aequos wrote: Out of curiosity, besides what iNcontrol said, what are the weaknesses to opening Spanishiwa style? It seems pretty good in theory (be immune to early pressure, have good income).
On May 01 2011 13:15 Aequos wrote: Out of curiosity, besides what iNcontrol said, what are the weaknesses to opening Spanishiwa style? It seems pretty good in theory (be immune to early pressure, have good income).
On May 01 2011 13:15 Aequos wrote: Out of curiosity, besides what iNcontrol said, what are the weaknesses to opening Spanishiwa style? It seems pretty good in theory (be immune to early pressure, have good income).
blink stalker hard counters it, also what you do is contain them to 2 base and expand yourself, they cant push until the infesters come and 2 base infester will not give you a large army
On May 01 2011 13:15 Aequos wrote: Out of curiosity, besides what iNcontrol said, what are the weaknesses to opening Spanishiwa style? It seems pretty good in theory (be immune to early pressure, have good income).
It gets trounced by a fast expo though, you have no ability to put pressure on at all, and have no real ability to defend a fast third against 2 base timings or an opponent who is able to defend your mid-game pressure. It easily falls behind on econ mid-game. It's a good mid-game plan and style, and a great end-game style, but it's not a good opening build in my humble opinion.
On May 01 2011 13:09 will.pity wrote: really nice reaction timings to those baneling drops GG
lol he lost over 50 workers to banes.
He also sniped, overlords full of banes with his stalkers and lost 0 stalkers. He also pulled all his workers MULTIPLE times and saved ALL of them. When massive dropped ALL game long MANY MANY times. I think he did pretty well
The New York Knicks didn't let Shaq hit any 3 pointers. So good!
On May 01 2011 13:15 Aequos wrote: Out of curiosity, besides what iNcontrol said, what are the weaknesses to opening Spanishiwa style? It seems pretty good in theory (be immune to early pressure, have good income).
Being greedy. Zerg has almost no way to pressure the protoss, you can cut corners like a mofo.
On May 01 2011 13:09 aurum510 wrote: Anyone who is saying "machine shouldn't have tried to bust through the choke!"
1) The whole map is a choke. 2) He was about to run out of bases on the map that he could mine from, while HasuObs was comfortably mining.
Haso has no air and a lack of funds, chokes are the only thing going for him. Broodlords outrange everything he has, with a few infestors he can just shell away from safe distance of the winding paths and force Hasu away to chokes further back or just engage him. Either way, there are always moments of opportunity to exploit when one side has to back away
Don't be blind. Machine had about as good of a unit position he could hope for. Broodlords shell army from a distance -> blink stalkers blinked to fight the broodlords -> which was where the roaches were, so pretty much all the roaches were fighting.
The positioning of the battle wasn't a mistake by machine. What was a fault was army comp. At the end, machine had a stockpile of gas, and he could have afforded to get good infestor numbers. High infestor numbers also happens to be very useful to stop large numbers of blink stalkers from blinking underneath your broodlords. He should have waited a bit, get like a dozen infestors, and then pushed, and it would have been much more powerful.
His Broodlords were in range of Storm though. Machine could have easily use a Nydus or an overlord drop to get Hasu out of position. Def agree with the lack of Infestors, with such tight chokes he can turn the entire map against Hasu with 8-9+ Infestors
On May 01 2011 13:09 aurum510 wrote: Anyone who is saying "machine shouldn't have tried to bust through the choke!"
1) The whole map is a choke. 2) He was about to run out of bases on the map that he could mine from, while HasuObs was comfortably mining.
Haso has no air and a lack of funds, chokes are the only thing going for him. Broodlords outrange everything he has, with a few infestors he can just shell away from safe distance of the winding paths and force Hasu away to chokes further back or just engage him. Either way, there are always moments of opportunity to exploit when one side has to back away
Don't be blind. Machine had about as good of a unit position he could hope for. Broodlords shell army from a distance -> blink stalkers blinked to fight the broodlords -> which was where the roaches were, so pretty much all the roaches were fighting.
The positioning of the battle wasn't a mistake by machine. What was a fault was army comp. At the end, machine had a stockpile of gas, and he could have afforded to get good infestor numbers. High infestor numbers also happens to be very useful to stop large numbers of blink stalkers from blinking underneath your broodlords. He should have waited a bit, get like a dozen infestors, and then pushed, and it would have been much more powerful.
His Broodlords were in range of Storm though. Machine could have easily use a Nydus or an overlord drop to get Hasu out of position. Def agree with the lack of Infestors, with such tight chokes he can turn the entire map against Hasu with 8-9+ Infestors
Hasuobs had a bunch of high templar, and used feedback occasionally against overseers etc. I think machine felt infestors would be useless for that reason.
On May 01 2011 13:09 aurum510 wrote: Anyone who is saying "machine shouldn't have tried to bust through the choke!"
1) The whole map is a choke. 2) He was about to run out of bases on the map that he could mine from, while HasuObs was comfortably mining.
Haso has no air and a lack of funds, chokes are the only thing going for him. Broodlords outrange everything he has, with a few infestors he can just shell away from safe distance of the winding paths and force Hasu away to chokes further back or just engage him. Either way, there are always moments of opportunity to exploit when one side has to back away
Don't be blind. Machine had about as good of a unit position he could hope for. Broodlords shell army from a distance -> blink stalkers blinked to fight the broodlords -> which was where the roaches were, so pretty much all the roaches were fighting.
The positioning of the battle wasn't a mistake by machine. What was a fault was army comp. At the end, machine had a stockpile of gas, and he could have afforded to get good infestor numbers. High infestor numbers also happens to be very useful to stop large numbers of blink stalkers from blinking underneath your broodlords. He should have waited a bit, get like a dozen infestors, and then pushed, and it would have been much more powerful.
His Broodlords were in range of Storm though. Machine could have easily use a Nydus or an overlord drop to get Hasu out of position. Def agree with the lack of Infestors, with such tight chokes he can turn the entire map against Hasu with 8-9+ Infestors
With 8-9 infestors, he would of only had 5 brood lords and few banes. Gas restriction~
really bad fight/control by machine imo in that first engagement. Spanishiwa style is forgiving if you are cost inefficient but you cant miss all the sentries with banelings... That was alot of losses
On May 01 2011 13:21 will.pity wrote: really bad fight/control by machine imo in that first engagement. Spanishiwa style is forgiving if you are cost inefficient but you cant miss all the sentries with banelings... That was alot of losses
He did burn a lot of sentry energy though, which is pretty good for the next time he engages.
On May 01 2011 13:09 aurum510 wrote: Anyone who is saying "machine shouldn't have tried to bust through the choke!"
1) The whole map is a choke. 2) He was about to run out of bases on the map that he could mine from, while HasuObs was comfortably mining.
Haso has no air and a lack of funds, chokes are the only thing going for him. Broodlords outrange everything he has, with a few infestors he can just shell away from safe distance of the winding paths and force Hasu away to chokes further back or just engage him. Either way, there are always moments of opportunity to exploit when one side has to back away
Don't be blind. Machine had about as good of a unit position he could hope for. Broodlords shell army from a distance -> blink stalkers blinked to fight the broodlords -> which was where the roaches were, so pretty much all the roaches were fighting.
The positioning of the battle wasn't a mistake by machine. What was a fault was army comp. At the end, machine had a stockpile of gas, and he could have afforded to get good infestor numbers. High infestor numbers also happens to be very useful to stop large numbers of blink stalkers from blinking underneath your broodlords. He should have waited a bit, get like a dozen infestors, and then pushed, and it would have been much more powerful.
His Broodlords were in range of Storm though. Machine could have easily use a Nydus or an overlord drop to get Hasu out of position. Def agree with the lack of Infestors, with such tight chokes he can turn the entire map against Hasu with 8-9+ Infestors
With 8-9 infestors, he would of only had 5 brood lords and few banes. Gas restriction~
That wasn't really the issue, he had all the time in the world, Hasuobs was waiting for Machine. The main problem was all those useless roaches, they simply don't have the range needed to do anything in a choke.
On May 01 2011 13:09 aurum510 wrote: Anyone who is saying "machine shouldn't have tried to bust through the choke!"
1) The whole map is a choke. 2) He was about to run out of bases on the map that he could mine from, while HasuObs was comfortably mining.
Haso has no air and a lack of funds, chokes are the only thing going for him. Broodlords outrange everything he has, with a few infestors he can just shell away from safe distance of the winding paths and force Hasu away to chokes further back or just engage him. Either way, there are always moments of opportunity to exploit when one side has to back away
Don't be blind. Machine had about as good of a unit position he could hope for. Broodlords shell army from a distance -> blink stalkers blinked to fight the broodlords -> which was where the roaches were, so pretty much all the roaches were fighting.
The positioning of the battle wasn't a mistake by machine. What was a fault was army comp. At the end, machine had a stockpile of gas, and he could have afforded to get good infestor numbers. High infestor numbers also happens to be very useful to stop large numbers of blink stalkers from blinking underneath your broodlords. He should have waited a bit, get like a dozen infestors, and then pushed, and it would have been much more powerful.
His Broodlords were in range of Storm though. Machine could have easily use a Nydus or an overlord drop to get Hasu out of position. Def agree with the lack of Infestors, with such tight chokes he can turn the entire map against Hasu with 8-9+ Infestors
With 8-9 infestors, he would of only had 5 brood lords and few banes. Gas restriction~
He was floating like 2k gas at the end of the game. Machine may have had 99 problems, but gas wasn't one
Hasuobs had a bunch of high templar, and used feedback occasionally against overseers etc. I think machine felt infestors would be useless for that reason.
That is where the map works against Hasu, with such tight and narrow path ways, how do you get Templars close enough to feedback Infestors?
A drinking game based on Gretorp saying "el oh el" would have been pretty devastating during tonight's broadcast; plus, you'd have missed out on some fairly interesting games.
On May 01 2011 13:10 motbob wrote: That map is pretty terrible for a zerg who wants to force a decisive engagement.
I really don't get why tournaments like it so much, it seems like a terribly imbalanced map for Protoss due to their cliffwalking mechanics (blink and Colossi) and their ability to make a choke much better.
I remember when the map was first introduced for tournaments/ladder it was universally praised on the sole basis of it being a BW map port. The cramped nature was already there. Just an amusing fact, no point to make here.
I don't like the choice for brood lords with that many blink stalkers out and high templars to feedback infestors, I think ultralisks would be a better call.
Bunch of nydus worms + infestor/ultra is basically impossible to use.
Machine looks like he hasn't practiced much with this build at all. He may be a better player than Spanishwa, but Spanishwa definitely executes this x10 better
I feel like Machine got a good strategy, but his execution is not so good. Baneling drop is an excellence idea but I feel like if the probe moves away, he could just burrow the baneling and delay that mining for a long time until some unit comes and clean it up.
I love Machine, but his play did not do that build justice. The 8+ queen creep spread and mass transfuse of the brood lords is what makes that build so effective. The macro hatch and every other hatch should be massing queens T_T
On May 01 2011 13:22 DiaBoLuS wrote: HasuObs fight management is simply nothing but perfect...
this style is SO hard to beat, but he does somehow oO
actually you crush it pretty easily by turtling up and just watching the minimap for drops.
ye, its great to sit on 3 base and try to defend it half as perfect as hasu does, while the Zerg goes up to 5 base and trades armys in battles with baneling drops into your ball...
rly, machine played the most effective style vs protoss imaginable, i have absolutly no idea how hasu did it
On May 01 2011 13:28 emesen wrote: machine would have been better off dropping zerglings instead of banelings with hasuobs' immediate reaction to the OLs
Zerglings get cleaned up too easily. You want to drop banelings regardless, but not when HasuObs is sitting with his army and scanning the mini map. Like any drop you have to distract the player's attention elsewhere before doing it or it will fail.
On May 01 2011 13:22 DiaBoLuS wrote: HasuObs fight management is simply nothing but perfect...
this style is SO hard to beat, but he does somehow oO
actually you crush it pretty easily by turtling up and just watching the minimap for drops.
ye, its great to sit on 3 base and try to defend it half as perfect as hasu does, while the Zerg goes up to 5 base and trades armys in battles with baneling drops into your ball...
rly, machine played the most effective style vs protoss imaginable, i have absolutly no idea how hasu did it
No he didn't, he had a bunch of tools he didn't make use of that could have torn shreds into Hasuobs. Machine played quite well, but he didn't play amazing or anything like that, and it's not the most effective style imaginable. I think Spanishiwa's mid-game style of nydus worms everywhere and attacks in 8 different locations across the map right after another after another is a lot stronger than trying to break the protoss ball in a straight up fight, even with baneling drops.
On May 01 2011 13:22 DiaBoLuS wrote: HasuObs fight management is simply nothing but perfect...
this style is SO hard to beat, but he does somehow oO
actually you crush it pretty easily by turtling up and just watching the minimap for drops.
ye, its great to sit on 3 base and try to defend it half as perfect as hasu does, while the Zerg goes up to 5 base and trades armys in battles with baneling drops into your ball...
rly, machine played the most effective style vs protoss imaginable, i have absolutly no idea how hasu did it
Bane roach corruptor does not "trade armies" with protoss, unless the protoss micros badly and lets overlords directly over their stalkers. 2 cannons in each mineral line was all Hasu needed to deter the bane drops after the first 1-2 times, and protoss can eventually take a 4th and be in a good position like Hasu.
Ofc it works, but it is not the "best zvp build that exists"
On May 01 2011 13:22 DiaBoLuS wrote: HasuObs fight management is simply nothing but perfect...
this style is SO hard to beat, but he does somehow oO
actually you crush it pretty easily by turtling up and just watching the minimap for drops.
ye, its great to sit on 3 base and try to defend it half as perfect as hasu does, while the Zerg goes up to 5 base and trades armys in battles with baneling drops into your ball...
rly, machine played the most effective style vs protoss imaginable, i have absolutly no idea how hasu did it
Yeah this -___-
You turtle against that style, but not by choice, you cannot just walk out and do anything, Zerg has the entire map under his control.
It is much MUCH harder playing against this style than it seems, Hasu just makes it seem easy, Sen makes every other Toss look like a scrub when he does it on his stream.
It is a different style from the regular, you need practice, Machine didn't seem to be executing it quite as well.
Ugh I was ranked 97th in the liquibet until Hasu vs. Machine, I voted for Machine Anyway PvZ always entertaining. Looking forward to this great PvP! Let's see if MC is still the king of this matchup.
On May 01 2011 13:22 DiaBoLuS wrote: HasuObs fight management is simply nothing but perfect...
this style is SO hard to beat, but he does somehow oO
actually you crush it pretty easily by turtling up and just watching the minimap for drops.
ye, its great to sit on 3 base and try to defend it half as perfect as hasu does, while the Zerg goes up to 5 base and trades armys in battles with baneling drops into your ball...
rly, machine played the most effective style vs protoss imaginable, i have absolutly no idea how hasu did it
you just squash the drops then push out while zerg tries to re supply and pick off expansions. With stalkers being faster than ovies you can always pick them off if you're paying attention.
On May 01 2011 13:28 emesen wrote: machine would have been better off dropping zerglings instead of banelings with hasuobs' immediate reaction to the OLs
Zerglings get cleaned up too easily. You want to drop banelings regardless, but not when HasuObs is sitting with his army and scanning the mini map. Like any drop you have to distract the player's attention elsewhere before doing it or it will fail.
yes banelings are better to drop.. when they can blow up a mineral line.. but with hasuobs immediately pulling away his probles plus warping in a couple of stalkers they were completely ineffective
yeah zerglings get cleaned up easier.. but they are far and away cheaper than banelings and would have been able to pick off a few workers
On May 01 2011 13:28 emesen wrote: machine would have been better off dropping zerglings instead of banelings with hasuobs' immediate reaction to the OLs
Zerglings get cleaned up too easily. You want to drop banelings regardless, but not when HasuObs is sitting with his army and scanning the mini map. Like any drop you have to distract the player's attention elsewhere before doing it or it will fail.
yes banelings are better to drop.. when they can blow up a mineral line.. but with hasuobs immediately pulling away his probles plus warping in a couple of stalkers they were completely ineffective
yeah zerglings get cleaned up easier.. but they are far and away cheaper than banelings and would have been able to pick off a few workers
Would have been awesome if he'd done infestor drops to fungal the probes, or burrowed the banelings to block mining for a while until an observer came over.
Warcraft 3 players seem to really get protoss. I guess it is such a micro intensive race that it sort of makes sense. But some of the best protoss players are former wc3 players (Naniwa, hasuobs, kiwikaki etc.).
On May 01 2011 13:31 Monzterg wrote: Gretorp seems like a really kind and heartly person so without beeing personal:
Gretorp, you just have to go - this doesnt work....
Got to disagree. I think Gretorp has improved incredibly since the first day of NASL and has made me lol many times tonight. The chemistry between these 2 has also improved greatly and I can only see it getting better from here
well, i pretty much like how Zergs realize the only way to crush toss is to let him dance...
may it be constant roachpressure on several different locations, muta techswiches or baneling drops. So hard to play against, pretty much balances the matchup imo
On May 01 2011 13:22 DiaBoLuS wrote: HasuObs fight management is simply nothing but perfect...
this style is SO hard to beat, but he does somehow oO
actually you crush it pretty easily by turtling up and just watching the minimap for drops.
ye, its great to sit on 3 base and try to defend it half as perfect as hasu does, while the Zerg goes up to 5 base and trades armys in battles with baneling drops into your ball...
rly, machine played the most effective style vs protoss imaginable, i have absolutly no idea how hasu did it
you just squash the drops then push out while zerg tries to re supply and pick off expansions. With stalkers being faster than ovies you can always pick them off if you're paying attention.
On May 01 2011 13:22 DiaBoLuS wrote: HasuObs fight management is simply nothing but perfect...
this style is SO hard to beat, but he does somehow oO
actually you crush it pretty easily by turtling up and just watching the minimap for drops.
ye, its great to sit on 3 base and try to defend it half as perfect as hasu does, while the Zerg goes up to 5 base and trades armys in battles with baneling drops into your ball...
rly, machine played the most effective style vs protoss imaginable, i have absolutly no idea how hasu did it
you just squash the drops then push out while zerg tries to re supply and pick off expansions. With stalkers being faster than ovies you can always pick them off if you're paying attention.
The initial cheese were pretty horribly executed by Ace, but the follow up and the defense of his proxy gateways were beautiful. Deserved that win, and MC deserved to lose for not scouting.
Nice initlal defense from MC, but he thought it was more all in than it was, and so not only did he build ANOTHER cannon, he built a gateway as well, not making probes, and no gas. Meanwhile Ace just chrono'd out probes.
Also, I'm super excited to see NASL now. Casting amazing, games good, players awesome. NASL is getter better each day production wise as well. They truly deserve, and deserve even more, the 10000 people who tune in every day to watch them.
If you guys want to talk about how you feel WC3 players are/are not dominating the scene, and whether we shall see dominance arise from one of them, then make a thread about it. Don't clutter it up in here.
On May 01 2011 13:53 Pandain wrote: If you guys want to talk about how you feel WC3 players are/are not dominating the scene, and whether we shall see dominance arise from one of them, then make a thread about it. Don't clutter it up in here.
Chances of such a thread being closed = ? (Your guess is as good as mine)
On May 01 2011 14:03 Deathmanbob wrote: MC , whats going on 0-3.... you have to win EVERY game now to come back
He would have to win every game and pray that somehow he would have the top 2 record in his group, which is just as unlikely given that Ace and Select are 3-0 right now...
On May 01 2011 14:04 SayHello wrote: Imo MC is just dropping these games intentionally. Last week crazy builds vs Ret. Now this...
You're kidding, right? He played his best, and he lost.
On May 01 2011 14:03 Deathmanbob wrote: MC , whats going on 0-3.... you have to win EVERY game now to come back
It's actually possible that he can't at this point, if two people in his group go 7-2, which is possible, he can't make a comeback, especially given how well SeleCT and Ace are playing.
On May 01 2011 14:04 SayHello wrote: Imo MC is just dropping these games intentionally. Last week crazy builds vs Ret. Now this...
Ya I also wouldn't want 50,000... especially if I were a player very capable of winning it... as well as after saying I want to win 1 million dollars in my career (I forgot what amount he said he was going after). In fact I wouldn't even know why I signed up for the league at all... I guess I would just want to get in to prove I am capable of getting in, and then I would just make sure I don't get to the finals.
On May 01 2011 14:04 SayHello wrote: Imo MC is just dropping these games intentionally. Last week crazy builds vs Ret. Now this...
Oy, you. I don't think you know how things work around here... NEVER accuse players of dropping games. On a side note, what a amazing micro battle between both Mc and Ace, but the upgrades and mind games for Ace won him the battles.
On May 01 2011 14:05 Rarak wrote: MC whats happening man?
he didnt play badly, but seems to have lost a step. Maybe it is as he says and hasnt had time to practice much lately with all the travel etc.
I think he needs to focus on upgrades a bit more in longer games perhaps...
He just failed to scout the 2nd base on time, thought Ace was on one base still, and was worried about a one base play. That means you don't get upgrades, while Ace was banking on the risk of his hidden base and blink play to keep MC contained, and got upgrades while MC was building up.
On May 01 2011 14:05 Rarak wrote: MC whats happening man?
he didnt play badly, but seems to have lost a step. Maybe it is as he says and hasnt had time to practice much lately with all the travel etc.
I think he needs to focus on upgrades a bit more in longer games perhaps...
I think people are realizing weaknesses in his play, upgrades being one of them. While he was dominating, he wasn't perfect. People are just starting to catch up imo. He get going again though, he is a great player.
On May 01 2011 14:03 Deathmanbob wrote: MC , whats going on 0-3.... you have to win EVERY game now to come back
He would have to win every game and pray that somehow he would have the top 2 record in his group, which is just as unlikely given that Ace and Select are 3-0 right now...
Well done Ace, I wouldn't be surprised if he finished his group x-0 now. Very nice games. But still ways to go.
MC can't really hope to qualify directly now. Even if he wins all matches it just might not be enough. But oh well, I doubt that MC will compketly bum out, so he still has more than a chance.
Ace used the fact that Mc only probed far enough with his observers to take advantage of that fact. Ace played passive-aggressively, where he poked in enough to startle Mc, and made Mc look exactly in the direction he wanted to, while distracting Mc long enough from the big picture. By the time Mc realized, he had fallen too far behind in upgrades.
On May 01 2011 14:03 RPR_Tempest wrote: How come Ace is so good at Foreign tournaments (IEM, NASL) but fails so hard at GSL?
Because of the players maybe?
The most likely explanation is because the game is too volatile as of now.. any top player can have a winning/losing streak nowadays.. i.e., winning a GSL or two means a little bit more than a few more percentage points in your chances against other top players. I really have no idea why people overreact when a player loses or wins.. when ret or heypro lost their last three or four games in a row, they are calling for their retirement... lol, it's not like these guys are fighting physically you know..
On May 01 2011 14:09 Azarkon wrote: Ace took some big risks those games, while MC played safe and did not punish him for it.
First game: proxy 2 gate, no more need be said.
Second game: hidden nexus, not keeping up with unit production in order to get upgrades and probes
MC had the bigger army the second game but never attacked. He looked like he was expecting an attack from Ace.
He made the wrong read and never poked enough to correct himself.
Risks aren't the same in PvP as they are in other matches, they are a lot less straight forwards. You can take HUGE risks and be confident that the other player won't punish you for them. Risks are played through mind games and what the other player expects. You can't have observers running around the map, in PvP that 75 gas is a BIG deal, far away expansions when the enemy has Blink Stalkers are hard to punish
I thought MC played well regardless of losing. That first build from Ace was really refined and you could tell he knew what to do even if it didn't win him the game outright. Also saw him use the same build in ST inhouse and came out with the win even though it was scouted.
Second game MC micro'd and tech'd well, but not knowing about the expo from Ace really cost him the game. If he had attacked while he was still on 1 base and they were tied on upgrades no doubt he'd have won.
Sigh. It makes me sad that people take huge risks against MC while he tries to play safe and standard, and it makes haters say that MC is overrated. Oh well, well-played by Ace.
On May 01 2011 14:20 Heavenly wrote: Sigh. It makes me sad that people take huge risks against MC while he tries to play safe and standard, and it makes haters say that MC is overrated. Oh well, well-played by Ace.
That's the way it always works. A better player thinks "I'm much better than this guy, so I'll play safe" while the worse player says "hey i can't beat this guy straight up, I have to try to get some early advantage". In a game, that undeveloped like starcraft 2, it happens frequently that the worse guy beats the better guy, as for some builds, you just don't have safe counters, so you gonna lose if you recognize it too late. In BW nowadays it's far less possible to lose against a very weak player, as you have safe builds
On May 01 2011 14:05 dtz wrote: ACE is on the road to dominate the foreign scene. First Europe, then Australia, Soon America.
Fear not! IdrA will take a home stand!
Ace beat Idra 2-0 in IEM if I'm not mistaken
That was squirtle
No he's right. Ace beat Idra 2-0 in the group stages of IEM. Squirtle of course beat Idra 3-2 in the quarterfinals.
The series was close games, and zerg got buffed since with infestors
If it was 70:30 for ace before, it's maybe 50:50 or 55:45 now xd
More importantly IdrA got 50x better at ZvP. Just take a look at his last few ZvPs. He has been owning it up lately. He manhandled kiwikaki in the IPL.
On May 01 2011 14:28 namedplayer wrote: mc is not the best animoa!
Then who is and why is he not? From losing to double proxy gate which was beautifully held off for much longer than almost anyone else could do in that circumstance? For losing to a risky hidden expansion that would've died to aggressive one base play at a large timing MC had? Losing to Ret after doing silly builds? Losing 3-2 to Thorzain while focused on tons of other series while Thorzain specifically set out to snipe him in his best matchup and MC's worst?
Someone winning 2 or 3 games in a best of series happens all the time. There are tons of builds that someone like MC won't have seen before, and heavily risky play wins all the time against better players. Flash and Jaedong don't win 100% of the time, is MC supposed to win 100% of the time in a game that hasn't been figured out yet?
Yes MC fanboy. Stupid mentality going around that apparently to be the best player in the world you must never lose a single game in something with as many possibilites as SC2. Take into consideration that Ret and Ace can't even make it into Up and Down, where MC has had tons of dominating runs where he's barely dropped any games.
On May 01 2011 14:05 dtz wrote: ACE is on the road to dominate the foreign scene. First Europe, then Australia, Soon America.
Fear not! IdrA will take a home stand!
Ace beat Idra 2-0 in IEM if I'm not mistaken
That was squirtle
No he's right. Ace beat Idra 2-0 in the group stages of IEM. Squirtle of course beat Idra 3-2 in the quarterfinals.
The series was close games, and zerg got buffed since with infestors
If it was 70:30 for ace before, it's maybe 50:50 or 55:45 now xd
More importantly IdrA got 50x better at ZvP. Just take a look at his last few ZvPs. He has been owning it up lately. He manhandled kiwikaki in the IPL.
Pretty interesting series. I'd avoid taking too much away from it, though. MC still has superb micro and (apparently) superb macro. He's not stupid. If the way he's playing doesn't work out for him, he's gonna get motivated to figure something else out. It kind of bothers me that the second anyone drops a few games there's some segment of the community that the player isn't worth shit to anymore.
MC wins Dreamhack and Copenhagen in decisive fashion.
Is no longer world's best player.
The internet can be so fickle. MC is still statistically the best PvPer inside or outside of korea. One Bo3 involving a 2-gate proxy does not change that. Ace played intelligently and deserved the wins, but this series alone has essentially no weight on MC's reign as PvP god.
While it is true that MC has not been dominating everything he touches recently, it is difficult to argue that any other player in the world has been consistently winning as much as MC. One might even go as far as to say he is bi-winning.
MC has won 30,000 USD in the month of April, 3,000 more than the next highest player(MVP). His winnings in march(40,000) surpassed the #2 spot by 25,000.
If MC stops winning when it matters, then perhaps we can say he is no longer dominating the scene. As it stands, MC is comfortably the most successful SC2 player to date. One Bo3 does not change that.
On May 01 2011 14:05 dtz wrote: ACE is on the road to dominate the foreign scene. First Europe, then Australia, Soon America.
Fear not! IdrA will take a home stand!
Ace beat Idra 2-0 in IEM if I'm not mistaken
That was squirtle
No he's right. Ace beat Idra 2-0 in the group stages of IEM. Squirtle of course beat Idra 3-2 in the quarterfinals.
The series was close games, and zerg got buffed since with infestors
If it was 70:30 for ace before, it's maybe 50:50 or 55:45 now xd
More importantly IdrA got 50x better at ZvP. Just take a look at his last few ZvPs. He has been owning it up lately. He manhandled kiwikaki in the IPL.
I don't think this is true at all. One bo3 doesn't prove anything. And more importantly especially when you take a closer look at the games and how Idra won them. In game 1, that was pure starsense. His overlord spotted the chrono boosted citadel (while kiwi was going for a blink fakeout into dts). Kiwi suspiciously did not have a stalker there to deny that scout. Red flag 1. Idra comes back a few seconds later to see that the citadel has stopped being cbed. Still no stalkers. Red flag 2. And then he is super active with all his lings and sees SO little stalkers and gas units that he manages to snipe his nexus. BIG red flag 3. Morphs an overseer at the back of his nat like a champ denies any harass and is in a HUGE lead. He's able to make like 20 drones at that point cause he knows kiwi has no army and has sacced his army for a failed attack. No return on invesment.
Game 2. Kiwi does another risky (considering the current trend) 2 gate expo. Gets a quick stargate. Take note of the VR pathing which will come into play in game 3. At first I thought kiwi was doing such a risky opening because he worked out very specific timings for that all in roach build. But his VR goes straight for Idra's third. Anyways he does some damage with his phoenixes, Idra goes for a drop. BOTCHES his drop and loses a wholleee bunch of hydras and roaches for nothing. He then almost loses 800 minerals (or really 1600) worth of overlords. He drops roaches at the nat and at the main. Draws kiwi's forces back. At this moment if Kiwi defends well then he's in a huge huge lead. But Idra attacks kiwi's third at the same time and kiwi's collosus are also left out in the open. After this great nexus snipe Idra does multiple-prong drops through out the entire game with his roaches. And he specifically targets them with his roaches, keeping the probe count down superrrr low. He rolls him with his army later on.
Problem is, this strategy is actually pretty risky (Especially on a map like shakuras). If Kiwi had defended JUST a little better he would've been in a commanding lead. He didn't make a single cannon at his main or nat min line. That's the key to defending against this type of drop play (Though it stil cuts it close, see cruncher vs mondi on shakuras). But yeah, if you don't inflictbig dmaage as a zerg, you lose. Picking off probes is way harder than it looks. If kiwi had a cannon there that would've bought him more time, ran his probes away, Idra wouldn't have picked anything off but a cannon (Then he would've loaded his stuff back ran away and attacked his third at the same time). I think Kiwi will be WAY more prepared next time, if they face off again in the IPL.
Game 3: Well yeah...Again if you look at the pathing of the VR it was hunting for a third base and NOT for some sort of early bling or roach cheese which would've been a safe, defensive opening.
So nooo. I don't think Idra is 50x better at zvp now than he was, what, two weeks ago lol. All I see is he's been all inning more (2 base hydras, roach cheese, etc.) and being more aggressive. He's pretty much been trying anything and everything even when he ladders on his stream. But I don't think he's really found a "solid" strategy yet.
On May 01 2011 15:10 Duoma wrote: MC wins Dreamhack and Copenhagen in decisive fashion.
Is no longer world's best player.
The internet can be so fickle. MC is still statistically the best PvPer inside or outside of korea. One Bo3 involving a 2-gate proxy does not change that. Ace played intelligently and deserved the wins, but this series alone has essentially no weight on MC's reign as PvP god.
While it is true that MC has not been dominating everything he touches recently, it is difficult to argue that any other player in the world has been consistently winning as much as MC. One might even go as far as to say he is bi-winning.
MC has won 30,000 USD in the month of April, 3,000 more than the next highest player(MVP). His winnings in march(40,000) surpassed the #2 spot by 25,000.
If MC stops winning when it matters, then perhaps we can say he is no longer dominating the scene. As it stands, MC is comfortably the most successful SC2 player to date. One Bo3 does not change that.
it's not because MC isn't winning every game that he's no longer considered the best player, more so that everyone else is playing much better
MVP hasn't dropped a BoX since entering the WCs and did really well in the GSTL, and Nestea might even WIN code S this season making him another 2 time champion
also, it's not fair to compare winnings when one player has entered a lot more tournaments than the other
Poor MC. It feels like PvP is turning against him lately. I think he still def. has it, but others are catching up faster than he (and some of the other champions of SC2) can improve. I hope the guys that are 0-for will play doubly hard and make this thing interesting midway through the season.
Maybe... just MAYBE... MC is just really good but he can still lose?
It's probably the same people that call players 'ZOMG BEST IN THE WORLD' when doing well, that call them not the best player in the world after losing.
Since Gretorp and Incontrol asked for feedback on the background:
It looks bad, you can see outlines around your heads :D My suggestion would be just make something interesting going on behind you, in the studio itself. Just look how this is done in television shows, it's pretty tricky to do it right.
I can't be the only one with this problem; the statistics page on the Nasl main website doesn't actually work at all. The player search is broken and clicking on the race stats does nothing at all. Just trying to make sure they know there is a problem.
I LOVE how BratOk surrounds his scvs with like 50 supply depots, even if zerglings did get in there he could just raise the depots and they would maybe pick off two depots, negating much of the possible damage.
I don't think the word 'slump' is understood by a lot of people around here.
MC losing a tournament, or losing a few matches in a tournament does not mean a slump. Especially when he's winning tournaments mere days after losing said games.
Back and forth game, unusual strategy from Catz, a game WITH catz, expansions dying left and right, Catz relocating and building a whole new 4 bases after losing his original 4, beautiful fungals.
On May 02 2011 02:58 Pandain wrote: How is this game not recommended?
Back and forth game, unusual strategy from Catz, a game WITH catz, expansions dying left and right, Catz relocating and building a whole new 4 bases after losing his original 4, beautiful fungals.
On May 02 2011 02:58 Pandain wrote: How is this game not recommended?
Back and forth game, unusual strategy from Catz, a game WITH catz, expansions dying left and right, Catz relocating and building a whole new 4 bases after losing his original 4, beautiful fungals.
It might just be me and I know Im nit picking, but are the black lines round incontrol and gretorp because of the superimposed background pissing anyone else off? I know its a small thing but I just cant get over it, they should have done it properly or just put a board with NASL on behind the casters.
That's the disadvantage of that effect yeah i don't like it either. It would make sense if they do something with the background but all i've seen so far is a static background image.
Finally the big battlecruiser tech switch, thats what ive been shouting for the last 4 mins. This is why TvT is imo the bast mirror by far, such an epic close game!
On May 02 2011 04:21 rysecake wrote: I love how Mc loses 2 games then people start saying "Mc in a slump". God sc2 fans(that never followed sc1) are morons...
Nice generalization you got there. Maybe sc2 fans thinking there are special because they followed sc1 are morons...
On May 02 2011 04:21 rysecake wrote: I love how Mc loses 2 games then people start saying "Mc in a slump". God sc2 fans(that never followed sc1) are morons...
Here's a lesson in statistics, you can't win everything.
If Bisu wins one game against anyone good (or a terran) he's suddenly back and rerevolutionizing a matchup.
I really feel like Gretorps casting has improved alot throughout the course of NASL and him and incontrol are getting better and better.
Although what i dont like about Gretorp is when something bad is about to happen he just squeals and squeals like 'uh oh uh oh uh oh' instead of like describe the situation in a dramatic voice for eg. 'And OMG if the banshees DONT WATCH OUT it WILL get Vaporized by those marines'
HasuObs is a thoughtful player. His Micro is great, but I believe his decisionmaking is his strongest point. I just love the walloff at the ramp and the beautiful buildingplacement. You can practically see how much thought he brought into this.
On May 02 2011 04:21 rysecake wrote: I love how Mc loses 2 games then people start saying "Mc in a slump". God sc2 fans(that never followed sc1) are morons...
Here's a lesson in statistics, you can't win everything.
lol. have you seen the perennial "jaedong is in a slump" or " guess who's hot? bisu's not" thread. Fickleness is all around.
and yummm gosu micro by hasu. Such fast and precise control.
loving the backdrop with the horses and the soothing music. nice touch.
in all seriousness though I think the NASL has come a long way in the few weeks you have been on and it keeps on getting better and better. huge props to you guys.
Keep up the good works guys you have been steadily improving as casters and the show in general and i love the new background its awesome. Good stuff guys
EPT
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/motbob/NASL_Banner.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/LpeHT.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1166.jpg)
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![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1636.jpg)
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BRAT_OK < Crossfire SE > ![[image loading]](/images/flags2/pe.png)
CatZ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/980.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1221.jpg)
![[image loading]](/images/flags2/nl.png)
![[image loading]](/images/flags2/de.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1825.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1346.jpg)
![[image loading]](/images/flags2/ks.png)
![[image loading]](/images/flags2/ca.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1587.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1131.jpg)
HasuObs < Crossfire SE > ![[image loading]](/images/flags2/us.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/640.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/100.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/jojobob89/Capture-4.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Si331.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/p0JFS.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/DjGch.png)
![[image loading]](http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/4206/ret.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.apaixonadosporseries.com.br/wp-content/arquivos/2010/08/sheldon-cooper.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/thumb/9/98/HasuObs.jpg/399px-HasuObs.jpg)
