EPTDo you EMP or do you snipe the vipers?
The LotV Terran Help Me Thread - Page 13
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MockHamill
Sweden1798 Posts
Do you EMP or do you snipe the vipers? | ||
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guitarizt
United States1492 Posts
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Tee1990
20 Posts
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NoisyNinja
United States991 Posts
Is the Cyclone upgrade even worth getting? | ||
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Sissors
1395 Posts
And in principle not, the upgrade is fine, but the unit is crap by the time you can afford the upgrade. | ||
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NoisyNinja
United States991 Posts
On December 23 2015 23:35 Sissors wrote: TvP, sometimes TvT, right after you made your factory. And in principle not, the upgrade is fine, but the unit is crap by the time you can afford the upgrade. What is its purpose? What's it meant to counter/do? I know it has auto lock on and its ability, but I'm talking about effective use. | ||
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Guillermoman
24 Posts
On December 23 2015 23:40 NoisyNinja wrote: What is its purpose? What's it meant to counter/do? I know it has auto lock on and its ability, but I'm talking about effective use. It's purpose is to lock on and stop drops. In TvT, it also is a hard counter to Banshees and Reapers. In TvP, it hard counters Oracle and helps against Pylon Overcharge rushes (one Lock-On can kill a pylon while being out of range). | ||
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NoisyNinja
United States991 Posts
On December 24 2015 00:02 Guillermoman wrote: It's purpose is to lock on and stop drops. In TvT, it also is a hard counter to Banshees and Reapers. In TvP, it hard counters Oracle and helps against Pylon Overcharge rushes (one Lock-On can kill a pylon while being out of range). Alright, thanks. I think I get the idea and it seems like Cyclone is for very specific situations. | ||
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Sissors
1395 Posts
On December 24 2015 00:02 Guillermoman wrote: It's purpose is to lock on and stop drops. In TvT, it also is a hard counter to Banshees and Reapers. In TvP, it hard counters Oracle and helps against Pylon Overcharge rushes (one Lock-On can kill a pylon while being out of range). And possibly the most important one: Quickly take out Warp Prisms before units can warp in. | ||
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Westy
England808 Posts
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PinheadXXXXXX
United States897 Posts
On December 24 2015 05:27 Westy wrote: So what is a safe opener that survives the ling roach ravager allin? I am a mid-high masters terran, recently back from a longish break, and I just keep getting dicked by roach ravager ling allins. Hellion banshee, the hellions melt away and even if I can keep the banshee alive, it the zerg can literally clear my production buildings before I kill of their first wave. Not really got a clue how to handle this without giving up on hellion openers. You probably have to give up on hellion openers, unfortunately. Most current TvZ openings are 3OC reaper builds that reactor marines (in the case of Innovation's build, after getting 2 hellions) while building a few tanks and liberators/medivacs before adding on more raxes and 2 ebays. These are safe against nearly everything zerg can throw at you but you need to be on top of your liberator control and make sure not to lose the small amount of map control you have from the single reaper with or without 2 hellions. | ||
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SpecKROELLchen
Germany151 Posts
On December 24 2015 00:02 Guillermoman wrote: It's purpose is to lock on and stop drops. In TvT, it also is a hard counter to Banshees and Reapers. In TvP, it hard counters Oracle and helps against Pylon Overcharge rushes (one Lock-On can kill a pylon while being out of range). One thing i would like to mention is, that the cyclone counters 1 oracle. 2 oracles destroy a cyclone and you can get in real trouble sometimes. I refer to some pro matches but do not remember if it was at homestorycup or at the GSL code S qualifier. | ||
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NoisyNinja
United States991 Posts
On December 24 2015 06:42 SpecKROELLchen wrote: One thing i would like to mention is, that the cyclone counters 1 oracle. 2 oracles destroy a cyclone and you can get in real trouble sometimes. I refer to some pro matches but do not remember if it was at homestorycup or at the GSL code S qualifier. Do you know who was playing? If I have names, Google can do the rest for me. | ||
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Sissors
1395 Posts
On December 24 2015 05:27 Westy wrote: So what is a safe opener that survives the ling roach ravager allin? I am a mid-high masters terran, recently back from a longish break, and I just keep getting dicked by roach ravager ling allins. Hellion banshee, the hellions melt away and even if I can keep the banshee alive, it the zerg can literally clear my production buildings before I kill of their first wave. Not really got a clue how to handle this without giving up on hellion openers. What I do is more banshees. Granted I need to refine some stuff since it is a pain when they do break through your wall. Personally I don't bother with hellions in LotV. The zerg has either speed or roaches so fast their utility is alot more limitted. I rather add some widow mines: Very few zerg bother to check for widow mines when banshees are firing on them, which can result in quite some dead lings. It really helps if you see it coming, so you can repair your bunker (which I assume you have) while banshees do the killing part. And thats why it is important to take out ravagers asap, because if a bunch of them are alive you are not going to repair the bunker. | ||
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AXygnus
Portugal1008 Posts
I have no idea what composition I should be building in LotV, how should I play (aggressively, defensively)... | ||
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julyterran
15 Posts
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PinheadXXXXXX
United States897 Posts
On December 24 2015 07:57 AXygnus wrote: How the fuck do you even play against Zerg I have no idea what composition I should be building in LotV, how should I play (aggressively, defensively)... The basic gameplan hasn't changed much since HotS. You try to get some semblance of map control in the early game and try to keep the zerg honest (usually with liberators and perhaps a marine drop), and then once you get medivacs you focus on pushing back the creep, denying easy fourth base mining and then a fifth once you secure your own fourth. As in HotS, you try to take fights and trade favorably when possible, dropping if necessary to gain superior position. At this point in the game you will be on MMMM or MMM tank depending on preference. Once you secure a fourth and its gases, you want to look towards a ghost academy and 2-3 starports for liberators, getting ghosts earlier if zerg rushes hive, and then you want to keep playing the same game--drops to deny mining, choke zerg out, keep the creep back, and expand behind. Do not take bad fights. It's still fundamentally about map control; there may be a bit more focus on getting out specific tech (ghosts, liberators) but it doesn't change much. The specifics of how you go about denying bases, and the degree to which you split up your army, do vary, but you figure out how much to do this, and how aggressive to be based on the same fundamental judgments you used in HotS. | ||
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AXygnus
Portugal1008 Posts
On December 24 2015 08:38 PinheadXXXXXX wrote: The basic gameplan hasn't changed much since HotS. You try to get some semblance of map control in the early game and try to keep the zerg honest (usually with liberators and perhaps a marine drop), and then once you get medivacs you focus on pushing back the creep, denying easy fourth base mining and then a fifth once you secure your own fourth. As in HotS, you try to take fights and trade favorably when possible, dropping if necessary to gain superior position. At this point in the game you will be on MMMM or MMM tank depending on preference. Once you secure a fourth and its gases, you want to look towards a ghost academy and 2-3 starports for liberators, getting ghosts earlier if zerg rushes hive, and then you want to keep playing the same game--drops to deny mining, choke zerg out, keep the creep back, and expand behind. Do not take bad fights. It's still fundamentally about map control; there may be a bit more focus on getting out specific tech (ghosts, liberators) but it doesn't change much. The specifics of how you go about denying bases, and the degree to which you split up your army, do vary, but you figure out how much to do this, and how aggressive to be based on the same fundamental judgments you used in HotS. I skipped HotS and went straight from WoL to LotV... That may explain why I feel so lost. Even though I already felt lost in WoL TvZ (easily my worst match-up). So basically we still need to keep the pressure on, or pressure the Zerg even more in order to stop him from getting Hive tech. What about timings, especially expansion timings? When should I go 4M or MMM+Tank, is it really up to preference or would each one of them be better against a specific meta-composition? | ||
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NinjaDuckBob
187 Posts
On December 23 2015 04:19 MockHamill wrote: I you have tank/thor/liberator/hellbat/ghost and they go broodlord/corruptor/mass vipers what do you do with your ghosts? Do you EMP or do you snipe the vipers? EMP. Vipers can cancel your Snipe by pulling you. Even if you have extra Ghosts, you can EMP then still have some leftover for Snipes. | ||
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EAGER-beaver
Canada2799 Posts
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