EPT[G][L] TvX: How to make a low SD/Rax ramp wall - Page 2
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fearus
China2164 Posts
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wordd
Australia190 Posts
cheers. | ||
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Chaosvuistje
Netherlands2581 Posts
 . I never know what they are up to and by the time I got my banshee defense up they float their safe CC over to the natural with a big smile on their face. | ||
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Weirdkid
Singapore2431 Posts
On April 19 2011 20:32 Chaosvuistje wrote: I hate going against these kinds of walls on long maps . I never know what they are up to and by the time I got my banshee defense up they float their safe CC over to the natural with a big smile on their face.Hahaha I laughed when I saw this. Know the exact feeling man  Low ground walling is so so suspicious though. I do it when I am going for a 3 rax marine scv all in. I don't like that it looks so suspicious, but I guess I'd I'd rather look suspicious and leave them wondering than let their scout into my base. Anyway, appreciate the effort in creating this thread. If it came out earlier I could have saved 10 minutes of my life that I spent figuring out how to do it haha. It'll help some people I'm sure. | ||
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Zellabris
United States43 Posts
On April 19 2011 11:08 Chahta wrote: so basically something you would discover by turning on building grid in the options menu? I suppose this would be appreciated by newer players. I suppose this just amuses me so because a lot of effort was put into explaining the obvious. Very clear guide, that is for sure, but perhaps a replay of zerglings trying to get by? (sealing in *proof*) I actually had to test this out after a couple of tries on the unit testing map. The walling IS tricky and can be misleading sometimes. For example, with the north-facing ramps, I really have to remember that one open orange grid held off units coming in from the diagonal :\ | ||
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salehonasi
United States87 Posts
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PJFrylar
United States350 Posts
On April 19 2011 11:54 noobinator wrote: What is the point of putting the wall off at the bottom, a faster wall off to deny any initial scouting? Very interesting, now I can go for gas heavy builds without my opponent knowing until it's too late  Seems like this would be viable for Toss as well, as long as they leave a 1 unit space for a zealot. It is to deny scouting. If you wall at the top of your ramp a unit can run up the ramp and get a peek at the area in the main around the ramp. If the wall is at the bottom they won't be able to do this. It also allows you to make a second wall at the top of your ramp if you fear an early baneling bust. Also there is less space required to make the wall (able to wall with a barracks + depot rather than a barracks +2 depots or 2 barracks sized buildings). | ||
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HypernovA
Canada556 Posts
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lorkac
United States2297 Posts
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iAmJeffReY
United States4262 Posts
Very nice post, I still struggle with it. lol How I made it so far into the game not knowing that, or the cost of a factory till 3 or so months ago lol. It's very good against zerg, and if you can trick a protoss into thinking your teching, a proxy rax and that rax together with pulled scvs can usually hit 4/5 marines and 5+ scvs before the sentry pops in a typical zeal/stalker/sentry BO for the protoss. Although, a stalker poke and you're fucked without marauders. In short -- thanks, now I won't struggle in teams to do a quick wall | ||
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PJFrylar
United States350 Posts
On April 20 2011 05:19 iAmJeffReY wrote: In short -- thanks, now I won't struggle in teams to do a quick wall Hmm, I never thought of using this wall for team games. It would be quite good from fending the very early cheeses that can be common. However, I would worry about the amount of surface area exposed with potentially 2 rushes coming at it. I'm probably going to try it out and see what happens anyway though. | ||
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statikg
Canada930 Posts
Roach rushes can give this kind of wall off alot of issues because its easier for them to bait your marines into a vulnerable position. As well, if you are planning on teching behind a bunker you will have to sacrifice that depot because there is no safe place to put the bunker, but you can always float the barracks back. I would definitely not do this in a team game. Your wall would get owned for sure if you came under early attack by anything except for a weak ling attack. | ||
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FabledIntegral
United States9232 Posts
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iAmJeffReY
United States4262 Posts
On April 20 2011 06:36 FireBearHero wrote: Hmm, I never thought of using this wall for team games. It would be quite good from fending the very early cheeses that can be common. However, I would worry about the amount of surface area exposed with potentially 2 rushes coming at it. I'm probably going to try it out and see what happens anyway though. Or blocking off a zerg ally who's about to get heavy rushed. That's my thinking. Share control for them to use the Sdepot and no more sling run bys on your roach going Z ally. Sure helps vs TZ when they sling hellion. I've only done it twice, but both times in my mind is saved us the game because it let my ally roach up. I can just stay with him and snipe slings off him and let him FF down hellions | ||
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monitor
United States2408 Posts
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infinity21
Canada6683 Posts
On April 20 2011 07:13 monitor wrote: Cool! I wonder if its possible to wall with a evo chamber and a spine crawler... Iirc, since evo chamber is 3x3 and spine crawler is 2x2 I don't see why it wouldn't work. | ||
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Huragius
Lithuania1506 Posts
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TickTockBoom
Canada185 Posts
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PJFrylar
United States350 Posts
On April 20 2011 05:19 iAmJeffReY wrote: Or blocking off a zerg ally who's about to get heavy rushed. That's my thinking. Share control for them to use the Sdepot and no more sling run bys on your roach going Z ally. Sure helps vs TZ when they sling hellion. I've only done it twice, but both times in my mind is saved us the game because it let my ally roach up. I can just stay with him and snipe slings off him and let him FF down hellions So you wall off both you and your ally? Mmm, that's an interesting thought indeed. With the bottom of the ramp style wall you could have a wall for each player not long after a standard top of the ramp wall for just yourself. Thanks for the idea, I like it. On April 20 2011 08:06 TickTockBoom wrote: Uhh, i'm confused, is blocking it under the ramp more advantageous than blocking it above the ramp? Coming from BW I just build 2 SDs and a rax and block above the ramp on most maps, except that one with two spawning positions with the gigantic ramp, where I just do 3sd 1 rax. It is situational, the wall at the bottom has advantages and disadvantages. The main advantages is denying scouting information (because they can't poke up the ramp with a unit and see the surrounding area in your main) and less buildings required. It is mostly used if you're really trying to hide tech or at least acting like you are. However, the wall is more vulnerable, because it exposes more surface area to attack, while giving up surface area to repair. It also tends to give ranged units more available angles to attack your wall. Ranged units will also be able to see your wall without spotting up your ramp. This will allow them to attack from full range, while not being hit back by something behind the wall. I would not suggest this against protoss or terran as you surrender a good deal of defender's advantage (while giving them the possibility of forcing engagement. Edit: wow that post got really screwed up lol | ||
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michaelhasanalias
Korea (South)1231 Posts
On April 19 2011 20:29 wordd wrote: nice guide but very primitive. I think you should add the pros and cons of walling low and high ground so low level T's don't get the wrong impression. cheers. The reason for the skimpiness is two-fold: For one, I wanted to keep the OP simple and informative, without clouding it with the subjectivity of my own view. Secondly, and more principally, I simply lack the expertise with Terran to go into the situational advantages and disadvantages of this type of wall. If a higher level Terran player (I usually play zerg) wants to go into detail about it, I'd be more than happy to include it in the OP. At least for me, the reason I love low walls is because I am a very aggressive player, and so my goal with the wall is simply to deny scouting, not defend against anything. Certainly there are different merits for and against it. | ||
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