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The HotS Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 231

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. Do not just ask for build orders.
SidianTheBard
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2474 Posts
February 02 2014 09:00 GMT
#4601
On February 02 2014 12:46 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
If someone takes the tower on Habitation Station, which mineral fields of the gold bases can they see being mined?


Pretty sure it's the bottom 3 patches. Miiiight be the bottom 4 patches but at least in my version it was only the bottom 3, I know Blizzard moved the watchtower a little bit but iirc I still only gives vision to 3 of the 6 patches.
Creator of Abyssal Reef, Ascension to Aiur, Battle on the Boardwalk, Habitation Station, Honorgrounds, IPL Darkness Falls, King's Cove, Korhal Carnage Knockout & Moonlight Madness.
Kurbz42
Profile Joined February 2014
1 Post
Last Edited: 2014-02-02 09:15:19
February 02 2014 09:15 GMT
#4602
Is there any sort of rule of thumb for how many production structures (primarily Gateways) one should have based on time, bases, or food? I understand that it is highly variable depending on build and matchup, but I always seem to either have too few (in a tech opening) or too many (in a Twilight or aggressive opening) and it either leads to me piling up money and not having army supply to defend, or turning pressure into an all in.
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
February 02 2014 10:34 GMT
#4603
Generally 3 gates and a tech building (twilight, robo, stargate) per base. On 2/3 bases also add 1/2 forges for upgrades.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
SeptY
Profile Joined February 2014
Finland2 Posts
February 03 2014 00:58 GMT
#4604
Hi! So i am new protoss player and would like to know where i can find new pro replays and basic builds for all 3 matchups!
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
February 03 2014 01:02 GMT
#4605
Hello and welcome to TL.
First off, take a look at the Strategy forum guidelines here:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=338554
As you can see from the note on top of the thread, normally we ask our users to not just ask for builds because they are easily found, but given that it's your first post it's no big deal this time. You can find replay packs from the WCS tournaments on Liquipedia here http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Main_Page which should include more replays than you can possibly watch.
For builds take a look here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=284255, where we have gathered the best threads over time. In the last year and a half Teamliquid has had an official staff releasing strategy guides named "TL Strategy", so particularly look out for those as they are the highest quality guides you will find on SC2.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
KatatoniK
Profile Blog Joined October 2013
United Kingdom978 Posts
February 03 2014 13:48 GMT
#4606
I recently got promoted to Silver and I'm getting crushed in every match-up, it may be partly my MMR smoothing itself out to get me back to my 50% win rate but I feel my micro and army control is pretty shit atm and I feel my control groups are part of the issue.

Can anyone give pointers on a good set-up for control groups, should I group up my Nexus into one group. Which units should get control groups separate from the rest of the army etc.
Flying on the Jin Air hype plane. Lets go Maru, Rogue, sOs and the handsome CJ herO
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
February 03 2014 14:45 GMT
#4607
On February 03 2014 22:48 KatatoniK wrote:
I recently got promoted to Silver and I'm getting crushed in every match-up, it may be partly my MMR smoothing itself out to get me back to my 50% win rate but I feel my micro and army control is pretty shit atm and I feel my control groups are part of the issue.

Can anyone give pointers on a good set-up for control groups, should I group up my Nexus into one group. Which units should get control groups separate from the rest of the army etc.


Older Day9 video, must watch:


Generally most people set up 1-3 as control groups for their units and then have 4 as nexus, 5 as gateways, 6 as robo, 7 as gateway. Or something like that. Generally all nexuses are hotkeyed together so that you can chronoboost constantly. The best way to separate the Protoss army in hotkeys is based on spells, so for instance:

PvT maxed army:

1 - Colossus/zealot/sentry (FF)
2 - Blink stalkers (Blink)
3 - High templar (Storm)
(4th hotkey) - MSC (time warp/recall)

Just do whatever you find most comfortable!
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
[UoN]Sentinel
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States11320 Posts
February 03 2014 17:04 GMT
#4608
SC2John is right, although you don't need to separate your army yet at silver. It's a good practice to have, but it'll take a lot of time away from actions that could be going into making your next warp cycle or putting down proxy pylons or other buildings. Up to high gold I just kept everything in one army group and used tab to cycle through my spells.

In general, separate your spellcasters and make sure they aren't somewhere they can be easily sniped.
Нас зовет дух отцов, память старых бойцов, дух Москвы и твердыня Полтавы
Whitewing
Profile Joined October 2010
United States7483 Posts
February 04 2014 00:38 GMT
#4609
On February 04 2014 02:04 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
SC2John is right, although you don't need to separate your army yet at silver. It's a good practice to have, but it'll take a lot of time away from actions that could be going into making your next warp cycle or putting down proxy pylons or other buildings. Up to high gold I just kept everything in one army group and used tab to cycle through my spells.

In general, separate your spellcasters and make sure they aren't somewhere they can be easily sniped.


I actually disagree: learning a new hotkey setup is the most difficult and time intensive thing. If you play the game a ton with one hotkey setup, you are going to have to unlearn that muscle memory and learn an entirely new (more correct one), and lose a ton of games in the process.

You should absolutely switch to a better hotkey system as soon as possible and start learning it, once you are used to it, it will make things later on so much easier.
Strategy"You know I fucking hate the way you play, right?" ~SC2John
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
February 04 2014 01:07 GMT
#4610
If you want to change your hotkeys, do so slowly. Change one hotkey every once in a while, and once you're used to it move on to another one.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
[UoN]Sentinel
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States11320 Posts
February 04 2014 01:15 GMT
#4611
On February 04 2014 09:38 Whitewing wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 04 2014 02:04 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
SC2John is right, although you don't need to separate your army yet at silver. It's a good practice to have, but it'll take a lot of time away from actions that could be going into making your next warp cycle or putting down proxy pylons or other buildings. Up to high gold I just kept everything in one army group and used tab to cycle through my spells.

In general, separate your spellcasters and make sure they aren't somewhere they can be easily sniped.


I actually disagree: learning a new hotkey setup is the most difficult and time intensive thing. If you play the game a ton with one hotkey setup, you are going to have to unlearn that muscle memory and learn an entirely new (more correct one), and lose a ton of games in the process.

You should absolutely switch to a better hotkey system as soon as possible and start learning it, once you are used to it, it will make things later on so much easier.


Personally I found it pretty simple to switch from one setup to another. When I started to separate my HT's from my main army group, the extra split second I spent controlling my HT's behind my army was made up for by not losing HT's, and the time it took for me to commit the new setup to muscle memory was offset by the improvement in my game.
Нас зовет дух отцов, память старых бойцов, дух Москвы и твердыня Полтавы
[UoN]Sentinel
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States11320 Posts
February 04 2014 01:15 GMT
#4612
On February 04 2014 10:07 Teoita wrote:
If you want to change your hotkeys, do so slowly. Change one hotkey every once in a while, and once you're used to it move on to another one.

Bottom line, I agree with this.
Нас зовет дух отцов, память старых бойцов, дух Москвы и твердыня Полтавы
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland25029 Posts
February 04 2014 12:38 GMT
#4613
I'm with Teo on this, and I've changed setup about 9 times at this stage
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
HelpMeGetBetter
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
United States764 Posts
February 04 2014 16:41 GMT
#4614
So I've been running into a Forge fast expand vs Protoss. Is this becoming a thing now or just a silly build people do every now and then?
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24417 Posts
February 04 2014 16:53 GMT
#4615
It's not a viable build, no.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
HelpMeGetBetter
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
United States764 Posts
February 04 2014 17:03 GMT
#4616
On February 05 2014 01:53 DarkLordOlli wrote:
It's not a viable build, no.


And I always lose to it...because it's so weird I have no idea what to do lol
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland25029 Posts
February 04 2014 17:08 GMT
#4617
If I see an FFE, oldschool WP 4gate off one gas. Seems to work well as people I've encountered doing such silly things tend to turtle with cannons at their front and think they can just turtle up to Voids.
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
Whitewing
Profile Joined October 2010
United States7483 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-04 17:45:03
February 04 2014 17:43 GMT
#4618
Against a FFE you can really kill him with pretty much any build you want off of one base. Stalkers can kill a building wall without being hit by cannons, then once zealots get into the cannons they vanish. If he throws down like 8 cannons to live, just expand yourself and you're ahead. Hell, blink stalkers are amazing vs. this, as are immortal busts, stargate plays, warp prism 4 gates, 10 gate into 3 gate rush, etc.

Just don't do DTs.

If you don't want to commit to an attack, just expand yourself immediately and don't make cannons, and bang, you're ahead.
Strategy"You know I fucking hate the way you play, right?" ~SC2John
[UoN]Sentinel
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States11320 Posts
February 04 2014 17:50 GMT
#4619
I'd love to get some FFE-going opponents on ladder.

Immortals/robo works against anything involving cannons, Oracle does wonders against early expands and is even more effective since he has to get forge and cannon before he gets stalker/msc, blink circumvents the wall, just pick a tech choice and you'll cripple him if not win the game outright.
Нас зовет дух отцов, память старых бойцов, дух Москвы и твердыня Полтавы
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24417 Posts
February 04 2014 17:58 GMT
#4620
I think a single void ray could win the game
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
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