EPTPersonally it is :
- banshee -> raven -> viking
- 2nd CC (@6:30)
- 2 more rax // stim + cshield
- Third CC
- 2 ebays
- 2 more rax // double reactor
Is there a more effective way to do it ? Or is my transition good?
The HotS Terran Help Me Thread - Page 212
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
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wag_
88 Posts
Personally it is : - banshee -> raven -> viking - 2nd CC (@6:30) - 2 more rax // stim + cshield - Third CC - 2 ebays - 2 more rax // double reactor Is there a more effective way to do it ? Or is my transition good? | ||
Slydie
1935 Posts
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Whatson
United States5357 Posts
On November 28 2013 08:35 Slydie wrote: Watching high levl tvp these days, I die a little inside when I see all the no risk all-inns protoss can do because they defend with the MSC so easily. I was theorycrafting: is it the future to go for faster ghosts and try very hard to sneak in an EMP on the msc? Maybe using medivac speedboost... lol as in like 1-base ghost? Even in WoL I don't think there were many 2base all-ins that worked TvP You might as well as go 1-1-1 with raven (pdd to take up shots) | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On November 28 2013 08:35 Slydie wrote: Watching high levl tvp these days, I die a little inside when I see all the no risk all-inns protoss can do because they defend with the MSC so easily. I was theorycrafting: is it the future to go for faster ghosts and try very hard to sneak in an EMP on the msc? Maybe using medivac speedboost... Nope, way too big of an early investment + zero chance to work since the MSC is supposed to be positioned out of reach. | ||
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Kalfos
Dominican Republic34 Posts
Here's the Replay: http://drop.sc/366422 | ||
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B-rye88
Canada168 Posts
On November 28 2013 08:35 Slydie wrote: Watching high levl tvp these days, I die a little inside when I see all the no risk all-inns protoss can do because they defend with the MSC so easily. I was theorycrafting: is it the future to go for faster ghosts and try very hard to sneak in an EMP on the msc? Maybe using medivac speedboost... By the time you have a medivac AND a ghost AND enough of an army to do something with it, his all-in has already hit you or he's safely macroing with enough defense to smash your face. | ||
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Slydie
1935 Posts
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Doc Brawler
United States260 Posts
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BurningRanger
Germany303 Posts
On November 28 2013 16:44 Slydie wrote: I have seen pros use ghosts in a medivac to emp hts, is it really impossible to do the same with the msc? The point is that you have to do it, before he activates the overcharge. If he reacts quick enough, you're quite much dead. Actually that brought me to a nice idea for the overcharge ability. Blizzard should make it drain Nexus energy. So when casted on a Nexus, it would use like 1 or 2 energy per second from that Nexus. Then this could be countered by EMP (and Feedback?). Protoss players would also have to keep some energy on Nexi if they want to use it to defend instead of using it all for chronoboosts. | ||
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Lazuras
Sweden52 Posts
thanks | ||
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KingofGods
Canada1218 Posts
The whole idea is for you to be pushing across the map at or before his mutas hatch so that he is forced to keep his mutas at home to defend and you can slowly dwindle down his numbers so they don't become a muta ball quickly. If he is going 2 base mutas and you went 3 CC, you will have to defend with turrets because you won't have enough marines. | ||
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Jazzman88
Canada2228 Posts
On November 29 2013 09:32 KingofGods wrote: A standard 3 base zerg would have mutas at your base around 11:30. They could have mutas as early as 10:00 if they are going 2 base mutas. I've seen very aggressive 2 base mutas where they come earlier but that doesn't happen often. The whole idea is for you to be pushing across the map at or before his mutas hatch so that he is forced to keep his mutas at home to defend and you can slowly dwindle down his numbers so they don't become a muta ball quickly. If he is going 2 base mutas and you went 3 CC, you will have to defend with turrets because you won't have enough marines. Exactly. This is the whole idea behind the move out with your first set of Medivacs. Assuming you have 1-2 Scans available, you get to kill some creep for free and use your Widow Mines to prevent yourself getting completely boned by Banelings. Mutas can't afford to attack across because if he committed hard to the first batch, you have a real chance to take advantage of the gas that got dumped there and just wipe a bunch of Lings and force him to produce units instead of tech/Drones/static D. He will probably show the Mutas to force you back, in which case your 5-8 Barracks are already cranking up and you can place mineral line Turrets to complete the 3-base defense. | ||
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Fhiz
361 Posts
Thoughts opinions ? | ||
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OatmeeL
United States12 Posts
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ander
Canada403 Posts
On November 29 2013 14:29 OatmeeL wrote: Does anyone know if its possible to hold a 10 gate msc/stalker pressure when opening 12 rax/12 gas reaper into reactor? Is there any slight, blind variation to the 12/12 build that can be done to hold this? I don't have trouble with the 12 or 13 gate version, but the 10 gate chrono'ed build feels like a BO loss when i open reaper. I've been struggling with this, too. I assume you expo on the low ground? The first zealot gets there at 4-ish, so if you scout the first zealot leaving his base, then hypothetically you should be able to get a bunker up at your nat in time. If you don't get it up in time, then I think you skip the techlab on your second rax, and just pump marines while attacking with your scv's. If you can hold without losing more than 5 scv's, and you get his MSC, then I think you're golden. Just make sure that you're using scv's in tandem with your marines. That's what I'm gonna try next time, anyway. I struggle with it too, my problem is that i can never get my bunker or second CC up in time. Scouting the zealot moving across the map seems key, but it's tough on maps with multiple rush paths like bel'shir. | ||
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Jazzman88
Canada2228 Posts
On November 29 2013 18:08 ander wrote: I've been struggling with this, too. I assume you expo on the low ground? The first zealot gets there at 4-ish, so if you scout the first zealot leaving his base, then hypothetically you should be able to get a bunker up at your nat in time. If you don't get it up in time, then I think you skip the techlab on your second rax, and just pump marines while attacking with your scv's. If you can hold without losing more than 5 scv's, and you get his MSC, then I think you're golden. Just make sure that you're using scv's in tandem with your marines. That's what I'm gonna try next time, anyway. I struggle with it too, my problem is that i can never get my bunker or second CC up in time. Scouting the zealot moving across the map seems key, but it's tough on maps with multiple rush paths like bel'shir. Take a look at the path your SCV takes when it leaves to scout next time you play that map, and watch how it travels. Then, flip that path 180% and send your scouting SCV manually on that path next game. It's slightly slower, but since the Zealot wants to get there as quickly as possible, it will be taking its shortest path, which is the one you just manually commanded scouting on. | ||
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OatmeeL
United States12 Posts
At this point I see no way to hold because his 3 units are on top of my only producing rax. Plus he has a time warp ready so getting an scv surround is impossible, and once the time warp is out, it lasts so long that he has time for his second stalker to show up. | ||
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KingofGods
Canada1218 Posts
And yup, I recommend scv scouting even while your barracks is still building. | ||
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Jazzman88
Canada2228 Posts
On November 30 2013 07:56 KingofGods wrote: If you run your reaper straight to his base (instead of scouting for proxies immediately) usually you can spot the zealot coming across the map with your reaper. With hit and run with the reaper you can usually slow it down enough for your to get a bunker up. Some maps though where there is more than 1 path you will often miss that zealot. And yup, I recommend scv scouting even while your barracks is still building. Conventional progamer tendencies have the scout leaving at between 14 and 15 supply, typically soon after your Refinery has finished. Kite the Zealot all day and get up the Bunker and you should be okay. He cuts enough economy to get out those units that you can afford to trade 3 or so SCVs for the attacking force and be okay with your quick expo. | ||
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halpimcat
215 Posts
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