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[G] Only Bio in TvZ! - Page 6

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
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Sega92
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States467 Posts
June 29 2012 23:12 GMT
#101
Thanks for this! I was just thinking about giving bio a try in TvZ. Now I can!
Chantastic
Profile Joined June 2012
86 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-29 23:30:45
June 29 2012 23:29 GMT
#102
On June 22 2012 17:35 dohgg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2012 16:23 dynwar7 wrote:
I have been using this and I won 10x in a row vs Zerg.

HOWEVER....

....

Now I just cannot simply win, because in the guide you say to move out wirh marines early to deny his 3rd. I cannot. He already has ling bling before taking 3rd. If this is the case, what do I do?

Cant believe I cannot find....was winning 10 in a row just a few days ago.. Basically I cannot snipe his 3rd. even without bling, his ling coutn is really high to kill my marines..


I think the main idea of that combat shiled push is to just "screw up the zerg intentions"

He made a third for a clear reason to saturate it, and it'll be harder for him to do so, if he made lings and defence to stop your push, however, as the OP said, eventho he might hold ur push, the idea is still to trade effective as possible.

I have another question to the OP.
I was trading quite good on 10~15 min, till the zerg managed to get infestors out, obivously i m not MKP, but i did minimize his fungels effect with a decent split, but on overall view:

its just nearly immposible to trade well vs infestors with a good upgraded lings to cover them, i did focus fire with marauders but still got fungeled loacked and surrounded by lings. and in the end of the day, the trades became more of a trade of bio for energy (of infestors) then a trade of bio for reasources (banlings/roaches/mutas).


Just chiming in here, I've been experimenting with this build quite a bit. The point of the extremely fast upgrades, literally constant upgrades, and high medivac count is to force a large number of lings to cover the infestors. Don't view the trades as just mineral/gas efficient, but larvae efficient!

By dropping, engaging in multiple locations, and engaging as cost efficiently as possible, you will either kill all the lings because he's being stretched very thin, or you make it much more difficult for him to inject larvae at all times. Even if you lose a big army, your ability to rebuild and move out is much better than with siege tanks, as you do not need to wait for a critical number of tanks, you just need a few MMM to continuously poke and drop him to death. Just force trade after trade and with MMM being so supply/larvae efficient against Ling/Infestor, the Zerg should have a hard time keeping up.

Also, the point of the combat shield push is indeed just to "screw up the zerg intentions." Unless they've already spread creep to their third, which on some maps is rather difficult to do, it's hard to get a queen response, and you can delay mining while forcing quite a few zerglings.
awakenx
Profile Joined May 2011
United States341 Posts
June 30 2012 00:33 GMT
#103
I wonder if a transition to bio/sky terran is viable late game against broodlords; I like HSM soooo much because broods stack up and I adore watching them explode :D
WorstMicroNA
s3rp
Profile Joined May 2011
Germany3192 Posts
June 30 2012 00:47 GMT
#104
On June 30 2012 09:33 deathtrance wrote:
I wonder if a transition to bio/sky terran is viable late game against broodlords; I like HSM soooo much because broods stack up and I adore watching them explode :D


Can work but you need to be able to take at least 4 Bases . I'm also not a fan of HSM overall its way too gimmicky and easy to counter.
dohgg
Profile Joined February 2011
310 Posts
June 30 2012 23:32 GMT
#105
Well you can make any kind of transition as long as NEVER stop the pressure.. and thats pretty important point!

Also, getting +1.. +2.. +3 on your air attack is pretty important.. altho the chances of him to get broods are kinda low, or you didnt aggresive enough..
oemoR
Profile Joined June 2012
Canada29 Posts
July 01 2012 00:09 GMT
#106

Disturbed Zerg reporting..

I must say, this is the most annoying style of play when I face Terran.. endless vomiting of tier 1's all day.
Detailed guide to my bane makes me raise an eyebrow.
Follow the breadcrumbs.
Thylacine
Profile Joined August 2011
Sweden882 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-01 16:44:53
July 01 2012 16:23 GMT
#107
I feel like my army is just way to small to drop midgame/lategame.

heres a replay of a game i just played, this happens every time: mass ling infestor and I just can't be aggresive anymore because it's too swarmy, even when im ahead economically. If i start trading i just die and its cost efficent for him?

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replay-videos/19108
What you're looking at could be the end of a particularly terrifying nightmare. It isn't. It's the beginning. Introducing Mr. John Valentine, air traveler. His destination: the Twilight Zone...
forsakeNXE
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany539 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-01 17:30:10
July 01 2012 17:11 GMT
#108
On July 02 2012 01:23 Thylacine wrote:
I feel like my army is just way to small to drop midgame/lategame.

heres a replay of a game i just played, this happens every time: mass ling infestor and I just can't be aggresive anymore because it's too swarmy, even when im ahead economically. If i start trading i just die and its cost efficent for him?

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replay-videos/19108


First:

You kinda mess up the opening by quite a bit:

3rd cc full minute too late
reactors too late
4th gas way to early
You can add those 3 rax at the time you move out (or even 4)
And do not build reactors on those rax

The big error you made here is that you've messed up the opening by quite a bit and then added rax even later AND built reactors which leaves you with no additional reinforcements till 13:30 (!!)

You really need to execute the opening alot more crisper and add the cc, reactors and additional rax WAY earlier.

Also you have a very low unit count around 10:20, i just looked up a game where my medivacs where delayed cause i messed up but i lost my first combat shield push and had 30 marines and 2 marauders + 2 medivacs just started at 10:20 you had 18 marines (!!) and 1 marauder + 2 medivacs so you definitly need waaay more marines.

Edit also work on your scv production, you should be around 50-55 around the 10minute mark
Let's learn together!
dohgg
Profile Joined February 2011
310 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-01 18:23:24
July 01 2012 18:22 GMT
#109
I personally can advice to use less of drop action, with that specific build, you want as much of "power army" infront of his face to utilize trading efficency.

A droping terran is much better for a style that relay on slow zerg army (Roaches?) and also, to a style that benefit from getting into seige tanks (wtf is siege tanks?) position while droping and "stealing his attention"... its simply less effective with that syle, but eventho, mixing it while doing pressure is pretty good and fun once you got ahead...
Thylacine
Profile Joined August 2011
Sweden882 Posts
July 01 2012 19:34 GMT
#110
On July 02 2012 02:11 Enemyy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 02 2012 01:23 Thylacine wrote:
I feel like my army is just way to small to drop midgame/lategame.

heres a replay of a game i just played, this happens every time: mass ling infestor and I just can't be aggresive anymore because it's too swarmy, even when im ahead economically. If i start trading i just die and its cost efficent for him?

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replay-videos/19108


First:

You kinda mess up the opening by quite a bit:

3rd cc full minute too late
reactors too late
4th gas way to early
You can add those 3 rax at the time you move out (or even 4)
And do not build reactors on those rax

The big error you made here is that you've messed up the opening by quite a bit and then added rax even later AND built reactors which leaves you with no additional reinforcements till 13:30 (!!)

You really need to execute the opening alot more crisper and add the cc, reactors and additional rax WAY earlier.

Also you have a very low unit count around 10:20, i just looked up a game where my medivacs where delayed cause i messed up but i lost my first combat shield push and had 30 marines and 2 marauders + 2 medivacs just started at 10:20 you had 18 marines (!!) and 1 marauder + 2 medivacs so you definitly need waaay more marines.

Edit also work on your scv production, you should be around 50-55 around the 10minute mark


I simply dont have the minerals at 7 min to throw up a CC. What should I cut off in order to get enough mins for it?
When should I take 4th gas?
Thanks for all this kind information i was thinking my opener was completely fucked up. It's probably because i wrote down my ''own'' timings of stuff (on notes that i put on my pc) that isn't supply reliant.

Btw, at very early game when CC is making at 16 supply, I cut marine but keep making SCV as i make 17 depot, because else I think i will get supply blocked. should i do that?
What you're looking at could be the end of a particularly terrifying nightmare. It isn't. It's the beginning. Introducing Mr. John Valentine, air traveler. His destination: the Twilight Zone...
Chantastic
Profile Joined June 2012
86 Posts
July 01 2012 23:35 GMT
#111
On July 02 2012 04:34 Thylacine wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 02 2012 02:11 Enemyy wrote:
On July 02 2012 01:23 Thylacine wrote:
I feel like my army is just way to small to drop midgame/lategame.

heres a replay of a game i just played, this happens every time: mass ling infestor and I just can't be aggresive anymore because it's too swarmy, even when im ahead economically. If i start trading i just die and its cost efficent for him?

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replay-videos/19108


First:

You kinda mess up the opening by quite a bit:

3rd cc full minute too late
reactors too late
4th gas way to early
You can add those 3 rax at the time you move out (or even 4)
And do not build reactors on those rax

The big error you made here is that you've messed up the opening by quite a bit and then added rax even later AND built reactors which leaves you with no additional reinforcements till 13:30 (!!)

You really need to execute the opening alot more crisper and add the cc, reactors and additional rax WAY earlier.

Also you have a very low unit count around 10:20, i just looked up a game where my medivacs where delayed cause i messed up but i lost my first combat shield push and had 30 marines and 2 marauders + 2 medivacs just started at 10:20 you had 18 marines (!!) and 1 marauder + 2 medivacs so you definitly need waaay more marines.

Edit also work on your scv production, you should be around 50-55 around the 10minute mark


I simply dont have the minerals at 7 min to throw up a CC. What should I cut off in order to get enough mins for it?
When should I take 4th gas?
Thanks for all this kind information i was thinking my opener was completely fucked up. It's probably because i wrote down my ''own'' timings of stuff (on notes that i put on my pc) that isn't supply reliant.

Btw, at very early game when CC is making at 16 supply, I cut marine but keep making SCV as i make 17 depot, because else I think i will get supply blocked. should i do that?



Not sure how everyone else does it, but I cut the SCV to have 3 marines at 19 supply and use those three marines to do some initial poking to scout for all-ins or sneak out a few drone kills.
forsakeNXE
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany539 Posts
July 01 2012 23:45 GMT
#112
I go rax finished -> oc -> marine -> drop mule + scv -> supply depot -> 2nd marine
Let's learn together!
Thylacine
Profile Joined August 2011
Sweden882 Posts
July 02 2012 06:18 GMT
#113
Can you answer my other questions too? What to cut at 7 min to afford CC and when 4th gas?
What you're looking at could be the end of a particularly terrifying nightmare. It isn't. It's the beginning. Introducing Mr. John Valentine, air traveler. His destination: the Twilight Zone...
NoZyneighbor
Profile Joined October 2010
Canada77 Posts
July 02 2012 06:40 GMT
#114
if you have only 2 guys in both gas than you should be able to afford the third CC at around 7:10-7:20 without cutting production as only one rax will be producing, the other two should be making reactors. the fourth gas is gotten as you get your armory and second engineering bay to get +2/+2
Information is the best weapon to have
Thylacine
Profile Joined August 2011
Sweden882 Posts
July 02 2012 09:58 GMT
#115
And when do I get my 2nd engi bay + armory? And when do I fully saturate my geysers in main?
What you're looking at could be the end of a particularly terrifying nightmare. It isn't. It's the beginning. Introducing Mr. John Valentine, air traveler. His destination: the Twilight Zone...
dohgg
Profile Joined February 2011
310 Posts
July 02 2012 10:26 GMT
#116
On July 02 2012 18:58 Thylacine wrote:
And when do I get my 2nd engi bay + armory? And when do I fully saturate my geysers in main?

2ed ebay with armory, and fill the missing scvs as soon as you start your 3rd. 7:10~
forsakeNXE
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany539 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-02 11:50:11
July 02 2012 11:49 GMT
#117
till 7:10 you have 2 gas with 2 scvs in them.

@ 7:10 you throw down 1 more gas, the cc and put 2 more in gas so you have 3 gas with 3 i each in total.

At 10 minutes you get 2nd ebay and armory and 4th gas.
Let's learn together!
Manimal_pro
Profile Joined June 2010
Romania991 Posts
July 02 2012 12:06 GMT
#118
i play masters TvZ on europe and my go to strat is 3 command centers before gas, 20 marine poke into bio + blue flamed hellions
If you like brood war, please go play brood war and stop whining about SC2
-niL
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada1131 Posts
July 02 2012 17:12 GMT
#119
On June 25 2012 20:05 Procify wrote:
Pure bio works pretty well from what I've tried.

What I've found really seals the deal is a build that I watched mkp do on stream multiple times.

Basically, he does 1 rax fe into a sort of 1/1/1 where he gets blue flame and 4 medivacs with 1/1 infantry. He follows it with a 1/1 timing attack that uses blue flame hellions and the support of 4 medivacs. In 8 games, I have 100% winrate.


Around what time do you hit?.

EnE
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
417 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-02 17:59:05
July 02 2012 17:50 GMT
#120
Yeah pure bio is good TvZ but only vs ground based (infestor ling, roach bling, etc).

Vs muta styles you play oldschool but with a triple cc opening.

@Thylacine:

I don't know about other people or this guy in particular, but what I do is open a sort of reactor hellion build but I get gas at 16 after starting orbital, so it's technically a 1 rax expansion but with the factory going down right after the first CC. The later gas allows me to play like a normal reac hellion into timing, but with a 3rd cc put in earlier (6 mins or so?), and the extra 3 base infrastructure put in sooner after that, as I begin to mule from the additional OC.
I'm embarrased by my past actions and even more ashamed of my present thoughts and future endeavors to clear my name.
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