• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 03:38
CET 09:38
KST 17:38
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10
Community News
RSL Season 3: RO16 results & RO8 bracket6Weekly Cups (Nov 10-16): Reynor, Solar lead Zerg surge1[TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation14Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada4SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA11
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview RSL Season 3: RO16 results & RO8 bracket SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA Mech is the composition that needs teleportation t GM / Master map hacker and general hacking and cheating thread
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 3 $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest 2025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales! Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 500 Fright night Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened
Brood War
General
Data analysis on 70 million replays soO on: FanTaSy's Potential Return to StarCraft FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[BSL21] RO16 Tie Breaker - Group B - Sun 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO16 Tie Breaker - Group A - Sat 21:00 CET [BSL21] GosuLeague T1 Ro16 - Tue & Thu 22:00 CET [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Current Meta How to stay on top of macro? PvZ map balance Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile [Game] Osu! Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Clair Obscur - Expedition 33 Nintendo Switch Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI About SC2SEA.COM
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Dyadica Evangelium — Chapt…
Hildegard
Coffee x Performance in Espo…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2280 users

[G] MaxPax's PvT Easy MMR Macro DT Opener

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
ESChamp
Profile Joined September 2014
Canada124 Posts
September 10 2021 21:54 GMT
#1


Replay Download - MaxPax vs HeRoMaRinE

+ Show Spoiler [ Build timings] +

12 0:08 Pylon
13 0:27 Gateway
15 0:42 Assimilator
18 1:14 Cybernetics Core
19 1:31 Nexus
19 1:38 Pylon
20 1:47 Adept (Chrono Boost)
20 1:53 Assimilator
22 1:59 Warp Gate
23 2:07 Adept (Chrono Boost)
27 2:29 Twilight Council
27 2:32 Adept
30 2:42 Shield Battery
32 2:57 Robotics Facility
37 3:22 Dark Shrine
37 3:29 Gateway
39 3:45 Warp Prism (Chrono Boost)
43 3:57 Gateway
45 4:06 Pylon x2
45 4:13 Assimilator x2
46 4:29 Pylon
48 4:37 Dark Templar x2
54 4:38 Blink (Chrono Boost)
56 5:00 Dark Templar
56 5:01 Archon
60 5:11 Nexus
60 5:14 Dark Templar, Stalker
60 5:20 Archon
66 5:24 Forge
68 5:40 Stalker x2
68 5:42 Observer
74 5:44 Robotics Bay
77 6:06 Stalker x3
77 6:10 Charge
84 6:13 Protoss Ground Weapons Level 1
83 6:28 Shield Battery
83 6:29 Colossus (Chrono Boost), Gateway
92 6:51 Stalker x3
98 6:54 Photon Cannon
98 6:55 Gateway
98 6:58 Extended Thermal Lance
97 7:14 Gateway x2
97 7:15 Colossus (Chrono Boost)
97 7:18 Photon Cannon
99 7:32 Nexus, Zealot
99 7:35 Sentry x2
103 7:37 Zealot
107 7:53 Stalker
111 8:00 Zealot x3
117 8:08 Shield Battery
118 8:15 Zealot x4
118 8:18 Colossus (Chrono Boost)
130 8:28 Zealot
74 9:20 Colossus (Chrono Boost)
90 9:39 Dark Templar x4
90 9:44 Archon x2



The Transition:
Now, in a lot of games, you just got some free MMR. Luckily Maxpax is playing vs Biggest of Gabes, who has indeed scouted the DT Shrine earlier. At 5:15, he is grabbing the third base to further transition into the Macro Game, while also warping in 2 more DTs in the front to potentially go for an Archon Drop. At 5:25 a forge is added.

Now from here on out, the game opens up massively for the Protoss, depending on what the gamestate is, and what your preference in playstyle is. The three meta Macro transitions are into a Mass Gate Style with a second Forge, a Storm focused style with a High Templar Archives, or what Maxpax will be showing here: Robotics Bay and Colossi.

With Blink finishing, charge is started, and Maxpax is opting for pressure with the Archon Drop and a handfull of stalkers. Once again trying to punish potential mistakes, without actually committing them. It is ESSENTIAL that we don't lose Starkers unnecessarily. Having a hand full of stalkers in your army is great for Anti-Air and some added damage, however adding more stalkers after this first battle, will not only delay your tech, but production for actually good Core units in your army, aka Zealots.

Micro-wise, Maxpax is trying to get some damage done with the Archons. As Archons are very tanky, the main thing to worry about is to not lose the Prism. Macro wise, we're setting up the minimum amount of Static D (Cannons in Mineral lines, shield battery the base), while getting the gateway count up to 8-10 without building units in the meantime, if possible. That way, the big gateway explosion will enable the perfect abusing of the economic advantage we have gained.

Defending the Counter
Now, if you've macroed well, and did some damage, depending on your transition, you could go for a final push to end the game while taking a fourth base or gases..or both. Gases allow for easier Tech switching, another base allows for more Gateways. However, Maxpax only traded decently here, which means the Terran can go for their counter attack. This phase is now all about vision, knowing where the Terran army is coming from, if it might be dropping. In between the drop and the Colossi, Maxpax has been pumping out observers to gain some vision. If a raven is out, Map vision and vision of main army both is preferable to..well, losing your Observer. You may also add pylons, or even move single zealots / surviving adepts in spots to see the army and drop movements.

If the army is moving out, you want to safely kite the Terran army with your larger range, keeping them from stimming on top of you with forcefields, while baiting out stims, sieges and raven disables far away from where the actual fight will happen. If you did it correctly, the fight will then be happening at one of your bases, fortified with batteries, and an incredible army advantage from your economy kicking in earlier.
jimminy_kriket
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Canada5520 Posts
September 12 2021 01:06 GMT
#2
Thank you for the guide, I will be using it on ladder. I am curious as to why maxpax didn't place his initial pylon gateway and core in position to block the reaper ledge. Against any decent player who opens reaper I would think this gets scouted pretty easily and it did.

One could argue that it's probably going to get scouted anyways, or that he expected a marine opening which is somewhat meta at the moment. Still seems strange not to try. Or perhaps its actually better to let it get scouted because the terran might over invest in turrets making the archon harass more potent due to lack of units.

What do you think?
life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery
HolyHit
Profile Joined March 2013
Germany4 Posts
September 12 2021 16:38 GMT
#3
It's probably because of the tightness of the 12 pylon 13 gateway, and getting the best out of that opening.

If the main focus is the dt drop itself, a normal opening, 14 pylon 16 gateway, would probably be the better option, as it's easier to proxy the dt shrine / wall-off the main. But since the DT shrine being scouted is never a game ending moment, I'm guessing the focus really was just on getting that 12/13 as clean as possible.
jimminy_kriket
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Canada5520 Posts
September 16 2021 23:51 GMT
#4
That makes sense, I haven't been using 12 pylon very much so I wasn't sure how impactful being behind15 minerals or so would be to the overall timings.
life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery
_fool
Profile Joined February 2011
Netherlands678 Posts
September 18 2021 18:34 GMT
#5
I'm not a Protoss player, but I really appreciate people putting out this type of content! Stuff like this makes TL the go-to SC2 platform. Well done!
"News is to the mind what sugar is to the body"
qcHanHan
Profile Joined September 2011
Denmark71 Posts
October 05 2021 09:02 GMT
#6
Still works like a charm for me in master 1 (y) Lovely build.
HerO - herO - PartinG - sOs - Rain - Zest - Stats
Danijonn
Profile Joined October 2021
2 Posts
October 14 2021 20:04 GMT
#7
--- Nuked ---
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
RSL Revival
07:30
Playoffs
Classic vs ReynorLIVE!
Maru vs SHIN
MaxPax vs TriGGeR
Crank 977
Tasteless546
IndyStarCraft 96
Rex48
3DClanTV 42
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Crank 977
Tasteless 546
ProTech129
IndyStarCraft 88
Rex 52
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 2175
Shuttle 1742
actioN 892
Zeus 635
Flash 610
Killer 396
BeSt 326
EffOrt 215
Backho 119
Aegong 118
[ Show more ]
ToSsGirL 66
soO 54
Dewaltoss 53
Sacsri 44
Mind 41
zelot 38
yabsab 30
sorry 24
Soma 23
NotJumperer 20
Shinee 16
Sexy 15
HiyA 12
Bale 9
Dota 2
XaKoH 501
NeuroSwarm92
League of Legends
JimRising 594
Counter-Strike
shoxiejesuss292
Heroes of the Storm
Trikslyr30
Other Games
summit1g14296
ceh9358
crisheroes333
Happy271
C9.Mang0265
Fuzer 88
Mew2King81
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream11105
Other Games
gamesdonequick643
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH261
• LUISG 16
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1228
• Lourlo1139
• Stunt479
Other Games
• Scarra4097
Upcoming Events
OSC
4h 22m
BSL: GosuLeague
12h 22m
RSL Revival
22h 52m
WardiTV Korean Royale
1d 3h
Replay Cast
1d 14h
RSL Revival
1d 22h
WardiTV Korean Royale
2 days
IPSL
2 days
Julia vs Artosis
JDConan vs DragOn
BSL 21
2 days
TerrOr vs Aeternum
HBO vs Kyrie
RSL Revival
2 days
[ Show More ]
Wardi Open
3 days
IPSL
3 days
StRyKeR vs OldBoy
Sziky vs Tarson
BSL 21
3 days
StRyKeR vs Artosis
OyAji vs KameZerg
Replay Cast
3 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-11-16
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
CSCL: Masked Kings S3
SLON Tour Season 2
RSL Revival: Season 3
META Madness #9
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025

Upcoming

BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.