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Players such as Jinro, HuK, and Adelscott did not apply for this tour, so don't ask why they aren't on this list. DIMAGA, Kas, and LaLush turned applications in late so they will not appear either. Please take some time to learn who exactly applied. Please inform yourself about who applied and who didn't. |
On March 23 2011 11:15 UNeeK wrote:
GSL builds a house for foreigners in korea, we have people trying to deny koreans to play in our tournament. It's like we took 2 steps forward (this really was an amazing idea at first), then proceeded to take 10 steps back(terrible execution), the first impression on the community (the showmatch) the audio/video wasn't even sync'd... it was like watching a bad car accident... u didnt wanna see it, but you had to.
I don't wish anything bad on NASL, but it just seems very low-calibur in comparison to its competition and with the announcement of IGN's league, I don't know that NASL will be able to compete as the #1 sc2 event in North America, let alone the world.
The whole don't invite koreans is blatant racism, i don't care HOW you look at it... it's by definition racist.
Do you know how things are done in real sports leagues...?
And the GSL wants foreigners in Korea because they want foreign viewers - that's how GOMTV makes money - viewers, especially those who buy the passes.
It's amazing that people are so naive as to think that all of this is about charity when it is very much a business. Having some Koreans in NASL might be good for business, because Korean vs. foreigner matches often attract more viewers. But having 40-50 Koreans in NASL is not good for business because the primary audience is going to be NA/EU viewers and these people want to watch players they can relate to and who are part of the community, or at least that's what it seems from NASL's point of view.
NASL, from the very beginning, has been about supporting the NA/EU SC 2 scenes. That's why they did those application videos. So that the players can be better promoted as eSports stars, in much the same way real sports promote their players as sports stars.
Given the people involved in NASL (ie Incontrol, Gretorp, Xeris, etc.) I have always seen it as a sort of promotion for the foreigner scene in SC 2. You can't have that if your participants are mostly Koreans. This is easy to see so I'm not sure what people are confused about. It's fine to say that you'd rather watch July vs. Nada a hundred times than Cruncher vs. Darkforce once, but the point of NASL is to promote the latter. That's their goal.
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As (edit: posts just before) above post pointed out, its a little early to be whining about who is and who is not in the top 50. 15 have been selected and posted so far, but there are alot of others who have not.
On the subject of Koreans, as someone earlier stated, this tourny is for the growth of e-sports outside Korea. Because of that, inviting 1/4 of the field from Korea is fine, but shouldn't be more than that to start. While other Koreans should have the oppertunity to qualify, I do think the vast majority should be from the "western" world, and, no matter what country, all people should be taken on who are the best players, even if that means 35 of them from Germany or whatever.
Either way, still 35 more invites to go, lets see what happens 
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On March 23 2011 11:35 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 11:15 UNeeK wrote:
GSL builds a house for foreigners in korea, we have people trying to deny koreans to play in our tournament. It's like we took 2 steps forward (this really was an amazing idea at first), then proceeded to take 10 steps back(terrible execution), the first impression on the community (the showmatch) the audio/video wasn't even sync'd... it was like watching a bad car accident... u didnt wanna see it, but you had to.
I don't wish anything bad on NASL, but it just seems very low-calibur in comparison to its competition and with the announcement of IGN's league, I don't know that NASL will be able to compete as the #1 sc2 event in North America, let alone the world.
The whole don't invite koreans is blatant racism, i don't care HOW you look at it... it's by definition racist. Do you know how things are done in real sports leagues...? And the GSL wants foreigners in Korea because they want foreign viewers - that's how GOMTV makes money - viewers, especially those who buy the passes. It's amazing that people are so naive as to think that all of this is about charity when it is very much a business. Having some Koreans in NASL might be good for business, because Korean vs. foreigner matches often attract more viewers. But having 40-50 Koreans in NASL is not good for business because the primary audience is going to be NA/EU viewers and these people want to watch players they can relate to and who are part of the community, or at least that's what it seems from NASL's point of view. NASL, from the very beginning, has been about supporting the NA/EU SC 2 scenes. That's why they did those application videos. So that the players can be better promoted as eSports stars, in much the same way real sports promote their players as sports stars. Given the people involved in NASL (ie Incontrol, Gretorp, Xeris, etc.) I have always seen it as a sort of promotion for the foreigner scene in SC 2. You can't have that if your participants are mostly Koreans. This is easy to see so I'm not sure what people are confused about. It's fine to say that you'd rather watch July vs. Nada a hundred times than Cruncher vs. Darkforce once, but the point of NASL is to promote the latter. That's their goal.
I agree, what do you think would be a proper representation of Koreans?
5 invites or 10-20?
Also, do you think top koreans should be invited such as MC and JulyZerg?
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out of all koreans to invite, why moon?
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Cause moon bashed all whites being bad etc, and it gives something for NASL to work off promoting him playing vs any foreigner.
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CrunCher made it into tsl3... not sure why people question his spot in NASL
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On March 23 2011 11:40 Clare wrote:
out of all koreans to invite, why moon?
well why the hell not? he finished 2nd at IEM and proved that he has improved a lot and is rly solid now. also he's a huge fan favorite and is gonna attract many viewers because he's a warcraft 3 legend. also, he's definitely not the only korean for the tournament. there are 35 more players yet to be announced and i'm sure some of them are gonna be koreans.
On March 23 2011 11:40 Myia wrote:
Cause moon bashed all whites being bad etc, and it gives something for NASL to work off promoting him playing vs any foreigner.
You totally got that wrong. His statement "Koreans own white dudes" was an inside joke. Carmac (Product Manager of IEM and the guy who handed them the trophies) wrote an article with that headline a long time ago.
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On March 23 2011 11:40 Myia wrote:
Cause moon bashed all whites being bad etc, and it gives something for NASL to work off promoting him playing vs any foreigner.
So then I assume by that logic MC(The GOD PROTOSS) would be a no brainer? One would hope...
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On March 23 2011 11:39 DazZle. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 11:35 Azarkon wrote:On March 23 2011 11:15 UNeeK wrote:
GSL builds a house for foreigners in korea, we have people trying to deny koreans to play in our tournament. It's like we took 2 steps forward (this really was an amazing idea at first), then proceeded to take 10 steps back(terrible execution), the first impression on the community (the showmatch) the audio/video wasn't even sync'd... it was like watching a bad car accident... u didnt wanna see it, but you had to.
I don't wish anything bad on NASL, but it just seems very low-calibur in comparison to its competition and with the announcement of IGN's league, I don't know that NASL will be able to compete as the #1 sc2 event in North America, let alone the world.
The whole don't invite koreans is blatant racism, i don't care HOW you look at it... it's by definition racist. Do you know how things are done in real sports leagues...? And the GSL wants foreigners in Korea because they want foreign viewers - that's how GOMTV makes money - viewers, especially those who buy the passes. It's amazing that people are so naive as to think that all of this is about charity when it is very much a business. Having some Koreans in NASL might be good for business, because Korean vs. foreigner matches often attract more viewers. But having 40-50 Koreans in NASL is not good for business because the primary audience is going to be NA/EU viewers and these people want to watch players they can relate to and who are part of the community, or at least that's what it seems from NASL's point of view. NASL, from the very beginning, has been about supporting the NA/EU SC 2 scenes. That's why they did those application videos. So that the players can be better promoted as eSports stars, in much the same way real sports promote their players as sports stars. Given the people involved in NASL (ie Incontrol, Gretorp, Xeris, etc.) I have always seen it as a sort of promotion for the foreigner scene in SC 2. You can't have that if your participants are mostly Koreans. This is easy to see so I'm not sure what people are confused about. It's fine to say that you'd rather watch July vs. Nada a hundred times than Cruncher vs. Darkforce once, but the point of NASL is to promote the latter. That's their goal. I agree, what do you think would be a proper representation of Koreans? 5 invites or 10-20? Also, do you think top koreans should be invited such as MC and JulyZerg?
If I were running this tournament, and I am not and is therefore not aware of most of the limitations and concerns involved, I'd have separate groups for the Korean server and the EU/US servers, assuming the latter two have decent latency with each other. Then I'd invite the top X finishers from those groups to the Ro16 LAN. The rough distribution I'd follow would be something like 4 Koreans and 12 foreigners for the Ro16, or 25% Koreans. This avoids lag and gives proper representation for the best of each region.
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On March 23 2011 11:43 JayJay_90 wrote:well why the hell not? he finished 2nd at IEM and proved that he has improved a lot and is rly solid now. also he's a huge fan favorite and is gonna attract many viewers because he's a warcraft 3 legend. also, he's definitely not the only korean for the tournament. there are 35 more players yet to be announced and i'm sure some of them are gonna be koreans.
Well I mean, moon is rather weak compared to most koreans. Just look at Ace, who got first in IEM gets 2-0'd in the up/down matches. Why not get the top koreans?
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the best player in the world has to be picked. (mc)
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On March 23 2011 11:35 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 11:15 UNeeK wrote:
GSL builds a house for foreigners in korea, we have people trying to deny koreans to play in our tournament. It's like we took 2 steps forward (this really was an amazing idea at first), then proceeded to take 10 steps back(terrible execution), the first impression on the community (the showmatch) the audio/video wasn't even sync'd... it was like watching a bad car accident... u didnt wanna see it, but you had to.
I don't wish anything bad on NASL, but it just seems very low-calibur in comparison to its competition and with the announcement of IGN's league, I don't know that NASL will be able to compete as the #1 sc2 event in North America, let alone the world.
The whole don't invite koreans is blatant racism, i don't care HOW you look at it... it's by definition racist. Do you know how things are done in real sports leagues...? And the GSL wants foreigners in Korea because they want foreign viewers - that's how GOMTV makes money - viewers, especially those who buy the passes. It's amazing that people are so naive as to think that all of this is about charity when it is very much a business. Having some Koreans in NASL might be good for business, because Korean vs. foreigner matches often attract more viewers. But having 40-50 Koreans in NASL is not good for business because the primary audience is going to be NA/EU viewers and these people want to watch players they can relate to and who are part of the community, or at least that's what it seems from NASL's point of view. NASL, from the very beginning, has been about supporting the NA/EU SC 2 scenes. That's why they did those application videos. So that the players can be better promoted as eSports stars, in much the same way real sports promote their players as sports stars. Given the people involved in NASL (ie Incontrol, Gretorp, Xeris, etc.) I have always seen it as a sort of promotion for the foreigner scene in SC 2. You can't have that if your participants are mostly Koreans. This is easy to see so I'm not sure what people are confused about. It's fine to say that you'd rather watch July vs. Nada a hundred times than Cruncher vs. Darkforce once, but the point of NASL is to promote the latter. That's their goal.
40-50 is wayy overkill and obviously an unrealistic compromise. Anyway we are pretty much beatin a dead horse here, there have been threads about this "koreans in nasl" topic.
Nonetheless I want to ask you, since you're talking about the "business" aspect of the league, how many people do you think are going to pay to watch Cruncher vs. Darkforce? I mean, if you take a look at the TSL, their VODs are free...
(I won't compare NASL to GSL because it's unfair IMHO, formats being too different)
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^ You don't pay to watch one match, but for a whole season. Just as I don't pay to watch two random Koreans no one cares about at GSL. Also, you don't have to pay. They are giving you the option.
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oh man, so much complaining -.- cant you enjoy the first truely international league, that will only improve even so its already going to be überentertaining?
but to join you =P : if you just want to see the best player just watch code s ro8 (and why have an na league with only 1-2 na players^^). nasl wont pick players randomly. they will make sure to get in all regions, entertaining players and those with the biggest fan bases. that way everybody can cheer for someone they like
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On March 23 2011 11:47 AlBundy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 11:35 Azarkon wrote:On March 23 2011 11:15 UNeeK wrote:
GSL builds a house for foreigners in korea, we have people trying to deny koreans to play in our tournament. It's like we took 2 steps forward (this really was an amazing idea at first), then proceeded to take 10 steps back(terrible execution), the first impression on the community (the showmatch) the audio/video wasn't even sync'd... it was like watching a bad car accident... u didnt wanna see it, but you had to.
I don't wish anything bad on NASL, but it just seems very low-calibur in comparison to its competition and with the announcement of IGN's league, I don't know that NASL will be able to compete as the #1 sc2 event in North America, let alone the world.
The whole don't invite koreans is blatant racism, i don't care HOW you look at it... it's by definition racist. Do you know how things are done in real sports leagues...? And the GSL wants foreigners in Korea because they want foreign viewers - that's how GOMTV makes money - viewers, especially those who buy the passes. It's amazing that people are so naive as to think that all of this is about charity when it is very much a business. Having some Koreans in NASL might be good for business, because Korean vs. foreigner matches often attract more viewers. But having 40-50 Koreans in NASL is not good for business because the primary audience is going to be NA/EU viewers and these people want to watch players they can relate to and who are part of the community, or at least that's what it seems from NASL's point of view. NASL, from the very beginning, has been about supporting the NA/EU SC 2 scenes. That's why they did those application videos. So that the players can be better promoted as eSports stars, in much the same way real sports promote their players as sports stars. Given the people involved in NASL (ie Incontrol, Gretorp, Xeris, etc.) I have always seen it as a sort of promotion for the foreigner scene in SC 2. You can't have that if your participants are mostly Koreans. This is easy to see so I'm not sure what people are confused about. It's fine to say that you'd rather watch July vs. Nada a hundred times than Cruncher vs. Darkforce once, but the point of NASL is to promote the latter. That's their goal. 40-50 is wayy overkill and obviously an unrealistic compromise. Anyway we are pretty much beatin a dead horse here, there have been threads about this "koreans in nasl" topic. Nonetheless I want to ask you, since you're talking about the "business" aspect of the league, how many people do you think are going to pay to watch Cruncher vs. Darkforce? I mean, if you take a look at the TSL, their VODs are free... (I won't compare NASL to GSL because it's unfair IMHO, formats being too different)
In the beginning? Not many at all. But in the beginning of the GSL how many people would have paid to see MC vs. MVP? It is the job of the league to promote its own players, to make us care about Cruncher and Darkforce, and thereby encourage the growth of the scene. It's true that right now few people would pay to see them play, but the hope is that by the end of NASL that would change, which in the long run is good for business because it generates interest in foreigner players and teams and so increases the exposure and viewership of foreigner events that feature them.
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On March 23 2011 11:48 GenoZStriker wrote:
^ You don't pay to watch one match, but for a whole season. Just as I don't pay to watch two random Koreans no one cares about at GSL. Also, you don't have to pay. They are giving you the option.
Are you saying that we will be able to access the VODs for free? In that case I'll take my question back and I'll go back to reading the nasl FAQS.
edit: oh I get it- if you don't like it, don't buy it.
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Fenix? I feel like better players than him are gonna be left out. kinda disappointed.
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On March 23 2011 11:56 Snoyarc wrote:
Fenix? I feel like better players than him are gonna be left out. kinda disappointed.
well, do you know better players in south america? i feel there needs to be at least one player from every region, like in the fifa wc ;-)
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On March 23 2011 11:56 Snoyarc wrote:
Fenix? I feel like better players than him are gonna be left out. kinda disappointed.
I'm pretty sure that Fenix will be in this league. He has a lot of achievements (winning IEM USA, placing third in Dreamhack, etc.) and Xeris knows about that .
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On March 23 2011 11:56 Snoyarc wrote:
Fenix? I feel like better players than him are gonna be left out. kinda disappointed.
He has shown he can be one of the best in the past, he may just be slumping, and, like Moon and Loner, some invites are to draw in more fans or more demographics to watch the league. As in Fan Favorites are often chosen over Closet Gosus in almost any league with invites.
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EPT
