EPTAggressive zerg can be quite powerful early and late game. Its the mid game that we are forced to be passive to get our economy up. Mid game timings are just not as powerful for zerg as it is for terran or protoss.
[G] GrandMaster SC2 Lecture: Aggressive Zerg Play - Page 12
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Acidosis
United States172 Posts
Aggressive zerg can be quite powerful early and late game. Its the mid game that we are forced to be passive to get our economy up. Mid game timings are just not as powerful for zerg as it is for terran or protoss. | ||
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Catgroove
Sweden67 Posts
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Bad_Habit
Germany243 Posts
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Threx
Germany4 Posts
I myself improved my play using this style. So I thank you Tang for showing me a different side of Zerg. | ||
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sSoda
United States95 Posts
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
On November 04 2011 09:22 sSoda wrote: not gm anymore lol. "I will be gm season 4". Apparently not... Random reset, not my fault ^^ I beat sheth, been a good day. | ||
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Rivkeh
United States58 Posts
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
On November 04 2011 10:45 Rivkeh wrote: I'd be really happy to see non-muta aggression become a tool in Z's toolbox making a scarier race and adding to the depth of play, way to be TangSC. Don't forget about muta aggression though! You can always transition from the roach/ling to 4gas 2base muta  | ||
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RoyalFlush
Canada109 Posts
On November 04 2011 10:42 TangSC wrote: Random reset, not my fault ^^ I beat sheth, been a good day. Random Reset? LOL they just weeded out everyone who didnt deserve GM spots beating a progamer once on ladder literally means nothing | ||
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
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Eschaton
United States1245 Posts
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sanddbox_sc2
United States173 Posts
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michaelhasanalias
Korea (South)1231 Posts
On November 03 2011 10:00 TangSC wrote: I don't really take offense to that, if you could simply all-in your way to grand master without skill, like you're implying, everyone would do it. I appreciate builds that win games, be they long or short term. If you want to play SC2 well, you should be well-versed in cheesy/all-in builds, even the best of pros don't macro every single game. And honestly I think aggressive timing attacks are one of the best ways to practice fundamental mechanics. People don't do that because it's a boring and shitty way to play this game. Only if you had some financial interest like scamming bad players out of some extra money or really put that much of a premium on the icon in your profile would you do this. I got to high master by doing lame cheeses before I took the time to really try and improve. After 5-10 games of it it just wears on you doing the exact same build every game to every player. Ever since I stopped some months ago I've gotten much better at this game. Unfortunately for me, all my old practice partners who just played standard and legit the entire time are competing at MLGs and trying to go pro, whereas I'm just another random mid master player (GM on SEA, but that's not a real server). You could probably be a great player if you put the time you spend promoting yourself and cheesing into actually learning how to lay standard macro games. Instead, you continually try to forward this persona of "hey I'm the greatest and I cheese pros, pay me money and I'll reveal my secrets to you, a lowly silver player." I can't wait to see you make it back to GM though, as I'm sure you will. Interspersed between two long streaks of cheesey all-ins will be 20-30 epic macro games of unquestionable skill. And I'm sure we won't get any replays of them. Also don't send me 4 PMs me asking me to be nice to you when you shit on everything that this forum stands for in helping players improve by advocating your cheesy style and trying to pass it off as high level play. If you don't like being criticized for your actions, then change your actions. | ||
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TumescentPie
United States28 Posts
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
People don't do that because it's a boring and shitty way to play this game. Only if you had some financial interest like scamming bad players out of some extra money or really put that much of a premium on the icon in your profile would you do this. I got to high master by doing lame cheeses before I took the time to really try and improve. After 5-10 games of it it just wears on you doing the exact same build every game to every player. Ever since I stopped some months ago I've gotten much better at this game. Unfortunately for me, all my old practice partners who just played standard and legit the entire time are competing at MLGs and trying to go pro, whereas I'm just another random mid master player (GM on SEA, but that's not a real server). You could probably be a great player if you put the time you spend promoting yourself and cheesing into actually learning how to lay standard macro games. Instead, you continually try to forward this persona of "hey I'm the greatest and I cheese pros, pay me money and I'll reveal my secrets to you, a lowly silver player." I can't wait to see you make it back to GM though, as I'm sure you will. Interspersed between two long streaks of cheesey all-ins will be 20-30 epic macro games of unquestionable skill. And I'm sure we won't get any replays of them. Also don't send me 4 PMs me asking me to be nice to you when you shit on everything that this forum stands for in helping players improve by advocating your cheesy style and trying to pass it off as high level play. If you don't like being criticized for your actions, then change your actions. I've received an incredibly positive response from the majority of the SC2 community and I know my efforts to help people improve will not be appreciated by everyone, but that's perfectly fine. I love what I do and I thoroughly enjoy my play style so comments like yours truly don't phase me. If you took the time to constructively contribute and help improve the quality of my guides and posts, I'd happily consider your suggestions. Your criticism, however, is filled with spite and does not help anyone. I wish you'd put your time into helping out the community by doing a lecture or writing TL threads rather than spreading such negativity. | ||
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sanddbox_sc2
United States173 Posts
On November 06 2011 06:52 TangSC wrote: I've received an incredibly positive response from the majority of the SC2 community and I know my efforts to help people improve will not be appreciated by everyone, but that's perfectly fine. I love what I do and I thoroughly enjoy my play style so comments like yours truly don't phase me. If you took the time to constructively contribute and help improve the quality of my guides and posts, I'd happily consider your suggestions. Your criticism, however, is filled with spite and does not help anyone. I wish you'd put your time into helping out the community by doing a lecture or writing TL threads rather than spreading such negativity. You're delusional. The only positive response is from noobs that find that allins increase their winrate (no way!) and from your delusional ego congratulating yourself for swindling dozens of bad players. None of your play is without risk, and none of it shows skill. You execute various highly-effective allins because ladder is a best of one format. It's very easy to lose to someone who 6 pools every game, but very hard to lose a best of five against them once you figure out how unskilled of a player they are. You're no different. If you want to show your skill, play a showmatch versus someone, instead of making pretty-looking but otherwise useless guides to try to promote your website/stream/coaching. You haven't even attempted to strategically defend any aspect of your play, you've simply been saying "lots of people who are bad at this game find me helpful and why are you meanies still picking on me?". You have no intellectual honesty; you're here to profit, or at the very least to stroke your own ego. | ||
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Marokeas
Canada13 Posts
Tang has produced multiple productive threads for the community. Examples include: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252865 and http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=244816 Both of these posts go in depth on the teaching part of SC2. The post on a positive mindset has barely anything to do with starcraft but it's a great post for any one who wants to learn how to play the game nonetheless. The post on an effective opening build describes what I believe is a popular (used to be popular?) opening for zerg. In the end, the whole post has very little to do with the build itself and highlights the thinking required for learning any new build. I'm only a gold player, so I can't comment on Tang's play, except by saying that he's better than I am. I can comment, just from looking at both of these posts, that he's a good teacher. I can tell from both of these posts that he knows how to explain things in a way that allows someone to walk away having learned something they can apply later. Both of these posts, after I read them, made me a better player. This lecture is the same way. For some reason, Tang is getting hell from some self appointed people who believe he's doing something wrong by adding onto his posts links to more of him. He streams and he's just letting you know. He coaches and he's just letting you know. After putting in the effort and time to make posts like these, it's fair to give him a few lines to promote even more things he does for the community. One last thing as well. I got some coaching from Tang. It was very informative in that it taught me about starcraft 2 and, more importantly, it gave me tools that I could use to practice better than I could before. | ||
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Inters
Canada29 Posts
First off, cheese is the best way to learn. I flogged around for a bit in bronze league when I first started playing, then I discoved that you could actually just build a spawning pool at 6 supply. Once that got accomplished, I used that as a stepping stone to gold league by learning how to multitask/macro by building only 6 lings at the start and trying to keep them alive as long as possible. I went from bronze scrub to diamond scrub in 100 games. Obviously not record breaking, but something to consider. Why would anyone below plat, or hell even diamond, even attempt to do complicated stuff when they can't do simple stuff like cheese? You have to start with the easy stuff or you're NEVER going to learn the hard stuff. Oh, and EVERY progamer knows some cheese of some sort. Even IdrA. Cheese is part of the game, deal with it. If you refuse to ever cheese, you're worse off than the people who do cheese every game. So unless you see July posting in the threads about how to do aggressive play, I'd suggest everyone stfu and give this guy a chance. | ||
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snexwang
Australia224 Posts
cheese is the best way to learn That's a good one. | ||
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