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Rewok
38 Posts
In one week, I went from Top 50 gold where I was stuck to top 8 platinum. braveZOMBiE.532 My win rate against Terran is like 90%. Now that I've figured out how to hold the initial bunker rush, it's more like 100%. I just remember being stuck in Gold and then winning like 15 straight vs gold, platinum and eventually diamond. If your ZvT could use some work, this guide ROCKS. | ||
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TangSC
Canada1852 Posts
On March 17 2012 05:05 Rewok wrote: Love this ZvT style. In one week, I went from Top 50 gold where I was stuck to top 8 platinum. braveZOMBiE.532 My win rate against Terran is like 90%. Now that I've figured out how to hold the initial bunker rush, it's more like 100%. I just remember being stuck in Gold and then winning like 15 straight vs gold, platinum and eventually diamond. If your ZvT could use some work, this guide ROCKS. Bunker rushes require you to pull drones from your main and occasionally produce a couple extra zerglings and 1-2 spines. After you hold it, though, you can transition into the roach/ling timing to contain him to 1 base. | ||
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bri9and
United States246 Posts
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TangSC
Canada1852 Posts
On March 21 2012 04:53 bri9and wrote: If they don't fall for that, offer $20 for a surrender and that pretty much secures the win. Bit of a silly suggestion, not really related to strategy. I can't imagine anyone would accept such an offer, and anyone who pays 20$ for someone to leave a game would go broke pretty fast. | ||
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bri9and
United States246 Posts
http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/5499/loltang.jpg http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=32696¤tpage=1076#21526 forevernerdy was just banned by Chill. That account was created on 2011-10-23 14:05:06 and had 30 posts. Reason: You seriously made a second account to ask yourself questions in your own thread Tang? Come on bro. | ||
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TangSC
Canada1852 Posts
On March 24 2012 03:06 bri9and wrote: Well played sir.. well played. http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/5499/loltang.jpg http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=32696¤tpage=1076#21526 Do some research on the poster of that topic on reddit, it's just a line taken out of context of the greater joke. Please post the entire replay, so we can all see! Also, Chill unbanned that account, it was banned because a Uwaterloo friend and I have the same IP when we're on campus. I appreciate your desire to keep the SC2 community honest though! It would be shameful if someone actually paid their way into Grand Master, or created an account to bump their own threads on TL. | ||
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WolfintheSheep
Canada4372 Posts
On January 28 2012 02:59 TangSC wrote: I agree XChoke, I think there's a double-standard in StarCraft where Terran and Protoss players are expected to do pressure builds but if a Zerg player tries to pressure it's suddenly cheese. I hope more people open up to the variety of strategies in SC2! Imagine a Terran or Protoss player pulls 10-15 workers with every pressure build that they do. That's usually around the number of drones you're cutting with your builds on every offensive, and that's why they're all-ins. If your builds were built around keeping an equivalent economy with your opponent, then you might be able to call it pressure. But there is no double-standard - If Terran and Protoss cut worker production, or pull workers, then they're doing an all-in. It would be a double-standard not to say the same about Zerg. | ||
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TangSC
Canada1852 Posts
On March 24 2012 03:34 WolfintheSheep wrote: Imagine a Terran or Protoss player pulls 10-15 workers with every pressure build that they do. That's usually around the number of drones you're cutting with your builds on every offensive, and that's why they're all-ins. If your builds were built around keeping an equivalent economy with your opponent, then you might be able to call it pressure. But there is no double-standard - If Terran and Protoss cut worker production, or pull workers, then they're doing an all-in. It would be a double-standard not to say the same about Zerg. I like that you're analyzing it critically! But I would disagree with a few points. First, you cannot compare executing a timing attack that uses 15 larva with protoss/terran players pulling 10/15 workers. Using workers as part of a timing attack immediately cuts your income in half! Not to mention lost mining time of moving across the map. With a roach/ling timing you're droning into the mid game, securing one fully-saturated base and an expansion with a few drones (it takes roughly 22-26 drones to be able to support 2hatch/2queen drone production). I understand that you see StarCraft II as a game that revolves around "keeping an equivalent economy with your opponent". Many people would agree with you, and I think your answer is partically right: maintaining equal or greater economy with your opponent is a significant factor and it's one way to approach your decision-making. But you have to take into consideration other factors too, like map control and safety to drone, scouting information, damage done to opponent, and additional defenses built by opponent. There are a wide variety of economic and aggressive transitions available to those who properly execute Roach/Ling timing attacks. | ||
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Proxee
63 Posts
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TangSC
Canada1852 Posts
On March 31 2012 04:29 Proxee wrote: This build is Very much NOT an all-in. It can be used that way, or u could just go for a macro game. And also I'm sick of these double standard for zerg players, Protoss/Terran do early timing attacks and its stratgey, Zerg does an early timing attack and its Just cheese. Tang's guides are very useful for learning. Just because u can opt to do an all-in doesn't mean its an All-in. I agree with you about double standards, people overestimate how badly zerg needs 60+ drones and 3 fully saturated bases. Of course going for as strong of an economy and unit composition in the late game is a great strategy/mindset, but it's not the only one - There are a lot of ways to be dangerous in the early/midgame. | ||
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bmore_bulldog
18 Posts
Now, if Tang actually paid people to drop or used fake accounts, that's another thing, but for now I'll take his word that he didn't. | ||
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Glitch890
22 Posts
I also find it interesting that when P or T (especially T) plays aggressively, no one bats an eye, but when Zerg does it all of a sudden your a cheesy noob. | ||
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Th1rdEye
United States1069 Posts
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TangSC
Canada1852 Posts
On April 23 2012 10:13 Glitch890 wrote: I also find it interesting that when P or T (especially T) plays aggressively, no one bats an eye, but when Zerg does it all of a sudden your a cheesy noob. It has been that way since beta I'm afraid, but I've seen so many pros (Nestea/Losira/Drg) go for 2base timings and transition into 3-4 base standard macro. The thing that bothers me the most is that people even criticize players for choosing all-in styles, they can be as effective as any. | ||
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zZzJinzZz
United States13 Posts
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Sithelin123
Canada168 Posts
Tang ALL of your guides are extremely amazing and IMO the best guides in this forum. | ||
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GodOfWarAReS
Germany105 Posts
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bankai
362 Posts
- Is there a reason for the slight difference in this BO compared to the original Tang thread on the ZvT Roach all-in or is it? In Phase 1 in this one, you build lings up to 60/60 supply, but in the other thread you only build lings up to 52/60 supply. - The basic BO in Step 1 does not seem to mention drone scouting - at what point should I send my drone out? I prefer 9 normally so I can get inside the terran wall-off to scout gas or not. Thanks for your help everyone  | ||
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Tenken
United States17 Posts
On April 24 2012 00:45 TangSC wrote: It has been that way since beta I'm afraid, but I've seen so many pros (Nestea/Losira/Drg) go for 2base timings and transition into 3-4 base standard macro. The thing that bothers me the most is that people even criticize players for choosing all-in styles, they can be as effective as any. The difference is that they are actually good at the game where as your game is lacking past the 10 minute mark. | ||
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ETisME
Hong Kong11881 Posts
that's really my main and only concern, probably the one guide from Tang that I might do because it looks more macro based and easier to transition. | ||
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