The HotS Zerg Help Me Thread - Page 88

On July 24 2013 06:43 CivilAnarchy wrote:


Tilea plays random, firstly, and doesn't actually do the Hatch block in competitive play;




So I don't know what you're talking about as for this hatch block stuff. And even if she has done it in a few games, Catz has also gone 4 hatchery before pool against Protoss. This doesn't mean it's a good idea, or a good standard strategy, it just means one player has decided to do it.
The reality is we can take 99 Zerg players in ZvP, and see that they actively decide not to do this strategy, because it is bad.

And yes, a four gate is the correct response to this strategy. I don't know if you've heard of it, but 4gate pressure off a FFE is actually a highly common opener, and builds well into a 6gate allin or teching builds. You, as the Zerg, need to make sure that you're going to protect your third base against that attack. Considering 1 base Protoss economy is more than enough to support 4gate production, setting their expansion back actually achieves nothing as to delaying or dealing with the attack itself. However, you now have less queens, a lower gas count, and likely a delayed roach warren.

This is the point that you miss entirely, that protoss tech can advance even with a delayed expansion, but the tech zerg requires to deal with this sort of play is reliant on the timing of that natural hatchery. Sure a delayed natural for the protoss can delay any sort of Robo or Stargate tech, but not any form of gateway pressure. Without that creep spread, and without the roach count, a 4gate pressure attack will kill your third, putting you in a horrible position.

Your math is entirely incorrect, because all of the things you mention, besides the pylon to block your hatchery, are things that the protoss doesn't actually lose. In most situations, they were already going to get a forge, cannon, and pylon (definitely a pylon, come on) at their ramp to take the expansion anyway. So you're not actually hurting them when they put down a forge. In addition to that, they will always be able to kill your hatchery before a queen can get out to lay down a tumor, or, even better, they'll be smart enough to not let it happen. There is no world where you will finish an entire hatchery, and queen, before the protoss player gets at least one zealot. This means that your chance of getting a creep tumor down, if the hatchery even survives that long, is next to nothing.

The reality is, if you do this build, you're either going to be contained on two bases while the Protoss is able to get his up significantly faster than if you had just taken the third anyway, or you're just going to die to some Gateway timing that you're going to be entirely ill prepared for. People have tried these builds, and there's a reason they're not used by 99/100 pro players.

On July 28 2013 18:09 bo1b wrote:
Hey I've started playing zerg again and I'm really struggling vs air toss. Is the only way to beat it to spread creep around the map and build spores and eventually asphyxiate him?

On July 28 2013 18:24 TheGreenMachine wrote:

Lots of creep, into a bunch of queens into 4 base ultra is what i do. The queens are very cost efficient vs voidrays. If hes going hardcore voidray u can get hydra too. Queen, ultra, hydra to deal with the mass voidray+ht. Oh and once you're max try to trade asap, cuz imo a maxed skytoss is stronger than any maxed zerg army.

On July 28 2013 18:09 bo1b wrote:
Hey I've started playing zerg again and I'm really struggling vs air toss. Is the only way to beat it to spread creep around the map and build spores and eventually asphyxiate him?

On July 28 2013 18:40 bo1b wrote:

I was maxing out on pure hydra which was probably a mistake, just didn't really know what I was supposed to do lol. His army composition was basically mass phoenix and voidray with a few hts. He'd just lift up my hydras and they'd melt to storm.