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On March 31 2011 00:06 GreEny K wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:04 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:01 GreEny K wrote:
I just shift A-click the worker constructing the bunker or building... Thought this was common knoweledge already The average person A-moves when they're close to the SCV. This of course is less than ideal since the AI idles your attacking worker once the SCV moves do the opposite side of the barracks or a second SCV attacks your attacking worker. That may be, but I'm talking about shift Attack and then click on the worker. It works, and it doesn't stop attacking until it kills the SCV.
My point was that the average person would overlook the fact that shift queuing would be advantageous in this situation. Personally, I didn't think of this and I believe it's a very useful tip to store away in the back of your mind.
Thanks again for this OP, it's going to help a lot of people without a doubt.
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I never have problem with targeting scvs before, maybe because I ususally a-click on the ground near the rax, bunker that the scv is building, so it always targets the unit near there, which is the scv. Nevertheless, this seems like a cool trick.
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On March 30 2011 23:22 Scrubington wrote:
I can just picture the great big rage face every single Terran player is making.
I hope they don't get rid of this as a 'bug' 
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On March 31 2011 00:11 canikizu wrote:
I never have problem with targeting scvs before, maybe because I ususally a-click on the ground near the rax, bunker that the scv is building, so it always targets the unit near there, which is the scv. Nevertheless, this seems like a cool trick.
If you A click near the ground where the building SCV is and the Terran player pulls a secondary SCV and sets that second SCV to attack your attacking worker, your attacking worker will switch targets.
In the case that you REALLY want to kill the building SCV and pull maybe two workers, this trick would be useful since your attacking workers will not switch targets until the building SCV is dead.
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On March 30 2011 23:58 Scrubington wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 23:53 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:47 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it.  Read the thread, "brah." I've read the entire thread, what are you getting at? Read again, maybe? On March 30 2011 23:21 TimeSpiral wrote:
I'm not saying the SCV should be invulnerable. I'm saying that shift a+clicking a wandering SCV is a bug and should be fixed. You can still kill the SCV. Also, it kinda sounds to me like you're only talking about bunker rushes ... Otherwise, why on earth would you be pulling workers to attack an SCV building a rax or supply depot  See, bunkers in proxy locations are not the only buildings that a Terran needs to construct  You're getting off-topic. My point is shift-A clicking an SCV repeatedly is obviously working as intended. That is all. If you give me one legitimate reason why queuing up attacks is a bug I might change my mind. EDIT: I find it both odd and insulting that you make the assumption I haven't read the thread. In the future try not to be an asshole.
I apologize if I offended you.
I assumed you did not read the whole thread because I listed a very specific reason why I felt this was a bug and you started talking about Terran building attributes (flying, repair, SD raise/lower, etc) and appeared to be talking exclusively about bunker rushing.
Reason (1): An attack command is canceled when the SCV wanders during building construction. I'm arguing this is a purposeful attribute of the SCV's construction routine.
Let's say the SCV has four construction locations (a), (b), (c), and (d). Issuing the attack command while at station (a) attacks the SCV at station (a). That attack command is no longer valid once the SCV moves to a different station.
Shift-queuing the attack command on the SCV would issue: Attack SCV at station (a)*number of commands queued. Once the SCV wanders to a different station any queued attack commands become invalid because they were all queued at station (a).
That's my logic. It may or may not be correct, but I'm not just saying "bah! BS! No Way!" I'm clearly operating off what I believe to be bugged game-logic. Similar to the Patrol Flower. Clearly air units can stack, so why not be able to stack them on top of each other? Because that is not how Blizzard intended that mechanic to work/be used.
On March 31 2011 00:05 GreEny K wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." So what's your problem? Theres nothing in the thread that would support your view... Also, keep the red out of your posts, admins use red for warnings and bans and mod edits.
Hwat do you mean?
I used red to express my headline. TL intends for us to format our posts, and even offers instructions on how to use the various colors. If red was reserved, they could simply reserve that tag, similar to the HTML tags.
If you're wondering why as referenced the thread see my response above to that poster. I will admit I was urked by the l2p-ish "umad bro" which just wreaks of prepubescent antagonizing.
I also admit that I am using these colors to screw with you. I apologize
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On March 31 2011 00:35 TimeSpiral wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 23:58 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:53 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:47 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." I've read the entire thread, what are you getting at? Read again, maybe? On March 30 2011 23:21 TimeSpiral wrote:
I'm not saying the SCV should be invulnerable. I'm saying that shift a+clicking a wandering SCV is a bug and should be fixed. You can still kill the SCV. Also, it kinda sounds to me like you're only talking about bunker rushes ... Otherwise, why on earth would you be pulling workers to attack an SCV building a rax or supply depot See, bunkers in proxy locations are not the only buildings that a Terran needs to construct You're getting off-topic. My point is shift-A clicking an SCV repeatedly is obviously working as intended. That is all. If you give me one legitimate reason why queuing up attacks is a bug I might change my mind. EDIT: I find it both odd and insulting that you make the assumption I haven't read the thread. In the future try not to be an asshole. I apologize if I offended you. I assumed you did not read the whole thread because I listed a very specific reason why I felt this was a bug and you started talking about Terran building attributes (flying, repair, SD raise/lower, etc) and appeared to be talking exclusively about bunker rushing. Reason (1): An attack command is canceled when the SCV wanders during building construction. I'm arguing this is a purposeful attribute of the SCV's construction routine. Let's say the SCV has four construction locations (a), (b), (c), and (d). Issuing the attack command while at station (a) attacks the SCV at station (a). That attack command is no longer valid once the SCV moves to a different station. Shift-queuing the attack command on the SCV would issue: Attack SCV at station (a)*number of commands queued. Once the SCV wanders to a different station any queued attack commands become invalid because they were all queued at station (a). That's my logic. It may or may not be correct, but I'm not just saying "bah! BS! No Way!" I'm clearly operating off what I believe to be bugged game-logic. Similar to the Patrol Flower. Clearly air units can stack, so why not be able to stack them on top of each other? Because that is not how Blizzard intended that mechanic to work/be used. Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:05 GreEny K wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." So what's your problem? Theres nothing in the thread that would support your view... Also, keep the red out of your posts, admins use red for warnings and bans and mod edits. Hwat do you mean?I used red to express my headline. TL intends for us to format our posts, and even offers instructions on how to use the various colors. If red was reserved, they could simply reserve that tag, similar to the HTML tags.If you're wondering why as referenced the thread see my response above to that poster. I will admit I was urked by the l2p-ish "umad bro" which just wreaks of prepubescent antagonizing.I also admit that I am using these colors to screw with you. I apologize
WHAT a guy.
EDIT: Your logic is flawed.
Issuing an attack command on the same SCV multiple times logically should override the any AI. User input > AI. Makes sense, not a bug. Guarantee you it's working as intended, it's been that way since alpha.
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Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug.
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On March 31 2011 00:38 Scrubington wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:35 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:58 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:53 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:47 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." I've read the entire thread, what are you getting at? Read again, maybe? On March 30 2011 23:21 TimeSpiral wrote:
I'm not saying the SCV should be invulnerable. I'm saying that shift a+clicking a wandering SCV is a bug and should be fixed. You can still kill the SCV. Also, it kinda sounds to me like you're only talking about bunker rushes ... Otherwise, why on earth would you be pulling workers to attack an SCV building a rax or supply depot See, bunkers in proxy locations are not the only buildings that a Terran needs to construct You're getting off-topic. My point is shift-A clicking an SCV repeatedly is obviously working as intended. That is all. If you give me one legitimate reason why queuing up attacks is a bug I might change my mind. EDIT: I find it both odd and insulting that you make the assumption I haven't read the thread. In the future try not to be an asshole. I apologize if I offended you. I assumed you did not read the whole thread because I listed a very specific reason why I felt this was a bug and you started talking about Terran building attributes (flying, repair, SD raise/lower, etc) and appeared to be talking exclusively about bunker rushing. Reason (1): An attack command is canceled when the SCV wanders during building construction. I'm arguing this is a purposeful attribute of the SCV's construction routine. Let's say the SCV has four construction locations (a), (b), (c), and (d). Issuing the attack command while at station (a) attacks the SCV at station (a). That attack command is no longer valid once the SCV moves to a different station. Shift-queuing the attack command on the SCV would issue: Attack SCV at station (a)*number of commands queued. Once the SCV wanders to a different station any queued attack commands become invalid because they were all queued at station (a). That's my logic. It may or may not be correct, but I'm not just saying "bah! BS! No Way!" I'm clearly operating off what I believe to be bugged game-logic. Similar to the Patrol Flower. Clearly air units can stack, so why not be able to stack them on top of each other? Because that is not how Blizzard intended that mechanic to work/be used. On March 31 2011 00:05 GreEny K wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." So what's your problem? Theres nothing in the thread that would support your view... Also, keep the red out of your posts, admins use red for warnings and bans and mod edits. Hwat do you mean?I used red to express my headline. TL intends for us to format our posts, and even offers instructions on how to use the various colors. If red was reserved, they could simply reserve that tag, similar to the HTML tags.If you're wondering why as referenced the thread see my response above to that poster. I will admit I was urked by the l2p-ish "umad bro" which just wreaks of prepubescent antagonizing.I also admit that I am using these colors to screw with you. I apologize WHAT a guy.
Too much? lol. Come on, guys. Lighten up.
Seriously though, do you disagree with my reasoning? You did ask for an elaboration.
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On March 31 2011 00:40 Synystyr wrote:
Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug.
Friend, this is not a debate on simply attacking a building worker. It's a debate on shit-A clicking on the building SCV multiple times.
Again, it's not a debate on if Terran needing to pull additional workers is balanced or not.
We're discussing whether or not this particular game mechanic is intended or a slight bug.
EDIT: The Terran player can use this "trick" himself in order to defend the worker harass in the first place.
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On March 31 2011 00:43 Scrubington wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:40 Synystyr wrote:
Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug. Friend, this is not a debate on simply attacking a building worker. It's a debate on shit-A clicking on the building SCV multiple times.
The reason I gave above is simply enough to validate why this shouldn't be allowed. Sure, it has it's niche in dealing with Bunker rushes or catching a hidden expansion, but both of those have their weaknesses too.
Bunkers just had 5 seconds added on to its build time, giving you that much more time to deny the construction.
Hidden expansions are generally caught without any units to defend it, so a scouting worker can kill a building SCV very easily. Shift-A clicking is unnecessary.
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On March 31 2011 00:47 Synystyr wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:43 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:40 Synystyr wrote:
Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug. Friend, this is not a debate on simply attacking a building worker. It's a debate on shit-A clicking on the building SCV multiple times.
Shift-A clicking is unnecessary.
Most Tricks are "unnecessary".
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What I would do is shift-move-attack,because typically if the drone stops attacking it's cause SCV moved to the other side.
I find that if you just queue another attack, the drone will do something terribly stupid, like get tuck on the barracks trying to get at the SCV.
What can also happen whether you queue attack or queue move then attack, is another SCV getting in your drones way and getting owned, cause the drone has no clue how the hell to get around the SCV...
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On March 31 2011 00:38 Scrubington wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:35 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:58 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:53 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:47 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." I've read the entire thread, what are you getting at? Read again, maybe? On March 30 2011 23:21 TimeSpiral wrote:
I'm not saying the SCV should be invulnerable. I'm saying that shift a+clicking a wandering SCV is a bug and should be fixed. You can still kill the SCV. Also, it kinda sounds to me like you're only talking about bunker rushes ... Otherwise, why on earth would you be pulling workers to attack an SCV building a rax or supply depot See, bunkers in proxy locations are not the only buildings that a Terran needs to construct You're getting off-topic. My point is shift-A clicking an SCV repeatedly is obviously working as intended. That is all. If you give me one legitimate reason why queuing up attacks is a bug I might change my mind. EDIT: I find it both odd and insulting that you make the assumption I haven't read the thread. In the future try not to be an asshole. I apologize if I offended you. I assumed you did not read the whole thread because I listed a very specific reason why I felt this was a bug and you started talking about Terran building attributes (flying, repair, SD raise/lower, etc) and appeared to be talking exclusively about bunker rushing. Reason (1): An attack command is canceled when the SCV wanders during building construction. I'm arguing this is a purposeful attribute of the SCV's construction routine. Let's say the SCV has four construction locations (a), (b), (c), and (d). Issuing the attack command while at station (a) attacks the SCV at station (a). That attack command is no longer valid once the SCV moves to a different station. Shift-queuing the attack command on the SCV would issue: Attack SCV at station (a)*number of commands queued. Once the SCV wanders to a different station any queued attack commands become invalid because they were all queued at station (a). That's my logic. It may or may not be correct, but I'm not just saying "bah! BS! No Way!" I'm clearly operating off what I believe to be bugged game-logic. Similar to the Patrol Flower. Clearly air units can stack, so why not be able to stack them on top of each other? Because that is not how Blizzard intended that mechanic to work/be used. On March 31 2011 00:05 GreEny K wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." So what's your problem? Theres nothing in the thread that would support your view... Also, keep the red out of your posts, admins use red for warnings and bans and mod edits. Hwat do you mean?I used red to express my headline. TL intends for us to format our posts, and even offers instructions on how to use the various colors. If red was reserved, they could simply reserve that tag, similar to the HTML tags.If you're wondering why as referenced the thread see my response above to that poster. I will admit I was urked by the l2p-ish "umad bro" which just wreaks of prepubescent antagonizing.I also admit that I am using these colors to screw with you. I apologize WHAT a guy. EDIT: Your logic is flawed. Issuing an attack command on the same SCV multiple times logically should override the any AI. User input > AI. Makes sense, not a bug. Guarantee you it's working as intended, it's been that way since alpha.
Your statement does not address my logic.
On March 31 2011 00:43 Scrubington wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:40 Synystyr wrote:
Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug. Friend, this is not a debate on simply attacking a building worker. It's a debate on shit-A clicking on the building SCV multiple times.Again, it's not a debate on if Terran needing to pull additional workers is balanced or not. We're discussing whether or not this particular game mechanic is intended or a slight bug.
I've articulated my argument quite well, in my opinion.
The way it works now is such that your attack command is canceled after the SCV wanders. This is purposefully designed to help protect the SCV and give you a chance to respond. Shift clicking the attack command is bugged because you're essentially just issuing the same command multiple times.
Can you name another instance where shift-queuing identical commands is valid?
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On March 31 2011 00:41 TimeSpiral wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:38 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:35 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:58 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:53 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:47 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." I've read the entire thread, what are you getting at? Read again, maybe? On March 30 2011 23:21 TimeSpiral wrote:
I'm not saying the SCV should be invulnerable. I'm saying that shift a+clicking a wandering SCV is a bug and should be fixed. You can still kill the SCV. Also, it kinda sounds to me like you're only talking about bunker rushes ... Otherwise, why on earth would you be pulling workers to attack an SCV building a rax or supply depot See, bunkers in proxy locations are not the only buildings that a Terran needs to construct You're getting off-topic. My point is shift-A clicking an SCV repeatedly is obviously working as intended. That is all. If you give me one legitimate reason why queuing up attacks is a bug I might change my mind. EDIT: I find it both odd and insulting that you make the assumption I haven't read the thread. In the future try not to be an asshole. I apologize if I offended you. I assumed you did not read the whole thread because I listed a very specific reason why I felt this was a bug and you started talking about Terran building attributes (flying, repair, SD raise/lower, etc) and appeared to be talking exclusively about bunker rushing. Reason (1): An attack command is canceled when the SCV wanders during building construction. I'm arguing this is a purposeful attribute of the SCV's construction routine. Let's say the SCV has four construction locations (a), (b), (c), and (d). Issuing the attack command while at station (a) attacks the SCV at station (a). That attack command is no longer valid once the SCV moves to a different station. Shift-queuing the attack command on the SCV would issue: Attack SCV at station (a)*number of commands queued. Once the SCV wanders to a different station any queued attack commands become invalid because they were all queued at station (a). That's my logic. It may or may not be correct, but I'm not just saying "bah! BS! No Way!" I'm clearly operating off what I believe to be bugged game-logic. Similar to the Patrol Flower. Clearly air units can stack, so why not be able to stack them on top of each other? Because that is not how Blizzard intended that mechanic to work/be used. On March 31 2011 00:05 GreEny K wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
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The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." So what's your problem? Theres nothing in the thread that would support your view... Also, keep the red out of your posts, admins use red for warnings and bans and mod edits. Hwat do you mean?I used red to express my headline. TL intends for us to format our posts, and even offers instructions on how to use the various colors. If red was reserved, they could simply reserve that tag, similar to the HTML tags.If you're wondering why as referenced the thread see my response above to that poster. I will admit I was urked by the l2p-ish "umad bro" which just wreaks of prepubescent antagonizing.I also admit that I am using these colors to screw with you. I apologize WHAT a guy. Too much? lol. Come on, guys. Lighten up. Seriously though, do you disagree with my reasoning? You did ask for an elaboration.
What do you mean "Too much"? You're the one trying to run to blizzard with the smallest of "bugs" that don't favor Terran. The color text is a cute touch, if you're 10
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On March 31 2011 00:49 TimeSpiral wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:38 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:35 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:58 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:53 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:47 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." I've read the entire thread, what are you getting at? Read again, maybe? On March 30 2011 23:21 TimeSpiral wrote:
I'm not saying the SCV should be invulnerable. I'm saying that shift a+clicking a wandering SCV is a bug and should be fixed. You can still kill the SCV. Also, it kinda sounds to me like you're only talking about bunker rushes ... Otherwise, why on earth would you be pulling workers to attack an SCV building a rax or supply depot See, bunkers in proxy locations are not the only buildings that a Terran needs to construct You're getting off-topic. My point is shift-A clicking an SCV repeatedly is obviously working as intended. That is all. If you give me one legitimate reason why queuing up attacks is a bug I might change my mind. EDIT: I find it both odd and insulting that you make the assumption I haven't read the thread. In the future try not to be an asshole. I apologize if I offended you. I assumed you did not read the whole thread because I listed a very specific reason why I felt this was a bug and you started talking about Terran building attributes (flying, repair, SD raise/lower, etc) and appeared to be talking exclusively about bunker rushing. Reason (1): An attack command is canceled when the SCV wanders during building construction. I'm arguing this is a purposeful attribute of the SCV's construction routine. Let's say the SCV has four construction locations (a), (b), (c), and (d). Issuing the attack command while at station (a) attacks the SCV at station (a). That attack command is no longer valid once the SCV moves to a different station. Shift-queuing the attack command on the SCV would issue: Attack SCV at station (a)*number of commands queued. Once the SCV wanders to a different station any queued attack commands become invalid because they were all queued at station (a). That's my logic. It may or may not be correct, but I'm not just saying "bah! BS! No Way!" I'm clearly operating off what I believe to be bugged game-logic. Similar to the Patrol Flower. Clearly air units can stack, so why not be able to stack them on top of each other? Because that is not how Blizzard intended that mechanic to work/be used. On March 31 2011 00:05 GreEny K wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." So what's your problem? Theres nothing in the thread that would support your view... Also, keep the red out of your posts, admins use red for warnings and bans and mod edits. Hwat do you mean?I used red to express my headline. TL intends for us to format our posts, and even offers instructions on how to use the various colors. If red was reserved, they could simply reserve that tag, similar to the HTML tags.If you're wondering why as referenced the thread see my response above to that poster. I will admit I was urked by the l2p-ish "umad bro" which just wreaks of prepubescent antagonizing.I also admit that I am using these colors to screw with you. I apologize WHAT a guy. EDIT: Your logic is flawed. Issuing an attack command on the same SCV multiple times logically should override the any AI. User input > AI. Makes sense, not a bug. Guarantee you it's working as intended, it's been that way since alpha. Your statement does not address my logic. Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:43 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:40 Synystyr wrote:
Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug. Friend, this is not a debate on simply attacking a building worker. It's a debate on shit-A clicking on the building SCV multiple times.Again, it's not a debate on if Terran needing to pull additional workers is balanced or not. We're discussing whether or not this particular game mechanic is intended or a slight bug. Can you name another instance where shift-queuing identical commands is valid?
Let me just say that I fully understand what your point is. Although there isn't another instance in which queuing up perfectly identical commands (eg. attack X unit 10 times) is viable the feature is still in the game.
You can set a unit to "Move" in spot 50 times via shit-queue technique if you want, so why shouldn't you be able to set a unit to attack one unit 50 times?
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On March 31 2011 00:49 Scrubington wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:47 Synystyr wrote:On March 31 2011 00:43 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:40 Synystyr wrote:
Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug. Friend, this is not a debate on simply attacking a building worker. It's a debate on shit-A clicking on the building SCV multiple times.
Shift-A clicking is unnecessary. Most Tricks are "unnecessary".
Somehow, I knew you'd single out that one word =\
I wouldn't classify this as a trick as much as I would an abuse of shift commands. I boggles me as to why you can't see this as a bug.
When you issue the attack command directly onto the SCV, the worker you use never loses it's target, it is always in "attack mode". Shift queue commands work after they finish the first command they were issued. In this situation, the command the worker was given was never finished. The queue says to attack this worker until it dies, and then do its next command. This command was never finished and is bugged because the worker can repath to attack the worker, rather than follow the path it was given initially.
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On March 31 2011 00:58 Synystyr wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:49 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:47 Synystyr wrote:On March 31 2011 00:43 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:40 Synystyr wrote:
Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug. Friend, this is not a debate on simply attacking a building worker. It's a debate on shit-A clicking on the building SCV multiple times.
Shift-A clicking is unnecessary. Most Tricks are "unnecessary". Somehow, I knew you'd single out that one word =\ I wouldn't classify this as a trick as much as I would an abuse of shift commands. I boggles me as to why you can't see this as a bug. When you issue the attack command directly onto the SCV, the worker you use never loses it's target, it is always in "attack mode". Shift queue commands work after they finish the first command they were issued. In this situation, the command the worker was given was never finished. The queue says to attack this worker until it dies, and then do its next command. This command was never finished and is bugged because the worker can repath to attack the worker, rather than follow the path it was given initially.
Refer to my previous post.
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Oh my god. Thank you. THANK YOU.
This is going to save me so many broken keyboard ragequits.
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On March 31 2011 00:58 Synystyr wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:49 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:47 Synystyr wrote:On March 31 2011 00:43 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:40 Synystyr wrote:
Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug. Friend, this is not a debate on simply attacking a building worker. It's a debate on shit-A clicking on the building SCV multiple times.
Shift-A clicking is unnecessary. Most Tricks are "unnecessary". Somehow, I knew you'd single out that one word =\ I wouldn't classify this as a trick as much as I would an abuse of shift commands. I boggles me as to why you can't see this as a bug. When you issue the attack command directly onto the SCV, the worker you use never loses it's target, it is always in "attack mode". Shift queue commands work after they finish the first command they were issued. In this situation, the command the worker was given was never finished. The queue says to attack this worker until it dies, and then do its next command. This command was never finished and is bugged because the worker can repath to attack the worker, rather than follow the path it was given initially.
Excellent point! Our list of evidence is growing.
If you have a battle.net account, jump onto the bug report forum and chime in on the thread I started there to report this to Blizzard.
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On March 31 2011 00:58 Scrubington wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 00:49 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 31 2011 00:38 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:35 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:58 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:53 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:47 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." I've read the entire thread, what are you getting at? Read again, maybe? On March 30 2011 23:21 TimeSpiral wrote:
I'm not saying the SCV should be invulnerable. I'm saying that shift a+clicking a wandering SCV is a bug and should be fixed. You can still kill the SCV. Also, it kinda sounds to me like you're only talking about bunker rushes ... Otherwise, why on earth would you be pulling workers to attack an SCV building a rax or supply depot See, bunkers in proxy locations are not the only buildings that a Terran needs to construct You're getting off-topic. My point is shift-A clicking an SCV repeatedly is obviously working as intended. That is all. If you give me one legitimate reason why queuing up attacks is a bug I might change my mind. EDIT: I find it both odd and insulting that you make the assumption I haven't read the thread. In the future try not to be an asshole. I apologize if I offended you. I assumed you did not read the whole thread because I listed a very specific reason why I felt this was a bug and you started talking about Terran building attributes (flying, repair, SD raise/lower, etc) and appeared to be talking exclusively about bunker rushing. Reason (1): An attack command is canceled when the SCV wanders during building construction. I'm arguing this is a purposeful attribute of the SCV's construction routine. Let's say the SCV has four construction locations (a), (b), (c), and (d). Issuing the attack command while at station (a) attacks the SCV at station (a). That attack command is no longer valid once the SCV moves to a different station. Shift-queuing the attack command on the SCV would issue: Attack SCV at station (a)*number of commands queued. Once the SCV wanders to a different station any queued attack commands become invalid because they were all queued at station (a). That's my logic. It may or may not be correct, but I'm not just saying "bah! BS! No Way!" I'm clearly operating off what I believe to be bugged game-logic. Similar to the Patrol Flower. Clearly air units can stack, so why not be able to stack them on top of each other? Because that is not how Blizzard intended that mechanic to work/be used. On March 31 2011 00:05 GreEny K wrote:On March 30 2011 23:37 TimeSpiral wrote:On March 30 2011 23:23 Scrubington wrote:On March 30 2011 22:52 TimeSpiral wrote:
I will be reporting this as a bug!
============================
The SCV Wandering purposefully negates an attack command to help protect the SCV while it is constructing a building. Maybe it simulates the fact that it's working in a freaking building, and there are lots of places to run around in there, or maybe it's simply Blizzard saying "you cannot just a+click a worker and stop a building from being constructed."
Just like the Patrol Flowers, shift clicking on SCVs constructing buildings is bugged and should be fixed. It's bad enough that Terran is the only race that can have a building halted in mid construction.
Terran fellows - on to battle.net, now, and report this as a bug. You mad bro? Flying buildings that can be repaired, fly, and be lowered in exchange for being halted a couple of seconds... It's like you forget that your opponent is losing minerals pulling workers to attempt to halt your building construction. Report this as a bug all you want, but the fact of the matter is this is working as intended and you know it. Read the thread, "brah." So what's your problem? Theres nothing in the thread that would support your view... Also, keep the red out of your posts, admins use red for warnings and bans and mod edits. Hwat do you mean?I used red to express my headline. TL intends for us to format our posts, and even offers instructions on how to use the various colors. If red was reserved, they could simply reserve that tag, similar to the HTML tags.If you're wondering why as referenced the thread see my response above to that poster. I will admit I was urked by the l2p-ish "umad bro" which just wreaks of prepubescent antagonizing.I also admit that I am using these colors to screw with you. I apologize WHAT a guy. EDIT: Your logic is flawed. Issuing an attack command on the same SCV multiple times logically should override the any AI. User input > AI. Makes sense, not a bug. Guarantee you it's working as intended, it's been that way since alpha. Your statement does not address my logic. On March 31 2011 00:43 Scrubington wrote:On March 31 2011 00:40 Synystyr wrote:
Here's my input into this little debate...
I am siding with TimeSpiral that this is a bug. It necessitates that at least two SCVs are pulled to deal with the harassing worker. This is because if the enemy worker gets the first hit on the SCV that's building, it is guaranteed a kill even if it's under attack by another SCV. You either need to pause construction to have two SCVs to attack the worker (which can just kite away), or you have to pull a second worker off to attack, thus losing mining time (worker can also kite again).
This completely nullifies the reason that Terran have 11 supply with the CC, because that extra supply gives you an extra worker that makes up for the SCV constructing your buildings. By having to use at least two SCVs to defend harass, you already start accumulating an economic disadvantage that no other race has to deal with and thus makes this imbalanced and a bug. Friend, this is not a debate on simply attacking a building worker. It's a debate on shit-A clicking on the building SCV multiple times.Again, it's not a debate on if Terran needing to pull additional workers is balanced or not. We're discussing whether or not this particular game mechanic is intended or a slight bug. Can you name another instance where shift-queuing identical commands is valid? Let me just say that I fully understand what your point is. Although there isn't another instance in which queuing up perfectly identical commands (eg. attack X unit 10 times) is viable the feature is still in the game. You can set a unit to "Move" in spot 50 times via shit-queue technique if you want, so why shouldn't you be able to set a unit to attack one unit 50 times?
It's a bugged feature. The worker should follow its command until it is complete before moving onto the next, but it doesn't do that in this scenario. Instead, it does an entirely different command by repathing itself and then attacking again.
Shift-clicking to attack a unit over and over again should be executed like this:
Unit attacks worker until unit dies.
Following commands of attacking the worker are cancelled due to no target found.
I don't see how repathing to attack the unit works here.
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EPT
