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[NASL] Day 1-5 - Page 88
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Yesterday's broadcast has had its issues. We all saw it. There are 10+ pages of whining. There is an entirely new cast going on now. Please keep whining about issues experienced yesterday to yourself going forward in the thread and allow other people to enjoy the games. | ||
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CCa1ss1e
Canada3231 Posts
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Polygamy
Austria1114 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:39 Reborn8u wrote: Is Gretorp extremely tired? He looks like he's having trouble keeping his eyes open and they are bloodshot. I was kind of thinking he might be high? | ||
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Heaton31
United States323 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Let me just say this: 1. I am WAY against the humor displayed in that show during the intermission. I will speak on behalf of it being removed from future broadcasts. 2. This was a mistake. It's really really bad. I know the NASL is upset about it and will fix it. There is no way to go back in time.. but please know we are sorry. 3. Maps were updated. There is no legitimate argument for using the outdated maps. That too was a mistake overlooked by not consulting the pro players of the squad (me and gretorp). It has been rectified. Some inside info: The NASL isn't a bustling studio of 30 people. It's 5 production people and 2 commentators. We are hiring out professional help for the sound (after the problems) we consult pro's on the stage etc... but we are not some huge broadcasting company. When people say "mistakes like this shouldn't happen.. you need to watch for mistakes!" They do. They do the best they can. A lot of these guys are running off of 4 or less hours a night. Encoding, editing, doing graphics etc.. all each day after this schedule. Do they want your sympathy? No. No they do not. Do they expect better results than what we have produced? MORE THAN YOU KNOW. Nobody is more pissed than Russ and co after each mistake. This is the first week. None of them came from a broadcasting / league background. All of them are chasing a dream and trying to do it to the best of their abilities. When we make mistakes please tell us with all of this in mind. If you STILL feel the need to say "FIRE X" or "THIS IS FUCKING TERRIBLE" then I guess go ahead and do that. I get to wake up in the same house as these people and watch them go at it for another 16 hours each day. It is absolutely unacceptable to make these mistakes and they will not be made continuously. As they happen they get fixed asap. In the end it makes us better. We were never planning on 1 season so we have time to fix these things. Ideally, would they never have happened? OF COURSE. Is it possible to have caught these faster? CERTAINLY. But we didn't and we are sorry. Please understand the sheer effort and work that is going into this. This league is growing and it has growing pains. It also has amateur mistakes and huge errors. All of which will be sorted out as they come up. I'm sure most everyone appreciates the honesty, accountability and full disclosure, but for paying customers, I don't think reading about how the production team has little experience in broadcasting tournaments is a good thing. I think most people are learning some hard lessons from MLG and NASL. Don't pay for a product until you know what the product is. | ||
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Airship
United States465 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Let me just say this: 1. I am WAY against the humor displayed in that show during the intermission. I will speak on behalf of it being removed from future broadcasts. 2. This was a mistake. It's really really bad. I know the NASL is upset about it and will fix it. There is no way to go back in time.. but please know we are sorry. 3. Maps were updated. There is no legitimate argument for using the outdated maps. That too was a mistake overlooked by not consulting the pro players of the squad (me and gretorp). It has been rectified. Some inside info: The NASL isn't a bustling studio of 30 people. It's 5 production people and 2 commentators. We are hiring out professional help for the sound (after the problems) we consult pro's on the stage etc... but we are not some huge broadcasting company. When people say "mistakes like this shouldn't happen.. you need to watch for mistakes!" They do. They do the best they can. A lot of these guys are running off of 4 or less hours a night. Encoding, editing, doing graphics etc.. all each day after this schedule. Do they want your sympathy? No. No they do not. Do they expect better results than what we have produced? MORE THAN YOU KNOW. Nobody is more pissed than Russ and co after each mistake. This is the first week. None of them came from a broadcasting / league background. All of them are chasing a dream and trying to do it to the best of their abilities. When we make mistakes please tell us with all of this in mind. If you STILL feel the need to say "FIRE X" or "THIS IS FUCKING TERRIBLE" then I guess go ahead and do that. I get to wake up in the same house as these people and watch them go at it for another 16 hours each day. It is absolutely unacceptable to make these mistakes and they will not be made continuously. As they happen they get fixed asap. In the end it makes us better. We were never planning on 1 season so we have time to fix these things. Ideally, would they never have happened? OF COURSE. Is it possible to have caught these faster? CERTAINLY. But we didn't and we are sorry. Please understand the sheer effort and work that is going into this. This league is growing and it has growing pains. It also has amateur mistakes and huge errors. All of which will be sorted out as they come up. It's cool that you seem to take all of this personally, I think everybody here knows this is an editing and production folly. The streaming bandwidth issues, 480p justin tv service dropping and all that, well they happen. Vehicle of esports. Using an outdated map, that's a fairly understandable human error. But pre-recording the show a day or so in advance, cutting together the video for broadcast and not watching it in advance.. Someone in the office deserves a serious frowning at. | ||
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Gatsbi
United States1134 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Let me just say this: 1. I am WAY against the humor displayed in that show during the intermission. I will speak on behalf of it being removed from future broadcasts. 2. This was a mistake. It's really really bad. I know the NASL is upset about it and will fix it. There is no way to go back in time.. but please know we are sorry. 3. Maps were updated. There is no legitimate argument for using the outdated maps. That too was a mistake overlooked by not consulting the pro players of the squad (me and gretorp). It has been rectified. Some inside info: The NASL isn't a bustling studio of 30 people. It's 5 production people and 2 commentators. We are hiring out professional help for the sound (after the problems) we consult pro's on the stage etc... but we are not some huge broadcasting company. When people say "mistakes like this shouldn't happen.. you need to watch for mistakes!" They do. They do the best they can. A lot of these guys are running off of 4 or less hours a night. Encoding, editing, doing graphics etc.. all each day after this schedule. Do they want your sympathy? No. No they do not. Do they expect better results than what we have produced? MORE THAN YOU KNOW. Nobody is more pissed than Russ and co after each mistake. This is the first week. None of them came from a broadcasting / league background. All of them are chasing a dream and trying to do it to the best of their abilities. When we make mistakes please tell us with all of this in mind. If you STILL feel the need to say "FIRE X" or "THIS IS FUCKING TERRIBLE" then I guess go ahead and do that. I get to wake up in the same house as these people and watch them go at it for another 16 hours each day. It is absolutely unacceptable to make these mistakes and they will not be made continuously. As they happen they get fixed asap. In the end it makes us better. We were never planning on 1 season so we have time to fix these things. Ideally, would they never have happened? OF COURSE. Is it possible to have caught these faster? CERTAINLY. But we didn't and we are sorry. Please understand the sheer effort and work that is going into this. This league is growing and it has growing pains. It also has amateur mistakes and huge errors. All of which will be sorted out as they come up. So why did you hire 5 production people that have no broadcasting/league background? That doesn't really make a whole lot of sense. Better yet, why is there only FIVE people running a tournament called a STARLEAGUE? You obviously need more people than that. I understand you need to maximize profits, but FIVE people? Come on now. | ||
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Moonwrath
United States9568 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:40 vict1019 wrote: Oh my god why even lie. You tell so many jokes on SOTG that were just as bad and close to racism or worse as the one in the half time show. There is a HUUUUUUUUUUUGE difference between a professional league cast and SOTG. Please use your brain. | ||
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FunkQue
United States165 Posts
Overall, I find the NASL to be enjoyable, but maybe they jumped the gun. | ||
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GreYMisT
United States6736 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Let me just say this: 1. I am WAY against the humor displayed in that show during the intermission. I will speak on behalf of it being removed from future broadcasts. 2. This was a mistake. It's really really bad. I know the NASL is upset about it and will fix it. There is no way to go back in time.. but please know we are sorry. 3. Maps were updated. There is no legitimate argument for using the outdated maps. That too was a mistake overlooked by not consulting the pro players of the squad (me and gretorp). It has been rectified. Some inside info: The NASL isn't a bustling studio of 30 people. It's 5 production people and 2 commentators. We are hiring out professional help for the sound (after the problems) we consult pro's on the stage etc... but we are not some huge broadcasting company. When people say "mistakes like this shouldn't happen.. you need to watch for mistakes!" They do. They do the best they can. A lot of these guys are running off of 4 or less hours a night. Encoding, editing, doing graphics etc.. all each day after this schedule. Do they want your sympathy? No. No they do not. Do they expect better results than what we have produced? MORE THAN YOU KNOW. Nobody is more pissed than Russ and co after each mistake. This is the first week. None of them came from a broadcasting / league background. All of them are chasing a dream and trying to do it to the best of their abilities. When we make mistakes please tell us with all of this in mind. If you STILL feel the need to say "FIRE X" or "THIS IS FUCKING TERRIBLE" then I guess go ahead and do that. I get to wake up in the same house as these people and watch them go at it for another 16 hours each day. It is absolutely unacceptable to make these mistakes and they will not be made continuously. As they happen they get fixed asap. In the end it makes us better. We were never planning on 1 season so we have time to fix these things. Ideally, would they never have happened? OF COURSE. Is it possible to have caught these faster? CERTAINLY. But we didn't and we are sorry. Please understand the sheer effort and work that is going into this. This league is growing and it has growing pains. It also has amateur mistakes and huge errors. All of which will be sorted out as they come up. Thank you for the in depth response. I know that the first week is sure to have its glitches and errors and I have no doubt that the NASL will be highly successful moving forward. Really glad to hear that you guys are working hard to fix everything that is going wrong, thanks for the league! | ||
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dtz
5834 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Let me just say this: Some inside info: ... It's ok. Shit happens. Better luck next time And i think it's good to have tl members here as some kind of a "test audience" Teamliquid members might be whiny and "cruel" but most of us stay and we critique because we cares. And people who complains will keep tuning in the next day. But as NASL's aim is to expand Esports to the mainstream especially in North America, it is worth remembering that "outsiders" might not have the same tolerance. They would not flame nor complain and they will just leave and never give NASL a second chance. I believe a lot of people are upset because they truly want to help spread esports and ask their friends to watch but a lot of what has happened made it difficult for newcomers. Same goes with MLG. It's kinda hard when you promised your friend that you are in for an epic spectacle but it fails so miserably. I am sure you are well aware of this though Again, don't take the critism from TL too hard but do remember that there are outsiders who will get turned off by the many problems and that's potential market/customers gone and i do hope things will improve fast. All the best for NASL! that said, go sen go go go! | ||
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Vansetsu
United States1454 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:26 Polygamy wrote: Honestly... Yes the NASL is still making mistakes and ironing out the kinks but.... its still amazing: They are featuring some of the best players in the world with a prize pool that produces some of the best games we could ask for. The casters have been doing a great job. and unless you want HD, you can watch for free. People need to realize how lucky we are to have a league like this and stop acting like every little mistake is detrimental. its new... its FREE.... get over it. No... screw that attitude. There are a lot of people (who aren't idiots, niche hardcore nerds, even sc2 players, ect) that actually want e-sports to be taken seriously. This is suppose to be some of our community pillars creating a foundation for e-sports progression throughout the vehicle which is SC2. I (as I am sure others) would prefer a solid foundation, rather than a poor one. If something is garbage or unacceptable, it needs to be protested and petitioned. If nothing changes, it needs to be ditched and dropped. Way too many e-sports organizations materialize and then evaporate, this time it's suppose to be different. I'm never going to get upset when I hear constructive criticism about this stuff, even just criticism. At this point it's time for professionals to be professionals, take the feedback, take it like adults, and make changes... then hopefully use some common sense in decisions where they don't have a precedent or choose not to use ones set. I hope NASL really really steps it up, but if they don't, I won't watch. I'll have to hope IGN or someone else steps it up. If it doesn't, it's on no one but our "pillars" and our own communities lack of quality involvement. Because apparently, the money is actually there, and SC2 is kind of popular. :/ | ||
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grungust
United States325 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Thanks for the long and detailed explanation Geoff. I think what happened today, and this week for that matter, NEEDED to happen. It's major screw ups like this that become big wake up calls. The people in charge of the production side will now be extra tentative about their work and as a result, we the viewers will receive a better product. Let me just say this: 1. I am WAY against the humor displayed in that show during the intermission. I will speak on behalf of it being removed from future broadcasts. 2. This was a mistake. It's really really bad. I know the NASL is upset about it and will fix it. There is no way to go back in time.. but please know we are sorry. 3. Maps were updated. There is no legitimate argument for using the outdated maps. That too was a mistake overlooked by not consulting the pro players of the squad (me and gretorp). It has been rectified. Some inside info: The NASL isn't a bustling studio of 30 people. It's 5 production people and 2 commentators. We are hiring out professional help for the sound (after the problems) we consult pro's on the stage etc... but we are not some huge broadcasting company. When people say "mistakes like this shouldn't happen.. you need to watch for mistakes!" They do. They do the best they can. A lot of these guys are running off of 4 or less hours a night. Encoding, editing, doing graphics etc.. all each day after this schedule. Do they want your sympathy? No. No they do not. Do they expect better results than what we have produced? MORE THAN YOU KNOW. Nobody is more pissed than Russ and co after each mistake. This is the first week. None of them came from a broadcasting / league background. All of them are chasing a dream and trying to do it to the best of their abilities. When we make mistakes please tell us with all of this in mind. If you STILL feel the need to say "FIRE X" or "THIS IS FUCKING TERRIBLE" then I guess go ahead and do that. I get to wake up in the same house as these people and watch them go at it for another 16 hours each day. It is absolutely unacceptable to make these mistakes and they will not be made continuously. As they happen they get fixed asap. In the end it makes us better. We were never planning on 1 season so we have time to fix these things. Ideally, would they never have happened? OF COURSE. Is it possible to have caught these faster? CERTAINLY. But we didn't and we are sorry. Please understand the sheer effort and work that is going into this. This league is growing and it has growing pains. It also has amateur mistakes and huge errors. All of which will be sorted out as they come up. Everyone needs to sit back and relax. We need to not bash the NASL, instead show our concerns and support for them. | ||
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Grody
United States1 Post
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Let me just say this: 1. I am WAY against the humor displayed in that show during the intermission. I will speak on behalf of it being removed from future broadcasts. 2. This was a mistake. It's really really bad. I know the NASL is upset about it and will fix it. There is no way to go back in time.. but please know we are sorry. 3. Maps were updated. There is no legitimate argument for using the outdated maps. That too was a mistake overlooked by not consulting the pro players of the squad (me and gretorp). It has been rectified. Some inside info: The NASL isn't a bustling studio of 30 people. It's 5 production people and 2 commentators. We are hiring out professional help for the sound (after the problems) we consult pro's on the stage etc... but we are not some huge broadcasting company. When people say "mistakes like this shouldn't happen.. you need to watch for mistakes!" They do. They do the best they can. A lot of these guys are running off of 4 or less hours a night. Encoding, editing, doing graphics etc.. all each day after this schedule. Do they want your sympathy? No. No they do not. Do they expect better results than what we have produced? MORE THAN YOU KNOW. Nobody is more pissed than Russ and co after each mistake. This is the first week. None of them came from a broadcasting / league background. All of them are chasing a dream and trying to do it to the best of their abilities. When we make mistakes please tell us with all of this in mind. If you STILL feel the need to say "FIRE X" or "THIS IS FUCKING TERRIBLE" then I guess go ahead and do that. I get to wake up in the same house as these people and watch them go at it for another 16 hours each day. It is absolutely unacceptable to make these mistakes and they will not be made continuously. As they happen they get fixed asap. In the end it makes us better. We were never planning on 1 season so we have time to fix these things. Ideally, would they never have happened? OF COURSE. Is it possible to have caught these faster? CERTAINLY. But we didn't and we are sorry. Please understand the sheer effort and work that is going into this. This league is growing and it has growing pains. It also has amateur mistakes and huge errors. All of which will be sorted out as they come up. What did you expect trying to create the largest sc2 tournament in the west with just a production crew of 5 people? This just reeks of a money grab trying to do something large with the bare minimum in order to maximize profits. The amount of hype created around this league does not come close to living up to the reality. As an aside to those that argue to buy a sub in order to support e-sports: why would you want something as mediocre as this to be the standard for other western tournaments? Save your money for when an actual worthy tournament shows up, or when the NASL finally gets its act together rather than trying to make an easy buck given that they arrived early to the western e-sports scene. | ||
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SONE
Canada839 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:38 wildwest wrote: but its 100 times better than this circus User was temp banned for this post. that's not what i meant, it was in regards to them looking forward to tasteless and artosis later on but it's code a. | ||
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DR.Ham
Netherlands621 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Let me just say this: 1. I am WAY against the humor displayed in that show during the intermission. I will speak on behalf of it being removed from future broadcasts. 2. This was a mistake. It's really really bad. I know the NASL is upset about it and will fix it. There is no way to go back in time.. but please know we are sorry. 3. Maps were updated. There is no legitimate argument for using the outdated maps. That too was a mistake overlooked by not consulting the pro players of the squad (me and gretorp). It has been rectified. Some inside info: The NASL isn't a bustling studio of 30 people. It's 5 production people and 2 commentators. We are hiring out professional help for the sound (after the problems) we consult pro's on the stage etc... but we are not some huge broadcasting company. When people say "mistakes like this shouldn't happen.. you need to watch for mistakes!" They do. They do the best they can. A lot of these guys are running off of 4 or less hours a night. Encoding, editing, doing graphics etc.. all each day after this schedule. Do they want your sympathy? No. No they do not. Do they expect better results than what we have produced? MORE THAN YOU KNOW. Nobody is more pissed than Russ and co after each mistake. This is the first week. None of them came from a broadcasting / league background. All of them are chasing a dream and trying to do it to the best of their abilities. When we make mistakes please tell us with all of this in mind. If you STILL feel the need to say "FIRE X" or "THIS IS FUCKING TERRIBLE" then I guess go ahead and do that. I get to wake up in the same house as these people and watch them go at it for another 16 hours each day. It is absolutely unacceptable to make these mistakes and they will not be made continuously. As they happen they get fixed asap. In the end it makes us better. We were never planning on 1 season so we have time to fix these things. Ideally, would they never have happened? OF COURSE. Is it possible to have caught these faster? CERTAINLY. But we didn't and we are sorry. Please understand the sheer effort and work that is going into this. This league is growing and it has growing pains. It also has amateur mistakes and huge errors. All of which will be sorted out as they come up. Well said! I think everyone here wan't this to be a success, and probably can't imagine all the background work which goes into this scale of production. Mistakes will of course happen; as long as they are rectified, I'm sure people will be happy. The feedback from your team to the community is very much appreciated. | ||
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Doraemon
Australia14949 Posts
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Vega62a
946 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Let me just say this: 1. I am WAY against the humor displayed in that show during the intermission. I will speak on behalf of it being removed from future broadcasts. 2. This was a mistake. It's really really bad. I know the NASL is upset about it and will fix it. There is no way to go back in time.. but please know we are sorry. 3. Maps were updated. There is no legitimate argument for using the outdated maps. That too was a mistake overlooked by not consulting the pro players of the squad (me and gretorp). It has been rectified. Honestly, I really appreciate this. The stream issues don't bother me that much - shit happens. I can't imagine how hard it is to run an event like this. The thing that is easy is checking things like your halftime show for inappropriate humor. Inc, you've been doing an amazing job avoiding the language pitfalls of gaming culture, and I'm grateful. I cringe everytime someone says HOLY BALLS THAT SHIT RAPED HIM, and I haven't cringed at this cast. I wish you could offer a regame of g2 to tyler, but that's probably not in the cards. I hope he does better next round, is all. | ||
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Oreo7
United States1647 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:36 iNcontroL wrote: Let me just say this: 1. I am WAY against the humor displayed in that show during the intermission. I will speak on behalf of it being removed from future broadcasts. 2. This was a mistake. It's really really bad. I know the NASL is upset about it and will fix it. There is no way to go back in time.. but please know we are sorry. 3. Maps were updated. There is no legitimate argument for using the outdated maps. That too was a mistake overlooked by not consulting the pro players of the squad (me and gretorp). It has been rectified. Some inside info: The NASL isn't a bustling studio of 30 people. It's 5 production people and 2 commentators. We are hiring out professional help for the sound (after the problems) we consult pro's on the stage etc... but we are not some huge broadcasting company. When people say "mistakes like this shouldn't happen.. you need to watch for mistakes!" They do. They do the best they can. A lot of these guys are running off of 4 or less hours a night. Encoding, editing, doing graphics etc.. all each day after this schedule. Do they want your sympathy? No. No they do not. Do they expect better results than what we have produced? MORE THAN YOU KNOW. Nobody is more pissed than Russ and co after each mistake. This is the first week. None of them came from a broadcasting / league background. All of them are chasing a dream and trying to do it to the best of their abilities. When we make mistakes please tell us with all of this in mind. If you STILL feel the need to say "FIRE X" or "THIS IS FUCKING TERRIBLE" then I guess go ahead and do that. I get to wake up in the same house as these people and watch them go at it for another 16 hours each day. It is absolutely unacceptable to make these mistakes and they will not be made continuously. As they happen they get fixed asap. In the end it makes us better. We were never planning on 1 season so we have time to fix these things. Ideally, would they never have happened? OF COURSE. Is it possible to have caught these faster? CERTAINLY. But we didn't and we are sorry. Please understand the sheer effort and work that is going into this. This league is growing and it has growing pains. It also has amateur mistakes and huge errors. All of which will be sorted out as they come up. Incontrol, let me start by saying I love what you are trying to do. The idea of watching the best players in the world play in American prime time is really exciting, and I want it to work. That said, I have a few problems with what you said. Points 1 and 2 fine. Your apology is accepted so long as you follow through Point 3...not so much. Tyler lost that game because of the small ramp, plain and simple. He clearly prepared for this match and got fucked by a map switch that he was not made aware of. So why is their no move made by the NASL to rectify this mistake? At the very least, why was their no regame? Basically you fucked him, and all you have to say is "sorry"...which is sadly becoming a theme with Nasl  .@The rest of your post (I bolded what I have a problem with) A lot of this is an apology. Fine. Whatever. I don't care for your apology, I care for your results. But the bolded bit...that part disturbs me. Why, when NASL was hiring did you NOT hire people with a background in broadcasting? What was the though process here?! I really want NASL to succeed...if I didn't I wouldn't be writing this post. And I know your not the head of NASL and you don't make all these decisions inc, but you are the community liason so I am directing my problems to you. | ||
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Fries
United States124 Posts
On April 18 2011 11:32 aike wrote: MLG and GSL are LIVE CAST so there are bound to be some things out of their direct control. NASL is prerecorded. As incontrol has said, it's just unacceptable. I agree that it's unacceptable. What I'm questioning is the mass amounts of people who are declaring NASL over. People saying it's best for NASL to just shut down? Give me a break. It's hard to launch anything this massive without problems. You try to minimize them of course, but it's to be expected. Also, I'm aware MLG and GSL are live casts and there are additional problems with that but regardless of the differences, to say this is a bigger fail than MLG where we had to sit around for HOURS without seeing anything is ridiculous. | ||
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MUFFINS1
United States533 Posts
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GreYMisT
United States6736 Posts
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