EPTPvZ How to beat a 6 pool? - Page 5
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Lazy_89
United States87 Posts
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tehemperorer
United States2183 Posts
Thanks goes to iSTime/WhiteRa for this; I have a lot of difficulty in PvZ and literally pray for a 6pool every time because it's so easy to fight off. | ||
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evilduky666
United States101 Posts
To answer your op however, if you wall off with a forge and gateway and then build a cannon behind your wall it defends against 6 pool almost 100% of the time. Edit: Oh and you should build your second pylon by your min line just in case they break through your wall you can make a cannon at your min line. | ||
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pezzaperry
142 Posts
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thePROtoss
United States18 Posts
On September 26 2011 11:58 thePROtoss wrote: Did i read the post correctly? diamond rank 10 having problems with 6pool? honestly to block a 6pool you don't even need to have a forge, just do a normal wall off and chronoboost out your first zealot make sure to addanother gateway or a cybercore to create a choke, and if you need time fill the choke with one or two probes until the zealot comes out, then just micro and kill the lings. if your gateway hasn't finished then just complete the wall off with pylons and more gateways if you need to, or micro your workers. Also you'll mostlikely have double the amount of probes then lings it shouldn't be that hard to deal with, without losing more than 3 probes at most. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You would lose versus a good 6-pooler almost 100% of the time if you did this. When you seal a wall, it guarantees that your gateway and core will die simultaneously while your zealot spawns helplessly in the back. And when that gateway goes down it will be 14 zerglings to 1 zealot and 16-18 probes. Posts like this are precisely why 6 pool works up and into grandmaster league on NA and EU ladders uhm yeah i've been playing on my friend's acc in diamond league, as protoss and i've been 6pooled before, and blocking a 6pool with 1 zealot and with about a dozen probes is no problem at all, and creating a choke is probably one of the smartest things to do so idk what you're talking about with the "100% loss" and the "14 lings to 1 zealot" if you just make a choke from the start you won't have that problem, because when you get 6pooled, it's not 14lings its about one wave of 6 lings, which is not that hard to block with a choke, and if the lings decide to attack and your gateway isn't finish so you have to resort to a full wall off you simply kill off one of your own gateways or pylons and make sure that there's still a choke and hit with a mix of workers and zealots, it's honestly not that hard. | ||
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10350 Posts
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Quochobao
United States350 Posts
On August 24 2011 13:51 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: I will be quoting myself from another 6 pool thread. And I'm still wondering why more people don't do this. There is no reason not to, really. A forge + cannon is a waste and like some said if he just makes 6 lings and drones immediately (which is what I do when i play zerg and 6 pool or 7 pool) then the game will not be necessarily in your favor just by defending the 6 lings. Your gas tech will be significantly behind, u will have to kill ur pylon or such later on to leave your base, and the zerg should be able to catch up on econ/drones very easily (8-9 drones depending if 6 pool or 7 pool by time 6 lings start to build, then as you drone and your lings hit his base you should be at 12-14 drones while the protoss usually will have 15 ish, but even less if he cut in order to get forge+canon out; also get a queen and gas or a hatch or such). THIS IS THE WAY! except...one question: if the zerg goes hatch first, and I want to match it with 1 gate FE, I always feel vulnerable of zerglings run-buys without a wall at ramp. What should I do about this? Is this just irrational fear? Would you claim that 2 gate expand is fine? (Even though in my experience it does not seem so...) If you 2 gate expand, what kind of pressure do you put on the zerg? | ||
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tuho12345
4482 Posts
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tuho12345
4482 Posts
On September 27 2011 15:20 Quochobao wrote: THIS IS THE WAY! except...one question: if the zerg goes hatch first, and I want to match it with 1 gate FE, I always feel vulnerable of zerglings run-buys without a wall at ramp. What should I do about this? Is this just irrational fear? Would you claim that 2 gate expand is fine? (Even though in my experience it does not seem so...) If you 2 gate expand, what kind of pressure do you put on the zerg? 1 gates expand always need to be fast, otherwise get the forge and cannon up be fore 2nd and 3rd gates. 2 gates expand you should watch MC's show. Where he get 1 stalkers first and the rest is sentries. You could pressure him. Or chronoboost 2-4 zealots to do serious damage right away. | ||
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JASONB0URNE
Australia22 Posts
- Bulid your pylon/gateway hugging your nexus. - Chronoboost your zealots. - Pull probes to dance/fight with your zealot. - KEEP CALM <---- most important! I get behind everytime I forge/gateway/cannon block and half the time it doesn't work anyway because you have reacted too slow (scouting the last position on a large map for example). | ||
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HornyHydra
Taiwan222 Posts
12 Gate Cannon (you may/may not have to cut probes to wall and cannon) If you scout a 6 pool with your scout from the forge, just wall off and build a cannon you can keep a probe outside of your wall to check if the 6 pool is continuing or if they try to drone. From here you can either +1Attack 4Gate or expand (I prefer the 4Gate because it should kill them outright). The delayed timing WG timing doesn't matter because they've 6 pooled. Since you're diamond I think it's safe to assume you can sort of wing the timings on gas with the 10 forge. If you 10 forge and don't scout a 6 pool, you can save the forge for upgrades later as your build will be delayed by 150 minerals only. Edit: I think this way is better if you aren't confident if your micro, as it's not very micro intensive to plop a few buildings down. If you can micro, you can just do the zealot probe "dance" posters above are suggesting. | ||
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Quochobao
United States350 Posts
On September 27 2011 15:28 tuho12345 wrote: 1 gates expand always need to be fast, otherwise get the forge and cannon up be fore 2nd and 3rd gates. 2 gates expand you should watch MC's show. Where he get 1 stalkers first and the rest is sentries. You could pressure him. Or chronoboost 2-4 zealots to do serious damage right away. How can 1 stalker and all sentries deal pressure against zergling? =) Z can engage, tempt force field, then run away. 1 2 spine crawlers would be adequate too, wouldn't they? | ||
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michaelhasanalias
Korea (South)1231 Posts
On September 27 2011 15:41 JASONB0URNE wrote: To stop a 6 pool: - Bulid your pylon/gateway hugging your nexus. - Chronoboost your zealots. - Pull probes to dance/fight with your zealot. - KEEP CALM <---- most important! I get behind everytime I forge/gateway/cannon block and half the time it doesn't work anyway because you have reacted too slow (scouting the last position on a large map for example). I can't speak from experience because I don't do early pool vs toss other than 6 pool... but wouldn't this be absolutely awful against anything other than a 6pool? For example, some 7 pools and all 8 pools can continuously reinforce, and wouldn't you just die if you didn't eventually wall off? The idea behind putting your pylong/gate/etc at your nexus is to defend against 6 pool and then get your wall up with 2/3 gate or 2gate/core, yes? Any opener like this would need to be solid against the gamut of zerg openers, and are you sure that's the case? You would do this in every situation on every map where you don't FFE vs zerg? | ||
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10350 Posts
On September 27 2011 15:20 Quochobao wrote: THIS IS THE WAY! except...one question: if the zerg goes hatch first, and I want to match it with 1 gate FE, I always feel vulnerable of zerglings run-buys without a wall at ramp. What should I do about this? Is this just irrational fear? Would you claim that 2 gate expand is fine? (Even though in my experience it does not seem so...) If you 2 gate expand, what kind of pressure do you put on the zerg? I'm not familiar with the 2 gate sorry, I don't know enough about protoss. About the first part, first you need to consider what map it is; if it's wide, then just wall off with your buildings to cover the ramp to your nexus; put a canon hugging the nexus so that it can shoot lings that run around and attack your probes, while also covering the 2 buildings in front of it vs Roaches (forge + gate) or at least so that any roach attack would be significantly slowed (perhaps there would only be 1 matrix where a roach can stand to attack without being hit by a canon; that is fine). You can cut workers if needed, you can determine this with your scouting probe. You can also chrono boost out a zealot ASAP and pull probes to the ramp, mineral walking back the hurt ones. The forge/gate should be hugging your ramp if possible, reducing the entrance to it to 1-2 zealots width. On September 28 2011 10:52 michaelhasanalias wrote: I can't speak from experience because I don't do early pool vs toss other than 6 pool... but wouldn't this be absolutely awful against anything other than a 6pool? For example, some 7 pools and all 8 pools can continuously reinforce, and wouldn't you just die if you didn't eventually wall off? The idea behind putting your pylong/gate/etc at your nexus is to defend against 6 pool and then get your wall up with 2/3 gate or 2gate/core, yes? Any opener like this would need to be solid against the gamut of zerg openers, and are you sure that's the case? You would do this in every situation on every map where you don't FFE vs zerg? I've never had trouble vs 6 pool like that, but I'm not sure about 7 and 8 pool. However, I don't try to wall off at the ramp, I just tech to stalkers asap and kite back and forth (for 6 pool). | ||
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