EPT[G] TvT Hellion / Air Revamped - Page 2
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LtCalley
United States244 Posts
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aNickname
8 Posts
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Tactical_Tim
United States20 Posts
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legend4411
Canada21 Posts
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10292 Posts
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Soluhwin
United States1287 Posts
On July 13 2011 19:50 Numy wrote: This line confuses me. Why wouldn't you be able to still beat a player if he knows what tech you are going? I was considering trying this stuff out but if it relies on your opponent not knowing I'm not quite sure if I like it. I like robust builds more. It is because the one thing iEchoic's build lost to was a fast thor, because he would simply rely on battle cruisers late game to combat thors, which you can't exactly get off of one base. Really the only reason anyone would get a super fast thor now-a-days is if someone saw the 2 factories and 2 starports on one base, and because iEchoic's style is the only one that uses these 4 production facilities so quickly you basically lost if your opponent knew what you were doing. That's not to mean the build isn't robust though, since it presents itself as a much more standard build and really, who rushes thors? | ||
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legend4411
Canada21 Posts
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lorkac
United States2297 Posts
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lorkac
United States2297 Posts
On July 31 2011 19:31 legend4411 wrote: I just found that when marines is upgraded with stim pack, hellions die so fast. engage with battlecruisers while marines are shooting battlecruisers, attack with hellions ????? Profit | ||
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whoopingchow
United States293 Posts
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iAmJeffReY
United States4262 Posts
On August 01 2011 02:03 whoopingchow wrote: Thanks for the guide! Definitely looking to try this out, since it looks really similar to what a lot of players are doing at MLG recently (except this build has fewer Starports, more Factories). Just a quick question though--what do you get the Raven for? For detection? PDD? Auto-turreting siege lines? I'm asking just so I get a better understanding of what you're really going for in this build. Thanks again! Helps control the air. PDD means your vikings get more shots that connect, so even if you're down in viking count, you're ahead with PDD. A spotter. And occasional auto turret when the situation arises. Spots for cloakshees. 1raven 1viking is what a LOT of seem to get against banshee openings. | ||
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Toxi78
966 Posts
either way, if i get it and he doesn't do cloak banshee, a raven is a very useful unit to have to defend pushes, push yourself or to use later in viking wars, or even against a thor (saves a few hits). nowadays i almost always go for this though, as it is the safest and the raven is awesome. i think medivac /viking into raven + 2nd factory can be a really solid build too, but for the time being i enjoy playing the air composition so i stick to it. | ||
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Toxi78
966 Posts
i really think there is a lot of potential in it, for me it's really the best all around TvT build. but love is blind.. edit: except he put the starport on the reactor, and just made a single viking instead, boxer used this very build today. he then made the mech transition i talked about earlier in the thread, he even made the CC as i suggested in my post (down page 1). when i say this build is awesome, trust me. | ||
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cilinder007
Slovenia7251 Posts
On August 01 2011 04:22 Toxi78 wrote: looking at MLG, they are all trying to work towards my build i think ^^. i really think there is a lot of potential in it, for me it's really the best all around TvT build. but love is blind.. the difference is that they are all getting tanks in the mix, without tanks you cant beat a meching player, you simply cant...if he's has similar skill that is | ||
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GinDo
3327 Posts
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genius_man16
United States749 Posts
On August 01 2011 06:04 GinDo wrote: The issue about Hellion Banshee is the fact that you lack tanks. Against a Marine Tank player yeah you stand a strong chance because Marines die to Hellions, but against a Mech player you lose flat out unless you get lucky with the harass. Which the mech player may also. Thors destroy banshees, and if you keep making banshees, Terran is just gonna push with turrets. On August 01 2011 05:34 cilinder007 wrote: the difference is that they are all getting tanks in the mix, without tanks you cant beat a meching player, you simply cant...if he's has similar skill that is If you do it right you still beat mech and it really isn't even close. If someone is going mech they are going to have what, a maximum of 4 vikings? You can get 4 vikings before 8 min into the game, and then if they are stupid and don't make more vikings all you have to do is simply make banshees the rest of the game. Idk if you've noticed but banshees > tanks. Not only that but they are cheaper than tanks by 25 gas, and that adds up pretty quick, so you can spend your extra gas into other stuff like upgrades, more banshees/vikings, marauders if you feel snazzy, or in your tech up to battlecruisers. And if someone goes for thors, you have to A) Get BC's, which you should already be getting if you are proactive with scouting, and B) magic box your vikings + banshees. Zerg players do it, and Terrans can do it too, most just don't have the experience so they don't think to do it. Viking/Banshee/BC/Hellion CAN and DOES beat every other T composition in the game, it just takes good scouting and proper response. It can be tricky at times but that's what gives it such a high skill ceiling. | ||
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lorkac
United States2297 Posts
On August 03 2011 03:03 genius_man16 wrote: If you do it right you still beat mech and it really isn't even close. If someone is going mech they are going to have what, a maximum of 4 vikings? You can get 4 vikings before 8 min into the game, and then if they are stupid and don't make more vikings all you have to do is simply make banshees the rest of the game. Idk if you've noticed but banshees > tanks. Not only that but they are cheaper than tanks by 25 gas, and that adds up pretty quick, so you can spend your extra gas into other stuff like upgrades, more banshees/vikings, marauders if you feel snazzy, or in your tech up to battlecruisers. And if someone goes for thors, you have to A) Get BC's, which you should already be getting if you are proactive with scouting, and B) magic box your vikings + banshees. Zerg players do it, and Terrans can do it too, most just don't have the experience so they don't think to do it. Viking/Banshee/BC/Hellion CAN and DOES beat every other T composition in the game, it just takes good scouting and proper response. It can be tricky at times but that's what gives it such a high skill ceiling. It's a gross oversimplification to say that Viking/Vanshee/Vattlecruiser/Hellion beats every other Terran composition--it does, but not exactly. If you have air dominance, then his Vikings are moot and your Banshees reign supreme. This forces Thors, which forces Battlecruisers as a response. This forces the mech player to stop making tanks and makes it so that he is massing Hellions and Marines as the mineral dumps. Hellions to harass and marines to help the thors. At this point both players have highly immobile armies of battlecruisers vs Thor+tank. All the while hellion harass from both sides kill all scvs. | ||
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megaBICEPS
Canada79 Posts
On August 04 2011 03:14 lorkac wrote: It's a gross oversimplification to say that Viking/Vanshee/Vattlecruiser/Hellion beats every other Terran composition--it does, but not exactly. If you have air dominance, then his Vikings are moot and your Banshees reign supreme. This forces Thors, which forces Battlecruisers as a response. This forces the mech player to stop making tanks and makes it so that he is massing Hellions and Marines as the mineral dumps. Hellions to harass and marines to help the thors. At this point both players have highly immobile armies of battlecruisers vs Thor+tank. All the while hellion harass from both sides kill all scvs. Pretty sure BCs are MUCH more mobile than tanks and thors | ||
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xza
Singapore1600 Posts
Do i need to delay his instant counter en route to my base because once he has 4 siege tanks outside my base i can't do anything. I feel that thats the only push that I have to fend off and i've won since i killed almost all of his scvs but i needed like 1 more min to be able to fend it off | ||
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ComBro1
80 Posts
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