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PartinG's PvT: The Big Boy Build

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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PartinG's PvT: The Big Boy Build

Text byTL Strategy
Graphics byMeru
September 22nd, 2014 01:25 GMT

(Wiki)PartinG

The BIG BOY Build



Introduction

Build overview
Early Game
Taking and Holding a Third Base
Holding SCV Pulls
Three Base Timings, Transitioning to Late Game
Build Variations
VoDs

Appendix
History of PvT During Heart of the Swarm
The Evolution of PartinG's Style
Comparing PartinG's and Zest's Styles


Parting and PvT


Throughout the history of SC2, few players have changed the PvT matchup as much as PartinG has. Over the years he has been credited with the invention or refinement of fast three-nexus into 10 gate timings, two base templar builds, late game templar usage, and most recently blink stalker/warp prism openers.

Just like his older styles, these blink builds are extremely technical and harder to execute than a more standard, passive colossus build, but they also allow for more control over the game and more opportunities for a superior player to take advantage of an opponent's mistakes or incorrect reads. More importantly, they are quite fun to play and a valid and powerful alternative to passive robo builds for every ladder player.



Build Overview


The goal of this style is to gain map control before a Terran can push out on the map in order to secure a faster third base than most other builds. The combination of early game pressure, light harassment capabilities and fairly quick colossus tech allow the Protoss to play more aggressively around 12:00-13:00 instead of being stuck in their base worrying about defending drops or SCV pulls. This second round of aggression in turn can either turn into a powerful all-in or simply secure a storm transition heading to the late game.

All these factors make this style quite deceiving to play against: the presence of blink stalkers early on is enough to scare most Terran players into being overly defensive, while the mid game colossus attacks hit at awkward timings that easily catch any opponent off guard and out of position. Additionally, the basic opening is extremely versatile, allowing for several different builds to mix things up and play very unpredictably.

Of course, not every build is perfect, and for every advantage gained there is also a drawback. Investing in early game stalker and a quick third naturally delays your upgrades, but more importantly, delays the robo for a minute and makes it impossible to afford an extensive observer network. This makes positioning your army perfectly to defend across three nexi extremely hard. Therefore, spreading pylons through the map to spot for potential drop paths is absolutely mandatory.



Early Game Opening and Execution


PartinG's favourite build is fairly non-standard as far as macro blink openers go, as he prefers to delay his extra gates in favour of a faster robo. This allows him to produce a very fast warp prism, or even get observers in time to defend most factory openings, without sacrificing stalker production significantly. His approximate timings are as follows:

Single gas MSC expand. 4 Chronos on the Nexus, then as blink as needed
23/26, 4:00: Second gas, pylon
26/34, 4:20: Stalker, warpgate. Units off first gateway: 3x stalkers
29/34, 5:00: Twilight council. Start blink as soon as it completes
~6:30-7:40: Robotics, then 2 gates, then natural gasses as money allows
100% Warpgate: warp in one stalker, then 3x more, then 3x zealots
100% Robo: Support bay, warp prism, 1-2 obs
~9:00: Third base and forge, extra gates as money allows
As mentioned in the intro, the goal of the blink/warp prism opening is to gain map control and kill a few SCVs while establishing colossus tech and a fast third base. Because you aren't really trying to commit to a straight up attack, feel free to leave the MSC at home to defend any counterattacks while you pressure.

When blink is finishing up and your warpgates are coming online, move out with your force along with a probe. Poke the Terran's front while dropping the zealots in the main with the warp prism, but never commit to a full on engagement. Use blink to retreat damaged stalkers while sniping marines, marauders and especially repairing SCVs, prioritizing keeping the warp prism alive over doing as much damage as possible. Your force cannot win a straight up engagement, so do not try to blink into the Terran's main. More importantly, utilize the probe you brought with you to start spreading spotter pylons along common drop routes. Ideally you should warp in from the same pylons used to defend drops (see the screenshots below).

While you pressure, you should take your third base and start tech up while warping in two to four sentries at home. If you execute your build correctly, you should be able to do all this while warping in seven to ten stalkers and three to six zealots.


[image loading]
Light Harassment. The stalkers are focusing exclusively on the repairing SCVs.



Taking and Holding a Third Base vs Drops and Timings



This phase of the game is particularly delicate. Around 9:30-10:00, the Terran will have his first set of medivacs, which means you will have to retreat to defend your newly established nexus. You should be particularly careful of players bypassing your stalker contain and sending the medivacs straight to your main base. Without proper positioning and map coverage, this move can cause considerable damage. To avoid this, you simply need perfect minimap awareness and good map control. In these screenshots, Parting is respectively the orange player on Frost and Merry Go Round, and the red one on Catallena and Deadwing. Note how he constantly utilizes every tool at his disposal - pylons, warp prisms, blink stalkers and observers - to have good map coverage and keep tabs on his opponent. The only exception is the Catallena screenshot, and the end result is losing his third nexus.

[image loading]
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[image loading]

[image loading]
[image loading]
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[image loading]
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[image loading]
Using pylons, army movement and the warp prism to check for army movements is mandatory. Note how on Catallena there is nothing to spot for the Terran army, resulting in a denied third base.


Spreading pylons, positioning observers and even using your warp prism for vision are absolutely key in holding off the Terran's mid game harassment. Against a particularly aggressive player who keeps trying to split his army in two, you may be forced into dividing your own army in groups of one to two colossi, one to two sentries and several stalkers. While hard to execute, this is easier to accomplish than with other builds because the faster third and delayed upgrades results in a bigger gateway force in this phase of the game. Note that splitting your army makes the individual groups particularly vulnerable, so again, scouting and map awareness are crucial.

[image loading]
Parting retreats his stalkers as soon as he spots Innovation's double medivac drop, thanks a well placed pylon


Holding SCV Pulls


Defending SCV pulls is usually a matter of execution and scouting more than build specifics. Nevertheless, they are common and powerful enough that they are very worth discussing. As a general guideline, there are a few tips that show a Terran might be preparing to pull the boys:

  • Low SCV count: normally Terrans who want to bring the boys will only make about 50 of them without really saturating their third, and instead maximizing their army supply and relying on MULEs for income.
  • Passive mid game: if your opponent is playing passively, it's likely that he wants to save units to hit a big mid game timing, with or without SCVs.
  • No armory, no second ebay, ghost academy or second starport on the way: all these things maximize a Terran's army strength in the short-term against colossus builds, especially if you are trying to get to storm in the meantime.

Note that these are just general guidelines, and many players simply decide to pull SCV when they feel ahead enough that they can end it with one big attack or too behind to be able to compete against both storm and colossi. Either way, you should always be active with an observer and/or with hallucinations to check for army movements and have a rough idea of when this kind of huge attack is coming your way.

The most important adjustment to make to hold these attacks with a colossus build is to have nonstop colossus production until you have at least four as well as a good stalker/zealot force to support them. Investing in extra upgrades, charge, a templar archives, oversaturating your third, or simply not having enough gateways ready in time is very likely to cause you to lose the game. As a general rule, if you don't think an upgrade or tech can be complete before the Terran's attack, do not invest into it and try to maximize your short-term army strength instead. A good general tip when going for a mass colossus opening is to go up to eight to ten gateways before taking the third base gases. This adjustment should give you enough production to defend most SCV pulls.


[image loading]
Dat 142/116 supply block. Not a good spot to be in, even with 2/2 completing.


As soon as you see the boys coming your way, try to use your blink stalkers, along with ramps and forcefields, to delay the attack. The longer the Terran isn't mining, the better, especially if you are waiting for any kind of investment to complete, whether that's upgrades, an extra colossus, a set of gateways or storm. Be ready to sacrifice your third base if necessary. If you do decide to abandon your third, make sure that it doesn't supply block you. You need to account for the loss of a few pylons along with a nexus; sacrificing a few of the probes there can help offset this. Avoiding supply blocks is absolutely KEY in surviving, and in fact, it's a huge reason why PartinG himself recently lost to Flash and TY. Along with crisp macro and a good build, you need patience. Stay calm, make sure your colossi are protected against vikings, and wait patiently for an occasion to forcefield the Terran's army or land a key time warp.

Three Base Timings and Pressures, Transitioning to Late Game



[image loading]
Wtf since when do Protoss players attack like this???


The combination of early game map control, a fast third and delayed upgrades make the Protoss mid game army considerably stronger than normal. Skipping the forge completely and cutting probes at about 52 results in a devastating three base all-in, but even if you saturate your third base and start upgrades regularly, it's possible to end the game with three colossi and several gateway units, especially if you are ahead either after pressuring with blink or defending your third base.

Despite having the power to end the game quickly, this build transitions very well into a long term macro game while still being able to put on significant pressure. If you can confirm that no SCV pulls or other committed attacks are coming your way (or that they simply aren't a threat), you can move out with three to four colossi while setting up a storm transition. Using the warp prism to control the Terran army movement and force him to split his attention is particularly useful. Note that while going storm, Parting saves gas by warping in only about ten stalkers. However, he makes considerably more when he decides to commit to an attack.

The most important thing to remember about this phase of the game is that that once medivacs are on the map, no matter what your intentions are, it is absolutely mandatory to know where the Terran army is if you decide to move out. Use any combination of pylons, observers, hallucinations and even warp prism harassment to scout for army movement or even force a retreat. If you move out blindly you just risk getting doom dropped while your army is in the middle of nowhere, effectively handing the game to your Terran opponent.


[image loading]

[image loading]
PartinG spots Innovation's army and saturated third base before deciding to move out.


Build Variations



The combination of a fast twilight council and robotics facility allow this same opening to branch out in several directions with only small adjustments. The most obvious one is, of course, infamouse 7gate blink all-in, but since it has already been discussed in a certain Great Book, everyone is probably familiar with it. Another way of going semi all-in with this blink opener is to delay the robo while constantly producing stalkers off three to four gates and committing to a straight up attack as you slowly saturate your natural expansion. However, this kind of attack is weaker than a full out blink all-in, which means you will still need to prepare the same three base colossus transition.

Next up, ask yourself...what is one click away when you have a warp prism and twilight council? Yep...DT drops, hooray!
PartinG has used two different builds off this same opener. The first one is a simple build where he does the same exact opening he would with the standard build but getting a dark shrine instead of blink. This is particularly strong on Overgrowth, where DTs can bypass a turret at the natural by warping in from a pylon at the third base. After the harassment phase, PartinG goes for a more standard two base colossus/blink style into a third base. This is the build order he used against Maru in their last GSL match:

  • Standard MSC expand/twilight council opener
  • Only build 2x stalkers off the first gate
  • DT Shrine and second gate as soon as twilight council completes, sneak out a probe for proxy pylons
  • 6:30: Robotics, natural gasses as money allows; units off the robo: warp prism, 2-3 observers
  • 100% dt shrine: warp in DTs at your proxy pylons, send one to the main and one to the natural
  • Only warp in additional DTs if the opportunity is there. Prioritize killing SCVs over sniping add-ons unless you are sure the Terran won't have a scan in time.
  • ~8:30: Support bay and forge; play standard two base colossus/blink from here


The second build adds a DT drop on top of the blink stalker pressure, and is considerably less standard. In his match against TY, PartinG decided to still go fast third off this, but the investment into the DTs makes the nexus much harder to hold. If you choose this variation, be prepared to cancel it if a group of stimmed bio shows up. The build order is basically the standard blink/warp prism opening, but it delays the support bay and fast third nexus by about one minute in favor of starting a dark shrine together with blink and the warp prism.

[image loading]
Artosis' favourite build!


The last variation that Parting has used in a televised matchup is a simple two base, double forge colossus/blink build. Note that since the robo is still slightly delayed, it is still impossible to afford more than a couple of observers, making this a slightly sub-optimal build. Regardless, it can be a powerful addition to your arsenal, especially on blink-friendly maps like Catallena or King Sejong Station. The build order is:

  • Standard blink/robo opener, only make one extra gate after the robo
  • Units off robo: 2-3 observers
  • 7:40: Double forge, support bay
  • 8:40: 4 extra gates



VoDs



[image loading] Parting vs Maru on Star Station from Proleague Round 1.
This is, to my knowledge, the first time a rough version of this build was used in a televised match. Maru just so happened to be doing some weird 2-rax reaper build that did nothing, and so the three gate blink timing ended up winning the game.

[image loading] Parting vs MMA on Overgrowth from GSL GT.
This is the first appearance of the macro variant of the build, including a non all-in three base push that completely catches MMA off guard and ends the game.

[image loading] Parting vs Supernova on Waystation from GSL S2.
[image loading] Parting vs TY on Merry Go Round from SPL Round 3.
These are two early versions of the build which still include some kind of heavily committed pressure. Note how the attack is not as powerful as a six to seven gate all-in and can only end the game if the Terran commits to a bad fight. The macro follow-up is also delayed considerably.

[image loading] Parting vs Bunny on Frost from SPL round 4
This is the first time this innovative style was used in its most refined form, and, in fact, it caught even the commentators off-guard. Because of Bunny's greedy 3CC opening, the light pressure along with fast third was enough to put PartinG so ahead that, again, the three base pressure simply ended the game.

[image loading] Parting vs bbyong on Outboxer from SPL playoffs
This game is a perfect example of what to do against both widow mine openings and mech. Blink stalkers and an early robo allow PartinG to both secure a fast third base and hit a powerful immortal/blink timing.

[image loading] Parting vs Flash on Merry Go Round from SPL playoffs
In this game, Parting commits to the three base all-in despite being slightly behind after the early game, adjusting by attacking with one less colossus than normal. This proves to be fatal, as Flash was setting up an SCV pull, which closed the game out after a crucial supply block and a terrible engagement by Parting.

[image loading] Parting vs TY on Overgrowth from GSL S3
This game features the two base double forge/colossus variant. Again, PartinG loses to an SCV pull that he could have held had he not been supply blocked and engaged somewhat poorly.

[image loading] Parting vs TY on Catallena from GSL S3
In this game Parting goes for a DT drop along with the blink pressure. The mid game is extremely sloppy from both sides, but it shows reasonably well how important map vision is in defending the third base.

[image loading] Parting vs Maru on Overgrowth from GSL S3
The second DT variant used by Parting, made particularly effective by the map's architecture.

[image loading] Parting vs Innovation on Deadwing from GSL S3
This is the latest, most evolved version of the style. It skips the aggressive mass stalker/three colossus timing to instead push with four colossi exclusively to open some room to harass and tech to storm. Also notable is Parting's early game map vision.


Appendix



History of PvT During Heart of the Swarm


Throughout HotS, PvT has probably been one of the most changing matchups. While the mid game battles of bio vs gateway units/AoE has remained the same since 2010, the builds used by Protoss players have changed drastically.

The start of the expansion seemed to signal an era of Terran dominance: the new medivac boost, hellbats, and mines all proved to be devastating against outdated, WoL-style Protoss builds. As a result, many players began mixing up their strategies with proxy oracles, one base blink, and immortal busts almost becoming the norm. Eventually macro builds were developed again, and thanks to the defensive power of the mothership core, many went back to the familiar style of simple, passive colossus openings. Protoss were able to defend and get comfortably to late game again.

This was soon countered by Terrans with seemingly unstoppable SCV pulls, exploiting the timing window before storm was ready and punishing the outdated three colossus builds still used. However, combined with a hellbat nerf and a new map pool that offered particularly exposed mains, there was a rise of abusive two base blink all-ins along with templar openings that could defend SCV builds much more easily while giving Protoss players more harassment and non all-in offensive options than any colossus style. The sheer number of oracle, DT, blink, robo, templar or colossus openings seemed too much for the Terran's limited toolkit, and many Terran players felt helpless against the multitude of Protoss defensive and offensive strategies. Despite their struggles though, Terrans kept on fighting, and indeed, this era produced some of the most exciting PvT series to date, with both sides splitting up their armies and keeping up the aggression until one side crumbled to the multitasking required to keep up or to the power of late game deathballs.

Blizzard again intervened by buffing the mine specifically against Protoss shields with the declared intent of improving Terran's early game harassment options. While not successfully changing much in the PvT early game, the new mines proved to be devastating against chargelots, to the point of rendering every templar before colossus opening obsolete. Protoss players were back at square one: Colossus builds died to SCV pulls, templar builds died to mines. Luckily, Protoss players quickly adapted to the new metagame and learned how to defend most attacks with their robo-based builds.

In the modern days of PvT, the options for the Protoss are more limited than ever, and the vast majority of games feature completely passive colossus play that can not afford to play overly greedy, as the threat of "the boys" is always lurking. However, as PartinG and Zest have showed in their recent matches, there is room for innovative builds that combine the strength of both templar and colossus builds. This build combines the map control, harassment, and opportunity for aggression of templar builds, with the mobility and strength of colossus styles, while being perfectly capable of dealing both with mines and SCV pulls.


The Evolution of PartinG's Style


While most Protoss players have at some point employed macro-oriented blink openings, none has refined or embraced the playstyle as much as PartinG has. Not only is blink/robo his go to PvT opener these days, but he has also developed several different follow-ups to remain unpredictable.

Even the way he utilizes his units has changed with time, as shown in the VODs. The first versions of the builds he used, dating to the early rounds of Proleague, featured three to four gate blink timings that were considerably more aggressive at the cost of severely delayed robo tech and a third base. These attacks do allow a macro follow-up by saturating the natural expansion reasonably quickly, but it's extremely delayed compared to more modern versions. As Terrans became better at dealing with blink all-ins, these kind of non-committal heavy pressure builds also became less and less effective, to the point of almost not being worth the investment.

The modern version of the blink/robo build is very, very different from its roots. Using blink stalkers only to poke at the front makes it considerably less map dependent than in the past, and thanks to the quick third base and robo tech, the blink investment doesn't need to do major damage to pay for itself. Most importantly, the ability to harass and keep map control while punishing mistakes with powerful three base attacks is something that previously only templar builds could accomplish, while colossus openings tended to always play extremely passively until around +2/+3 upgrades and storm are researched. The ability to be out on the map more often and more safely thanks to a bigger army is something no other colossus build has achieved to date, and is a very notable step in the evolution of PvT.

Parting and Zest's Styles



To date, the only other player to truly commit to blink/robo builds is Zest, as shown by his recent IEM games. Interestingly, the way he chooses to play out games is very different from PartinG, despite using very similar builds.

While PartinG is certainly capable and willing of hitting three base all-ins and timings, it isn't the center of his play. He prefers to not commit as much to his attacks, and instead he quickly saturates his third base while putting on some light pressure. His goal with the colossus pushes is usually to simply set up his late game army while punishing opponents that fall particularly behind. To this end, he has also developed several different builds to keep his opponents guessing and unsure while his macro gets going.

Zest at IEM, on the other hand, showed a much more brute force style. He mixed in more aggressive four gate builds with delayed robos to come out farther ahead in the early game and, most importantly, set up a three base all-in designed to finish the game before the Terran had enough vikings to threaten his colossi. In fact, this 50 probe, three base all-in build is the only follow-up he employed to the blink opening for the entire tournament.

It's truly impressive how a simple re-arrangement of the standard pieces in a PvT macro build (blink, colossus, ugprades and 3rd base) can allow for such diversity in styles, while essentially executing the same build order. With time, we may see this even creep in as the new standard PvT opening. Thanks again, PartinG senpai!


Brought to you by the TL Strategy Team
Writers: Teoita
Graphics: Meru
Editors: Zeth, SC2John, NovemberstOrm
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Applesmack
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada680 Posts
September 22 2014 01:31 GMT
#2
OMG! Just what I needed. Thanks a lot!
Mahanaim
Profile Joined December 2012
Korea (South)1002 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-22 01:34:44
September 22 2014 01:34 GMT
#3
"Artosis' favorite build" cracked me up.



P.S. Great article, as always!
Celebrating Starcraft since... a long time ago.
Erik.TheRed
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1655 Posts
September 22 2014 01:44 GMT
#4
cool shit, thanks guys!
"See you space cowboy"
CosmicSpiral
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States15275 Posts
September 22 2014 01:49 GMT
#5
This is a great article.
WriterWovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muß man schweigen.
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
September 22 2014 01:54 GMT
#6
Woot woot! Go productivity!

As always, everyone is welcome to ask questions, provide criticism (useful and mannered criticism that is), and share any experience with the build, either playing it or playing against it .
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
r691175002
Profile Joined October 2012
249 Posts
September 22 2014 02:01 GMT
#7
Let TL Strat show you how to play the matchup like a Big Boy and find success like PartinG.

I laughed when I saw this article description right after Parting got knocked out of groups with a 1-4 mapscore.
Darkhorse
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
United States23455 Posts
September 22 2014 02:04 GMT
#8
Awesome article! Now Protoss players everywhere can get rekt by Polt just like Parting!

In all seriousness stop teaching Protoss players how to beat me D:
WriterRecently Necro'd (?)
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States44158 Posts
September 22 2014 02:14 GMT
#9
Yay this is awesome! Thanks guys!
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
September 22 2014 02:28 GMT
#10
What is the best way to scout/defend a hellion attack, such as in Parting vs Polt in Red Bull Battlegrounds?

Thanks a bunch for the guide, by the way! I'll definitely give it a try!
Iodem
Profile Joined October 2010
United States1173 Posts
September 22 2014 02:36 GMT
#11
For you.
If you don't like it, you can quit.
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
September 22 2014 03:21 GMT
#12
On September 22 2014 11:28 Trfel wrote:
What is the best way to scout/defend a hellion attack, such as in Parting vs Polt in Red Bull Battlegrounds?

Thanks a bunch for the guide, by the way! I'll definitely give it a try!


To be honest, those builds were highly specialized for that series and were designed to deal specifically with PartinG's builds (and his complete lack of scouting) So, there's that.

Main thing is to figure out where the gas is going. The most common way this is done is by scouting with a probe on 13 after gateway, checking the gas timing, and then hiding the probe somewhere for a followup scout ~4:00. This followup scout will let you know if the Terran is expanding and also if he stopped mining gas at 50-100 to get barracks 2-3 up faster. If the Terran hasn't done either, you know something is up and some kind of factory and/or starport pressure is underway. If this probe gets denied (from the reaper hunting it down or whatever), you can just poke with a stalker and count the marines. If there's a conspicuously small amount of marines (<8), it's usually some kind of factory play.

As far as actually defending it, just play defensively and make sure you're not hardcore cutting units. If you're doing this particular build (3-gate blink -> robo), just warp in the first six stalkers at home before poking around and starting to pressure. If your opponent cuts early rax production or delays stim/ebay/medivac timings, he's going to be putting himself behind to do the pressure, so you don't have to start attacking right away like you would normally.

In short:
  • Get a good read on the gas usage
  • Play defensively
  • Make units and more than one gateway
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
Cricketer12
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
United States13972 Posts
September 22 2014 04:24 GMT
#13
#TheBigBoyBuild
Kaina + Drones Linkcro Summon Cupsie Yummy Way
Xanatoss
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany539 Posts
September 22 2014 05:16 GMT
#14
Oh boy! This saves my day. Didnt expect this so fast. Much props to TL Strategy!
The chair slowly turns around. You see his face, but it can't be. He's not supposed to be here. Not him. Not a Protoss. Not THAT Protoss. MC says, "Hi Greg, long time no see." You back slowly out of the booth. But you can't. It's already forcefielded.
Joedaddy
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States1948 Posts
September 22 2014 05:48 GMT
#15
Is the robo done in time to deal with mine drops?
I might be the minority on TL, but TL is the minority everywhere else.
Whitewing
Profile Joined October 2010
United States7483 Posts
September 22 2014 07:01 GMT
#16
Teo so boss.
Strategy"You know I fucking hate the way you play, right?" ~SC2John
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-22 07:32:56
September 22 2014 07:31 GMT
#17
On September 22 2014 14:48 Joedaddy wrote:
Is the robo done in time to deal with mine drops?


Yes. It does depend on the specific builds though (gates vs robo first for example).

On September 22 2014 12:21 SC2John wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 22 2014 11:28 Trfel wrote:
What is the best way to scout/defend a hellion attack, such as in Parting vs Polt in Red Bull Battlegrounds?

Thanks a bunch for the guide, by the way! I'll definitely give it a try!

In short:
  • Get a good read on the gas usage
  • Play defensively
  • Make units and more than one gateway


Also it can be helpful to partially wall your ramp with one pylon+gate, hold position a stalker there to keep hellions from running up, and focus exclusively on defending your main while letting your natural nexus tank some damage. I have seen Rain doing this on stream a few times.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24417 Posts
September 22 2014 08:15 GMT
#18
Been doing this for weeks
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
samurai80
Profile Joined November 2011
Japan4225 Posts
September 22 2014 08:44 GMT
#19
Awesome <3
moofang
Profile Joined June 2011
508 Posts
September 22 2014 09:31 GMT
#20
Thank you! Struggling to find a new equillibrium macro playstyle after having to tearfully leave my trusty old templar opening behind. Really really needed this.
Pandemona *
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Charlie Sheens House51478 Posts
September 22 2014 09:33 GMT
#21
Criticism = Teoita isn't any fun.

Positive = Nice article, woop. BIG BOY BUILD :3
ModeratorTeam Liquid Football Thread Guru! - Chelsea FC ♥
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
September 22 2014 09:57 GMT
#22
My articles are alwasys fun
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
SonGoku
Profile Joined September 2013
Germany152 Posts
September 22 2014 10:44 GMT
#23
Great. The 100th protoss article. Terran, guys. TERRAN!
Metak
Profile Joined August 2011
296 Posts
September 22 2014 11:04 GMT
#24
Amazing writeup, thanks!
SatedSC2
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
England3012 Posts
September 22 2014 12:02 GMT
#25
--- Nuked ---
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
September 22 2014 12:24 GMT
#26
On September 22 2014 19:44 SonGoku wrote:
Great. The 100th protoss article. Terran, guys. TERRAN!


You do realize that writing for TL is done on a voluntary basis, and we haven't had a dedicated (and very active) terran writer in forever?

On September 22 2014 21:02 SatedSC2 wrote:
Playing without an Observer network scares the hell out of me in PvT. In fact, playing macro on maps that aren't Overgrowth scares the hell out of me because it's so easy for Terran to drop on the other three maps I play even if you do have a bunch of Observers (esp. Catallena and Merry Go Round). I'd really love to try this style, but I think it's too far beyond my comfort zone/skill-level. This is a cool write-up though, and it's definitely a strong style if you're comfortable with being vulnerable to drops (by which I mean comfortable with not seeing drops coming via Observers), or you have PartinG level game-sense =P


Yes, the execution part of spreading pylons and hallucinations while being active with blink stalkers is the hardest part of this build, especially when you are used to having 5-6 obs map hacking all over the map
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
lantz
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States762 Posts
September 22 2014 13:17 GMT
#27
I thought he got pwned in Redbull, why would I want to lose in ladder?
DinoMight
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States3725 Posts
September 22 2014 13:44 GMT
#28
THANKS.
"Wtf I come back and find myself in camp DinoMight all of a sudden, feels weird man." -Wombat_NI
DinoMight
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States3725 Posts
September 22 2014 13:46 GMT
#29
On September 22 2014 22:17 lantz wrote:
I thought he got pwned in Redbull, why would I want to lose in ladder?


He's one of the best performing players in Pro League and has reached GSL Code S something like 11x in a row now?

Sure, he didn't do well at Red Bull, but losing 1-2 to Polt and 0-2 to Scarlett is an "any given Sunday" type of thing.
"Wtf I come back and find myself in camp DinoMight all of a sudden, feels weird man." -Wombat_NI
Cricketer12
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
United States13972 Posts
September 22 2014 14:29 GMT
#30
On September 22 2014 22:46 DinoMight wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 22 2014 22:17 lantz wrote:
I thought he got pwned in Redbull, why would I want to lose in ladder?


He's one of the best performing players in Pro League and has reached GSL Code S something like 11x in a row now?

Sure, he didn't do well at Red Bull, but losing 1-2 to Polt and 0-2 to Scarlett is an "any given Sunday" type of thing.

Then let's use a DRG build, he is on 15, time for a DRG award?
Kaina + Drones Linkcro Summon Cupsie Yummy Way
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
September 22 2014 14:32 GMT
#31
Are you seriously deciding, based on a series alone (did he even use this style vs polt?), wether a build is viable?
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
SatedSC2
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
England3012 Posts
September 22 2014 14:35 GMT
#32
--- Nuked ---
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
September 22 2014 14:36 GMT
#33
Also historically he has brought an insane number of innovations to the matchup.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
KathrynWard
Profile Joined September 2014
United States3 Posts
September 22 2014 15:39 GMT
#34
--- Nuked ---
Whitewing
Profile Joined October 2010
United States7483 Posts
September 22 2014 15:53 GMT
#35
This is a very solid build and an excellent write-up Teo. Parting is a brilliant player, and this style fits right in with the recent switch to late upgrade styles. Just think: it's only very recently that the creator.prime style has fallen into disfavor.
Strategy"You know I fucking hate the way you play, right?" ~SC2John
parkufarku
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
882 Posts
September 22 2014 16:00 GMT
#36
On September 22 2014 19:44 SonGoku wrote:
Great. The 100th protoss article. Terran, guys. TERRAN!


Go away Terran. You're disrespecting a well-written article and its dedicated author. There are plenty of T stuff on TL if you look. Disgusting behavior.
pheer
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
5390 Posts
September 22 2014 16:51 GMT
#37
I haven't played sc2 since Hots came out, so the history section in the appendix was a nice little read to understand how PvT has changed since its release. Thanks for that Teo!
Moderator
CuChullain
Profile Joined February 2010
Switzerland85 Posts
September 22 2014 18:10 GMT
#38
Since i have a Terran friend on equal skill level, I was looking for PvT builds on google, then liquipedia. Did not find any useful information. So i decided to check teamliquid forum and on the front site it said: «Having trouble in PvT lately? Let TL Strat show you how to play the matchup like a Big Boy and find success like PartinG The Big Boy Build» I was like BINGO! Thanks.
Kazahk
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
United States385 Posts
September 22 2014 18:23 GMT
#39
TL so protoss biased, I swear when will we get a nice terran guid like this?
Rngesus blessed me with a tooth half, then shunned me with a spinach roll.
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-22 18:55:46
September 22 2014 18:54 GMT
#40
On September 23 2014 03:23 Kazahk wrote:
TL so protoss biased, I swear when will we get a nice terran guid like this?


When we can find a terran writer as consistent as me

As a group we don't really hate on races (i personally hate zergs but that's not the point), we just do what we can with the people we have, and unfortunately, we don't really have any terran writers that can produce consistent content right now. We know it's been an issue for a long time, but it's not one that can be fixed very easily.

On September 23 2014 01:51 pheer wrote:
I haven't played sc2 since Hots came out, so the history section in the appendix was a nice little read to understand how PvT has changed since its release. Thanks for that Teo!


Glad you liked it, no problem
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Mozdk
Profile Joined October 2010
Denmark6989 Posts
September 22 2014 20:28 GMT
#41
Looks great. I'll give this a try once I've read up a bit more and watched a few more VODs.

But it seems like it's a thin edge to make work for a diamond player. I'll probably get smacked a lot by WM openings... And probably wont beat mech ever.... But that's standard.
"It's really hard to Protoss" - White-Ra |||| "Apedts are dfucking amazing" - Lorning
Mozdk
Profile Joined October 2010
Denmark6989 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-22 20:30:55
September 22 2014 20:30 GMT
#42
On September 22 2014 12:21 SC2John wrote:

[*]Make units and more than one gateway


Blasphemy!
"It's really hard to Protoss" - White-Ra |||| "Apedts are dfucking amazing" - Lorning
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-22 20:55:49
September 22 2014 20:55 GMT
#43
On September 23 2014 05:28 Mozdk wrote:
Looks great. I'll give this a try once I've read up a bit more and watched a few more VODs.

But it seems like it's a thin edge to make work for a diamond player. I'll probably get smacked a lot by WM openings... And probably wont beat mech ever.... But that's standard.


You should be ok against widow mine openings as the robo is actually really fast, and you can always scout them before committing to this if you do not feel confident.

What is really going to cause losses to players not used to playing this style mostly the lack of observers imo. It's possible to have good map vision without them, but it's considerably harder. It definitely is a good style to learn if you want to improve your positioning and map awareness, not to mention imo it's more fun to play than robo openings.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Xanatoss
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany539 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-22 21:27:14
September 22 2014 21:13 GMT
#44
One of the major problems I encountered so far are stim timings that arrive just arround the time I warp in stalkers 5-7 and blink is around finishing. But even with Overcharge I either loose a lot of probes or most of my stalkers. Any advice about that?

Btw: The game on King Sejong Station - Parting vs Polt from RB Washington is an exceptional example of scaling a build down to match a decimated economy due to early harassment. Seeing Parting still going for this build step by step but with like 2/3 of what he usally would have had at each timestamp was beautiful in itself.
The chair slowly turns around. You see his face, but it can't be. He's not supposed to be here. Not him. Not a Protoss. Not THAT Protoss. MC says, "Hi Greg, long time no see." You back slowly out of the booth. But you can't. It's already forcefielded.
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-22 21:30:22
September 22 2014 21:29 GMT
#45
Yeah those kinds of builds are a pain in the ass for all blink stalker openings because you don't really rush a colossus or get sentries out, and when you are pushed vs your own nexus stalkers do not have any room to manouver.

I'm not completely sure on the timings as there's lots of variations out there, but going gates before robo and instantly warping in a round of units should help. Maybe try mixing in a few zealots for tanking. If you are really, really desperate i guess you could also scout the poke coming with a stalker, and then make an immortal instead of the warp prism, but that's not ideal.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Xinzoe
Profile Joined January 2014
Korea (South)2373 Posts
September 22 2014 21:41 GMT
#46
On September 23 2014 06:13 Xanatoss wrote:
One of the major problems I encountered so far are stim timings that arrive just arround the time I warp in stalkers 5-7 and blink is around finishing. But even with Overcharge I either loose a lot of probes or most of my stalkers. Any advice about that?

Btw: The game on King Sejong Station - Parting vs Polt from RB Washington is an exceptional example of scaling a build down to match a decimated economy due to early harassment. Seeing Parting still going for this build step by step but with like 2/3 of what he usally would have had at each timestamp was beautiful in itself.


are u talking about 8:30 stim attacks arriving at your natural or when he moves out? cuz that seems really fast. otherwise I just use the stalkers to slowly pick off units as he moves across the map. normally u can kill enough that nexus cannon will save u. if u baited a stim then u already held off the push.
igay
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Australia1178 Posts
September 22 2014 23:58 GMT
#47
This is the sickest build but holy shit I don't think I could pull this off
MVP <3 MKP <3 DRG <3
Joedaddy
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States1948 Posts
September 23 2014 01:20 GMT
#48
On September 23 2014 03:23 Kazahk wrote:
TL so protoss biased, I swear when will we get a nice terran guid like this?


Didn't you read the "Gangam Terran" guide? It was very helpful!
I might be the minority on TL, but TL is the minority everywhere else.
Entropy137
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada215 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-23 05:51:35
September 23 2014 05:47 GMT
#49
delete
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
September 23 2014 11:18 GMT
#50
On September 23 2014 10:20 Joedaddy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2014 03:23 Kazahk wrote:
TL so protoss biased, I swear when will we get a nice terran guid like this?


Didn't you read the "Gangam Terran" guide? It was very helpful!


I just don't get how to this day people still confuse guides with game analysis.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Salient
Profile Joined August 2011
United States876 Posts
September 23 2014 13:10 GMT
#51
Could you get a Templar Archives instead of Rovo Bay for the mid game transition? You would already have blink stalkers and access to observers in case of mines.
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-23 13:19:41
September 23 2014 13:18 GMT
#52
You could probably afford it, but imo it's not a good idea because
a) This style heavily delays upgrades, which templar styles rely on
b) It's been talked to death, templar is not even remotely close as strong as what it used to be because of mines. Even if it isn't completely unviable, at best it's an opening similar to a dt build: something you can do once in a while, but not a standard build to rely on.
c) This particular build is hard enough to execute as is, without adding the need to micro vs mines.
d) The whole point of this build is to have some advantages of templar play built into colossus styles
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24417 Posts
September 23 2014 13:20 GMT
#53
On September 23 2014 22:10 Salient wrote:
Could you get a Templar Archives instead of Rovo Bay for the mid game transition? You would already have blink stalkers and access to observers in case of mines.


That's an older HotS build, one that HerO for example used to great effect at IEM Cologne. But the general consensus nowadays (that I agree with) is that templar styles aren't viable against someone who knows what they're doing.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
September 23 2014 13:24 GMT
#54
On September 23 2014 22:20 DarkLordOlli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2014 22:10 Salient wrote:
Could you get a Templar Archives instead of Rovo Bay for the mid game transition? You would already have blink stalkers and access to observers in case of mines.


That's an older HotS build, one that HerO for example used to great effect at IEM Cologne. But the general consensus nowadays (that I agree with) is that templar styles aren't viable against someone who knows what they're doing.


I think that's not entirely true. Templar builds can work once in a while as a surprise build (again, exactly like dt's), and in fact the assumption that they are not viable does make them somewhat playable. However they are NOT as robust as they used to be, and definitely can not be used as a standard build (again, exactly like dt play).
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Don Jimbo
Profile Joined August 2014
70 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-23 20:27:01
September 23 2014 20:24 GMT
#55
Mana used this build against MMA today in WCS EU (first set). He held a proxy gas first mine drop and only lost two probes in the first game. He proceeded to get outplayed and lose, but at least the opening seemed to put him into a decent mid-game. He held a really early stim push in the second game despite having very few units. The build looked really vulnerable to the stim timing, but somehow it held with flawless control. Unfortunately, Mana proceeded to lose the game due to really bad stalker positioning (out in the middle of the map when his main was getting dropped). Anyway, it was a nice display that the build can hold up to scary early pressure as long as you control really well.
When you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes into you
Xanatoss
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany539 Posts
September 23 2014 20:37 GMT
#56
The 2nd Game wasnt a stim timing. It was combat shield first, which wasnt completed either. So just regular bio pressure halted by overcharge. Mana did control well during that though.
All in all his version of the build seemed worse to me and his execution in the mid- and lategame was very sloppy.
The chair slowly turns around. You see his face, but it can't be. He's not supposed to be here. Not him. Not a Protoss. Not THAT Protoss. MC says, "Hi Greg, long time no see." You back slowly out of the booth. But you can't. It's already forcefielded.
ReachTheSky
Profile Joined April 2010
United States3294 Posts
September 23 2014 22:50 GMT
#57
Extremely well written. Thank you for contributing.
TL+ Member
brickrd
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
United States4894 Posts
September 24 2014 00:22 GMT
#58
On September 24 2014 05:24 Don Jimbo wrote:
Mana used this build against MMA today in WCS EU (first set). He held a proxy gas first mine drop and only lost two probes in the first game. He proceeded to get outplayed and lose, but at least the opening seemed to put him into a decent mid-game. He held a really early stim push in the second game despite having very few units. The build looked really vulnerable to the stim timing, but somehow it held with flawless control. Unfortunately, Mana proceeded to lose the game due to really bad stalker positioning (out in the middle of the map when his main was getting dropped). Anyway, it was a nice display that the build can hold up to scary early pressure as long as you control really well.

he didnt lose because of stalker positioning, the drop in his main didnt do anything other than sniping a pylon + the twilight. he lost because of a horrible fight at MMAs base where he move commanded colossus and got surrounded in a huge arc by bio+scvs
TL+ Member
AkashSky
Profile Joined May 2014
United States257 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-24 00:38:52
September 24 2014 00:37 GMT
#59
@Teoita ,

I wanna try out this style, but I don't want to change my current opener as it is.
What is the best way to transition to this style using my current opener which is:

9 pylon
11 gas (This is timed so that exactly 200 gas is mined when cybernetics core completes)
11 gate
(going 11/11 means that I am cutting a single probe)
**12-15**2x cronoboost on nexus**
17 pylon
18/18/18 [MSC+Stalker+warpgate @ the same time]
**MSC and Stalker are cronoboosted**

That is my opening and I like it a lot.

From this point should I,

1). Pull probes out of gas to get an expansion up faster,

2). Add a second gas geyser and go for twilight council before expanding,

or

3). Not pull probes out of gas and go for an expansion followed by a twilight council into a second gas,

Basically, whats the most optimal way to transition into this style?

Following this, what is the safest time to start the robo facility using this style?

Because I am getting warp gate fairly fast, I want to time in 1-2 gateways with its completion, but I don't know how many gateways I can afford while getting blink as well. At bare minimum I want to get an observer out into my mineral line in time for a widow mine drop so I can use photon overcharge + observer to defend the drop.

Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
September 24 2014 07:03 GMT
#60
Honestly, that opening is uxtremely unoptimized because it cuts probes for an extremely long time, and you should just do a more standard opener. It's possible to fast expand without just rushing a msc (cj hero does that a lot), but there's better ways to do it than with your build.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
InVerno
Profile Joined May 2011
258 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-24 12:44:55
September 24 2014 12:43 GMT
#61
Teo you wrote this without mentioning who created this build, putting a banner photo of a random virgin asian guy? Karma will hit you hard someday - at least the title should be "Train sorry for all the bullshits i've told you, you was right".

User was warned for this post
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-24 12:48:05
September 24 2014 12:47 GMT
#62
Train's builds always were half arsed as fuck tbh

I've seen him going blink while doing the one colo no range builds and making a total of 3 stalkers...
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
IeZaeL
Profile Joined July 2012
Italy991 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-24 13:45:34
September 24 2014 13:37 GMT
#63
Actually those 3 stalkers did much more damage than your 30 zealots 9.30 allins in PvZ.
I will try this build definitely!
Author of Coda and Eastwatch.
ZeromuS
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada13389 Posts
September 24 2014 13:40 GMT
#64
If you want to have this conversation with Teo, please do so through other channels. This thread is about being a BIG BOY after all.
StrategyRTS forever | @ZeromuS_plays | www.twitch.tv/Zeromus_
FrozenProbe
Profile Joined March 2012
Italy276 Posts
September 24 2014 14:19 GMT
#65
I miss these discussions :D
TheTrain
Profile Joined November 2011
Italy8 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-09-24 15:15:48
September 24 2014 15:14 GMT
#66
Teo I love you.
Btw, every build w/ blink is a good build.
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
September 24 2014 15:17 GMT
#67
Please don't spam here or i'll ban you all
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Xanatoss
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany539 Posts
September 30 2014 05:25 GMT
#68
Still love this build. An interesting part is that on lower parts of ladder one doesnt need flawless execution, because a scouted twilight and the following agression often leads to many faults and overreacting on terrans side.
So much fun.
The chair slowly turns around. You see his face, but it can't be. He's not supposed to be here. Not him. Not a Protoss. Not THAT Protoss. MC says, "Hi Greg, long time no see." You back slowly out of the booth. But you can't. It's already forcefielded.
techin
Profile Joined March 2014
China4 Posts
October 01 2014 13:57 GMT
#69
That's very good
AkashSky
Profile Joined May 2014
United States257 Posts
July 26 2015 21:01 GMT
#70
Are you suppose to take your third base while on 3 gateways?
-HuShang-
Profile Joined December 2012
Canada393 Posts
July 26 2015 21:47 GMT
#71
On July 27 2015 06:01 AkashSky wrote:
Are you suppose to take your third base while on 3 gateways?


This guides pretty old. the standard lately is to take your third on 3 gateways if their stim is delayed. aka mine drops. If their stim isnt delayed you will see the protoss tech up to 6 gateways first usually. Although earlier in the week zest took his third before 6 gates but he skipped the forges till after the third was up.
Professional Starcraft 2 Coach & Caster | Message me for more info or business proposals
Fuell
Profile Joined February 2011
Netherlands3111 Posts
July 26 2015 23:30 GMT
#72
Seems like PartinG is still using this (or a slight variation) very frequently these days. I think I saw this build every game versus TY when he 3-0'd him at IEM a couple of days ago. His 2015 PvT winrate reflects the strength of this strat a bit .
fOu/Zenith/NEX/WeRRa/SlayerS
Alucen-Will-
Profile Joined October 2014
United States4054 Posts
July 27 2015 04:32 GMT
#73
On July 27 2015 08:30 Fuell wrote:
Seems like PartinG is still using this (or a slight variation) very frequently these days. I think I saw this build every game versus TY when he 3-0'd him at IEM a couple of days ago. His 2015 PvT winrate reflects the strength of this strat a bit .


More so it reflects his talent, but yes he still definitely uses this build and it's still one of the absolute best builds in the MU
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