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On November 25 2014 09:12 Mozdk wrote: My PvT is so horrible. Has been for many season. Only thing holding me back from Masters. What pros are great at it. With a lot of different strats. Looking for macro. And looking for someone where I can find a lot of replays from recent games. Anything past WM buff is good.
Edit: VODs don't matter. Need replays. I find VODs are great for ideas. Not for BO's.
CJherO is probably the most renowned PvT player at the moment, although I'm not sure about super recent replays. You might be able to find some from recent IEM's if there have been any.
Yeah I know, but the last time I searched for his games, I couldn't find any (recent ones).
Happy birthday
Any other sugggestions are still welcome.
I can recommend you from IEM Toronto (3 months ago) : Zest vs Yoda, game 3 (overgrowth). You can find the thread with the replay pack here on TL. Really solid BO for 1 gate expo > robo into 3 base blink colossus with quick charge/storm, staying on a single forge until on 6 gases.
On November 25 2014 09:12 Mozdk wrote: My PvT is so horrible. Has been for many season. Only thing holding me back from Masters. What pros are great at it. With a lot of different strats. Looking for macro. And looking for someone where I can find a lot of replays from recent games. Anything past WM buff is good.
Edit: VODs don't matter. Need replays. I find VODs are great for ideas. Not for BO's.
CJherO is probably the most renowned PvT player at the moment, although I'm not sure about super recent replays. You might be able to find some from recent IEM's if there have been any.
Yeah I know, but the last time I searched for his games, I couldn't find any (recent ones).
Happy birthday
Any other sugggestions are still welcome.
I can recommend you from IEM Toronto (3 months ago) : Zest vs Yoda, game 3 (overgrowth). You can find the thread with the replay pack here on TL. Really solid BO for 1 gate expo > robo into 3 base blink colossus with quick charge/storm, staying on a single forge until on 6 gases.
Thanks for the recommendation. I'll look into that game next chance I get.
I was plat at the end of WoL but dropped the game for lol when hots came out as most of my friends weren't interested in buying the expansion. Now that LoTV is coming out and s5 changes for league are dumb I'm trying to get back into sc2. Planning on using www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/435336-sc2-notes-duckdeoks-bs-blink-all-in-pvt this build for pvt and 10 gate 3 gate blink for pvp, but I'm having trouble finding a good 2 base all-in for pvz since most of the all-ins in the op seem like they're for WoL(no mention of mothership core). If anyone could link me to a vid or guide for blink/immortal-sentry all-in for HoTS or advice on the above builds, I'd love your help!
On November 27 2014 00:35 Fredizabeast wrote: I was plat at the end of WoL but dropped the game for lol when hots came out as most of my friends weren't interested in buying the expansion. Now that LoTV is coming out and s5 changes for league are dumb I'm trying to get back into sc2. Planning on using www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/435336-sc2-notes-duckdeoks-bs-blink-all-in-pvt this build for pvt and 10 gate 3 gate blink for pvp, but I'm having trouble finding a good 2 base all-in for pvz since most of the all-ins in the op seem like they're for WoL(no mention of mothership core). If anyone could link me to a vid or guide for blink/immortal-sentry all-in for HoTS or advice on the above builds, I'd love your help!
10 gate 3 gate blink doesn't exist. The best PvP all in is still 2 gate proxy, most of the others are easily denied by photon overcharge. 10 gate into 3 gate / first warp in ~5:20 (without blink) is probably reasonably good in low leagues though.
If I may ask, why do you want to do only all ins? To understand the game you should probably learn how to play macro too. Just so that you aren't completely screwed up if your attack fails even when you deal enough damage.
On November 27 2014 00:35 Fredizabeast wrote: I was plat at the end of WoL but dropped the game for lol when hots came out as most of my friends weren't interested in buying the expansion. Now that LoTV is coming out and s5 changes for league are dumb I'm trying to get back into sc2. Planning on using www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/435336-sc2-notes-duckdeoks-bs-blink-all-in-pvt this build for pvt and 10 gate 3 gate blink for pvp, but I'm having trouble finding a good 2 base all-in for pvz since most of the all-ins in the op seem like they're for WoL(no mention of mothership core). If anyone could link me to a vid or guide for blink/immortal-sentry all-in for HoTS or advice on the above builds, I'd love your help!
you can do 10 gate proxy DTs or the tasteless builds. most players would just prepare for an oracle instead so you just win the game easily.
On November 27 2014 00:35 Fredizabeast wrote: I was plat at the end of WoL but dropped the game for lol when hots came out as most of my friends weren't interested in buying the expansion. Now that LoTV is coming out and s5 changes for league are dumb I'm trying to get back into sc2. Planning on using www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/435336-sc2-notes-duckdeoks-bs-blink-all-in-pvt this build for pvt and 10 gate 3 gate blink for pvp, but I'm having trouble finding a good 2 base all-in for pvz since most of the all-ins in the op seem like they're for WoL(no mention of mothership core). If anyone could link me to a vid or guide for blink/immortal-sentry all-in for HoTS or advice on the above builds, I'd love your help!
10 gate 3 gate blink doesn't exist. The best PvP all in is still 2 gate proxy, most of the others are easily denied by photon overcharge. 10 gate into 3 gate / first warp in ~5:20 (without blink) is probably reasonably good in low leagues though.
If I may ask, why do you want to do only all ins? To understand the game you should probably learn how to play macro too. Just so that you aren't completely screwed up if your attack fails even when you deal enough damage.
It actually does exist. At the very least, PartinG did that against herO once. I believe the 10 gate was just to scout crazy fast with his msc though.
@satedsc2 Thanks! That liquipedia article was exactly what I was looking for. @KingAlphard. More interested in regaining mechanics than learning "macro style". IMO any build that requires little to no interaction with your opponent is pretty easy to exectute, but as of right now my comfort level and multitasking ability aren't where I want them to be. If you can link me to a guide build that you think can help me practice those skills better than an all-in, I'm all ears. Also, I've been somewhat ignoring stargate builds. My style is sort of "Terran" I'm that I like to stick to the mobility of gateway units for as long as possible, but I love Protoss macro mechanics too much to learn Terran. In WoL stargate play seemed much cheesier than it does now in HoTS so I'll go try out some oracle/Phoenix/warp prism openings and see if I enjoy them.
i think passive macro styles arguably require much more "interaction" in the form of scouting and reacting to what your opponent is doing. if you go passive macro and have no idea what you're up against you'll either just get a free lead or die to an unexpected attack. early rushes are micro intensive, but since you're setting the pace of the game you're actually reducing in some ways the requirements of what you need to execute. for straight up unit micro, sure, it'll be good, but macro styles require a LOT of multitasking unless you're just blindly gambling that you won't be attacked which isn't really a way to play at all
This feels like a really stupid question, but I feel like there might be something simple I'm missing (and it hasn't been addressed before). I've run into the situation once or twice now where my Terran opponent puts a planetary at their natural and turtles up with tanks. It seems pretty clearly that these are newer or mechanically weak players so I've always just set up a contain and teched for air. This seems like a really safe way to ensure a win, but it does take a while to actually get the GG called and I'm not sure if there is a better strategy I'm missing. For reference I've seen this from players all the way up to Diamond (maybe they were offracing?).
On November 27 2014 00:35 Fredizabeast wrote: I was plat at the end of WoL but dropped the game for lol when hots came out as most of my friends weren't interested in buying the expansion. Now that LoTV is coming out and s5 changes for league are dumb I'm trying to get back into sc2. Planning on using www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/435336-sc2-notes-duckdeoks-bs-blink-all-in-pvt this build for pvt and 10 gate 3 gate blink for pvp, but I'm having trouble finding a good 2 base all-in for pvz since most of the all-ins in the op seem like they're for WoL(no mention of mothership core). If anyone could link me to a vid or guide for blink/immortal-sentry all-in for HoTS or advice on the above builds, I'd love your help!
10 gate 3 gate blink doesn't exist. The best PvP all in is still 2 gate proxy, most of the others are easily denied by photon overcharge. 10 gate into 3 gate / first warp in ~5:20 (without blink) is probably reasonably good in low leagues though.
If I may ask, why do you want to do only all ins? To understand the game you should probably learn how to play macro too. Just so that you aren't completely screwed up if your attack fails even when you deal enough damage.
10 gate 3 gate is more than reasonably good, especially at lower leagues. In fact, i'd say 2 gate proxy is one of the weakest all ins (although there are many variations so i don't know which one you're talking about). Pure zealot ones become so much easier to hold by just scouting your main base, and ones further away can be held off without even scouting them. Stalker variations are indeed strong, but are very micro-intensive and don't have a ton of margin for error. Of course, most all ins become easier to hold after you scout them, but for proxy 2 gate, that fact is especially true.
On November 27 2014 00:35 Fredizabeast wrote: I was plat at the end of WoL but dropped the game for lol when hots came out as most of my friends weren't interested in buying the expansion. Now that LoTV is coming out and s5 changes for league are dumb I'm trying to get back into sc2. Planning on using www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/435336-sc2-notes-duckdeoks-bs-blink-all-in-pvt this build for pvt and 10 gate 3 gate blink for pvp, but I'm having trouble finding a good 2 base all-in for pvz since most of the all-ins in the op seem like they're for WoL(no mention of mothership core). If anyone could link me to a vid or guide for blink/immortal-sentry all-in for HoTS or advice on the above builds, I'd love your help!
10 gate 3 gate blink doesn't exist. The best PvP all in is still 2 gate proxy, most of the others are easily denied by photon overcharge. 10 gate into 3 gate / first warp in ~5:20 (without blink) is probably reasonably good in low leagues though.
If I may ask, why do you want to do only all ins? To understand the game you should probably learn how to play macro too. Just so that you aren't completely screwed up if your attack fails even when you deal enough damage.
10 gate 3 gate is more than reasonably good, especially at lower leagues. In fact, i'd say 2 gate proxy is one of the weakest all ins (although there are many variations so i don't know which one you're talking about). Pure zealot ones become so much easier to hold by just scouting your main base, and ones further away can be held off without even scouting them. Stalker variations are indeed strong, but are very micro-intensive and don't have a ton of margin for error. Of course, most all ins become easier to hold after you scout them, but for proxy 2 gate, that fact is especially true.
I still lose very often against scouted proxy gateways even if I know what to do, and I don't think my micro is terrible. Plus many people proxy them outside your natural and it's not efficient to scout everywhere or 9 scout your opponent's base. There's no other all in in PvP that I lose to when I scout it, maybe 10 gate into 3 gate and cannon rush sometimes too. That's mainly to say that PvP all ins are not that good nowadays because of photon overcharge. Obviously I'm talking about all ins which you decide to do from the start, not reactive ones like for example -" I see my opponent is going stargate expand so I blink all in him "
i need help with the openers that korean pros are using right now, like zest in PvZ Pylon in main nexus 16 gate in main
when the zerg dont pressure i have no problems, then i expand at min7:30≈ and get a lot of gates and i do a timing attack at 10:30 ≈ and i win like 90% when i can do that attack without pressure.
i can defend with lings my 3rd with sentrys and cannons, but i cant defend pool first and other types of lings attacks 2 bases before i complete my wall of the natural
i lose even when they open hatch but with gas and attack me with lings. I have no idea how to defend, i just have 1 zealot and a MSC, maybe i need to cronno sentry? when to scout? i need to use my msc to scout?
i have no idea how to reat to this, o what im supposed to have to defend this, maybe i nede no MSC fast and instead a sentry fast, i cant find vods of koreans defendings lings attacks because 90% pro zerg just get 3 hatcherys fast when nexus first.
On December 06 2014 12:32 d4v3d wrote: hello sorry for my bad english
i need help with the openers that korean pros are using right now, like zest in PvZ Pylon in main nexus 16 gate in main
when the zerg dont pressure i have no problems, then i expand at min7:30≈ and get a lot of gates and i do a timing attack at 10:30 ≈ and i win like 90% when i can do that attack without pressure.
i can defend with lings my 3rd with sentrys and cannons, but i cant defend pool first and other types of lings attacks 2 bases before i complete my wall of the natural
i lose even when they open hatch but with gas and attack me with lings. I have no idea how to defend, i just have 1 zealot and a MSC, maybe i need to cronno sentry? when to scout? i need to use my msc to scout?
i have no idea how to reat to this, o what im supposed to have to defend this, maybe i nede no MSC fast and instead a sentry fast, i cant find vods of koreans defendings lings attacks because 90% pro zerg just get 3 hatcherys fast when nexus first.
help
Well the answer is quite simple, don't go nexus gate. It's a very greedy build which gives you a good ~15 seconds advantage on tech timings due to earlier gases (compared to forge expand) but in return it's almost autoloss against early pools, 14/14 or other earlier attacks.
I'd suggest that you go nexus gate only against players you know don't cheese, otherwise go 13 forge 17 nexus. It's much, much safer and the difference in tech timings is not that much.
On November 27 2014 00:35 Fredizabeast wrote: I was plat at the end of WoL but dropped the game for lol when hots came out as most of my friends weren't interested in buying the expansion. Now that LoTV is coming out and s5 changes for league are dumb I'm trying to get back into sc2. Planning on using www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/435336-sc2-notes-duckdeoks-bs-blink-all-in-pvt this build for pvt and 10 gate 3 gate blink for pvp, but I'm having trouble finding a good 2 base all-in for pvz since most of the all-ins in the op seem like they're for WoL(no mention of mothership core). If anyone could link me to a vid or guide for blink/immortal-sentry all-in for HoTS or advice on the above builds, I'd love your help!
10 gate 3 gate blink doesn't exist. The best PvP all in is still 2 gate proxy, most of the others are easily denied by photon overcharge. 10 gate into 3 gate / first warp in ~5:20 (without blink) is probably reasonably good in low leagues though.
If I may ask, why do you want to do only all ins? To understand the game you should probably learn how to play macro too. Just so that you aren't completely screwed up if your attack fails even when you deal enough damage.
10 gate 3 gate is more than reasonably good, especially at lower leagues. In fact, i'd say 2 gate proxy is one of the weakest all ins (although there are many variations so i don't know which one you're talking about). Pure zealot ones become so much easier to hold by just scouting your main base, and ones further away can be held off without even scouting them. Stalker variations are indeed strong, but are very micro-intensive and don't have a ton of margin for error. Of course, most all ins become easier to hold after you scout them, but for proxy 2 gate, that fact is especially true.
actually proxy 2gate inside the main is pretty hard to hold even if scouted. The one that is proxying will always maintain a 1.5 zealot advantage due to chronoboost banked up and a faster 2nd gateway.
On November 27 2014 00:35 Fredizabeast wrote: I was plat at the end of WoL but dropped the game for lol when hots came out as most of my friends weren't interested in buying the expansion. Now that LoTV is coming out and s5 changes for league are dumb I'm trying to get back into sc2. Planning on using www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/435336-sc2-notes-duckdeoks-bs-blink-all-in-pvt this build for pvt and 10 gate 3 gate blink for pvp, but I'm having trouble finding a good 2 base all-in for pvz since most of the all-ins in the op seem like they're for WoL(no mention of mothership core). If anyone could link me to a vid or guide for blink/immortal-sentry all-in for HoTS or advice on the above builds, I'd love your help!
10 gate 3 gate blink doesn't exist. The best PvP all in is still 2 gate proxy, most of the others are easily denied by photon overcharge. 10 gate into 3 gate / first warp in ~5:20 (without blink) is probably reasonably good in low leagues though.
If I may ask, why do you want to do only all ins? To understand the game you should probably learn how to play macro too. Just so that you aren't completely screwed up if your attack fails even when you deal enough damage.
10 gate 3 gate is more than reasonably good, especially at lower leagues. In fact, i'd say 2 gate proxy is one of the weakest all ins (although there are many variations so i don't know which one you're talking about). Pure zealot ones become so much easier to hold by just scouting your main base, and ones further away can be held off without even scouting them. Stalker variations are indeed strong, but are very micro-intensive and don't have a ton of margin for error. Of course, most all ins become easier to hold after you scout them, but for proxy 2 gate, that fact is especially true.
actually proxy 2gate inside the main is pretty hard to hold even if scouted. The one that is proxying will always maintain a 1.5 zealot advantage due to chronoboost banked up and a faster 2nd gateway.
That's why you go for 3 gateways to defend. Still, there's quite a wide timing window where you have less zealots and need to use probes and micro perfectly to survive.
Yeah i always went 3gate vs it (usually it's ~15 probes to ~10 so you can afford it) and had really good success. You have to be careful and scout to see if he's transitioning, or you risk ending up with a few zealots vs stalker production.
Kind of interesting how most people seem to spam zealots to counter proxy 2 gates, when Rain actually stayed on a single gate against HuK's proxy 2 gate the other day.
EPT
