If you are maxed on tank hellbat Viking and want to slowly transition to sky Terran, instead of banking tons of resources you can invest in buildings, PF, sensor tower, and turrets. They will act as a speed bump to your transition to sky Terran. Cloaked banshees work well against immortals etc when you kill their observers.
You can slowly bleed your mech with hellion runbys and hellbat drops so you can free up resources for your switch to sky Terran.
I usually stop at 3 factories and steadily add star ports as resources allow, even going up to 6 or 7 star ports.if I can secure a 4th.
On January 07 2014 09:37 noSec wrote: Hey guys i never played mech TvT and i'd like to now some basic openers... Is that ForGG build from may 16th still viable? Thanks
We talked abou this on page 28. Yes it is still viable. It's my to-go build for TvT. You will find it hard to defend against 1 base marine tank pushes but with some practice you know how to deal with it.
On January 06 2014 19:41 Telon Petrides wrote: Gumba,
If you are maxed on tank hellbat Viking and want to slowly transition to sky Terran, instead of banking tons of resources you can invest in buildings, PF, sensor tower, and turrets. They will act as a speed bump to your transition to sky Terran. Cloaked banshees work well against immortals etc when you kill their observers.
You can slowly bleed your mech with hellion runbys and hellbat drops so you can free up resources for your switch to sky Terran.
I usually stop at 3 factories and steadily add star ports as resources allow, even going up to 6 or 7 star ports.if I can secure a 4th.
So in TvP i play a mech style with tons and tons of banshees, and the best response is always either archons or storm, I'm winning a good bit despite my inability to micro them. I have very good marine splits, but the method seems totally inneffective. Is there a better way to spread my banshees other than just pre-spreading them into a huge concave?
On January 06 2014 19:41 Telon Petrides wrote: Gumba,
If you are maxed on tank hellbat Viking and want to slowly transition to sky Terran, instead of banking tons of resources you can invest in buildings, PF, sensor tower, and turrets. They will act as a speed bump to your transition to sky Terran. Cloaked banshees work well against immortals etc when you kill their observers.
You can slowly bleed your mech with hellion runbys and hellbat drops so you can free up resources for your switch to sky Terran.
I usually stop at 3 factories and steadily add star ports as resources allow, even going up to 6 or 7 star ports.if I can secure a 4th.
Ok thx
I like to think of the mech progression as getting as much gas in your army as possible. Since your gas income is so limited you need minerals to fill out your army in the early game, hellbats over tanks, and vikings over ravens and banshees.(I mean A LOT of hellbats) As the game goes later your mineral units should die more frequently -- hellbats and vikes lead the charge. Just always build as many gas units and starports as possible FIRST, THEN fill with hellbats with extra minerals. Eventually you can get to 20 tanks(60 supply), 10 ghosts(20 supply), 4 hellbats and about 50-60 supply worth of vikes, ravens or banshees. From here you can transition into anything because your army is so well rounded and looses so little supply durring fights. I personally think 20 tanks and as many raveven as you can get is better than sky terran, unless toss is full blown carrier mode, but even then I like to keep 10-15 tanks, to zone out HT and zelot warp ins.
As far as production goes, I like to go 4 factory 1 rax ghost, and add as many SP as I can, first one reactor then all techlabed. Eventually a few more factories 5-8 can save your ass if a battle goes wrong, which is always possible with mech. GL mechin it happen tvp !!
How do you hold cloak banshee with forgg build? In my experience, the 6 marines die before the first viking comes out and you run out of scans before the raven is out. Is it necessary to make an e-bay and turrets, which would delay air control and ground army. Or to keep reactor on rax and keep making marines? Or make mines? I know there are all these options but not sure which is optimal?
if you know cloakshee is coming a 5:45 ebay shuts it down in time. minerals will be tight, so you might skip 2 marines and don't scan. Or get double gas and a raven, but this is weaker against double banshee followup
On January 10 2014 11:10 DBS wrote: So in TvP i play a mech style with tons and tons of banshees, and the best response is always either archons or storm, I'm winning a good bit despite my inability to micro them. I have very good marine splits, but the method seems totally inneffective. Is there a better way to spread my banshees other than just pre-spreading them into a huge concave?
Presplitting banshees is the only way I know of, and it is critical.
I like to try to lure the Protoss deathball into range of a few spread tanks behind a planetary at a choke; that can help thin out the high templars and by retreating for 2-3 seconds, you avoid his first storms and you can get pdd's. High templars have only so much energy, so by wasting their initial storms by a small retreat into a speed bump, it makes for less storm dodging in the middle part of the engagement.
Maru used cloakshees to good use in proleague this week. It is just so satisfying to kill Protoss when they don't have detection. Pays back for all the Dark Templars!
In mech tvp, I play primarily tank/hellbats with a few ghosts thrown in if I feel the need. I read that tanks shouldn't be focusing on zealots; is there a priority list of units I should be targeting? For example, first archons then immortals then stalkers, etc.?
The second question i have is about hellion drop tactics vs Protoss. In the midgame I go hellbats drops, but I'll usually attempt hellion drops in the early game to start off. If Protoss has a blind spot in his base, I smack my lips in anticipation of the probe roasting to come as I can drop all my hellions without him noticing. But if Protoss isn't horrible and has spotting in his base, where should I be dropping hellions? At the edge where it gives him time to group up and flee his probes? Or close/over the mineral line where the hellions slowly drop one at a time?
Hey guys... When going Mech vs Z how do i scout 2base roach timing? I do the banshee opening with the 5 hellions but after that should i make a third CC or add 2 factories?
On January 15 2014 11:09 halpimcat wrote: In mech tvp, I play primarily tank/hellbats with a few ghosts thrown in if I feel the need. I read that tanks shouldn't be focusing on zealots; is there a priority list of units I should be targeting? For example, first archons then immortals then stalkers, etc.?
The second question i have is about hellion drop tactics vs Protoss. In the midgame I go hellbats drops, but I'll usually attempt hellion drops in the early game to start off. If Protoss has a blind spot in his base, I smack my lips in anticipation of the probe roasting to come as I can drop all my hellions without him noticing. But if Protoss isn't horrible and has spotting in his base, where should I be dropping hellions? At the edge where it gives him time to group up and flee his probes? Or close/over the mineral line where the hellions slowly drop one at a time?
Because hellions are so quick, you always aim for a blind spot, as soon as your drop is scouted move-drop towards the mineral line and if you can, run each hellion as it drops out.
On January 15 2014 11:09 halpimcat wrote: In mech tvp, I play primarily tank/hellbats with a few ghosts thrown in if I feel the need. I read that tanks shouldn't be focusing on zealots; is there a priority list of units I should be targeting? For example, first archons then immortals then stalkers, etc.?
The second question i have is about hellion drop tactics vs Protoss. In the midgame I go hellbats drops, but I'll usually attempt hellion drops in the early game to start off. If Protoss has a blind spot in his base, I smack my lips in anticipation of the probe roasting to come as I can drop all my hellions without him noticing. But if Protoss isn't horrible and has spotting in his base, where should I be dropping hellions? At the edge where it gives him time to group up and flee his probes? Or close/over the mineral line where the hellions slowly drop one at a time?
Because hellions are so quick, you always aim for a blind spot, as soon as your drop is scouted move-drop towards the mineral line and if you can, run each hellion as it drops out.
On January 15 2014 11:09 halpimcat wrote: In mech tvp, I play primarily tank/hellbats with a few ghosts thrown in if I feel the need. I read that tanks shouldn't be focusing on zealots; is there a priority list of units I should be targeting? For example, first archons then immortals then stalkers, etc.?
I'd say the list looks kinda like this (high to low prio): HTs (AoE units that die quickly) Colossi (AoE units that are armored > take bonus damage) EMP'ed! Immortals (anti-Tank units that are armored > take bonus damage, when Shields are down) Archons (because they kill your Hellbats so fast) Stalkers (armored > take bonus damage) everything else that's not close to your own units (to prevent friendly splash)
How do I play mech if my opponent opens air and makes a sizeable chunks of phoenixes? My drop attempts get picked off, but if I don't drop toss army goes out of control. I have no idea what to do tactics and strategy wise, and also compositionaly. I just lost a game where toss opened air, harassed me a bit with Phoenix, kept me in my base, then roll me with immortal archon off what felt like one or two gateways.
On January 17 2014 17:05 halpimcat wrote: How do I play mech if my opponent opens air and makes a sizeable chunks of phoenixes? My drop attempts get picked off, but if I don't drop toss army goes out of control. I have no idea what to do tactics and strategy wise, and also compositionaly. I just lost a game where toss opened air, harassed me a bit with Phoenix, kept me in my base, then roll me with immortal archon off what felt like one or two gateways.
I use missile turrets to guard key points in my defense, both on flanks and in my forward direction of the push. As mech you usually are limited by gas and have plenty of minerals. Missile turrets help against protoss air, observers, DTs and even colossus for forward turrets. Then with whatever anti-air you go for, be that vikings, widow mines, ravens or thors, if you fight close to your turret it can tip the engagement in your favor.
If the Protoss goes heavy air, the turret upgrade Hi-Sec Auto Tracking is useful.
For harass you can still do hellion runbys since medivacs are countered, or just get each expansion safely and push after you win an engagement.
Check out the Youtube Flash Mech vs Sniper and DRG TvZ from ProLeague last night. Besides his amazing macro, his moveouts to deny expansions (tank runbys etc) before maxing is really amazing and something I haven't really seen at the Pro Level.
Hey guys whats up? I have another question regarding TvZ. I'm new to mech in TvZ and i feel kinda lost in time in the match. It feels like i never have the proper army to deal with the enemy and then i suddenly realize that i'm 18 mins into the game... Well... Should i MASS turrets to defend against Mutas? Cause most of the time i'm cought out of position with thors or moving out to attack the Z...
The other question may sound retarded but i have my reasons to ask... When should i stop making hellions and begin making Hellbats? (In TvZ and TvT)
Watch flash. He makes 6 hellions and then Hellbats. Strelok makes them all game and harrases with them. Just know that throwing away 6 hellions is 12 supply and 600 minerals, so if you don't trade well with them over and over you will fall behind
On January 22 2014 13:29 noSec wrote: Hey guys whats up? I have another question regarding TvZ. I'm new to mech in TvZ and i feel kinda lost in time in the match. It feels like i never have the proper army to deal with the enemy and then i suddenly realize that i'm 18 mins into the game... Well... Should i MASS turrets to defend against Mutas? Cause most of the time i'm cought out of position with thors or moving out to attack the Z...
The other question may sound retarded but i have my reasons to ask... When should i stop making hellions and begin making Hellbats? (In TvZ and TvT)
Thank you guys...
Make 4 - 6 Thors after Helions, add few turrets around mineral lines and widow mine
EPT
