EPTthis build seems to be able to transition really nicely, and i love that the quick upgrades allow you to hold your own late game against the toss
thorzain is my new favorite player when it comes to tvp
Analysis of ThorZain's Bio TvP - Page 2
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Lezt
United States115 Posts
this build seems to be able to transition really nicely, and i love that the quick upgrades allow you to hold your own late game against the toss thorzain is my new favorite player when it comes to tvp | ||
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Techno
1900 Posts
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Frequencyy
United States344 Posts
On April 28 2011 12:46 Tiel wrote: thanks for this post, its always nice to have additional builds to use :D this build seems to be able to transition really nicely, and i love that the quick upgrades allow you to hold your own late game against the toss thorzain is my new favorite player when it comes to tvp Haha yes we share the same favorite players for TvP. I think we can say that ThorZain is the Titan Slayer | ||
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LastMan
90 Posts
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Cano
Poland200 Posts
After reading that I have no idea about how his base looks like at ceratin points. You don't say anything about addons, usage of factory, etc. | ||
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Frequencyy
United States344 Posts
On April 28 2011 20:04 Cano wrote: I know that VODs aren't hard to find but you should still include them here. After reading that I have no idea about how his base looks like at ceratin points. You don't say anything about addons, usage of factory, etc. Hm good idea, I will post the links to the videos, they are in teamliquid.net's youtube channel but for you guys I will do it. Thanks for the input, the addons really aren't that important in my opinion though, and he doesn't use the factory at all except maybe a reactor port switch but it's not really build more so a style to play. | ||
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Wren
United States745 Posts
On April 27 2011 07:59 Thorzain wrote: I only did the 5 rax because I thought he would do a 3 gate Void Ray all in when I saw his Void Ray. Then I saw that he had expanded and just thought that I would try to punish it with a 1-1 combat shield + stim marine timing push. It worked out OK. I traded armies and i killed 4-5 probes. I make the marines early game because marauders are too "time effective". 2 pop 100 minerals every 30 seconds compared to 1 pop 50 minerals every 25 seconds, and that I need the gas for upgrades/tech. They are more versatile than marauders in the early game imo. There are some 2 base builds that can be somewhat scary if you are caught completely off guard, but I didnt play against anything that "Oh, he did this build, I lose now." pushes. That's the difference between an attempt to learn a build/style and truly owning it. OP is a great breakdown of a specific iteration of an effective style, but as Thorzain's gnerous enough to point out, it's only an execution of some much broader goals. | ||
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Frequencyy
United States344 Posts
On April 29 2011 04:09 Wren wrote: That's the difference between an attempt to learn a build/style and truly owning it. OP is a great breakdown of a specific iteration of an effective style, but as Thorzain's gnerous enough to point out, it's only an execution of some much broader goals. Indeed but can someone tell me what an OP is, I'm new to the forums lol. | ||
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ozzymoto
108 Posts
On April 29 2011 06:51 Frequencyy wrote: Indeed but can someone tell me what an OP is, I'm new to the forums lol. OP: Opening Post, Original Post either works. or Over Powered =P | ||
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Frequencyy
United States344 Posts
On April 29 2011 07:27 ozzymoto wrote: OP: Opening Post, Original Post either works. or Over Powered =P ohhhh okay okay, ik OP meant overpowered haha | ||
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Curu
Canada2817 Posts
The only reason it looks like he's taking guys out of gas in some of the VODs is because he puts 2 more SCVs in there when the scouting Probe reaches his base to trick the Protoss into thinking he's going a tech build. As soon as the Probe is taken out/leaves, he instantly takes them out of gas. It's a very, very strong and safe build. When you push out at 2/2 if they have been going for Colossus, your army should destroy his Gateway units allowing you to rush up and take out the Colossus. If he's been double Forging you're on more or less the same level, but I feel Bio does pretty well against Gateway units anyways unless you're very behind in upgrades (which you won't be). Any sort of DT/Void Ray opening and as long as you did not take substantial damage from the harass, you just push across the map and win. | ||
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Carmine
United States263 Posts
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statikg
Canada930 Posts
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10366 Posts
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captainwaffles
United States1050 Posts
On April 29 2011 08:56 Frequencyy wrote: ohhhh okay okay, ik OP meant overpowered haha Also my name... it was chosen out of a hat. My parents were weird like that. | ||
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Frequencyy
United States344 Posts
On April 29 2011 11:11 statikg wrote: You guys are obsessing way to much over the BO, just take note of the composition that worked and give it your own spin. Correct, as I said in the OP and as thorzain said in his post this is not a build, the opening yes, but it's basically his modified marauder opening this is a STYLE I cannot stress this enough. | ||
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Tenspeed
Sweden28 Posts
Playing on a diamond level, I'm currently 8-0 vs P (using this style, mind you there have been some losses on close-positions metal where 1 marauder expand simply isn't viable.) The P builds I've been going up against have ranged from 3gate aggression, 2gate, 4gate, 1gate fe, 2gate robo, yada yada. I'm expecting the results to even out somewhat, especially against master tosses but it's a fairly promising start. Some builds I'm yet to face but looking forward to test this build against are: naniwa build, 6gate, general adelscott-style gateway play. Things I've learned so far: 1. Place your bunkers smartly, also consider placing your engibay or another structure close by your ramp to prevent P running past your bunkers. (Here I'm assuming you built your expand by your nat) 2. Be careful about the timing on your first 4 raxes, the upgrade-heavy style takes some getting used to in terms of when you have to add more raxes before establishing that trust fund. 3. If he goes fast colossi, you WILL need 2 reactored starports as noted in the OP. 4. Be METICULOUS about the timings on the upgrades, especially the fast stim which is KEY in holding off alot the early aggression. 5. If your opponent is teching hard, don't be afraid to make timing attacks before 2/2 hits. 6. If he's going colossus, keep a close count on those bad boys, if you overcommit to vikings, which is really easy running 2ports, while he does a tech switch you're in a bad seat. I realise alot of these points really apply to bio-play in general and if you feel everything I said is a blatant truism please accept my apologies Cheers! | ||
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TG_CryMeAReaver
United States7 Posts
I remember watching ThorZain use this build effectively on Xelnaga Caverns and on Crossfire in his TL3 matches vs Liquid Tyler and OGSMC however I cannot recall him using this build on larger maps. If I recall correctly ThorZain did not use this build on Tal'Darim against OGSMC and went for a more "standard" bio build. In general how does one compensate for the immobility of mech (especially Thors) on larger maps? | ||
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TG_CryMeAReaver
United States7 Posts
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kusu
Sweden440 Posts
On May 05 2011 04:46 Tenspeed wrote: Things I've learned so far: 1. Place your bunkers smartly, also consider placing your engibay or another structure close by your ramp to prevent P running past your bunkers. (Here I'm assuming you built your expand by your nat) 2. Be careful about the timing on your first 4 raxes, the upgrade-heavy style takes some getting used to in terms of when you have to add more raxes before establishing that trust fund. 3. If he goes fast colossi, you WILL need 2 reactored starports as noted in the OP. 4. Be METICULOUS about the timings on the upgrades, especially the fast stim which is KEY in holding off alot the early aggression. 5. If your opponent is teching hard, don't be afraid to make timing attacks before 2/2 hits. 6. If he's going colossus, keep a close count on those bad boys, if you overcommit to vikings, which is really easy running 2ports, while he does a tech switch you're in a bad seat. Thank you sooo much for these tips! I've also been playing this style now recently, but i haven't got much time to try it out yet. So this is much approved! On May 05 2011 05:28 TG_CryMeAReaver wrote: I apologize I thought I was posting under the "[D] Thorzain Build TvP build" thread I read earlier this morning You can always edit your post so we don't have to read through it  | ||
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