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On November 03 2011 04:51 iZenn wrote:I love this build so much, my win rate versus top diamond low masters zerg's has gone up to about 70%+. I find that it's a little hard to get the 1-1 upgrade but even without that upgrade I still do a ton of damage. It seems the only way zerg holds this drop off is if he has banelings prepared or a decent amount of lings. You can simply back up into a corner and take out most lings if he doesn't back off. I usually hit them right before Mutalisk's come out, which is great cause my damage delays it so much that they become useless, and it opens you up to a huge timing push after the drop. Amazing build!!! *thumps up* P.S. Let's let this thread die so this stays a secret 
On smaller maps or closer air spawns, I stop marine production for a second as the factory goes up to get the engineering bays down faster. It should help the 1/1 complete faster, and you'll still have enough marines to man the bunkers. On cross spawns I've found that I produced a bit more than 2 bunkers + 2 medivacs worth of marines and still had the upgrades complete, so no rush in that situation.
The drop can also be held by roaches. However, you can simply pick up and drop his natural or third--roaches can't keep up.
Can't emphasize enough on how amazing the timing is. Feels so good when you see mutas hatch right as your marines drop in his main, since he has to use them to defend the base instead of harassing with them. Zerg wastes resources in unupgraded mutas, terrible against 1/1 marines with medivac support. Most of the time you end up killing the spire and/or the pool. Sometimes I've had games the pool was sniped before the opponent's injects popped, instantly winning due to Zerg not being able to make anything but mutas.
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On November 03 2011 02:08 zmansman17 wrote:
I actually have a better variant of this build that goes for 1/1, shields and stim but there is no need for medivacs or factory.
Just a ton of marines with patrol back micro and splitting is enough to beat gm, rank 1 master zergs even with banelings. The only good counter to this build is the roach ling all in, which can be negated if I land 1-2 bunkers in front of my rax block after opening reaper FE. So handsome
Mind sharing this with us?
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Great build, I do a lot of early damage but still fail to late game Infestors. Even with 3/3 upgrades. :-(
Guess I still need to work on micro or just get more tanks.
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On November 08 2011 03:06 BECOKA wrote:
Great build, I do a lot of early damage but still fail to late game Infestors. Even with 3/3 upgrades. :-(
Guess I still need to work on micro or just get more tanks.
Ghost are essential vs any hive tech, in fact if you see hive on it's way or done start getting ghost. It's great vs infestors, brood lords, and ultras. Once you get enough[10+] it's border line too strong even against hive tech.
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On November 08 2011 05:05 HansK wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2011 03:06 BECOKA wrote:
Great build, I do a lot of early damage but still fail to late game Infestors. Even with 3/3 upgrades. :-(
Guess I still need to work on micro or just get more tanks. Ghost are essential vs any hive tech, in fact if you see hive on it's way or done start getting ghost. It's great vs infestors, brood lords, and ultras. Once you get enough[10+] it's border line too strong even against hive tech.
Thanks,
I've been meaning to try Ghosts against Infestors but always forget to get them. I'm just now really starting to use them against Protoss with a lot of success.
I'm going to hate it when they nerf the EMP radius. :-(
Now I just have to remember to get the Acadamy when I first sniff the use of them.
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Is anyone doing this build actually able to get their medivacs to pop at 9:30? The best I've ever done is 10:10, but my macro isn't great. -Illusion- starts his CC at his natural and skips the 2 early bunkers and his medivacs still don't pop until 9:50.
The build has been pretty solid for me, the only thing I don't like is I can't get a read on what Zerg's up to until the drop actually happens. Using an early scan to scout feels really wasteful as the build is mineral starved early on. Also, you have zero map control before the drop.
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On November 13 2011 12:01 MysteryHours wrote:
Is anyone doing this build actually able to get their medivacs to pop at 9:30? The best I've ever done is 10:10, but my macro isn't great. -Illusion- starts his CC at his natural and skips the 2 early bunkers and his medivacs still don't pop until 9:50.
The build has been pretty solid for me, the only thing I don't like is I can't get a read on what Zerg's up to until the drop actually happens. Using an early scan to scout feels really wasteful as the build is mineral starved early on. Also, you have zero map control before the drop.
You will get your medivacs sooner if you take sooner gasses. I take my gasses a bit later (the 3rd and 4th) so I can take my 3rd faster. Atleast I think I did, don't remember the replay games too clearly  !
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WHY DIDNT I FIND THIS GUIDE BEFORE!!!
Wow this sounds like a great setup for the mid game push.
One question-
Should you move out like around 7 mins to force a little bit of lings or clear creep tumors? like normally.
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On November 13 2011 13:46 jjhchsc2 wrote:
WHY DIDNT I FIND THIS GUIDE BEFORE!!!
Wow this sounds like a great setup for the mid game push.
One question-
Should you move out like around 7 mins to force a little bit of lings or clear creep tumors? like normally.
It depends, it's probably fine to move out a little bit but of course never commit. The reason I'm sort of scared to do it as some zergs make a bunch of lings early on and will randomly surround all your marines when you do that and you sorta lose your entire 1-1 drop timing from there.
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I feel that this build deserves some attention because its really awesome, and it has a lot of potential.
having reading this build and trying it for the first time I managed to pound the zerg opponent - it allowed me to be the aggressor while having excellent macro.
great job OP 
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Ive noticed while I was playing with this build is that its pretty weak to lings blings semi-all ins. I believe better walls and simcity will be a solution. Will play more with this build and see what happens.
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On November 14 2011 07:34 KrSuma wrote:
Ive noticed while I was playing with this build is that its pretty weak to lings blings semi-all ins. I believe better walls and simcity will be a solution. Will play more with this build and see what happens.
I think some one posted some replays of how to beat all-in's with this build some where, but it really comes down to bunkers ebays and supply depots with well positioned and microd marines to hold them off.
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You say that you've played all races to gain an understanding of them. How would you personally deal with this type of drop harass as zerg ofc? I was being dropped in a similiar manner and was at a complete loss. (How would you deal with drops as Zerg in general?)
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On November 18 2011 03:02 Host- wrote:
You say that you've played all races to gain an understanding of them. How would you personally deal with this type of drop harass as zerg ofc? I was being dropped in a similiar manner and was at a complete loss. (How would you deal with drops as Zerg in general?)
It depends on what build you're going. The simple answer is to have units at the 10:30 mark though. As zerg I highly prefer muta ling bling so I deal with the drops with just banelings and queen targeting medi-vacs until few mutas come out. It's annoying but if you micro properly you should not take much damage
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So what happens if the greedy zerg gets a spire up at 9 minutes and snipes your drop?
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On November 20 2011 06:50 deathtrance wrote:
So what happens if the greedy zerg gets a spire up at 9 minutes and snipes your drop?
You made a mistake. To get a spire up that early you really have to sacrifice a lot, and if you fly two medivacs full of 1-1 stim combat shield marines into a pack of mutas and just let them die you will be behind. The thing is you don't do that and you either use a scan for the spire, or as soon as you see mutas instantly drop marines.
The only way you lose them all if you use no scans and shift click drop to his base and look away from the screen and he happens to have his mutas directly where your drop ship is.
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lolyeah, i asked the question too early. i had my friend do this against me, and... muta carnage
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these dropps are very powerfull! as zerg if your not prepared and maybe even have no banes u can just loose against something like that if the terran has his units in good spots
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Well, back with another quick Q: Is there a time before the drop where you can pressure the zerg beforehand? What would be the timing of a small poke/push?
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On November 20 2011 10:19 deathtrance wrote:
Well, back with another quick Q: Is there a time before the drop where you can pressure the zerg beforehand? What would be the timing of a small poke/push?
There is never a safe timing to push out after 2-3 marines. You are always at risk of losing all your marines to speedlings after 5-6minutes. In this build there is no way you can get enough marines to be guaranteed damage with marines. You alwys risk getting beat by a large group of speedlings, or even worse if you meet a baneling bust in the field (which 1rax FE attracts)
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EPT
