EPT[G] Bronze to Masters, Improving Mechanics - Page 56
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MikeyH
United States44 Posts
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enanoretozon
Panama57 Posts
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MikeyH
United States44 Posts
I'll PM Filter to see if I can get a response more quickly. I'm not sure that he checks this much anymore. | ||
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enanoretozon
Panama57 Posts
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bluebereft
Singapore13 Posts
i started playing sc2 a couple of months ago, and have been stuck in bronze for the longest time. i watch a great deal of streams and videos, and all these macro builds. tried to follow day9's newbie tuesday advice, and apollo's learningterran vids. but my play didn't seem to get any better. was getting some occasional wins against silver, and fluctuate in and out of top 10 bronze, but i didn't feel like i was making any measurable kind of improvement. so i decided to start from scratch, and follow filter's vids! played 2 games on the ladder, aiming for video 1's benchmarks of 50 SCVs at 10:00 and FE at 3:45. No scouting, no gas, no tech, only marines. Got paired with a silver player the first game and completely rolled him by a-moving marines (52 scvs and 50+ marines at 10:00). 2nd game, against a favoured silver player, 54 scvs and 58 marines at 10:00! lost that game as he was sentry heavy and forcefielded the ramps till colussi came out. but the feeling of making a measurable improvement is amazing. going to move on to the next video now, and hopefully make more progress! thanks filter! | ||
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Lexity
United Kingdom4 Posts
On November 14 2012 03:43 bluebereft wrote: thanks to filter for making these videos! i started playing sc2 a couple of months ago, and have been stuck in bronze for the longest time. i watch a great deal of streams and videos, and all these macro builds. tried to follow day9's newbie tuesday advice, and apollo's learningterran vids. but my play didn't seem to get any better. was getting some occasional wins against silver, and fluctuate in and out of top 10 bronze, but i didn't feel like i was making any measurable kind of improvement. so i decided to start from scratch, and follow filter's vids! played 2 games on the ladder, aiming for video 1's benchmarks of 50 SCVs at 10:00 and FE at 3:45. No scouting, no gas, no tech, only marines. Got paired with a silver player the first game and completely rolled him by a-moving marines (52 scvs and 50+ marines at 10:00). 2nd game, against a favoured silver player, 54 scvs and 58 marines at 10:00! lost that game as he was sentry heavy and forcefielded the ramps till colussi came out. but the feeling of making a measurable improvement is amazing. going to move on to the next video now, and hopefully make more progress! thanks filter! Can you post the replay of the game where you got 54 SCVs by 10 minutes? | ||
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Qube
Canada46 Posts
On November 14 2012 23:23 Lexity wrote: Can you post the replay of the game where you got 54 SCVs by 10 minutes? Yeah! I'd like to see that too! I can't hit 50 constantly... I usually get 46-47 SCVs. Your replay might help me a bit! Thanks! | ||
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Coya
Germany6 Posts
So i know that people say there is no strat involved in platinum league and it really all comes down to macro and whatnot, but right now i feel like macro is just not going to cut it. I get the feeling to change up my strats to involve mutas and infstors and such would benefit me more than going for the filter build. What I am interested in, is wether somebody else had same experiences in plat league, or am i still just horrible at macroing (I use SC2gears to track my macro and my avg injection gap is probably around 10 secs but mostly 7-9 secs, which i thought was quite good). I dont necessesarily want to switch up builds if i can be certain that im just bad and thats why im losing, but eventually if im not the only one, it might be better to just switch. | ||
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BurningRanger
Germany303 Posts
On November 15 2012 00:07 Qube wrote: Yeah! I'd like to see that too! I can't hit 50 constantly... I usually get 46-47 SCVs. Your replay might help me a bit! Thanks! Actually easy, when you don't upgrade to OCs. Upgrading takes as long as producing 2 SCVs. With 2 CCs that's 4 SCVs. But not useful certainly.  | ||
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MikeyH
United States44 Posts
On November 15 2012 00:20 Coya wrote: So as most of the watchers of Filters videos im quite thankful for that I am mid-high platinum on the EU servers now instead of bronze as Zerg. But i hit a wall, in form of basically losing most of my games, because of toss doing Immortal Sentry every game, which is, for me at least, an instalose, because most of the toss have reasonable macro to build enough sentries and immortals. Zergs mostly are building zerg and banes and go allin or at least build too much for me to defend with ~10 roaches which i would have by then. If they dont they build infestors, and depending on their roach/infestor ratio i win or i lose and terran is still okay either, but there are no terrans in platinum apparently. So i know that people say there is no strat involved in platinum league and it really all comes down to macro and whatnot, but right now i feel like macro is just not going to cut it. I get the feeling to change up my strats to involve mutas and infstors and such would benefit me more than going for the filter build. What I am interested in, is wether somebody else had same experiences in plat league, or am i still just horrible at macroing (I use SC2gears to track my macro and my avg injection gap is probably around 10 secs but mostly 7-9 secs, which i thought was quite good). I dont necessesarily want to switch up builds if i can be certain that im just bad and thats why im losing, but eventually if im not the only one, it might be better to just switch. I think the problem here is just a build order loss. I know you said that you don't want to change build orders, but in this situation you might not have a choice. The immortal sentry all in is very powerful. Day9 covered a good counter for it a couple weeks ago. Maybe you should take a look. | ||
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Coya
Germany6 Posts
On November 15 2012 01:00 MikeyH wrote: I think the problem here is just a build order loss. I know you said that you don't want to change build orders, but in this situation you might not have a choice. The immortal sentry all in is very powerful. Day9 covered a good counter for it a couple weeks ago. Maybe you should take a look. Oh I did not actually mean to say that I didn't want to switch build orders, I was well aware that my build order was horrible to play against what i was up against, but since I hear people saying, that in platinum all you need is macro and such a thing as a build order loss is not correct to say in platinum league, since if you lose you are just shitty at macro. But I might try to get that build order down for ZvP can't get worse than 100% lose ratio against immortal sentry. Thanks for the link and the help! | ||
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bluebereft
Singapore13 Posts
On November 14 2012 23:23 Lexity wrote: Can you post the replay of the game where you got 54 SCVs by 10 minutes? very embarassingly, i went to look at the replay again and realised i was counting scvs from the wrong tab! have been using the worker supply number (which includes mules) as the scv number. I've been tabulating all the timings and numbers I achieve in an excel spreadsheet. Table image These are for the benchmarks set for Ep3-4, I moved on to those after I thought I hit the Ep1-2 ones comfortably (but may not have, due to the wrong scv count!) Marines only, 52 scvs This is the game where I thought I had 54 scvs. Turns out that I had about 51/52 at 10:00. Had 58 marines. Here, the benchmarks from Ep1-2 were used; so, only naked rax, keep making rax, scvs, depots. A-moved the army and lost, might also have moved out late! I found the examples of filter playing with these benchmarks really useful. Not so much for how he reacts to what the opponent does, but more of when he puts down extra rax (whenever he has extra money after a macro cycle), etc. MMM, 40scvs This was one of the first few games I played using the 2nd set of benchmarks (Ep 3-4). It's game two of the table in the picture. This game really motivated me; I actually failed all the benchmarks here, except for the timing of the natural. I missed scvs during the attack, didn't switch the reactor to starport properly then (starport actually goes floating somewhere by accident), and was also late on 3rd gas which delayed the factory etc. Missed marines and all that too. But in spite of being late and getting attacked at 9mins, I knew what I needed to build after, and I had a good economy set up with all those scvs being built. Pushed out later and won the game, with the opponent being in the top 10 silver for his division! Still not hitting those benchmarks, but I can feel myself improving and getting more comfortable with macroing. Naturally some games are wins and some losses, but notice that the table doesn't show which are wins or losses! Most of the losses came simply because I didn't macro enough and push out at 10mins. Am working at it, hopefully will make silver soon! | ||
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Qube
Canada46 Posts
But man, by looking at your spreadsheet, I saw exactly the same thing I was doing myself. That's pretty funny and you can see what progress you make. I use this "tool" for my "vs. AI" games also, it helps a lot! | ||
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dUTtrOACh
Canada2339 Posts
User was warned for this post | ||
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enanoretozon
Panama57 Posts
On November 15 2012 06:55 dUTtrOACh wrote: What's funny about this type of guide, is, if every player were to adopt the same approach and increased in skill at approximately the same speed as they have been, nobody's rank would ever change very much. What I'm trying to say is, there's no polishing a turd. Thankfully, Mythbusters proved that you can polish a turd and all Bronze players who read this guide will be in Master league eventually. I'm trying to think of some way your post is in any way constructive but unfortunately so far it seems you're saying bronze players are turds, doomed to remain turds even if they improve, and somehow their mistake was to try to improve with this guide. Maybe if you could elaborate your criticism in a positive manner something can be salvaged from this. | ||
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bluebereft
Singapore13 Posts
THANK YOU FILTER! Failed the Ep3-4 benchmarks though  his reaper harass messed me up | ||
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Nitrotech
United Kingdom22 Posts
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Kyrao
United States161 Posts
On November 19 2012 05:23 Nitrotech wrote: Hey guys I have been using Filter's build for a while but due to work commitments i haven't been able to get onto the scouting guide yet, just focusing on my macro seems to do pretty well in bronze. However i am having problems with protoss who place forcefields around the back of my bunker stopping my scvs getting to repair it when they push, I feel like putting the bunker closer to my natural mineral line and bottom of my main base ramp would give better results against this and allow my scvs to get there quicker. Has anyone else had any success by changing the placement of the bunker? As a masters terran, I always take into account how far the bunker is from my natural mineral line for this very reason. You don't have to place it next to the ramp. | ||
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Faldinerous
United States62 Posts
On November 19 2012 05:23 Nitrotech wrote: Hey guys I have been using Filter's build for a while but due to work commitments i haven't been able to get onto the scouting guide yet, just focusing on my macro seems to do pretty well in bronze. However i am having problems with protoss who place forcefields around the back of my bunker stopping my scvs getting to repair it when they push, I feel like putting the bunker closer to my natural mineral line and bottom of my main base ramp would give better results against this and allow my scvs to get there quicker. Has anyone else had any success by changing the placement of the bunker? I saw on a Day9 newbie Tuesday (Here at 8:45) where he was saying that on a couple maps (he uses Ohana as an example) that a better place to put the bunker was wedged next to the ramp to the natural where it would protect the ramp and was closer to the SCVs. So your idea doesn't necessarily sound like a bad one. | ||
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Jekerdud
United States10 Posts
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