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Yesterday I gave it a try to 1v1 after 6 years of pause.
What I did in the meantime:
- watch online tournaments (I did it for years)
- watch live streaming and tutorials from pro players (like BeastyQt and others)
I remember the ladder as if it was yesterday. For me, it was really hard to beat Bronze 1. It felt like I was in a different league (maybe wood).
Yesterday I played 28 games (~6h), from which:
- 2 instaleave
- 2 wins (players were way worst than me)
- all the other games: I played against Dia, Plat and Gold almost constantly. Only a few games were against Silver.
After yesterday, I thought that today will be the big day. I played again. I got Plat.
Do I need to play hundred of games to have the opponent closest to my league? I don’t think I can play hundred of loss games. It's just depressing.
What am I missing?
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Were you playing unranked ? I reinstalled recently since I got the fiber. I created a new account and reached diamond 1 with P after ten games or so, after which I wanted to try to play some Z for fun. So I tried to play Z unranked. And all I got were diamond 1 / masters players, even after 5 losses. I didn't insist but maybe the problem lies here (are/were you diamond / plat in team games ?).
If you were playing ranked I have no idea.
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I played ranked. This is my profile https://starcraft2.com/en-us/profile/2/1/2576787.
A few years back I played team games. I got carried by a friend a lot. We played against masters in 2v2.
I was thinking that maybe APM has something to do with the discrepancies. For the moment I have it 60+. The MM algo thinks I can be diamond or something similar. I don't know.
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Throughout the past years the caps of the leagues went down.
Like, 4 years ago Diamond 2 MMR is in today's Masters MMR range.
In other words, the indication of the leagues aren't as what they were several years ago. Perhaps the free to play had something to do with it with a lot more accounts which make 25% of the accounts be a way larger number then what it was 4 years ago, lowering the MMR cap for Diamond. Same for Plat and Gold.
Just treat it as if you play opponents of the same level as you, even if you aren't used to them having league borders as high as you get now.
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Yeah, the leagues have changed a lot. Just play and enjoy it. It takes some time for the MMR to settle down, then you'll face opponents on your skill level.
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Youngest people love to see how strong they are, and Blizzard didn t change his ladder since 10 years... I m not surprised if you find it a bit messy. still 7 leagues !? do they really need to be ranked as diamond ?
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sry to hijack this here
so i actually tried sc2 again today. i kinda dont know what to build but unranked seems weird.
was high master back in the day, before gm was there. But wheres a good stating point for now, dont wanna watch hundreds of hours of videos to get a grip of strategy right now.
€ apparently my last post here is from 2012  that must have been around the time i last played
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On August 13 2020 06:35 oOa)sInNeR wrote:sry to hijack this here so i actually tried sc2 again today. i kinda dont know what to build but unranked seems weird. was high master back in the day, before gm was there. But wheres a good stating point for now, dont wanna watch hundreds of hours of videos to get a grip of strategy right now. € apparently my last post here is from 2012 that must have been around the time i last played
Welcome back! Try spawningtool.com for builds. And check Lowko/PiG/Harstem (and many others that I forget) for content that is both fun and useful.
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I have heard this from other people too. As bad a solution as this is for the general ecosystem, at this point I recommend instaleaving for a bit until you get to a more reasonable mmr. I'm sick of people finally trying starcraft after years of being intimidated because the game is too hard only to quickly leave when their fears are proved right. I don't care if you are masters or gold level, you should be winning about half of your games! If, in order to reach a place where you can actually enjoy the game you need to throw a few, I think that's totally worth it.
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You're probably a plat player. I don't think the average gold player (let alone silver or bronze) has 6 years of watching the game and all the game sense that comes with it.
The ladder was different 6 years ago, lots of players that had been around since launch, maybe even beta. Lots of players had tuned in to day9 tutorials and all the other content. There's not so much easily digested content like that today, and you've also got a lot of f2p players coming in that may or may not have a rts background.
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When you start fresh account MMR is going crazy in first 50ish~ games. You can see it under "Provisional mmr".
After the dust settles, you MMR will be decided based on score, toughness of your opponent, etc.
Ladder is definately hard these days but considering a fact you are gold after 6 years pause means you are good for starters. If I recall correctly you werent playing LotV at all, mechanics are different in this expansion, plystyle and metas changes week to week.
If you had your MMR borderline before, you can start fresh account until you are placed in league which suits your current skill.
Play 20 more games and that should be it!
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I guess it depends on your state of mind. I love playing and losing against people who are better than me. You can immediately see where the flaws in your game / BO are.
When you beat someone who is better than you, most of the time you don’t learn anything at all so it’s not a very productive use of your practise time.
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So I think your league is mostly based on your first 5 games. Then your mmr is a more accurate representation.
I had two friends who 5-0ed placements including beating a masters team and got put in masters, but then began a losing stream. The result is they had high platinum MMR, but were still technically ranked Masters.
They same thing might be going on with you.
The ladder should even things up for you eventually. I suspect you did well in your first 5 matches and got ranked too high and you have been overly challenged since.
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If you've left a game on pause for 6 years, I'd say it's time to just unpause the game, because I don't think your opponent is coming back to his computer. The only reasonable amount of time I'd ever keep a game paused is one year, maximum. After that, I will definitely unpause and win the game, and if he wants to report it, fine.
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On August 17 2020 17:24 ninazerg wrote:
If you've left a game on pause for 6 years, I'd say it's time to just unpause the game, because I don't think your opponent is coming back to his computer. The only reasonable amount of time I'd ever keep a game paused is one year, maximum. After that, I will definitely unpause and win the game, and if he wants to report it, fine.
10/10 post
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On August 10 2020 17:05 LittleOne2nd wrote:
Yesterday I gave it a try to 1v1 after 6 years of pause.
What I did in the meantime:
- watch online tournaments (I did it for years)
- watch live streaming and tutorials from pro players (like BeastyQt and others)
I remember the ladder as if it was yesterday. For me, it was really hard to beat Bronze 1. It felt like I was in a different league (maybe wood).
Yesterday I played 28 games (~6h), from which:
- 2 instaleave
- 2 wins (players were way worst than me)
- all the other games: I played against Dia, Plat and Gold almost constantly. Only a few games were against Silver.
After yesterday, I thought that today will be the big day. I played again. I got Plat.
Do I need to play hundred of games to have the opponent closest to my league? I don’t think I can play hundred of loss games. It's just depressing.
What am I missing?
considering you just came back, did you use proper builds or just did whatever? i would guess you wouldnt have a problem if you used optimized build order, i just came back myself and honestly most important thing is build order, since then you can focus more on actually game tactics and strategy instead of thinking what to build next.
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Post some replays if you are looking for advice
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On August 17 2020 17:24 ninazerg wrote:
If you've left a game on pause for 6 years, I'd say it's time to just unpause the game, because I don't think your opponent is coming back to his computer. The only reasonable amount of time I'd ever keep a game paused is one year, maximum. After that, I will definitely unpause and win the game, and if he wants to report it, fine.
This is sound advice.
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On August 10 2020 17:05 LittleOne2nd wrote:
Yesterday I gave it a try to 1v1 after 6 years of pause.
What I did in the meantime:
- watch online tournaments (I did it for years)
- watch live streaming and tutorials from pro players (like BeastyQt and others)
I remember the ladder as if it was yesterday. For me, it was really hard to beat Bronze 1. It felt like I was in a different league (maybe wood).
Yesterday I played 28 games (~6h), from which:
- 2 instaleave
- 2 wins (players were way worst than me)
- all the other games: I played against Dia, Plat and Gold almost constantly. Only a few games were against Silver.
After yesterday, I thought that today will be the big day. I played again. I got Plat.
Do I need to play hundred of games to have the opponent closest to my league? I don’t think I can play hundred of loss games. It's just depressing.
What am I missing?
just insta leave 50times in row, if you think you are getting to strong opponents, pretty simple
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On August 18 2020 05:30 starkiller123 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2020 17:24 ninazerg wrote:
If you've left a game on pause for 6 years, I'd say it's time to just unpause the game, because I don't think your opponent is coming back to his computer. The only reasonable amount of time I'd ever keep a game paused is one year, maximum. After that, I will definitely unpause and win the game, and if he wants to report it, fine. 10/10 post
Well, that's kind of how you know that BW players are weirders than SC2 ones.
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TL DR:
I still loose a lot as Silver player (the gold league badge is wrong, I'm not a gold player).
I win by instaleave or by having a very bad opponent player (literally has no clue).
My MMR is wrong. It says I'm close to Plat, but even Silver players give me a hard time.
The MM is still bad, I play mostly against dia, plat, gold, and a few silver, bronze.
My economy is from +20% to +200% better than my opponent's. Even over Plat players.
Most of the time my army size is around or over opponent's. On occasions, it is less.
Most of the cheese I can hold, I loose in mid/late game.
I usually don't forget to spend on tech and upgrades.
Sometimes I float minerals (never until mid-game), and not over 2k. The avg on replays is ~600.
Sometimes I make mistakes, like not scouting or having to few gates.
This is my last game: https://sc2replaystats.com/replay/16137821
The only thing I know I did wrong on it, was that I had fewer gates, thus fewer army supply. And not retreating behind the wall, but that would still not have saved me. He had way too many zealots.
Now I'm following ViBElol tutorials.
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On September 01 2020 14:29 bela.mervado wrote:404, upload again plz
Done! Updated my prev. post.
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hmm this is coming from someone playing all races at around ~4k mmr, zerg main.
tl;dr: you had some inefficiencies, you did not scout, and you were too greedy.
i think you should check out Vibe's bronze to masters series, maybe start from gold and watch up to dia. he has a lot of useful tips.
i think you should learn a stable/standard build and improve execution each game you play. one such build can be the old school 2 base +2 attack chargelot archon immortal timing attack. i'd recommend you open with two gates on top of the ramp, because your build would be fucked by a pair of adepts. (learn to wall the ramp, leave a hotkeyed probe on top of the ramp to build a battery or pylon to block the adepts). in this build i recommend you start with 2 stalkers or 1 stalker + 1 sentry, get a pylon below the ramp, expand, get a battery and probe your bases, get a fast forge and start +1 attack asap. get a twilight and start to work on charge. delay the robo a bit, get an obs, then immortals. steadily tech to templar archives. when you'll have 4 gases, keep the robo busy making immortals, get 1 prism before you move out. start +2 attack as soon as +1 finishes. chrono them as much as you can. spend the rest of your gas on archons. all your minerals are going into chargelots. have enough gateways. pylons as you need them, do not overmake them.
ok. the most important problems in your game in my opinion.
you were playing in the dark, you had no scouting apart from the gate-probe scout confirming he 1 gate expod. you need to be more active with scouting. you did not know what is coming to kill you. you can make a few (2-3) sentries at the start of the game for two reasons. 1. is to defend with force fields, buy some time for your units. 2. scout with hallucinations. you failed to scout your opponent only had 1 gas. he built 9 gateways and were going mass chargelots.
this would be very apparent by the followup scouts seeing like 5-10-15-20 growing number of zealots and no gas.
you did not check his base count, and did not have a forward scout warning you about him moving out. you can easily have one observer at his entrance, watching his army composition.
your build was inefficient. you had a nasty supply block at 23. you want to make a pylon at about 21-22. later as the expo nexus finishes, you are ok for a while. later in the game you made lots of pylons, like 50+ extra supply. imagine these are gateways, then pylons as you need them.
you were mining lots of gas but you did not spend it. your warp gate was very late. you did not have a forge to spend your gas. you only built the twilight at the end of the game just before he attacked you. very late.
(in this specific game you could have went stargate lazy void rays as well, but i would recommend sticking to one build first).
you wanted to make a 3rd without scoting him going chargelot allin. you spent a lot of money on that. your composition (stalkers, 2 immortals) sucks against chargelots. you had no battery at the third.
your probe production and distribution of probes was nice. sometimes you had 4 probes on gas but you fixed it. watch Vibe's videos he will tell you in each and every one of them to pay attention to your macro, you will be proud of yourself on this aspect of your play.
because of the most probably unnecessary 3rd, too many unneeded pylons, and lack of scouting (making stalkers against chargelots, not scouting he is 2 base allining) you did not have enough gateways (only 3 total).
should you have a few archons, some chargelots on your own (+1 was ready on time) you would hold this easily.
he had 33 zealots, 32 probes on minerals, 3 on gas.
you had 59 probes 13 stalkers 2 immortals 1 zealot 1 sentry, no battery at the choke/expo.
let me calculate the money you spent on 3rd and extra pylons:
you need 44 probes for 2 base saturation, that's extra 15 -> 750 minerals
nexus, 2x gas -> 550m
8 extra pylons for 165 supply when you were at 101 -> 800m
at around 6:45 when he hits, you had 200/850+ in the bank, and you had energy for 3 chrono.
i think you could have had +3 gates for a total of 6, twilight with charge ready. 2, maybe 3 archons. ~4 stalkers, 2-3 sentry, and like 12+ chargelots, and a battery. defending at the choke, using overcharge, this should be easy to hold.
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I love how bela.mervado went through a detailed analysis of the replay and corresponding advice, and the guy never even thank him.
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On September 01 2020 05:54 LittleOne2nd wrote:
My MMR is wrong. It says I'm close to Plat, but even Silver players give me a hard time.
This has already been said but I believe it should be emphasised:
Your MMR will converge to its "real value" only if you play more games.
And if it's too high, that means you will lose most of them.
If it feels better, you can accelerate the process by leaving games until your rank reaches one you're comfortable with, but if you're not discouraged by losing, playing better players will be much better practice.
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I tried to come back awhile ago. First game against a High Masters player, lost terribly. Happened over and over, in ranked. Apparently, there is no MMR/ELO decay even though I hadn't play ladder seriously for nearly a third of my life. Getting wrecked like that isn't exactly a way to ease back into the game, it isn't very inviting. In fact, I stopped playing again once it happened.
They should definitely add some kind of MMR decay, even if it only begins after one year of playing a ladder game.
The solution is to create a new account. That was the solution for me at least.
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It doesn't take hundreds of games. You'll probably normalize after about 30 or so. Continuously losing is the path to finding your Goldilocks zone, if you're overranked, I suppose.
Who knows? Maybe the act of "getting stomped" makes you better and better, assuming you're trying to win each game, taking some time to reflect on what happened and learning from the stompings...
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EPT
