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On May 03 2012 22:07 radiantshadow92 wrote:
I have really held it easily as terran even on antiga. Denying the high ground vision is key. Pull everything to kill the assimilator on antiga. Thanks for the easy points cheesers :D
Against whom? Gaulzi or just some random guy trying to cannon rush? It costs you 180 minerals+ Show Spoiler +(900/5 = 180 scv attacks*1.5 = 270 seconds of lost mining time[all scvs combined], 270*(40/60) = 180 minerals)
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On May 03 2012 22:26 Zarahtra wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 22:07 radiantshadow92 wrote:
I have really held it easily as terran even on antiga. Denying the high ground vision is key. Pull everything to kill the assimilator on antiga. Thanks for the easy points cheesers :D Against whom? Gaulzi or just some random guy trying to cannon rush? It costs you 180 minerals + Show Spoiler +(900/5 = 180 scv attacks*1.5 = 270 seconds of lost mining time[all scvs combined], 270*(40/60) = 180 minerals) to attack the assimilator at which point I'd assume he could just cancel the assimilator at last second and make pylon(or even possibly gateway) on the highground for vision. Unless you can outdmg the assimilator(as in do more dmg than the construct hp speed), I don't see how attacking the assimilator would be a fix.
Dude, you're looking at things in a vacuum. You're not the only person that has to make sacrifices. If you would like to quantify lost mining time, think about how the cannon rusher loses minerals for cutting probes, building the pylons and cannons, pulling probes off from mining, cutting into gas production, delaying warp gate tech, delaying all other tech, etc etc etc. If I could trade 180 minerals to WIN THE GAME, sign me up!
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On May 03 2012 22:34 Heh_ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 22:26 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:07 radiantshadow92 wrote:
I have really held it easily as terran even on antiga. Denying the high ground vision is key. Pull everything to kill the assimilator on antiga. Thanks for the easy points cheesers :D Against whom? Gaulzi or just some random guy trying to cannon rush? It costs you 180 minerals + Show Spoiler +(900/5 = 180 scv attacks*1.5 = 270 seconds of lost mining time[all scvs combined], 270*(40/60) = 180 minerals) to attack the assimilator at which point I'd assume he could just cancel the assimilator at last second and make pylon(or even possibly gateway) on the highground for vision. Unless you can outdmg the assimilator(as in do more dmg than the construct hp speed), I don't see how attacking the assimilator would be a fix. Dude, you're looking at things in a vacuum. You're not the only person that has to make sacrifices. If you would like to quantify lost mining time, think about how the cannon rusher loses minerals for cutting probes, building the pylons and cannons, pulling probes off from mining, cutting into gas production, delaying warp gate tech, delaying all other tech, etc etc etc. If I could trade 180 minerals to WIN THE GAME, sign me up!
I'm not at all watching things in a vaccum. The issue is simply that the crawl has already begun, if your 180 mineral investment to kill the assim doesn't stop the toss from getting vision on the highground(as in he can still place a pylon, gw or even 2nd assim) those 180 minerals, or rather 162.25 minerals(since it costs 18.75min to cancel) are a gift and just put your further behind while his cannons are going up and he's already siegeing your mineral line and crawling forward through your ramp.
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On May 03 2012 22:41 Zarahtra wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 22:34 Heh_ wrote:On May 03 2012 22:26 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:07 radiantshadow92 wrote:
I have really held it easily as terran even on antiga. Denying the high ground vision is key. Pull everything to kill the assimilator on antiga. Thanks for the easy points cheesers :D Against whom? Gaulzi or just some random guy trying to cannon rush? It costs you 180 minerals + Show Spoiler +(900/5 = 180 scv attacks*1.5 = 270 seconds of lost mining time[all scvs combined], 270*(40/60) = 180 minerals) to attack the assimilator at which point I'd assume he could just cancel the assimilator at last second and make pylon(or even possibly gateway) on the highground for vision. Unless you can outdmg the assimilator(as in do more dmg than the construct hp speed), I don't see how attacking the assimilator would be a fix. Dude, you're looking at things in a vacuum. You're not the only person that has to make sacrifices. If you would like to quantify lost mining time, think about how the cannon rusher loses minerals for cutting probes, building the pylons and cannons, pulling probes off from mining, cutting into gas production, delaying warp gate tech, delaying all other tech, etc etc etc. If I could trade 180 minerals to WIN THE GAME, sign me up! I'm not at all watching things in a vaccum. The issue is simply that the crawl has already begun, if your 180 mineral investment to kill the assim doesn't stop the toss from getting vision on the highground(as in he can still place a pylon, gw or even 2nd assim) those 180 minerals, or rather 162.25 minerals(since it costs 18.75min to cancel) are a gift and just put your further behind while his cannons are going up and he's already siegeing your mineral line and crawling forward through your ramp.
Okay, I guess there's a ton of misinformation floating around. The assimilator trick is mainly used on antiga against zerg, because you can't build on creep. Keeping an assimilator alive is easier than keeping a probe alive on creep. If you're getting cannon rushed as terran or protoss, you're supposed to completely deny entry to the probe. The assimilator is just a convenient structure to provide vision.
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On May 03 2012 22:41 Zarahtra wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 22:34 Heh_ wrote:On May 03 2012 22:26 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:07 radiantshadow92 wrote:
I have really held it easily as terran even on antiga. Denying the high ground vision is key. Pull everything to kill the assimilator on antiga. Thanks for the easy points cheesers :D Against whom? Gaulzi or just some random guy trying to cannon rush? It costs you 180 minerals + Show Spoiler +(900/5 = 180 scv attacks*1.5 = 270 seconds of lost mining time[all scvs combined], 270*(40/60) = 180 minerals) to attack the assimilator at which point I'd assume he could just cancel the assimilator at last second and make pylon(or even possibly gateway) on the highground for vision. Unless you can outdmg the assimilator(as in do more dmg than the construct hp speed), I don't see how attacking the assimilator would be a fix. Dude, you're looking at things in a vacuum. You're not the only person that has to make sacrifices. If you would like to quantify lost mining time, think about how the cannon rusher loses minerals for cutting probes, building the pylons and cannons, pulling probes off from mining, cutting into gas production, delaying warp gate tech, delaying all other tech, etc etc etc. If I could trade 180 minerals to WIN THE GAME, sign me up! I'm not at all watching things in a vaccum. The issue is simply that the crawl has already begun, if your 180 mineral investment to kill the assim doesn't stop the toss from getting vision on the highground(as in he can still place a pylon, gw or even 2nd assim) those 180 minerals, or rather 162.25 minerals(since it costs 18.75min to cancel) are a gift and just put your further behind while his cannons are going up and he's already siegeing your mineral line and crawling forward through your ramp.
you are right, if the toss still has high ground vision the game is over, but i pulled to kill it because i knew that the probe would die to my marine and he would have to rely on the ramp to keep high ground vision *because i walled off*. From there it doesn't matter how many minerals i spend trying to deny this. He spent money on cannons in the low ground and has no gateway. I have a barracks and can go into drops or expand. Its an auto win. And if he cut probes then it really is an auto win.
btw im in high masters.
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On May 03 2012 22:49 Heh_ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 22:41 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:34 Heh_ wrote:On May 03 2012 22:26 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:07 radiantshadow92 wrote:
I have really held it easily as terran even on antiga. Denying the high ground vision is key. Pull everything to kill the assimilator on antiga. Thanks for the easy points cheesers :D Against whom? Gaulzi or just some random guy trying to cannon rush? It costs you 180 minerals + Show Spoiler +(900/5 = 180 scv attacks*1.5 = 270 seconds of lost mining time[all scvs combined], 270*(40/60) = 180 minerals) to attack the assimilator at which point I'd assume he could just cancel the assimilator at last second and make pylon(or even possibly gateway) on the highground for vision. Unless you can outdmg the assimilator(as in do more dmg than the construct hp speed), I don't see how attacking the assimilator would be a fix. Dude, you're looking at things in a vacuum. You're not the only person that has to make sacrifices. If you would like to quantify lost mining time, think about how the cannon rusher loses minerals for cutting probes, building the pylons and cannons, pulling probes off from mining, cutting into gas production, delaying warp gate tech, delaying all other tech, etc etc etc. If I could trade 180 minerals to WIN THE GAME, sign me up! I'm not at all watching things in a vaccum. The issue is simply that the crawl has already begun, if your 180 mineral investment to kill the assim doesn't stop the toss from getting vision on the highground(as in he can still place a pylon, gw or even 2nd assim) those 180 minerals, or rather 162.25 minerals(since it costs 18.75min to cancel) are a gift and just put your further behind while his cannons are going up and he's already siegeing your mineral line and crawling forward through your ramp. Okay, I guess there's a ton of misinformation floating around. The assimilator trick is mainly used on antiga against zerg, because you can't build on creep. Keeping an assimilator alive is easier than keeping a probe alive on creep. If you're getting cannon rushed as terran or protoss, you're supposed to completely deny entry to the probe. The assimilator is just a convenient structure to provide vision.
Well as people and the video actually shows you, you simply can't just "deny the probe entry", did you even watch the video? D9 states quite clearly how much he likes the fact he's using 2 probes on 4 player maps so he can hit before the ramp is sealed. Only by knowing that it is coming you can skip scvs to finish the wall in time.
+ Show Spoiler +The problem with antiga in this case is simply that for zerg, you have creep but you don't have anything that can kill the probe on the ramp giving highground vision and for terran that you don't have creep to deny buildings from being made.
On May 03 2012 22:54 radiantshadow92 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 22:41 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:34 Heh_ wrote:On May 03 2012 22:26 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:07 radiantshadow92 wrote:
I have really held it easily as terran even on antiga. Denying the high ground vision is key. Pull everything to kill the assimilator on antiga. Thanks for the easy points cheesers :D Against whom? Gaulzi or just some random guy trying to cannon rush? It costs you 180 minerals + Show Spoiler +(900/5 = 180 scv attacks*1.5 = 270 seconds of lost mining time[all scvs combined], 270*(40/60) = 180 minerals) to attack the assimilator at which point I'd assume he could just cancel the assimilator at last second and make pylon(or even possibly gateway) on the highground for vision. Unless you can outdmg the assimilator(as in do more dmg than the construct hp speed), I don't see how attacking the assimilator would be a fix. Dude, you're looking at things in a vacuum. You're not the only person that has to make sacrifices. If you would like to quantify lost mining time, think about how the cannon rusher loses minerals for cutting probes, building the pylons and cannons, pulling probes off from mining, cutting into gas production, delaying warp gate tech, delaying all other tech, etc etc etc. If I could trade 180 minerals to WIN THE GAME, sign me up! I'm not at all watching things in a vaccum. The issue is simply that the crawl has already begun, if your 180 mineral investment to kill the assim doesn't stop the toss from getting vision on the highground(as in he can still place a pylon, gw or even 2nd assim) those 180 minerals, or rather 162.25 minerals(since it costs 18.75min to cancel) are a gift and just put your further behind while his cannons are going up and he's already siegeing your mineral line and crawling forward through your ramp. you are right, if the toss still has high ground vision the game is over, but i pulled to kill it because i knew that the probe would die to my marine and he would have to rely on the ramp to keep high ground vision *because i walled off*. From there it doesn't matter how many minerals i spend trying to deny this. He spent money on cannons in the low ground and has no gateway. I have a barracks and can go into drops or expand. Its an auto win. And if he cut probes then it really is an auto win. btw im in high masters.
Was this against Gaulzi or just someone trying to test this cannon thing out? Because atleast assuming someone knows what he is doing, it seems to me in the least that he should be able to keep the probe safe and make extra buildings before the rine is out to kill the probe off.
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Cannon rushing is a despicable strategy employed by the stupid and weak.
That said, a lot of high level players are lazy/complacent about scouting.
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On May 03 2012 22:57 Zarahtra wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 22:49 Heh_ wrote:On May 03 2012 22:41 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:34 Heh_ wrote:On May 03 2012 22:26 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:07 radiantshadow92 wrote:
I have really held it easily as terran even on antiga. Denying the high ground vision is key. Pull everything to kill the assimilator on antiga. Thanks for the easy points cheesers :D Against whom? Gaulzi or just some random guy trying to cannon rush? It costs you 180 minerals + Show Spoiler +(900/5 = 180 scv attacks*1.5 = 270 seconds of lost mining time[all scvs combined], 270*(40/60) = 180 minerals) to attack the assimilator at which point I'd assume he could just cancel the assimilator at last second and make pylon(or even possibly gateway) on the highground for vision. Unless you can outdmg the assimilator(as in do more dmg than the construct hp speed), I don't see how attacking the assimilator would be a fix. Dude, you're looking at things in a vacuum. You're not the only person that has to make sacrifices. If you would like to quantify lost mining time, think about how the cannon rusher loses minerals for cutting probes, building the pylons and cannons, pulling probes off from mining, cutting into gas production, delaying warp gate tech, delaying all other tech, etc etc etc. If I could trade 180 minerals to WIN THE GAME, sign me up! I'm not at all watching things in a vaccum. The issue is simply that the crawl has already begun, if your 180 mineral investment to kill the assim doesn't stop the toss from getting vision on the highground(as in he can still place a pylon, gw or even 2nd assim) those 180 minerals, or rather 162.25 minerals(since it costs 18.75min to cancel) are a gift and just put your further behind while his cannons are going up and he's already siegeing your mineral line and crawling forward through your ramp. Okay, I guess there's a ton of misinformation floating around. The assimilator trick is mainly used on antiga against zerg, because you can't build on creep. Keeping an assimilator alive is easier than keeping a probe alive on creep. If you're getting cannon rushed as terran or protoss, you're supposed to completely deny entry to the probe. The assimilator is just a convenient structure to provide vision. Well as people and the video actually shows you, you simply can't just "deny the probe entry", did you even watch the video? D9 states quite clearly how much he likes the fact he's using 2 probes on a player maps so he can hit before the ramp is sealed. Only by knowing that it is coming you can skip scvs to finish the wall in time. + Show Spoiler +The problem with antiga in this case is simply that for zerg, you have creep but you don't have anything that can kill the probe on the ramp giving highground vision and for terran that you don't have creep to deny buildings from being made.
Yes, I've watched the video and read the entire thread. It's easier to kill 1 probe and deny entry to others while preventing high ground structures from building, rather than allowing the cannon rusher to do whatever the hell he wants. On antiga, the low ground cannon can only shoot at 2 mineral patches; it's not the end of the world (but close) if the low-ground cannon completes and an assimilator/pylon is up.
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On May 03 2012 12:09 Clazziquai10 wrote:
The greatest pleasure in life is doing what people say you cannot!
I see what you did there!
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On May 03 2012 16:34 Ryndika wrote:So anyone has words how to stop this as terran? I usually rally 14th SCV to build second depot if I go gasless but that's not fast enough. Can it be held with CC first? http://www.twitch.tv/gaulzi/b/31346581810:45 doesnt seem enough that you depot block the probe.
At my level, cannon rushing is fairly common in PvP so I am used to facing it. I am sure I have not faced such a well practiced cannon rush, but the theory is similar.
If he makes a pylon, take 2/3 SCVs (3 drones or probes) and send them to the low ground. Put them on hold position so that he cant build cannons in a wallable location. Use workers to kill the cannons before they complete.
As song as you dont let him wall his cannons in they can never finish.
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On May 04 2012 01:18 hzflank wrote:
At my level, cannon rushing is fairly common in PvP so I am used to facing it. I am sure I have not faced such a well practiced cannon rush, but the theory is similar.
Get it used it man. I am playing High masters and GM players on NA, and literally every other game is a cheese fest 2 Gate or Cannon Rush.
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On May 02 2012 07:37 iAmJeffReY wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 07:30 reikai wrote:On May 02 2012 07:25 iAmJeffReY wrote:
well it's like that for anything. I can gasless FE, but if you 4 gate me, or bane bust, or roach bane, you dictate what I do. Aggressive builds dictate what the enemy has to do to react, and win.
I do wonder, as well, why their gas is 450/450 and doesn't require an SCV to sit and build, or to lose a drone.. i guess what i'm asking is what i'm supposed to do to stop that on antiga. normally i can "infer" a response to any strategy.... but this one doesn't seem fair/have a proper "retard check." (EX: you 1 rax FE against 4 gate, but scout it. retard check: build your bunkers and win the game later, or don't build them and eat gateway units while he eats your ladder points.. in case i made that term up. i can't be sure.) It's the map. It's like I think XNC where they could wall in behind your minerals with cannon and 2 pylons. Also quite stupid how you can see gas from the ramp on antiga. Like when I play TvZ, I take the gas near my ramp because of potential OL poking in the side early to check gas. Just hoping to get 'ahead' by him guessing my gas count wrong early. I agree though. It has no counter, other than unit control, and luck as terran. Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 07:37 Legion710 wrote:On May 02 2012 06:53 TheCasualGamer wrote:On May 02 2012 05:20 Legion710 wrote:
UH OH CALL THE CHEESE POLICE.
In all seriousness, i don't understand how you could effectively cannon a zerg and win the game with it? You could also cannon their natural and third, and if you have good enough skill to mass up units fast then you will beat them. Yeah, it's just I was under the impression that he was winning games only with the cannons  No simon, he has plat level macro to back it up. If you fend the cannon rush, but still take damage, he goes DT or VR and 1A's you.
Ok could be an obvious answer here, but in BW with certain cannon rushing spots, the best way to truly prevent this strategy was to place your own Worker unit on Patrol in those "imbalanced" cannon rushing areas on the map to obstruct your opponent from building there.
The other idea is to follow the probe immediately upon entering your base. If you want to ensure vision, build your first depot at the bottom of your ramp (to complete with rax + depot wall-off), or a depot at the ramp of your natural (Which will not provide full vision). Another option is to patrol a Worker at the ramp of your natural IF you know that the player is going to execute this strategy.
Once the worker enters, follow it and this should also help prevent his building. Note that I held this cannon rush by Depot + rax wall off at bottom, and then bunkered on high ground. However, I think the best way is also the most intuitive -- block all his potential areas to cannon with a worker (this is much better than wasting the mining time of several workers to kill a pylon/cannon)
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every pvp last night was a cannon rush i wanted to punch a baby into oblivion. i am dissappointed day[9] .
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When it comes from gaulzi at least as zerg you can deny the wall off that protects the first cannon...given you know he will either cannon rush or proxy 2 gates
As another race or against a guy you have no clue that he's going to do it or not it is just up to you to be carefull.
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On May 04 2012 03:11 MugenXBanksy wrote:
every pvp last night was a cannon rush i wanted to punch a baby into oblivion. i am dissappointed day[9] .
lol all 4 of my pvps today have been cannon rushes. Some how the only one I lost to though was gaulzi even though I knew he was going to do it from the start 
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On May 03 2012 22:34 Heh_ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 22:26 Zarahtra wrote:On May 03 2012 22:07 radiantshadow92 wrote:
I have really held it easily as terran even on antiga. Denying the high ground vision is key. Pull everything to kill the assimilator on antiga. Thanks for the easy points cheesers :D Against whom? Gaulzi or just some random guy trying to cannon rush? It costs you 180 minerals + Show Spoiler +(900/5 = 180 scv attacks*1.5 = 270 seconds of lost mining time[all scvs combined], 270*(40/60) = 180 minerals) to attack the assimilator at which point I'd assume he could just cancel the assimilator at last second and make pylon(or even possibly gateway) on the highground for vision. Unless you can outdmg the assimilator(as in do more dmg than the construct hp speed), I don't see how attacking the assimilator would be a fix. Dude, you're looking at things in a vacuum. You're not the only person that has to make sacrifices. If you would like to quantify lost mining time, think about how the cannon rusher loses minerals for cutting probes, building the pylons and cannons, pulling probes off from mining, cutting into gas production, delaying warp gate tech, delaying all other tech, etc etc etc. If I could trade 180 minerals to WIN THE GAME, sign me up!
Except he has probes still mining at home, no harass on them at all. He can cut probes, because he has constant income. You do not when you pull scvs/drones/probes to counter this. So unless you stop it without losing a lot, you're still behind.
And then the DT/VR or some other 1a style since he's plat is coming very soon after.
On May 03 2012 23:04 jdsowa wrote:
Cannon rushing is a despicable strategy employed by the stupid and weak.
That said, a lot of high level players are lazy/complacent about scouting.
Are you retarded? Scouting this does NOTHING for you. He scouts at 9, or earlier. No terran scouts before 12, as it's worthless to do against any normal opponent. This is so stupid to even say...to scout it. By the time you scout his base and see the forge, it's already too late as his probe has found you 90% of the time before you scout him.
Scouting is absolutely pointless against a cannon rush. It comes too early, before your barracks is even finished the pylons start dropping.
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On May 04 2012 04:57 Vathus wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 03:11 MugenXBanksy wrote:
every pvp last night was a cannon rush i wanted to punch a baby into oblivion. i am dissappointed day[9] . lol all 4 of my pvps today have been cannon rushes. Some how the only one I lost to though was gaulzi even though I knew he was going to do it from the start
I've been just opening Forge first on certain maps and if I scout my opponent opened Forge, I just build defensive cannons and tech, otherwise I just cannon rush. Been doing well so far, since everyone has been pretty much cannon rushing.
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ty for the warning. I know 2 cannon rushers who rely on it heavily (wbc) and now this guy. Just play ultra safe and I know i'll win.
It's silly how strong cannon rushes are, and I feel even if I stop it, it doesn't put the toss behind at all unless they don't cancel any of the cannons xD
The best way to hold off would be an 11 pool. If you know for a fact he's a player that relies on this kind of stuff, I would 11 pool vs that player and just play normal. I always follow a probe with my drone so I can stop the 3 pylon wall (this gives protoss literally a huge huge huge advantage and they should not lose, but they still lose to nydus even though they should know it's coming lol).
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On May 03 2012 08:11 gaulzi wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 06:32 oOOoOphidian wrote:On May 03 2012 04:27 Jaaaaasper wrote:On May 03 2012 04:06 ][Primarch][ wrote:
So...CombatEx and Deezer are gone but hey Gaulzi comes to rescue, he will make the ladder as disgusting as possible for everyone. Way to go Gaulzi! Herp Fucking Derp To be fair, from what i have seen of him, he doesn't bm or stream cheat, which was what made combat ez and deezer so despicable. If he does do that as well then yes he is just as bad, if not he is just someone who has chosen to be good at one (cheesy) thing, as opposed to trying to be good at the game over all. He has streamed his own play when you can clearly hear the sound of his opponent's stream in the background... Reference please.
lol trying to hide the truth? :D not only do you BM, Canon Rush and Streamcheat, you also talk about "next level canon-rushing". Are you actually CombatEx after plastic surgery? lol
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On May 04 2012 07:11 ][Primarch][ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 03 2012 08:11 gaulzi wrote:On May 03 2012 06:32 oOOoOphidian wrote:On May 03 2012 04:27 Jaaaaasper wrote:On May 03 2012 04:06 ][Primarch][ wrote:
So...CombatEx and Deezer are gone but hey Gaulzi comes to rescue, he will make the ladder as disgusting as possible for everyone. Way to go Gaulzi! Herp Fucking Derp To be fair, from what i have seen of him, he doesn't bm or stream cheat, which was what made combat ez and deezer so despicable. If he does do that as well then yes he is just as bad, if not he is just someone who has chosen to be good at one (cheesy) thing, as opposed to trying to be good at the game over all. He has streamed his own play when you can clearly hear the sound of his opponent's stream in the background... Reference please. lol trying to hide the truth? :D not only do you BM, Canon Rush and Streamcheat, you also talk about "next level canon-rushing". Are you actually CombatEx after plastic surgery? lol
I often don't post cause I think I might look like an idiot to my fellow forum-goers - but hey Mr ][Primarch][, those words are just vicious and unless you have any video of this actually being the case I suggest you gtfo. When people throw bad manner around for no good reason it just makes me really angry - especially when it's against cheesers because of how easy it is to lose people feel like they are some how justified in being generally bad manner towards them. Sure be angry in game I don't care about that - and besides that's cause you just got fucking cheesed and you're angry I get like that too lol - it's when people like Primarch take it to the forums where it is clearly not cause you're angry you got cheesed you are just trying to start a fight - these keyboard warriors just make me mad.
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EPT
