EPTIf it is a drone-spine all-in 6 pool, you need to delay engaging as long as possible to get lings out with 3 drones targeting down the spine if possible
[Q] How to defend vs 6 pool ZvZ - Page 3
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ILoveCoffee
Malaysia164 Posts
If it is a drone-spine all-in 6 pool, you need to delay engaging as long as possible to get lings out with 3 drones targeting down the spine if possible | ||
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BinxyBrown
United States230 Posts
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zZippo
Russian Federation13 Posts
replay I am gold zerg, played this game against platinum. Not the best game, I failed a lot, but you get the idea on how to do it and how to do it better than me :p | ||
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Lazermonkey
Sweden2176 Posts
I guess it all depends on the sitiation. But generally no. If he is building a spine it's very important not to let it finish, once it goes up, his army will be so much stronger. One spine means one less drone(+4 less lings+less mining, but that won't really affect your drone vs ling fight)and if your oponent goes for an agressive spine it will finish way before yours, and thus you will have a hard time moving your own spine foreward into a nice position. If he didn't go for a spine, you should be fine just defending with drones anyway. | ||
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ThyHate
240 Posts
Can someone please explain exactly what I should have done on this one? replay : http://www.mediafire.com/?gxioydmgp4qlhhb | ||
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SnoeAUS
Australia1 Post
Keep in mind that creep doesn't effect drone speed, ie: fighting lings off creep is preferable. | ||
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ThyHate
240 Posts
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ThyHate2
1 Post
Again I lost all my 6-7 pool todays.. Can someone explain me what I did wrong here ? : http://www.mediafire.com/?kvoh9fmuu6oua6f | ||
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biteMe
Germany241 Posts
On October 11 2011 04:35 TheLastGoose wrote: no offense but if you can't hold off a 6 pool with a 13g 14 pool that's quite bad. i seriously think your micro is far below average if you aren't able to hold this type of aggression off, after all it's only 6 lings and you have 14ish drones... User was warned for this post wow!!!! he seriously got temp banned for this??? | ||
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Lazermonkey
Sweden2176 Posts
On October 22 2011 18:53 ThyHate2 wrote: Hi again, OP here. Again I lost all my 6-7 pool todays.. Can someone explain me what I did wrong here ? : http://www.mediafire.com/?kvoh9fmuu6oua6f Okey, I actually watched the replay. By the time he enters your base you have your pool up, which means he basically has 24 secounds before he has lost the game.But instead you delay your lings about 15 secs for no reason( you even had the money) and built a spine. That spine didn't rly do anything at all, was a waste of minerals, and one less drone. You also engage him in your mineral line. without your spine you would've had 16 drones, and by the time his second wave of lings enters your base your first SHOULD'VE poped if you trained them when your pool finished, which means that everytime he gets 2 extra lings, you also get 2 extra lings, but with better eco. The important part is NOT to let his spine finish. if you do your in such a bad position and there really isn't a reason for you to let it finish. imagine you would've engaged him in the open it should be 16 drones vs 6 lings. That is a really easy win for you. Just engage with your drones in a Pacman formation  . if he backs of, attack the spine. it doesn't even matter if he trades a few lings for some drones because you already have 10(!) more then him. So you can even afford to lose 9 drones and still be ahead. | ||
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dementrio
678 Posts
The "drone drill" technique is meant to delay, threatening a surround until your lings come out. The problem is that with the spine variants you can't really delay, and your opponent chooses the position where you'll be forced to engage. Despite all the bashing, an early pool can be very hard to hold. Good micro is not enough if your opponent has better micro, and as with all sc2, the actual engagement lasts a couple seconds and the outcome can be vastly different depending on tiny positional differences. Try to force an engagement at the top of your ramp, or otherwise in open space, where your superior numbers are hard to overcome. It's not the optimal way but it's the easiest. | ||
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-stOpSKY-
Canada498 Posts
On October 11 2011 03:51 ThyHate wrote: So yeah, everyone right now is facepalming thinking "not this thread again" But I DID read most of the thread about it. I tried all the advices, I tried fighting with drones with mineral patch micro / running until the lings arrive / building spines. Whether it's with drones pulled + 1 spine, or no drones + 2 spines, or no drones nor spine, I just lose. All I am asking is a replay of someone defending it, when the 6 pool was scouted very late. because all the replays I find right now either don't work anymore, or the 6 pool is scooted very early. (I always 13gas 14pool , I'm diamond rank1 playing masters) Thanks in advance.. You should be able to defend with drones most of the time while pool finishes. If you cant have a friend 6pool you and practice microing low hp drones. | ||
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Thebbeuttiffulland
Brazil288 Posts
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Kamikiri
United States1319 Posts
On October 22 2011 22:28 Thebbeuttiffulland wrote: i build spawn crawle in my mainr at the beginning of every game its really like free win vs 6 pool 14/14 your pool isnt finished by the time the lings show up to your base so how in the world do you magically have a spine crawler..? This isnt how do i hold off 6 pool with a 9 pool. | ||
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Puph
Canada635 Posts
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iChromatiC
United States12 Posts
P.S.: Sorry for rambling | ||
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dmtran87
United States32 Posts
On October 21 2011 01:36 SnoeAUS wrote: I recommend getting a friend and practicing with them 6-pooling you until you feel comfortable. Even if Zerg is an off race for them it is an easy build to learn and execute. There's nothing quite like kinetic learning for these sort of things. Keep in mind that creep doesn't effect drone speed, ie: fighting lings off creep is preferable. THIS. Practice. I used to have a horrible time with it until I just asked my friend to practice like 20 games really quick with me... and do it on a small map like xel naga and dont' react until you noramlly would see it ingame (it when your overlord scouts the ling trail) | ||
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Hairy
United Kingdom1169 Posts
On October 22 2011 19:07 biteMe wrote: wow!!!! he seriously got temp banned for this??? He knows an aspect of his play is bad. He is here for help, assistance and suggestions on how to improve - not to be told that he is bad. TheLastGoose's post serves no purpose other than to attempt to offend/patronise the OP. Imagine for a second if ALL replies in every strategy thread were: "Lol, you're having problems with -X- ?? That's quite bad, you must be far below average lol". | ||
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aebriol
Norway2066 Posts
On October 11 2011 05:05 ThyHate wrote: this is offtopic but my ZvZ opening is 13gas / 14 pool so I can start ling speed exactly when the pool is finished, and then mine 50 more gas, build a baneling nest and let 2 drones in gas. Full lings + baneling agression and expand after 1 or 2 rounds of lings. If interested I will include a replay when I get home ... Have you tried: 9 overlord, 11 pool, 11 gas, drone to 14, queen, overlord, drone (17 / 18 supply at this point) ? It's a really aggressive opening, normally into banelings, which gives you slightly earlier queen (and therefore more zerglings), with same speed on zergling speed and banelings as 14 / 14 basically (a few moments earlier). And it's 100% safe vs 6-10 pools due to the earlier pool. (if not interested, I won't bother with a replay, but I find this build extremely good if you are planning on being aggressive, especially with banelings). I also struggled with well executed 6 pools at the masters level, and decided to ignore the problem by either doing this, or going 15 hatch and living with the losses | ||
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Hairy
United Kingdom1169 Posts
10 pool 10 gas 10 OL 6x lings (13/18) Queen (15/18) Metabolic boost (remove drones from gas at 100) 3x drones (18/18) (rally the 2nd and 3rd drones back into gas) Overlord Extractor trick drone (19/18) ZERGLINGS Baneling nest @50 gas The timings all work out really nicely so that speed finishes right when your first inject zerglings are hatching, and the baneling nest finishes just when those zerglings should be reaching your opponent's base (you can morph 3 banelings straight away). And, relevant to this discussion, it does exceedingly well against 6/7 pools both in your defense and your subsequent aggression. But I'm just Diamond, so perhaps it's terrible for one reason or another? I might make a thread focused on discussion/comparison of these earlyish pools.... | ||
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